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Wes Crayon wrote:

Robinson wrote:

Code3 wrote:Michael Bay to mislead us? WOW IM SHOCKED????? Didnt he do that with his 2 hour GM Commerical (I mean Transformers Movie?)
After seeing the first one on the internet since I would not pay him a dollar for screwing up the idea of the Transformers...

If you hate the movie so much and all that Bay did to it, why do you have barricades panel as your avatar when that itself represents a portion of what you hate?

And frankly since you freely admit to watching a pirated version and not even have the balls to shell out ten dollars to see a movie about a franchise that you care about your opinion really means ****. ...

I was going to mention that about the Barricade avatar too (lol), but I do share Code3's hatred for the film. And honestly, although I rushed out and paid the ticket fee to see it on opening day, I wish I hadn't -- that extra $10 could've gone towards Jungle Bonecrusher or a FAB repaint.

So really I could care less if Michael Bay wastes his time trying to mislead the fanbase or not, since this is the last time I waste my time and money on one of his crappy movies.

At least your opinion is respectful because you shelled out money to see it. People are allowed to like or dislike a movie thats perfectly fine but if you can't own up and actually pay to see it then you have no voice when it comes to a respected opinion.

All I can say is I liked the movie, I would like to see more of it, I just wish Micheal bay would just stop screwin' around with us fans.

And lo did The Bay sit back and chuckle at how he has once again managed to piss off fanboys on teh interweb.

Robinson wrote:And frankly since you freely admit to watching a pirated version and not even have the balls to shell out ten dollars to see a movie about a franchise that you care about your opinion really means ****. ...

You win non-sequitur of the year.
Or is an opinion only worthy if it's paid for nowadays?

homelessjunkeon wrote:

Robinson wrote:And frankly since you freely admit to watching a pirated version and not even have the balls to shell out ten dollars to see a movie about a franchise that you care about your opinion really means ****. ...

You win non-sequitur of the year.
Or is an opinion only worthy if it's paid for nowadays?

Yeah seriously...If you pay to see a movie to form an opinion of it, by that point your opinion no longer matters, because whoever made it just got paid.....by you.

Keep in mind, though, I paid to see the first one twice & now have it on DVD(which reminds me, I need to delete the pirated version I downloaded).

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:

homelessjunkeon wrote:

Robinson wrote:And frankly since you freely admit to watching a pirated version and not even have the balls to shell out ten dollars to see a movie about a franchise that you care about your opinion really means ****. ...

You win non-sequitur of the year.
Or is an opinion only worthy if it's paid for nowadays?

Yeah seriously...If you pay to see a movie to form an opinion of it, by that point your opinion no longer matters, because whoever made it just got paid.....by you.

Keep in mind, though, I paid to see the first one twice & now have it on DVD(which reminds me, I need to delete the pirated version I downloaded).

To me if you choose to dl the movie and only watch the pirated movie than your opinion means nothing. You can pay to see a movie and not like it thats fine but at least you did it the proper way.

Bay is cruel. To say the least. We are TF fans here. Not some lost school boys. We were fan 20 years before Bay even took notice of Transformers. How dare he openly mock us with his misleading bunch of trash.

It is very insulting.

He can withhold information if he wants to. That's absolutely normal. But no need to go lower than a scum, perpetrating this charade.

He is just pushing himself deeper into his own crap.

His sequel may have a big chance to come out as a super-blast. But there will be no love for Bay himself for doing what he's doing now.

Deception.

Decepticon! It's like Bay created the Movie Megatron out of his own likeness and character.

Auto Bot wrote:Bay is cruel. To say the least. We are TF fans here. Not some lost school boys. We were fan 20 years before Bay even took notice of Transformers. How dare he openly mock us with his misleading bunch of trash.

It is very insulting.

He can withhold information if he wants to. That's absolutely normal. But no need to go lower than a scum, perpetrating this charade.

He is just pushing himself deeper into his own crap.

His sequel may have a big chance to come out as a super-blast. But there will be no love for Bay himself for doing what he's doing now.

Deception.

Decepticon! It's like Bay created the Movie Megatron out of his own likeness and character.

There's a difference between being evilly deceptive and being childishly deceptive...

But those I really feel sorry for, are the people the childishness gets a rise out of. =/

Auto Bot wrote:Bay is cruel. To say the least. We are TF fans here. Not some lost school boys. We were fan 20 years before Bay even took notice of Transformers. How dare he openly mock us with his misleading bunch of trash.

It is very insulting.

He can withhold information if he wants to. That's absolutely normal. But no need to go lower than a scum, perpetrating this charade.

He is just pushing himself deeper into his own crap.

His sequel may have a big chance to come out as a super-blast. But there will be no love for Bay himself for doing what he's doing now.

Deception.

