The Energon Pub

I was staring at a Primus next to a Shattered Glass Botcon set the other say and I started wondering what the gods were like in the parallel universe.

In this case, would Unicron actually be the god that started everything and maintain himself as the planet Cybertron as an ever watchful god?

Would Primus actually be the bringer if Chaos and eater of planets?

Is The Fallen actually called The Cheerful? (stupid thought, I know)

So much to think about and so much to discuss... Have at it!

Well from what I can tell the Shattered Glass characters don't change their names from the standard universe so the Fallen would still be the Fallen.

However some characters do tend to just switch personalitys and/or color scemes with members of the oppiste team. So in that respect it's possible Shattered Glass Primus could be done in Unicron's color scheme and given a simular personality allthough keeping his original design rather than eating planets how about just blowing them up like the Death Star. As for Shattered Glass Unicron, do him in Primus' color scheme.

As for Cybertron, it should still be Primus to avoid changeing the design of the planet but change the backround of why Primus became Cybertron in the first place. Main universe he willing provided a home for his creations that way. Shattered Glass Universe, he was forced to become a planet after being defeated by Unicron.

Rial Vestro wrote:Well from what I can tell the Shattered Glass characters don't change their names from the standard universe so the Fallen would still be the Fallen.

There's a flaw in your logic.

Originally "The Fallen"'s true name was never revealed, it was lost to time and history.

He was called "The Fallen" by other Cybertronians because he "fell from grace" so to speak.

He was one of the original 13, and the 13 can be compared to "Angels".

So in the shattered I dont think it makes senve if he would still be called "The Fallen".

Rial Vestro wrote:As for Cybertron, it should still be Primus to avoid changeing the design of the planet but change the backround of why Primus became Cybertron in the first place. Main universe he willing provided a home for his creations that way. Shattered Glass Universe, he was forced to become a planet after being defeated by Unicron.

This I like.

Lets say after battleing his brother, Unicron the god of life, reshaped his brother into a life giving platet as punishment for his crimes.

Primus sees "his children" as parasites or bugs on his body but he starts a war between them threw manipulation.

Unicron travels the universe creating new worlds.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Unicron travels the universe creating new worlds.

This is a nice oppisite to his standard Universe incarnation however it paints a preddy disturbing picture.

Given that he normally destroys planets by eating them would this mean that Shattered Glass Unicron creates planets by regurgitating them?

Rial Vestro wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Unicron travels the universe creating new worlds.

This is a nice oppisite to his standard Universe incarnation however it paints a preddy disturbing picture.

Given that he normally destroys planets by eating them would this mean that Shattered Glass Unicron creates planets by regurgitating them?

Or "pooping" them out

Rial Vestro wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Unicron travels the universe creating new worlds.

This is a nice oppisite to his standard Universe incarnation however it paints a preddy disturbing picture.

Given that he normally destroys planets by eating them would this mean that Shattered Glass Unicron creates planets by regurgitating them?

Maybe Unicron is female in the Shattered Glass world and gives birth to new planets? I think this is one of those topics that Hasbro will never answer.

I'm liking where this is going with Primus. It adds a whole new dimension to what Cybertron was originally thought if.

I was thinking more about The 13. What if Primus made them to be his evil life destroying Transformers who sole purpose was to destroy all tings living? The Fallen could have an almost beachcomber mentality in that life is sacred. The Fallen in this case would have joined with Unicron to protect Unicron's creations. Fallen would have fallen from Primus's ideals just as his alternate self did and could still be called The Fallen.

I really wish Hasbro would make a cartoon series about Shattered Glass instead of it just being in the pages of some comics. There's so much that can be done with this series.

robofreak wrote:

Rial Vestro wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Unicron travels the universe creating new worlds.

This is a nice oppisite to his standard Universe incarnation however it paints a preddy disturbing picture.

Given that he normally destroys planets by eating them would this mean that Shattered Glass Unicron creates planets by regurgitating them?

Maybe Unicron is female in the Shattered Glass world and gives birth to new planets? I think this is one of those topics that Hasbro will never answer.

