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Jazz isnt gonna die is he?! **SPOILERS**

Discuss anything and everything related to the Transformers Live Action Films franchise, which are directed by Michael Bay. Join us to discuss the movies and stuff up to date with news for the 2017 release of Transformers 5. Check out our Live Action Film section here.

Postby Sunstar » Wed May 23, 2007 2:34 am

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he has a black voice actor I would assume.
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Postby Leonardo » Wed May 23, 2007 2:36 am

Exactly. He's got a voice actor. Not some racial heritage that extends past the Cybertronian.
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Postby Sunstar » Wed May 23, 2007 2:41 am

Motto: "All hail Lord Starscream"
Weapon: Null-Ray Rifle
which doesn't matter to a cybertronian. Afterall, they do come in all shapes, sizes and colours and they do not really pick on each other over such external differences...except rumble and Skywarp "metallic mini meatball" Although, it is not impossible that they may have some "elitist" attitudes at times.
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Postby Leonardo » Wed May 23, 2007 2:54 am

Sunstar wrote:which doesn't matter to a cybertronian. Afterall, they do come in all shapes, sizes and colours and they do not really pick on each other over such external differences...except rumble and Skywarp "metallic mini meatball" Although, it is not impossible that they may have some "elitist" attitudes at times.


That's my thinking, too. They probably don't have such distinctions, though the Decepticons may have some elitist or prejudiced attitudes.

I often thought that people like Mirage and Sunstreaker might also have an elitist attitude, not in a racial sense, but in a more class-structured sense.
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Postby Sunstar » Wed May 23, 2007 3:10 am

Motto: "All hail Lord Starscream"
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Leonardo wrote:
Sunstar wrote:which doesn't matter to a cybertronian. Afterall, they do come in all shapes, sizes and colours and they do not really pick on each other over such external differences...except rumble and Skywarp "metallic mini meatball" Although, it is not impossible that they may have some "elitist" attitudes at times.


That's my thinking, too. They probably don't have such distinctions, though the Decepticons may have some elitist or prejudiced attitudes.

I often thought that people like Mirage and Sunstreaker might also have an elitist attitude, not in a racial sense, but in a more class-structured sense.


Thundercracker did not care for non fliers... so that was kinda elitist. Sunstreaker and mirage struck me as a bit snobbish.
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Postby Leonardo » Wed May 23, 2007 3:15 am

Sunstar wrote:Thundercracker did not care for non fliers... so that was kinda elitist. Sunstreaker and mirage struck me as a bit snobbish.


Snobbish, that's a good word. I always thought of Mirage as an upper-class snob! I'd forgotten about Thundercracker's contempt for ground-based lifeforms.
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Postby lilcarus » Wed May 23, 2007 4:38 am

YouFearGalvatron wrote:
I live in TEXAS.

What do most whites listen to here? What motorsport is vastly the most popular here?

I listen to trance/metal/electronica/JPOP/classical, and I love MotoGP motorcycle racing, the 24 Hours of LeMans, Formula 1, rally racing, etc.

Not your typical white dude here, obviously.

Stereotypes are an educated guess, nothing more, so get over it.


lol....you cant be serious with that post...living in lago vista is just basically living right outside of austin, texas....what you posted cracks me up...but do your thang :grin:
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Postby Neko » Wed May 23, 2007 6:43 am

Here in AL it's Country and Rap. :P

I'm starving for some good alternative or rock. Scarce...very scarce.

back on topic:


But Jazz's character was always seen as the black guy.
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Re: Jazz isnt gonna die is he?! **SPOILERS**

Postby Wheeljack35 » Wed May 23, 2007 7:11 am

Central-Blast2 wrote:Watching the trailer it looks like he gets creamed! He ain't gonna die is he?


The action goes by too fast so how did you see that?

With the scenes flying by most of the bots look alike
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Re: Jazz isnt gonna die is he?! **SPOILERS**

Postby Cyber Bishop » Wed May 23, 2007 7:19 am

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Wheeljack35 wrote:
Central-Blast2 wrote:Watching the trailer it looks like he gets creamed! He ain't gonna die is he?


The action goes by too fast so how did you see that?

