Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

Rated X wrote:So it is true. Im not sure why Hasbro created this. It's not like their target audience (kids) is going to read up on fiction. Fiction in the form of continuities is more in line with adult collectors interests. So why would Hasbro allign a bunch of continuities that most collectors hate at least one ? Especially Rescue Bots. Thats just flat out dumb. Is Hasbro attempting to brainwash completionists into buying more toys by "alligning the continuities" ???

Um...What?!?! I think you dismiss kids a little too easily. When I was a kid watching G1 and G.I. Joe, I loved the shows not just because I could act out the stories with my toys, but becasue I could follow the stories. I couldn't wait to see the next part of a multi-part story. I also created stories myself. My friends and I would pretend we were various transformers running around outside coming up with crazy plot lines that were as good as some seen in the cartoons and comics. We had fun, and our imaginations went wild.

Again, your generalizations bug me. While I definitely agree with you that Hasbro forcing an aligned continuity doesn't make much sense, I think the support for your ideas makes too broad a brush stroke too often.

Rated X wrote:So why would Hasbro allign a bunch of continuities that most collectors hate at least one ? Especially Rescue Bots. Thats just flat out dumb.

Hold it right there. Rescue Bots is awesome. Stop trying to make opinions on things you haven't experienced.

As for why they would do this, it's so that all TF fiction going forward is in one universe (except the ongoing IDW G1 comics and the Bayformers movies). The 2000s had an explosion of several different TF continuities happening simultaneously and the brand reinventing itself every couple of months, so for the 2010s they're trying to bring everything back under one banner. They're saying "This is the new Transformers". I think it's an interesting idea. You can have a bunch of stories told within the universe that don't have a lot in common, but occasionally overlap, and that's really cool to me.

That Bot wrote:

Rated X wrote:So why would Hasbro allign a bunch of continuities that most collectors hate at least one ? Especially Rescue Bots. Thats just flat out dumb.

Hold it right there. Rescue Bots is awesome. Stop trying to make opinions on things you haven't experienced.

As for why they would do this, it's so that all TF fiction going forward is in one universe (except the ongoing IDW G1 comics and the Bayformers movies). The 2000s had an explosion of several different TF continuities happening simultaneously and the brand reinventing itself every couple of months, so for the 2010s they're trying to bring everything back under one banner. They're saying "This is the new Transformers". I think it's an interesting idea. You can have a bunch of stories told within the universe that don't have a lot in common, but occasionally overlap, and that's really cool to me.

Theres nothing wrong with stories crossing paths occasionaly. I liked when the Beast Wars bots found the original Autobots ark. I liked seeing an aging Cobra Commander get a cameo apperance on a later G1 episode. I like continuities crossing paths when it it is a product of the scriptwriters and animators creativity and it actually makes sense. But I dont like it being used as a corporate publicity stunt being dictated by Hasbro executives who DONT write the fiction. Imagine if Kreo or Botshots gets a cartoon. Could you imagine Hasbro (corporate) forcing the script writers to tell a story on how the G1 characters became the Botshots ? It's almost as bad as Marvel trying to justify why Action Masters couldnt transform.

I have yet to watch Rescue Bots. The fact that it is geared towards children under 5 makes me not too interested. One day I will give it a chance. But if Bob the Builder makes a guest appearance youre gonna hear it from me !

Well the production teams know going in that they're making a product that ties into the Aligned continuity, and they have to pull from the Binder of Revelation, so they're not being forced into it any more than any other writer or producer is ever forced to make a product that conforms with what Hasbro has in mind.

Bob the Builder doesn't make any appearances in Rescue Bots, but Tim Curry does. Make of that what you will.

That Bot wrote:Well the production teams know going in that they're making a product that ties into the Aligned continuity, and they have to pull from the Binder of Revelation, so they're not being forced into it any more than any other writer or producer is ever forced to make a product that conforms with what Hasbro has in mind.

Bob the Builder doesn't make any appearances in Rescue Bots, but Tim Curry does. Make of that what you will.

Tim Curry? Maybe a Unicron tie-in?

That Bot wrote:Well the production teams know going in that they're making a product that ties into the Aligned continuity, and they have to pull from the Binder of Revelation, so they're not being forced into it any more than any other writer or producer is ever forced to make a product that conforms with what Hasbro has in mind.

Bob the Builder doesn't make any appearances in Rescue Bots, but Tim Curry does. Make of that what you will.

I see it more as restricting creativity. Tomorrow the Hasbro CEO could have a wet dream and say "were going to expand the Barbie continuity into Transformers to supplement the human aspect". These guys need to shut up and go count their money and leave storylines to the scriptwriters who do it for a living. Hasbro recently announced they will make an Easy Bake Oven that isnt pink for little boys. Can we get that in the script too ? Maybe Im exaggerating a bit, but surely you must agree this whole concept is more corporate than anything else ? It's surely not something the script writers or artists came up with.

Scriptwriters and artists are always limited by the creative direction of the people funding their project. Thus far the Aligned Continuity has not been detrimental to the brand, I think it will continue to be fine and not detrimental.

So how about that Genesis?

Rated X wrote:

That Bot wrote:

Rated X wrote:So why would Hasbro allign a bunch of continuities that most collectors hate at least one ? Especially Rescue Bots. Thats just flat out dumb.

