The Energon Pub

Things about this movie i already know:

1) The FX rock

2) Im gonna like it a helluva lot more than the turds that were Pirates and Spidey 3

3) Robots will knock the **** outta each other and things.


This movie is going to be at least entertaining and a great summer movie

EnergonPrimeRules wrote:First, you call him a bay hater when he hasnt said anything bad about bay

No. You don't say? So that whole "All Bay does is make action flicks" wasn't meant in an insulting manner? Because that's how it's always come off when the hundreds of other Bay haters have said it.

Anyway, congrats on reigniting a little debate that we had ended.

And I guess it comes down to what people consider "brainless". I felt there was enough of a plot and story to it all, but like I said, i'm easily entertained and don't need an intricate deep story line to enjoy a movie.

What I don't get is why people are talking about this like it's even an issue? Are you people going on about deep and meaningful plots just trying to sound smart, or are you genuinely disappointed by the prospect of Transformers being an action movie?

Sheogorath wrote:What I don't get is why people are talking about this like it's even an issue? Are you people going on about deep and meaningful plots just trying to sound smart, or are you genuinely disappointed by the prospect of Transformers being an action movie?

Okay, going to try straighten this out. I'm not disappointed, I can appreciate an action flick like any other person. It doesn't have a deep plot, I say that because it doesn't (at least not what I would consider deep), but I didn't say that in an insulting manner. As I said, I like action films too, and Bay is THE guy for action films. I'm not going to be disappointed because all I'm expecting is an above-average action movie with giant ****ing robots beating the snot out of each other, that's pretty damn awesome.

Burn wrote:No. You don't say? So that whole "All Bay does is make action flicks" wasn't meant in an insulting manner? Because that's how it's always come off when the hundreds of other Bay haters have said it.

Well not in this case, but I know it might've come across that way. I'm not insulting Bay, what he does he does very well, and this film was perfect for him. If they'd hired Vincent Gallo to do it, then I might've expected a pretty deep and meaningful story, the problem is that Transformers isn't right for that, and plus Gallo's Buffalo '66 was HORRIBLY boring (yet I loved it so I don't know). The point is, I don't hate Bay, and I'm not talking down to action films or anything. I'm just setting aside the 'deep and meaningful' because it's not a concern here, which leaves us with just the action to think about, and we've seen already the action is pretty cool. I don't hate Bay, nor action films. He's suited for the Transformers genre, I honestly don't think someone like, say, David Fincher could pull off better.

Now hopefully things are cleared up

Meverix wrote:

Sheogorath wrote:What I don't get is why people are talking about this like it's even an issue? Are you people going on about deep and meaningful plots just trying to sound smart, or are you genuinely disappointed by the prospect of Transformers being an action movie?

Okay, going to try straighten this out. I'm not disappointed, I can appreciate an action flick like any other person. It doesn't have a deep plot, I say that because it doesn't (at least not what I would consider deep), but I didn't say that in an insulting manner. As I said, I like action films too, and Bay is THE guy for action films. I'm not going to be disappointed because all I'm expecting is an above-average action movie with giant ****ing robots beating the snot out of each other, that's pretty damn awesome.

Burn wrote:No. You don't say? So that whole "All Bay does is make action flicks" wasn't meant in an insulting manner? Because that's how it's always come off when the hundreds of other Bay haters have said it.

Well not in this case, but I know it might've come across that way. I'm not insulting Bay, what he does he does very well, and this film was perfect for him. If they'd hired Vincent Gallo to do it, then I might've expected a pretty deep and meaningful story, the problem is that Transformers isn't right for that, and plus Gallo's Buffalo '66 was HORRIBLY boring (yet I loved it so I don't know). The point is, I don't hate Bay, and I'm not talking down to action films or anything. I'm just setting aside the 'deep and meaningful' because it's not a concern here, which leaves us with just the action to think about, and we've seen already the action is pretty cool. I don't hate Bay, nor action films. He's suited for the Transformers genre, I honestly don't think someone like, say, David Fincher could pull off better.

Now hopefully things are cleared up

Yeah, my post wasn't really directed at you, but I've seen a lot of people expressing their disappointment that this isn't some kind of Dickensian masterpiece or somesuch. This boggles my mind. How can someone so stupid enjoy intelligent films?

A great plot would be great, but this film has a pretty run of the mill plot.

However...

It doesn't matter.

This film gets by on pure high concept, teamed with an exception directorial job by Bay. In fact Bay has done such an excellent job that people will overlook the rather straightforward 'first to the flag' plot.

Having said that, there is nothing wrong with a light summer film like this. It might not require much brain power, but then neither does sex, and last time I checked that was a lot of fun regardless;)

Meverix wrote:If they'd hired Vincent Gallo to do it, then I might've expected a pretty deep and meaningful story, the problem is that Transformers isn't right for that,

And that's the thing. While series like BW/BM may have had fantastic stories, it's not something that can easily be done in a 2 hour or so movie. Especially a movie which is essentially introducing the characters and the concept.