With the scenes flying by most of the bots look alike


Well let's see..
Megatron transforms in the air and "throws" Jazz then smashes him with his foot..
This scene, see Jazz and Megatron...
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Everyone else was able to pick out who was who.
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Postby Wheeljack35 » Wed May 23, 2007 7:44 am

Well excuse me as I said it went by fast and I didn't go frame by frame with this and I bet there are others who know nothing of this either

As I said when it goes by fast you can't make it out plus this was on like what 2 seconds of the trailer


sheeeesh
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Postby Godzilla » Wed May 23, 2007 10:39 am

Man screw the quote and quote spoilers! Jazz ain't gonna die!
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Postby Keith » Wed May 23, 2007 11:04 am

Skywarp/YFGalvatron,

First, thanks for reading the my post. It was long as hell. Here is another doozy:

Listen, I am not calling anyone racist. I was just responding to what I considered to be offensive over-generalizations about Black people on the issues of race. I am not saying that anyone has malice in their hearts when it comes to Black people. I don't know that. Only you know that about yourself.

This is not about blaming individuals. My whole point is about 1) not over-generalizing, and 2) speaking from a position of knowledge.

Racism is real. It has not gone away. Yes, this is 2007. That makes it even sadder that we still deal with this stuff. If you think racism is a thing of the past that will go away if people stop thinking about it, you are wrong. This not my opinion. This is fact. I wish you were right, but you are not. But, as a Black man (you may have guessed..LOL) I can tell you from very personal experience that it is real. YFG...I have spent a lot of time in Texas. It is VERY alive down there. I am from PA...the KKK is making a strong comeback in western PA and the midwest. Racism is indeed alive. Very sad.

Reparations.
Again, I stated a "token" of "acknowledgement", not the present day equivalent of 40 acres and a mule in 1865. However, fact is, the reparations were promised..as a political device, yes...but still promised. People should not act as if Black people are crazy for wanting reparations. It is not unprecedented. Did you know that the Japanese families that were interned during WWII got reparations from the US? The Allied powers rebuilt Germany and Japan after WWII. The Chinese workers that were indentured to build the American railroads got reparations. Look it up. The native Americans are tax exempt, and get free college tuition. Does this make up for atrocities? Heck no. But is an acknowledgement of wrong-doing by the US. Blacks folks simply want the same treatment. Given the precedents, it is offensive that we haven't gotten anything. That is why Black people get all upset. It is not a guilt trip. It is just fair and equitable treatment. People try to dismiss it as a guilt trip b/c they don't want to deal with it. This is a great country. Blacks are as responsible for its greatness as any group. Living here and benefitting from America's greatness does not mean there is not a reckoning necessary. Black people deserve all the good America has to offer b/c we helped build it. Reparations are the acknowledgement of the wrongs committed against Blacks while they were doing the building.

Slavery. Re-read my post about types of slavery. Most Black people have no idea 1) what country or tribe they are from; 2) what their real family name is; or 3) what the real religion of their culture is. Slavers very intentionally stripped the slaves of this knowledge as a way to de-humanize and subjugate them. It was very effective. I have a Celtic name. My fiance, also Black, has an English name. We are both Christian. That is real. Try to imagine life with no real knowledge of your cultural heritage. You may or may not choose to focus on your heritage, but at least you have an idea of what it is. The damage done is still being felt. BTW.....Africa is a as diverse as any other place. Try lumping the French, Germans and Spanish into one group and see how they like it. Africans are no different.

As far as being AMERICAN, and forgetting about the past, that is not fair. Blacks were among the FIRST to get here during colonization. Many Black families have been in this country since the 17th century. Still, America does not accept Black people as full-fledged Americans. You know this to be true. Check out Fox news as far as AMERICAN outcry over the "browning" of America. This is real. Did you know that Black people still do not have the right to vote? Black people's right to vote is granted by an ACT, not a law, that is reviewed and extended every 25 years. Did you know that 90% of people on death row are Black? Even though Blacks only account for about 25% of all murders each year? Did you know that a black defendant is 500% more likely to be convicted of an alleged crime than a white defendant accused of the same crime? That is the Black American experience.

Thanks for reading. I will not post again on this topic as to not disrespect the purpose of this particular board.
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Postby Sunstar » Wed May 23, 2007 11:47 am

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I will say this, but only once. I will not be moved to defend my statement.

Racism exists because people will not permit it to die out. The frequent "bringing" up of rasist suggestions, ie names.

To actually attempt to make a person aware of the existance or racism is only adding fuel to the fire. There were things I had not even remotely contemplated as being racist until It was pointed out to me. And I tell you, the context of my usages of the supposed racist comments were not in any way, manner or respect racist. And yet, I was informed...
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Postby Rodimus Cloud » Wed May 23, 2007 2:58 pm

Man, you guys have gone to the different direction. When you guys put it that way all the other Transformers are from Earth cuz they speak our language :-x
An alien robot who has a voice from the black people and is now an black alien?