I'm liking where this is going with Primus. It adds a whole new dimension to what Cybertron was originally thought if.

I was thinking more about The 13. What if Primus made them to be his evil life destroying Transformers who sole purpose was to destroy all tings living? The Fallen could have an almost beachcomber mentality in that life is sacred. The Fallen in this case would have joined with Unicron to protect Unicron's creations. Fallen would have fallen from Primus's ideals just as his alternate self did and could still be called The Fallen.

I really wish Hasbro would make a cartoon series about Shattered Glass instead of it just being in the pages of some comics. There's so much that can be done with this series.

I was thinking that the 13 would have come about by mistake but Primus controls\influences them to do his bidding.

And I think the Fallen would be given the name "The Ascended"

I don't know about haveing an entire series set in the Shattered Glass universe but it would be kinda cool if every new series had at least 1 episode with a character or multiple characters falling into a mirror of their own universe.

Wouldn't it be funny if there was a shattered glass animated Optimus Prime who spent time as a dissembodied head insted of Megatron?

Or even better if the Shattered Glass Animated Optimus Prime had the same personality traits as Beast Wars Megatron.

It's been stated by Hasbro/TFCC that Unicron, Primus, and the 13 are singularities. There is only one of them at any given time, though they may appear in different places.

Counterpunch wrote:It's been stated by Hasbro/TFCC that Unicron, Primus, and the 13 are singularities. There is only one of them at any given time, though they may appear in different places.

That olny applys if every TF universe is part of one multiverse and not many multiverses..

And besides, it doesnt preclude the possibility that their roles could be reverse in a anti-mater universe.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Counterpunch wrote:That olny applys if every TF universe is part of one multiverse and not many multiverses...

Please enlighten me. The "many multiverses" aspect seems to create something of a gray 'redundancy' in my processor.
I do have one notion kicking around in my brain but I just want to see if what I'm thinking jives with your explanation.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Counterpunch wrote:It's been stated by Hasbro/TFCC that Unicron, Primus, and the 13 are singularities. There is only one of them at any given time, though they may appear in different places.

That olny applys if every TF universe is part of one multiverse and not many multiverses..

And besides, it doesnt preclude the possibility that their roles could be reverse in a anti-mater universe.

I'm not trying to pick a fight here, just relaying the facts as they've been stated.

Several times Hasbro and the Club have put the 'one multiverse' idea forward. The whole Axiom Nexus from the Club fiction is essentiall that, a place where all those universes come together.

Then there's the Unicron singularity...which is the cause of so much issue in Cybertron.

But...I'm not trying to argue my view on the matter. I'm just restating what the Hasbro and TFCC fiction team have said again and again. Unicron, Primus, the 13...all singularities.

They even mentioned The Fallen specifically at BotCon and why a SG version of him would NOT be like some kind of robo-Jesus.

T-Macksimus wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Counterpunch wrote:That olny applys if every TF universe is part of one multiverse and not many multiverses...

Please enlighten me. The "many multiverses" aspect seems to create something of a gray 'redundancy' in my processor.
I do have one notion kicking around in my brain but I just want to see if what I'm thinking jives with your explanation.

I'm not sure how to "enlighten" you.

The concept is simple, there are more then one multiverse, each with millions of little universe with in it.

So you would be looking at a mulitverse where everything is simmilar to that of the shattered universe.

There are shattered universe versions of G1,BW,BM,RID,A/E/C,TFA.

An intire anti mater multiverse, where Unicron is always good and Primus is always bad.

Counterpunch wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Counterpunch wrote:It's been stated by Hasbro/TFCC that Unicron, Primus, and the 13 are singularities. There is only one of them at any given time, though they may appear in different places.

That olny applys if every TF universe is part of one multiverse and not many multiverses..

And besides, it doesnt preclude the possibility that their roles could be reverse in a anti-mater universe.

I'm not trying to pick a fight here, just relaying the facts as they've been stated.

Several times Hasbro and the Club have put the 'one multiverse' idea forward. The whole Axiom Nexus from the Club fiction is essentiall that, a place where all those universes come together.