Decepticon! It's like Bay created the Movie Megatron out of his own likeness and character.

Agreed.

Robinson wrote:

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:

homelessjunkeon wrote:

Robinson wrote:And frankly since you freely admit to watching a pirated version and not even have the balls to shell out ten dollars to see a movie about a franchise that you care about your opinion really means ****. ...

You win non-sequitur of the year.
Or is an opinion only worthy if it's paid for nowadays?

Yeah seriously...If you pay to see a movie to form an opinion of it, by that point your opinion no longer matters, because whoever made it just got paid.....by you.

Keep in mind, though, I paid to see the first one twice & now have it on DVD(which reminds me, I need to delete the pirated version I downloaded).

To me if you choose to dl the movie and only watch the pirated movie than your opinion means nothing. You can pay to see a movie and not like it thats fine but at least you did it the proper way.

The problem is, though, whit the thought that paying gives you right to opinion is that after you've bought in, your opinion dosen't matter anymore. You've already paid them, their efforts are already rewarded. If you don't like the movie at that point, you've already supported it. It'd be akin to complaining about an elected official after you've voted him into office. Dosen't matter if you like him or not, he's gonna be making laws you don't like on your behalf untill his term's over.

Now on the first movie, with all the leaks & everything I was well aware of the changes for the sake of change ahead of time, & because of being well-informed I was able to make an educated opinion of wether the movie was going to be likable or not before I ever stepped into the theatre. With this time around, this info is going to be denied(Or at least lost amongst a lot of flat-out BS), so I have no way of judging if it will be a good movie or not untill after I pay to support their efforts. & That is the problem with the idea that opinions aren't valid untill you pay...because even then your opinion dosen't matter.

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:The problem is, though, whit the thought that paying gives you right to opinion is that after you've bought in, your opinion dosen't matter anymore. You've already paid them, their efforts are already rewarded. If you don't like the movie at that point, you've already supported it. It'd be akin to complaining about an elected official after you've voted him into office. Dosen't matter if you like him or not, he's gonna be making laws you don't like on your behalf untill his term's over.

I'm not sure where that analogly is going with an elected official. If you didn't like someone, you wouldn't have voted him or her into office. As a matter of fact you probably would have voted for the other person and even if they didn't win it doesn't mean you don't have a right to complian. The only person that doesn't have a right to complain is the person that didn't vote. Look at local and state politics, in many situations, if the elected official is not fulfilling their obligation to their constituants, the people can have the elected official recalled and removed from office.

As a movie goer you can walk out during a show and ask for your money back if you really don't like the movie. I've seen people do it before. If I've already made up my mind that I won't like a movie, I probably won't see it at all. It does affect the value of my opinion to other people if I say it's an awful movie and then tell them that I haven't seen it. What's more silly, a person that pays to see a movie or a person that decides they don't like a movie before seeing it but still takes the time to look for it on the internet and download it, then watch it?

I get what you are saying about financially rewarding a movie you find an utter crap fest, but if it was so awful, it would have showed in the ticket sales. Word of mouth from friends telling people that a movie sucks can play a big factor. I imagine that part of the total ticket sales for Transformers also came from people returning to the theaters for multiple viewings because they loved the film.

I get that you didn't like the film or didn't want to support it, that's cool. I'm not bashing you for it. I just don't see where it is fair to say that people that paid to see a movie are not entitled to an opinion.

I was just saying that after the fact, the damage is already done. If you pay to see a movie, go in, watch the whole thing, & then decide it's crap, your opinion of the movie is a moot point, because you've already contributed. That's all I was getting at. Sorry for all the rambling. Personally, I thought the movie was pretty cool, but there are a lot of things about it that could have been better.

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:If you pay to see a movie, go in, watch the whole thing, & then decide it's crap, your opinion of the movie is a moot point, because you've already contributed.

I don't get this really.

How are you suppose to decide whether something is crap or not unless you actually do go to see it?

Maybe i'm reading this wrong (and I may have taken things out of context in which case tell me so) but just reading that statement it seems you're saying that if you pay to see a movie then you have no right to complain about how awful it was?

Burn wrote:

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:If you pay to see a movie, go in, watch the whole thing, & then decide it's crap, your opinion of the movie is a moot point, because you've already contributed.

I don't get this really.

How are you suppose to decide whether something is crap or not unless you actually do go to see it?

Maybe i'm reading this wrong (and I may have taken things out of context in which case tell me so) but just reading that statement it seems you're saying that if you pay to see a movie then you have no right to complain about how awful it was?

No, I'm just pointing out the paradox of opinions reguarding movies people are seeming to create here. If you haven't seen it, you have no right to an opinion, however, if you have paid, your opinion no longer matters because wether you like the movie or not, you've contributed.