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:-?

And back to the topic, I hope Starscream, Ironhide and Bumblebee survives.
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Postby primalVICTORY » Wed May 23, 2007 3:30 pm

skywarp-2 wrote:
PRiMES_DESTiNY wrote:
XxDunexX wrote:To answer that question..^^

SPOILERS!!

Jazz dies and Starscream is the only one who survives out of the Decepticons.

I personally wish it was Ratchet who dies, as he doesn't do much at all.


SPOiLER

:-? hmmm...someone else said that...


all the decepticons survive, cept megs. something about him being strapped to a nuke and dropped in the ocean. hmmm...



im wondering...either way as long as starscream, prime, or bumblebee dont die...im happy.



Ok, so in the midst of Slag, i find this....what is your secret knowledge, please PM, I'm getting too old to read super Small print on this crappy small LCD screen.. Sigh.. i need a wide screen..


if you think about it. it wouldnt seem right if only megatron died. what would happen to the other decepticons..run away? if they did, the autobots would probly go after them, and they would end up destroying more stuff. it makes sense that they all die except SS.

oh and skywarp-2..if you still want that 'knowledge' ill PM it to ya, unless sum1 else already did.
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Postby Godzilla » Wed May 23, 2007 3:43 pm

A look ive experience racism before but not much as Keith. A look no matter how you don't want to admit RACISM still there. But being black in America is one the toughest adversities in America. Trust me I am one! At least its not as bad as it was 30 yrs. But can we move on from this please! I'm wondering if I should've ever open this topic but all well.



What weapons is Jazz or all the Transformers gonna have in the movie?
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Postby primalVICTORY » Wed May 23, 2007 3:47 pm

most of them have some form of an arm cannon. megatron has his mace at some point, and some have sun gatling guns or something. i know blackout does guns.

apparantly jazz has a shield, sword and a gatling gun on his shoulder.
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Postby skywarp-2 » Wed May 23, 2007 4:25 pm

XxDunexX wrote:
skywarp-2 wrote:
PRiMES_DESTiNY wrote:
XxDunexX wrote:To answer that question..^^

SPOILERS!!

Jazz dies and Starscream is the only one who survives out of the Decepticons.

I personally wish it was Ratchet who dies, as he doesn't do much at all.


SPOiLER

:-? hmmm...someone else said that...


all the decepticons survive, cept megs. something about him being strapped to a nuke and dropped in the ocean. hmmm...



im wondering...either way as long as starscream, prime, or bumblebee dont die...im happy.



Ok, so in the midst of Slag, i find this....what is your secret knowledge, please PM, I'm getting too old to read super Small print on this crappy small LCD screen.. Sigh.. i need a wide screen..


if you think about it. it wouldnt seem right if only megatron died. what would happen to the other decepticons..run away? if they did, the autobots would probly go after them, and they would end up destroying more stuff. it makes sense that they all die except SS.

oh and skywarp-2..if you still want that 'knowledge' ill PM it to ya, unless sum1 else already did.



I moved on from that topic, because its pointless to argue about something that no one will ever comprise on, either side that is..you could say that Europeans and Indians from India came conquered Africa, drew lines of states, and left which caused devastation in its wake, or you could say that they ruled for hundreds of years with peace, and once under African rule, they now kill each other without remorse, the Europeans didn't tell them to pull those triggers.. so Europen rule vs Tribal rule with genocide..hmmmmm... but either way no one side will ever win the debate or argument..besides where I work is in predominantly white area, where I live is what some may call ghetto, and I get discrimination on a daily basis because I'm white..but is it okay for me to take that because I'm white or of things that happened 200+ years ago, that were out of my control...??


Anyhow, i would be okay with SS and the rest of the decepticons living still because, that could leave open side stories and comics or a CGI cartoon like Clone wars was for Episode 2 and 3 of Star Wars, now that would be cool.. stories and adventures leading up to the sequel of the Transformers movie.. Man i would love to see the Beast Wars company do the animation for the movie bots and have a special run on Cartoon network, that leads up to the next movie installment..or IDW doing a comicbook series that expands on Ss and co.. attacking Military bases, feul dumps ect.. ect.. and hiding from Autobots and Military.. its like marvel Secret Wars, but with Giant robots fighting each other and on the run from the Governments of the world... nice!!!
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Postby PRiMESDESTiNY » Wed May 23, 2007 6:34 pm

XxDunexX wrote:
skywarp-2 wrote:
PRiMES_DESTiNY wrote:
XxDunexX wrote:To answer that question..^^

SPOILERS!!