Then there's the Unicron singularity...which is the cause of so much issue in Cybertron.

But...I'm not trying to argue my view on the matter. I'm just restating what the Hasbro and TFCC fiction team have said again and again. Unicron, Primus, the 13...all singularities.

They even mentioned The Fallen specifically at BotCon and why a SG version of him would NOT be like some kind of robo-Jesus.

I'm not trying to argue either, nor am I denying or trying to change anything Hasbro has said.

What I am saying is that none of what Hasbro has said precludes the possibility that there is an antimater multiverse that hasnt been discovered yet.

This is Sci-fi story telling after all.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

T-Macksimus wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Counterpunch wrote:That olny applys if every TF universe is part of one multiverse and not many multiverses...

Please enlighten me. The "many multiverses" aspect seems to create something of a gray 'redundancy' in my processor.
I do have one notion kicking around in my brain but I just want to see if what I'm thinking jives with your explanation.

I'm not sure how to "enlighten" you.

The concept is simple, there are more then one multiverse, each with millions of little universe with in it.

So you would be looking at a mulitverse where everything is simmilar to that of the shattered universe.

There are shattered universe versions of G1,BW,BM,RID,A/E/C,TFA.

An intire anti mater multiverse, where Unicron is always good and Primus is always bad.

The redundancy in my way of thinking occured with the need for many multiverses. Why have many when the multi-verse concept should itself cover a near infinite number of universes? It stikes me as being along the same lines of having too many double-negatives in a sentence. At some point the sentence will just lose all meaning altogether. I guess I'm looking at the concept itself in over-simplistic terms. It's Monday and if I just jump in with all thrusters firing I'm liable to hurt myself or someone else, so there's my excuse.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:I'm not trying to argue either, nor am I denying or trying to change anything Hasbro has said.

What I am saying is that none of what Hasbro has said precludes the possibility that there is an antimater multiverse that hasnt been discovered yet.

This is Sci-fi story telling after all.

Sure, all that's fine.

But the SG Universe is a part of the Classics-verse and is so bound by the singularity rules that the fiction otherwise calls forth. Anything else is outside the boundaries of the rules and well...it's whatever people want.

T-Macksimus wrote:The redundancy in my way of thinking occured with the need for many multiverses. Why have many when the multi-verse concept should itself cover a near infinite number of universes? It stikes me as being along the same lines of having too many double-negatives in a sentence. At some point the sentence will just lose all meaning altogether. I guess I'm looking at the concept itself in over-simplistic terms. It's Monday and if I just jump in with all thrusters firing I'm liable to hurt myself or someone else, so there's my excuse.

The problem here is that the current "1" multiverse makes it impossible for Unicron to be good or Primus to be bad.

The multivers as its set up currently has Primus and Unicron both being 1 singler being.

Meaning the Primus and Unicron in one universe is the exact same being in the next universe.

So it makes it impossible for eith to switch roles.

Counterpunch wrote:Sure, all that's fine.

But the SG Universe is a part of the Classics-verse and is so bound by the singularity rules that the fiction otherwise calls forth. Anything else is outside the boundaries of the rules and well...it's whatever people want.

Well I wasnt trying to add to the exsisting SG universe.

I was thinking more along the lines of a seprate multivers based on the SG universe.

In other words, the multi-verse rules and theories that I have come to expect and follow in regards to other franchises are not what are adhered to in the TF multi-verse. Because I was working under the other assumption previously. I guess I didn't pick up all the pamphlets when I walked in the door a few years back. I suppose it makes sense that some things would be slightly altered from what I am used to following because the numerous "restarts" and spin-offs and the fact that we have a multi-cultural franchise that we are dealing with would necessitate more complex inner-workings. Of course, If we had followed "DC's" rules of multi-verse theory from the start years ago we wouldn't be in that mess to begin with but that would be closing the barn door after the horse is out. I'll grab the "Cliff's Notes" and catch up.

