The Energon Pub

News Credits: 1 · by **Cyberseven** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 8:35 pm

WTF is going on? Look at this pic, and it's just scary how much smaller all our TF's are getting.

PS: this is not my pic, just one I found.

by **orangeitis** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 8:42 pm

The prices of oil are getting higher, so Hasbro has to shrink products and raise the prices in order to maintain a similar profit.

It's not just toys, the general cost of living is going up.

/thread

News Credits: 15 · by **PrymeStriker** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 8:53 pm

Thank you. We've been seeing this since DOTM. It shouldn't be too much of a surprise to anyone by now.

Website · by **RK_Striker_JK_5** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 9:17 pm

PrimeStriker wrote:Thank you. We've been seeing this since DOTM. It shouldn't be too much of a surprise to anyone by now.

May not be a surprise, but it still sucks.

by **Doubledealer93** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 9:54 pm

RK_Striker_JK_5 wrote:
PrimeStriker wrote:Thank you. We've been seeing this since DOTM. It shouldn't be too much of a surprise to anyone by now.

May not be a surprise, but it still sucks.

yeah it still sucks. but oh well they are good toys. can anyone find me a size comparison pic with FOC prime with a classics toy like kup or hotrod?

News Credits: 2 · by **Twitchythe3rd** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 9:59 pm

orangeitis wrote:The prices of oil are getting higher, so Hasbro has to shrink products and raise the prices in order to maintain a similar profit.

It's not just toys, the general cost of living is going up.

/thread

What he said.

News Credits: 12 · by **robofreak** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 11:56 pm

The shrinking figures it getting ridiculous. Compare Cybertron Hotshot to WoC Optimus and you'll also feel ripped off.

Boils down to economics. Prices have been going down for oil so I thin Hasbro is just trying to squeeze additional profit from the US since they charge higher prices in other countries so they feel they can do the same here.

Bruticus will not be as big as I was hoping. ugh.

by **orangeitis** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 12:05 am

robofreak wrote:Bruticus will not be as big as I was hoping. ugh.

Judging from pictures of him next to WFC Megatron in those convention pictures, he should be the height of Armada/Energon Tidal Wave, if not a teeny bit shorter.

News Credits: 127 · by **Counterpunch** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 12:30 am

Twitchythe3rd wrote:
orangeitis wrote:The prices of oil are getting higher, so Hasbro has to shrink products and raise the prices in order to maintain a similar profit.

It's not just toys, the general cost of living is going up.

/thread

What he said.

No, the thread is not over.

The discussion on this kind of thing should not get a shoulder shrug and a "whatever".

These smaller, less detailed, higher price toys should be called out.

I've already cut back big time on my purchasing because of it. I suggest others do too.

by **orangeitis** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 12:36 am

Sorry, I'm gonna continue buying Hasbro shiz. *shrug*

News Credits: 1 · by **RhA** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 12:44 am

This is why I'm not running to the stores for these.

by **Valandar** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 1:01 am

For those who have been collecting since BEFORE TFTM, try this: Take a standard sized Deluxe from, say, Cybertron/Galaxy Force, such as Sideways or Hot shot. Now place them next to a recent Deluxe, such as one of the TF Prime figures.

Yeah. Disappointing, but honestly not as HUGE a difference as there could be - the current Deluxes could be the size of Scouts. And for those who say "But they are!!!!11one!"... no. No more than Legends / Cyberverse are "Happy Meal Toys".

To back me up, compare any Legends / Cyberverse toy with, say, this: http://www.tfu.info/2004/Decepticon/McM ... gatron.htm. They have a larger number of parts and articulation, mode detail in the sculpting, and are usually for more articulated. Sorry, that's a comment I find HORRIBLY irritating and incorrect.

Getting back to Shrinking Deluxes... Yes, they are shrinking. Yes, it's bad. But it's not QUITE as bad as some people claim.