Jazz dies and Starscream is the only one who survives out of the Decepticons.

I personally wish it was Ratchet who dies, as he doesn't do much at all.


SPOiLER

:-? hmmm...someone else said that...


all the decepticons survive, cept megs. something about him being strapped to a nuke and dropped in the ocean. hmmm...



im wondering...either way as long as starscream, prime, or bumblebee dont die...im happy.



Ok, so in the midst of Slag, i find this....what is your secret knowledge, please PM, I'm getting too old to read super Small print on this crappy small LCD screen.. Sigh.. i need a wide screen..


if you think about it. it wouldnt seem right if only megatron died. what would happen to the other decepticons..run away? if they did, the autobots would probly go after them, and they would end up destroying more stuff. it makes sense that they all die except SS.

oh and skywarp-2..if you still want that 'knowledge' ill PM it to ya, unless sum1 else already did.


not really cause IMO it would leave an opening to more stories or spin offs so to speak as to what happened to the remaining decepticons? did SS takeover? and all that other jazz...besides, i dont see the remaining decepticons running away and not coming back for a fight...especially SS..he is too greedy and cunning to just run off and stay gone....same with the others....one thing about decepticons, they always come back someway somehow....
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Postby lkavadas » Wed May 23, 2007 6:41 pm

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Keith wrote:Reparations. Again, I stated a "token" of "acknowledgement", not the present day equivalent of 40 acres and a mule in 1865. However, fact is, the reparations were promised..as a political device, yes...but still promised. People should not act as if Black people are crazy for wanting reparations. It is not unprecedented. Did you know that the Japanese families that were interned during WWII got reparations from the US? The Allied powers rebuilt Germany and Japan after WWII. The Chinese workers that were indentured to build the American railroads got reparations. Look it up. The native Americans are tax exempt, and get free college tuition. Does this make up for atrocities? Heck no. But is an acknowledgement of wrong-doing by the US. Blacks folks simply want the same treatment. Given the precedents, it is offensive that we haven't gotten anything. That is why Black people get all upset. It is not a guilt trip. It is just fair and equitable treatment. People try to dismiss it as a guilt trip b/c they don't want to deal with it. This is a great country. Blacks are as responsible for its greatness as any group. Living here and benefitting from America's greatness does not mean there is not a reckoning necessary. Black people deserve all the good America has to offer b/c we helped build it. Reparations are the acknowledgement of the wrongs committed against Blacks while they were doing the building.


Any race aside I find it absolutely hypocritical that we go through so much to bring equality to all of the races yet these same people bitch about special treatment.

Make up your mind. Do you want to be equal or unequal? Reparations makes you unequal. The government shouldn't have any fiscal or legislative obligation to any group of people besides American citizens in general and I disagree with the steps taken in the past to satiate groups of people. A public apology is fine and dandy but anything else is preferential treatment which shatters the illusion of equality between groups/races.

You can cry all you want about the past and how horrible this or that was but I don't think there's any excuse for the type of "reverse inequality" you demand. Reparations? The deaths of 366,222 Union soldiers aren't enough to satisfy you? Or doesn't their sacrifice count?

Keith wrote:Did you know that Black people still do not have the right to vote? Black people's right to vote is granted by an ACT, not a law, that is reviewed and extended every 25 years.


This is one of the most ignorant statements I've ever seen on this board. The act you're referring to is the "Voting Rights Act" of 1965.

It includes absolutely no mention of a specific race. The only thing this act does is outlaw literacy tests and provide federal registration of voters in areas where less than 50% of the eligible minority voters are registered.

The black vote was actually ensured in the 15th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution and is protected by the 14th Amendment which includes due process and equal protection to freed slaves.

On top of the provisions of the 14th Amendment you have the 15th Amendment which was explicitly written and ratified to ensure that the governments in the United States can not prevent or interfere with any citizen from voting because of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.

Now, switching back to the 14th Amendment we have a clear definition of citizenship and its qualification as it overturned the Supreme Court ruling in the Dredd Scott case. We adopted a juris soli rule of citizenship which is basically stating that if you're born on American soil you are automatically a citizen. The only exception to juris soli is the territory of American Samoa.