And look at it this way (not just you Mev, this is a generalised post), Hasbro put the license out there to generate money. I felt the movie does a good job of introducing the non-fan to the franchise and has the potential to leave people interested in Transformers to the point they may eventually become fans.

Now this is my opinion and people will no doubt disagree with it, but I think a deep, intricate, plot filled movie, probably wouldn't succeed, nor would it do much to make new fans.

Just let me touch on something that a particular guy on youtube said.

GIANT ROBOTS...
Are we clear on the GIANT WAR MACHINES?
Good

BEATING THE **** OUT OF EACH OTHER.
As in combat with guns, cannons and the like.

FOR YOUR ENTERTAINMENT!

How can it fail? Giant Robots beating the ever living **** out of each other for your Entertainment...

Unless Megatron, Prime and Bumblebee have a love triangle I don't see how the movie can not be entertaining.

Sheogorath wrote:What I don't get is why people are talking about this like it's even an issue? Are you people going on about deep and meaningful plots just trying to sound smart, or are you genuinely disappointed by the prospect of Transformers being an action movie?

Because after we have all seen the "cool" new jagged bot designs transform in all their CG splendor for the 34268346 time and blow stuff up, it will kind of, you know, loose its impact and all that will be left is the poor script/plot and cardboard characterizations.

Starscreams bad comedy wrote:

Sheogorath wrote:What I don't get is why people are talking about this like it's even an issue? Are you people going on about deep and meaningful plots just trying to sound smart, or are you genuinely disappointed by the prospect of Transformers being an action movie?

Because after we have all seen the "cool" new jagged bot designs transform in all their CG splendor for the 34268346 time and blow stuff up, it will kind of, you know, loose its impact and all that will be left is the poor script/plot and cardboard characterizations.

Well, when you get sick of seeing Transformers fight each other, you can leave and go watch a French movie about a repressed and troubled young man who meets an eccentric, extroverted girl and experiences an emotional awakening.

edit: btw, were you honestly expecting more from what is not only a Hollywood summer blockbuster, but a Hollywood blockbuster based on a children's cartoon from the 80's?

And you can always just wait for people with crazed imaginations to crawl out of the woodwork and make some damn good fanfiction out of it...

I am a nerd, so I'm speaking from experience when I say this: NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE FANBASE. Seriously. I've seen people write out long and meaninful stories for characters who only have a second or two of screen time. I've seen shows like Star Trek rewritten in more ways than I'd thought humanly possible. The same has happened with Star Wars. Who's to say it can't happen here? I think the popularity of the franchise DOES NOT have an effect on how much stuff the fans give us. Instead, it just means it takes a little longer to get it.

Sheogorath wrote:edit: btw, were you honestly expecting more from what is not only a Hollywood summer blockbuster, but a Hollywood blockbuster based on a children's cartoon from the 80's?

Don't forget, we've been spoiled by tons of summer blockbusters that had decent to really good plots over the past few years.

Cases in point:

X Men (2 out of the 3)- based on comic books.

Spider Man (2 out of the 3)- also comic books. (Not intended for adults, IIRC)

Lord of the Rings (all 3)- Based on CHILDREN'S BOOKS.

Pirates of the Carribean (2 of the 3) based on a frackin RIDE.

What do these movies have in common besides great special effects and fight scenes? A good to very good storyline. Granted, it's not Frida or Les Miserables, but nonetheless, really good stories ALONG WITH action.

Er, no offence Kronos mate, but the Spiderman Movies we're pretty much plot no brainers, Lord of the Rings, well, I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that not many kids read it and the ones that do don't understand a word of it, and Pirates Didnt -really- have that good a plot. The word play was fairly decent, but plot? Please.

Spiderman succeeded because it looked good. X-men succeeded because it looked GOOD. Pirates Succeeded because it was amusing. No idea why LOTR succeeded, it was a load of homoerotic pants, probably because it looked pretty and Orlando Bloom is the Worlds Biggest Metrosexual and the wimmin loved it.

TF will succeed because it's a big explody action film. Its got the FX, it's got noise. Frankly, Id be a little disappointed if they tried to assail me with a complicated storyline. I just want to see Robots beating the snot out of each other for 2 hours, cobbled together with a paper thin plot, and explosions that will make my eyes and ears bleed for days.

I think, if you expect much more, you're going to be disappointed.

Autobot City wrote:Er, no offence Kronos mate, but the Spiderman Movies we're pretty much plot no brainers, Lord of the Rings, well, I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that not many kids read it and the ones that do don't understand a word of it, and Pirates Didnt -really- have that good a plot. The word play was fairly decent, but plot? Please.

Spiderman succeeded because it looked good. X-men succeeded because it looked GOOD. Pirates Succeeded because it was amusing. No idea why LOTR succeeded, it was a load of homoerotic pants, probably because it looked pretty and Orlando Bloom is the Worlds Biggest Metrosexual and the wimmin loved it.

TF will succeed because it's a big explody action film. Its got the FX, it's got noise. Frankly, Id be a little disappointed if they tried to assail me with a complicated storyline. I just want to see Robots beating the snot out of each other for 2 hours, cobbled together with a paper thin plot, and explosions that will make my eyes and ears bleed for days.