News Credits: 1452 · by **Blurrz** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 1:41 am

It's not that bad

Our fanbase could have easily gotten **** on like any other franchise but we've stayed strong for 25+ years. Sure there's stuff like RID Knock Out having the smallest car mode ever but on the other hand a few years ago we had Animated Lockdown that was engineered to be as a tall as a Voyager.

Not saying there's a trade off between better articulation and detailing with cost, or more detailing is better with cheaper plastic, but I'm quite sure we'll reach that compromise soon enough.

The economy and oil theory is laughable, Transformers is honestly the only franchise that I can think of with this issue. Gundams always has the same scale, and they are improving. GIJoes and Action figurs will always be 3' or 6' and they are also improving. I honestly think Transformers are improving too - might not be size, but the ingenuity and the engineering is topclass. And like I said we never had a a set class scale or size. As much as it could go down, it could easily go up.

Sure they're 'shrinking'.... but that's not the problem. It's certainly not a problem we can fix. The problem is, is that they put OP in the Deluxe class. I don't care if Hbro thinks VGs are second rate compared to their cartoon developments.... OP should never be that small. As much as Deluxe Armada OP is 'more' articulate and what not, I still love the Leader Armada version because of it's size.

I really don't think Hasbro is going to short change FOC this time around. Especially if Soundwave is a Voyager, there's a damn good change Optimus will get an upsize as well.

by **Doubledealer93** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 1:43 am

i still want those toys. i like the design, i like the characters so there for i buy them. size not usually play a factor in my collecting.

News Credits: 4 · by **King Kuuga** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 4:19 am

Engineering cost has to be accounted for, as well. For $15, you can buy a deluxe Transformer or a large action figure. The Transformer is smaller, but it has to be an action figure AND a car/truck/plane/boat/folded-up-robot at the same time. Given the general complexity of toys, that means it has to have WAY more parts than your regular action figure, which means it's harder to design, manufacture, and assemble than an action figure of comparable retail cost. Really it probably costs several times more to assemble a Transformer than a regular action figure, but due to the massive quantities they're produced in and the cheap labor in China, Hasbro has been able to get them to us at non-exorbitant prices for nearly 30 years. Well, oil prices are on the rise, labor prices are on the rise, inflation is ever on the rise, and I think Hasbro has been resisting those changes for a while to try to keep the bottom line the same for the customer, but they just can't do that anymore while still maintaining a profit margin. So they're shrinking figures a bit and raising prices a bit to try to find a middle ground between $22 traditionally-sized deluxes or tiny scout-sized deluxes for $12. Again, when you consider the actual engineering complexity of the figure, even if it's "simple" by Transformer standards, I think $15 is not a horrible price to have to pay for what you're getting. If it's not worth it to you, that's unfortunate but it's your money.

by **Breakdown 2099** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 4:42 am

For those of you who are as curious as I was, here's a link that shows the price of crude oil from 1946 to the present day.
An interesting bit of information, particularly looking at when the live action movies and their respective toys came out.

http://inflationdata.com/inflation/infl ... _table.asp

by **NTESHFT** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 5:20 am

Counterpunch wrote:
Twitchythe3rd wrote:
orangeitis wrote:The prices of oil are getting higher, so Hasbro has to shrink products and raise the prices in order to maintain a similar profit.

It's not just toys, the general cost of living is going up.

/thread

What he said.

No, the thread is not over.

The discussion on this kind of thing should not get a shoulder shrug and a "whatever".

These smaller, less detailed, higher price toys should be called out.

I've already cut back big time on my purchasing because of it. I suggest others do too.

THIS.

I have cut back too. Smaller toys at higher prices. $10 bucks for Cyberverse figures? $15 for what now appears to be an overgrown scout? PASS. Looks more and more like my money will be goin elsewheres........

News Credits: 241 · by **Jelze Bunnycat** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 6:06 am

headsortails wrote:
Counterpunch wrote:
Twitchythe3rd wrote:
orangeitis wrote:The prices of oil are getting higher, so Hasbro has to shrink products and raise the prices in order to maintain a similar profit.