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:No, I'm just pointing out the paradox of opinions reguarding movies people are seeming to create here. If you haven't seen it, you have no right to an opinion, however, if you have paid, your opinion no longer matters because wether you like the movie or not, you've contributed.

I would agree with that. By the time one's paid for the ticket, they've got one's money. Of course, one can try to claim a refund but they can argue that the service they provide is the chance to watch a movie, not the chance to watch a movie one will necessarily enjoy.

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:Sorry for all the rambling. Personally, I thought the movie was pretty cool, but there are a lot of things about it that could have been better.

The Movie is pretty cool alright. It's definitely above average. It just fell short of the fans's expectations. Bay's intention is to cater to the non-fans, like himself.

Ok, lets all think back to good ol 1997 or so when we had good movies coming out and no reliable internet to downlaod them from. You either paid and went to see the movie and decided you liked or didnt like it or you didnt see it at all. There was none of this dvd quality bootleg crap going on where you can see it on a psp, or burnt disk or any other medium the day it came out and then say "eh I think I'll go watch that on the big screen".

My point in saying "if you dl the movie and don't pay to see it then your opinion is ****" is that if we did not have that availability then you would not have seen the movie because you didn't want to pay for it so therefore you have no opinion on the quality of the movie.

Basically all I'm trying to say is if you take the lazy route then I dont care what you have to say good or bad.

Leonardo wrote:

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:No, I'm just pointing out the paradox of opinions reguarding movies people are seeming to create here. If you haven't seen it, you have no right to an opinion, however, if you have paid, your opinion no longer matters because wether you like the movie or not, you've contributed.

I would agree with that. By the time one's paid for the ticket, they've got one's money. Of course, one can try to claim a refund but they can argue that the service they provide is the chance to watch a movie, not the chance to watch a movie one will necessarily enjoy.

After watching the Movie. This is how you can shape the film's success or failure.

If the Movie is good, you tell people about it. And more will watch it, and pay for more tickets. Also, you'll watch it again yourself.

If the Movie is unsatisfactory. It ends there. No more chain effect.

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:If you haven't seen it, you have no right to an opinion,

See, that's understandable.

however, if you have paid, your opinion no longer matters because wether you like the movie or not, you've contributed.

I simply don't get this. Are you suggesting that the only way a person can give an opinion on a movie is by pirating it?

I'm sorry but I simply cannot see the logic here, yes, you paid to support it, but you go in not knowing what to expect. You watch it and form an opinion about it.

I really cannot see your logic in that because you pay for it and support it that you then cannot criticise it.

Burn wrote:

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:If you haven't seen it, you have no right to an opinion,

See, that's understandable.

however, if you have paid, your opinion no longer matters because wether you like the movie or not, you've contributed.

I simply don't get this. Are you suggesting that the only way a person can give an opinion on a movie is by pirating it?

I'm sorry but I simply cannot see the logic here, yes, you paid to support it, but you go in not knowing what to expect. You watch it and form an opinion about it.

I really cannot see your logic in that because you pay for it and support it that you then cannot criticise it.

Your opinion still matters. Even if you've paid for the ticket. At least it will help shape the sequel into a better movie.

If you pay for a movie that sucks, you had better believe that the sequel is going to do poorly in the box office the next go round. How many people are willing to shell out money to see a sequel to a movie they didn't like?

ahhh but it's how you define whether a movie sucks or not.

If it's your personal opinion that it sucks then there's a good chance you're in a minority, hence why the sequel will be a success regardless of what you thought of the earlier movie.

However if the movie sucked big time at the box office then there's a good chance there won't even be a sequel, and if it is then yes, it's bound to suck at the box office as well or be direct-to-dvd.

Swerve wrote:If you pay for a movie that sucks, you had better believe that the sequel is going to do poorly in the box office the next go round. How many people are willing to shell out money to see a sequel to a movie they didn't like?

Not necessarily.

If Bay decided to end his ego trip. Come down from his own clouds, and listen to people. He may make some improvements to the sequel worth watching.

I just know it won't work, and I know he'll ruin some other design of fave bots. All I hope for is not so many pot holes, better actors, more bot action, less human interaction, a less alien ugly look to Starscream, Megatron to be less of a metal crappy toothy worm design, ...well better looking bots. Yup, I don't see anything changing soon, so I know it will be another Bay movie. Leak or not, I was hoping he would care more about the Transformers, but seems to be that he cares more about "his vision" of cool Transformers. Whatever, it going to be a fun ride...I guess.

Auto Bot wrote:If Bay decided to end his ego trip. Come down from his own clouds, and listen to people. He may make some improvements to the sequel worth watching.

Explain to me why he should listen to people who haven't studied to become directors?

What? Because they're fans of the source material? That does NOT make them experts in making movies.

Reality check, the movie wasn't perfect. NO movie is perfect. EVERY director makes mistakes.