I think, if you expect much more, you're going to be disappointed.

Alright...you won't accept XMen or SpiderMan's plots, (even though they made you actually care for the characters) I'll accept that. But as far as LOTR being homoerotic, that just tells me that:

1) the movies somehow made you uncomfortable

2) you don't understand that men can love eachother WITHOUT having homosexual tendencies (ask any soldier who had another soldier save his life-that's the emotion that's being portrayed)

3) you really didn't understand the characters.

See, the idea was that there was this group of people who basically stopped the destruction of everything that they knew was good. They risked their lives for eachother, their homes, their friends, their family. When you come out of something like that alive, you don't care whether the person you're celebrating with is a man or a woman...you're just glad to know you've made it out together...and there's a special kind of love there. A strong bond.

Ok...enough ranting about the homoerotic stuff...but you do have to admit, if you take MB's movies and put them up against the movies I've listed, you'll see that there's more of a plot outline, and you care a bit more for the characters in the movies I've mentioned than you do in say, Armageddon (which I tried to watch tonight, but got bored). Sure, explosions and all are pretty, but I'm not a big fan of cliche'd dialogue and stereotypes that permeate MB's movies.

Oh, and let me throw another movie in the mix that I feel had a really good plot that was a blockbuster...

Batman Begins.

Notice I didn't say Superman Returns...You know why? Because that one focused too much on extraneous plot devices (Supes has a kid? Ooh, look Supes actually picked up an island of kryptonite---wait, he's stalking Lois now).

If I wanted to just watch stuff blow up, I'll go to a construction site. But, in this movie, I want a rooting interest. I want to cheer for something. And to be able to do that I have to care for the characters. I hope to god that there's a bit more development than what was in the leaked script (there doesn't look like there was much more in the stuff that I've read so far). Plus, I'm not a big fan of the fact that Megatron doesn't get revealed until near the end of the movie (I always like the bad guys). I think the approach they're trying to take in this movie is how the first Alien movie was made..you didn't get to see the alien until near the end...but that was horror. I want an enemy, not a creature.

Anyway, I digress.

I think you've gotten my point.

Kronos, those movies you mentioned didn't have deep, substantial plots, they had exciting plots, and that's what's important here.

I'm just mystified by people who are railing the movie for being a 'switch off your brain popcorn flick' as if there was any possibility of it being anything else. As if they associate Transformers with high-brow, soul nourishing art

I mean seriously people, are you used to having your brain 'switched on' while watching children's cartoons? Are you really that dumb?

edit: forgot to say, if you're saying the plot sucks because you think it's going to be boring and not because it's going to be 'dumbed down', then none of my posts here are aimed at you

Sheogorath wrote:Kronos, those movies you mentioned didn't have deep, substantial plots, they had exciting plots, and that's what's important here.

I'm just mystified by people who are railing the movie for being a 'switch off your brain popcorn flick' as if there was any possibility of it being anything else. As if they associate Transformers with high-brow, soul nourishing art

I mean seriously people, are you used to having your brain 'switched on' while watching children's cartoons? Are you really that dumb?

edit: forgot to say, if you're saying the plot sucks because you think it's going to be boring and not because it's going to be 'dumbed down', then none of my posts here are aimed at you

I think you said it best. I want an exciting plot. I'm not looking for highbrow art, but something to make me care about the characters.

As far as my brain being switched on watching cartoons, there are some that you can watch that have good plots (Batman: The Animated Series for example).

Kronos wrote:

Sheogorath wrote:Kronos, those movies you mentioned didn't have deep, substantial plots, they had exciting plots, and that's what's important here.

I'm just mystified by people who are railing the movie for being a 'switch off your brain popcorn flick' as if there was any possibility of it being anything else. As if they associate Transformers with high-brow, soul nourishing art

I mean seriously people, are you used to having your brain 'switched on' while watching children's cartoons? Are you really that dumb?

edit: forgot to say, if you're saying the plot sucks because you think it's going to be boring and not because it's going to be 'dumbed down', then none of my posts here are aimed at you

I think you said it best. I want an exciting plot. I'm not looking for highbrow art, but something to make me care about the characters.

As far as my brain being switched on watching cartoons, there are some that you can watch that have good plots (Batman: The Animated Series for example).

My feelings on it are this. I already care about the characters. I have cared about the characters since I was 7 years old. Its not as if they are entirely foreign to me and the story has to make me fall in love with them all over again. Just hearing Cullens voice as O.P. and seeing characters (that for the most part) I recognize brings back the emotion of being a child again. Honestly I am glad that they have a storyline but just watching my childhood heroes in live action would have been good enough for me. Now I know that there are people out there who are not as familiar with TF's and there has to be a decent story to make them care about the characters for this movie to succeed. So hopefully they have done a good enough job with the script to have accompished that. I guess after my wife is done watching the movie I will find out. She has absolutely no past connection to TF's.

I'm going to have a great time watching this movie either way.