You aren't very educated about this my friend.
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Postby lilcarus » Wed May 23, 2007 6:49 pm

Neko wrote:But Jazz's character was always seen as the black guy.


i knew jazz was black because the second i read the script and they had a scene where his car is getting repossed...as soon as i read that i knew what time it was...:lol: :lol: :lol:
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Postby PRiMESDESTiNY » Wed May 23, 2007 7:16 pm

lkavadas wrote:
Keith wrote:Reparations. Again, I stated a "token" of "acknowledgement", not the present day equivalent of 40 acres and a mule in 1865. However, fact is, the reparations were promised..as a political device, yes...but still promised. People should not act as if Black people are crazy for wanting reparations. It is not unprecedented. Did you know that the Japanese families that were interned during WWII got reparations from the US? The Allied powers rebuilt Germany and Japan after WWII. The Chinese workers that were indentured to build the American railroads got reparations. Look it up. The native Americans are tax exempt, and get free college tuition. Does this make up for atrocities? Heck no. But is an acknowledgement of wrong-doing by the US. Blacks folks simply want the same treatment. Given the precedents, it is offensive that we haven't gotten anything. That is why Black people get all upset. It is not a guilt trip. It is just fair and equitable treatment. People try to dismiss it as a guilt trip b/c they don't want to deal with it. This is a great country. Blacks are as responsible for its greatness as any group. Living here and benefitting from America's greatness does not mean there is not a reckoning necessary. Black people deserve all the good America has to offer b/c we helped build it. Reparations are the acknowledgement of the wrongs committed against Blacks while they were doing the building.


Any race aside I find it absolutely hypocritical that we go through so much to bring equality to all of the races yet these same people bitch about special treatment.

Make up your mind. Do you want to be equal or unequal? Reparations makes you unequal. The government shouldn't have any fiscal or legislative obligation to any group of people besides American citizens in general and I disagree with the steps taken in the past to satiate groups of people. A public apology is fine and dandy but anything else is preferential treatment which shatters the illusion of equality between groups/races.

You can cry all you want about the past and how horrible this or that was but I don't think there's any excuse for the type of "reverse unequality" you demand.


not trying to get into this cause it doesnt have ANYTHING to do with Jazz dying BUT as a person of color, a MIXED person of color who is half caucasian (iRiSH) at that, I just want some clarifications on some of the things you said...now you said...


"Any race aside I find it absolutely hypocritical that we go through so much to bring equality to all of the races yet these same people bitch about special treatment."

what do u mean "these same people bitch about special treatment."

are you referring to people of color asking for equal respect across the board? then i dont see that as asking for "special treatment." i see that as something anyone of ANY race has the right to ask for and receive. and as much as people hate to admit it, it has yet to be truly 100% received and given.


i dont see how reparations makes anyone "unequal" so to speak since our ancestors were promised 40 acre and a mule and never received it. america was pretty much built on their backs and for someone of their descent to not demand it would be like doing an injustice to our ancestors of the past.


its funny that u say a public apology should be sufficient, but how many have there been? and how many of them have been 100% honest and legit??






p.s. and just to say, Jazz having a "black" so to speak demeanor, NEVER bothered me one bit and i never looked at him as being the "black" autobot. i just took it as a personality of one of the bots. **shrugs**
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Postby PRiMESDESTiNY » Wed May 23, 2007 7:20 pm

lilcarus wrote:
Neko wrote:But Jazz's character was always seen as the black guy.


i knew jazz was black because the second i read the script and they had a scene where his car is getting repossed...as soon as i read that i knew what time it was...:lol: :lol: :lol:


**shakes head** |:|
PRiMESDESTiNY
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Postby primalVICTORY » Wed May 23, 2007 7:27 pm

PRiMES_DESTiNY wrote:not really cause IMO it would leave an opening to more stories or spin offs so to speak as to what happened to the remaining decepticons? did SS takeover? and all that other jazz...besides, i dont see the remaining decepticons running away and not coming back for a fight...especially SS..he is too greedy and cunning to just run off and stay gone....same with the others....one thing about decepticons, they always come back someway somehow....


exactly my point. they wouldnt run away. and they dont run away cuz they all die in the final battle. SS is the only one left, so he leaves earth cuz he knows he'll die if he stays. megs will be back in TF2, and then so will SS, and then maybe he dies after. but every1 else dies becuz they did stayed and fought.
Last edited by primalVICTORY on Wed May 23, 2007 7:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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