T-Macksimus wrote:In other words, the multi-verse rules and theories that I have come to expect and follow in regards to other franchises are not what are adhered to in the TF multi-verse. Because I was working under the other assumption previously. I guess I didn't pick up all the pamphlets when I walked in the door a few years back. I suppose it makes sense that some things would be slightly altered from what I am used to following because the numerous "restarts" and spin-offs and the fact that we have a multi-cultural franchise that we are dealing with would necessitate more complex inner-workings. Of course, If we had followed "DC's" rules of multi-verse theory from the start years ago we wouldn't be in that mess to begin with but that would be closing the barn door after the horse is out. I'll grab the "Cliff's Notes" and catch up.

TF's multivere is a bit different then DC's or even Marvel's for that matter.

Both DC's and Marvels idea of a multiverse is based on the idea that just about everything has a counterpart.

TF's multiverse is different because it centers around Unicron and Primus.They are the constant binding forces for all the universe within the multiverse.

Primus is the same being but in different bodies in every universe while Unicron jumps between universes.

This was the conclusion I had pretty much gathered from your explanations leading up to my last post. Well, the multi-plane movements of Unicron was kind of a given really but having never really looked into the full scope of the multi-verses in the TF Universe I hadn't really had cause to question or explore the dynamics in regards to Primus' interplay in all of it.
The whole concept is something I have purposefully avoided since my knowledge of the TF Universe is still very much American based with just a smattering of the Japanese pre-TF history and what would be considered maybe 1 small notch above standard American knowledge of Japanese G1 and BW knowledge. The more knowledge I gain the more detailed my answers to my kids questions get which causes more questions and it starts a whole domino effect that I would just as soon not deal with.

T-Macksimus wrote:This was the conclusion I had pretty much gathered from your explanations leading up to my last post. Well, the multi-plane movements of Unicron was kind of a given really but having never really looked into the full scope of the multi-verses in the TF Universe I hadn't really had cause to question or explore the dynamics in regards to Primus' interplay in all of it.
The whole concept is something I have purposefully avoided since my knowledge of the TF Universe is still very much American based with just a smattering of the Japanese pre-TF history and what would be considered maybe 1 small notch above standard American knowledge of Japanese G1 and BW knowledge. The more knowledge I gain the more detailed my answers to my kids questions get which causes more questions and it starts a whole domino effect that I would just as soon not deal with.

I know what you mean.

But at least know you understand why I felt a different mutiverse was needed to explore the idea of "role reversal" for Unicron and Primus.

The overall 'tapestry' just wouldn't turn out right without some other means of keeping the threads untangled or without cutting some out entirely which leaves us with an incomplete picture. So it's like 3-axis CAD design of multiple parts on multiple screens all contributing components meshing into the same final sub-assemblies which in turn will converge into a larger assembly later on?

T-Macksimus wrote:The overall 'tapestry' just wouldn't turn out right without some other means of keeping the threads untangled or without cutting some out entirely which leaves us with an incomplete picture. So it's like 3-axis CAD design of multiple parts on multiple screens all contributing components meshing into the same final sub-assemblies which in turn will converge into a larger assembly later on?

Sorry but you just confused the hell out of me

Sorry, I shifted into Engineering mode without really thinking about it. Just drawing parallels in my own mind that I can relate the situation too. While I am technically not an engineer or designer (I'm actually a High End Cabinet Finisher by trade) I have training in machining and blueprints and I have also done cabinet design/layout/construction. I just had a 'geek' moment there. I hadn't meant to lose you.
You can just nod and say "Sure, it's exactly like what you said" and we'll just move on to something else. Nobody will be the wiser.

T-Macksimus wrote:Sorry, I shifted into Engineering mode without really thinking about it. Just drawing parallels in my own mind that I can relate the situation too. While I am technically not an engineer or designer (I'm actually a High End Cabinet Finisher by trade) I have training in machining and blueprints and I have also done cabinet design/layout/construction. I just had a 'geek' moment there. I hadn't meant to lose you.
You can just nod and say "Sure, it's exactly like what you said" and we'll just move on to something else. Nobody will be the wiser.

Maybe I sold one of your cabinets, I "WAS" a retail manager for Homedepot before my illness.

I handled all sorts of Kitchen and Bath room designs and custom orders.