It's not just toys, the general cost of living is going up.

/thread

What he said.

No, the thread is not over.

The discussion on this kind of thing should not get a shoulder shrug and a "whatever".

These smaller, less detailed, higher price toys should be called out.

I've already cut back big time on my purchasing because of it. I suggest others do too.

THIS.

I have cut back too. Smaller toys at higher prices. $10 bucks for Cyberverse figures? $15 for what now appears to be an overgrown scout? PASS. Looks more and more like my money will be goin elsewheres........

[drama] And thus, Transformers will die a slow but painful death. [/drama]

Even though I understand how things currently are, I'm still going to bear it for the figures I really want. Being Dutch (and used to high local prices), I'll still look for cheaper alternatives, like clearance sales when a line is done with.

News Credits: 1 · by **Cyberseven** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 6:29 am

Don't mis-understand me, I am going to keep supporting our Transformers franchise. I already have the 1st wave of FOC headed to me in the mail. I also have pre-ordered Amazon Bruticus, and plan to try for SDCC Bruticus.

I just wanted to visualize the changes we have all been seeing. I am not that happy about the price increase, but I would rather pay a bit more than have my figures get smaller.

It's hard to have FOC Optimus look like the leader of the Autobots, when he is just a bit taller than a Cyberverse commander figure now... :-(

Please stop Hasbro. I am not sure how others feel, but I will pay more to keep my TF's at a normal deluxe and Voyager size.

News Credits: 10 · by **gavinfuzzy** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 6:53 am

Knockout is a really good figure. I though I would hate it due to the flat chestpiece and not the show-accurate wheel wells but I'm not all the bothered by it. Found him loose yesterday for about 40% off, could not stop playing with it on the train ride back. :lol:

But yeah... when you get stuff like FOC shockwave with WFC figures, the size does bug me a little. Lines like 1st edition with RID, I have no problem. Scale matches nicely. DOTM with ROTF is also rather decent.

FOC's where the shrinkage is starting to bug me... but not enough to make me pass... But I'll wait for sale...

News Credits: 4 · by **freaky777** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 6:54 am

I also think that it is okay as long as the engineering and design is good. So far the 3 FOC DLXs that I have in hand are quite good, the worst of the 3 is Jazz and he is not that bad compared to say DOTM DLX Skids/Mudflap (they have the cool alt mode though).

News Credits: 2 · by **xyl360** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 9:48 am

Downsizing sucks, but economics is a factor. Parents don't have as much to spend on toys these days, so Hasbro must do something to turn a profit. They shrunk the toys and raised the prices slightly.

Perhaps one day we'll get a collector's line that isn't MP, but I don't expect it to come from Hasbro. If it comes, it will be from Takara for certain.

The US economy is in bad shape right now, so the price of everything is increasing. The food industry has done the same thing for years. They keep the price the same, but the weight/volume of food in the container (bag, box, can, whatever) is less. Hasbro is doing the same thing, it's just easier to see because you have something from the past to compare it to. If you opened a can of tuna fish and scouped it out into a bowl next to another bowl containing the tuna fish from a can of the same price and/or size from 5 or 10 years ago you'd see that the new can had much less in it. It's the way it is, it sucks, but that's economics. Inflation is a bitch.

News Credits: 2 · by **paul053** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 9:54 am

Wow, put size comparison aside. These two looks really bad standing next to the WFC Prime. And it's just not the custom paint that he did on WFC Prime that makes the difference.

News Credits: 4 · by **Ruthless Cynic** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 10:09 am

The biggest issue I have with the sizing is that they are raising the price and shrinking the figure. One or the other is not ideal but certainly not as bad as the practice they are currently employing. The justification with DOTM was the MechTech. Now there is no trade off to offset the price increase. I will continue to purchase them, but am certainly not thrilled about it. It has certainly pushed me into purchasing larger and vintage Transformers as a priority.