Hold it right there. Rescue Bots is awesome. Stop trying to make opinions on things you haven't experienced.

As for why they would do this, it's so that all TF fiction going forward is in one universe (except the ongoing IDW G1 comics and the Bayformers movies). The 2000s had an explosion of several different TF continuities happening simultaneously and the brand reinventing itself every couple of months, so for the 2010s they're trying to bring everything back under one banner. They're saying "This is the new Transformers". I think it's an interesting idea. You can have a bunch of stories told within the universe that don't have a lot in common, but occasionally overlap, and that's really cool to me.

Theres nothing wrong with stories crossing paths occasionaly. I liked when the Beast Wars bots found the original Autobots ark. I liked seeing an aging Cobra Commander get a cameo apperance on a later G1 episode. I like continuities crossing paths when it it is a product of the scriptwriters and animators creativity and it actually makes sense. But I dont like it being used as a corporate publicity stunt being dictated by Hasbro executives who DONT write the fiction. Imagine if Kreo or Botshots gets a cartoon. Could you imagine Hasbro (corporate) forcing the script writers to tell a story on how the G1 characters became the Botshots ? It's almost as bad as Marvel trying to justify why Action Masters couldnt transform.

I have yet to watch Rescue Bots. The fact that it is geared towards children under 5 makes me not too interested. One day I will give it a chance. But if Bob the Builder makes a guest appearance youre gonna hear it from me !

Beast Wars and G1, as far as I know, were always intended to be the same universe, not a random crossover. If was a random crossover, you might've seen names or places homaged, but not outright included. G1 was very much a part of Beast Wars and it's apparently intended.

The Ark, Voyager and Starscream's ghost... And in different episodes at different times... That's definitely more than random crossovers. That's intentional.

There's nothing wrong with WFC/FOC/Prime/Beast Hunters being the same continuity. Bayverse is it's own, this is it's own and G1/BW/BM is it's own. The Unicron Trilogy is another example of being a singular continuity with many pieces. RID (2001) is the only stand alone I can think of. You can't count Classics/Universe as a series because it's merely a toyline with a blurb to sell the product. Nothing more, nothing less.

Rated X wrote:

That Bot wrote:Well the production teams know going in that they're making a product that ties into the Aligned continuity, and they have to pull from the Binder of Revelation, so they're not being forced into it any more than any other writer or producer is ever forced to make a product that conforms with what Hasbro has in mind.

Bob the Builder doesn't make any appearances in Rescue Bots, but Tim Curry does. Make of that what you will.

I see it more as restricting creativity. Tomorrow the Hasbro CEO could have a wet dream and say "were going to expand the Barbie continuity into Transformers to supplement the human aspect". These guys need to shut up and go count their money and leave storylines to the scriptwriters who do it for a living. Hasbro recently announced they will make an Easy Bake Oven that isnt pink for little boys. Can we get that in the script too ? Maybe Im exaggerating a bit, but surely you must agree this whole concept is more corporate than anything else ? It's surely not something the script writers or artists came up with.

Restricting creativity? Not at all. Hasbro's even said they could do what they needed to for each piece, so long as the overall story ties in. That's why pieces of each contradict sometimes. It's even been said that Hasbro recognizes it and allows it.

I just wish you would read up more on stuff like this and educate yourself before posting some of this stuff. All it does is promote a need for people to argue and bicker over ultimately pointless stuff. We're talking about toys and video games, but get angry and fight like we're talking about life and death. It's silly and could be helped so much if people would just pay attention and read, rather than be attention seekers causing trouble, either intentionally or not.

And as for Genesis/Omega Supreme? Your desire is absolutely pointless for this figure. Wanting Crazy Devy to change this figure ruins the figure. Genesis is almost a 100% perfect replication of the WFC character model. I mean, you'd swear he walked out of the screen and onto your desk. This is how he's supposed to look. Changing him even a bit to look like G1 would absolutely ruin the figure. It's existence would be pointless.

And what I don't understand is... If you're not going to buy it, then why complain about it or let it affect you? I'm not saying you shouldn't have a voice, but a poster even said you bring this out in people. That statement can be taken two ways, and generally that tends to be a negative way when people are spoken of in such a manner.

I can't afford it, I can't get it, so I'm not going to complain about it. If I do have any comments on it, it's this: Amazing work, way too expensive, but definitely a worthy work of art.

Good points. No offense taken at all.

But altering Genesis to be more G1 wouldnt be ruining the figure. Especially when any Crazy Devy add on can be removed should the figure ever be sold. Do you feel I ruined this FOC shockwave ?



It can easily be converted back to the way Hasbro intended it which I feel is inferior to the mods I gave it. Just my personal opinion. Weve seen people customize Hercules, FP Bruticus, and other very expensive figures. Im sure Genesis will not escape the hands of Frenzy/Rumble, Encline, or our very own extremely talented Getrightrobot. Then theyll turn around and flip it for $1200 to some rich european collector. Im not in that spending league, but I could afford a regular Genesis plus a $60 add on set. That is if they ever make one. Continuities aside, everything is awesome to me except the arms. What you call ruining, I would call enhancing. Just like Headrobots sets.

Rated X wrote:<Edited to get this point> I could afford a regular Genesis plus a $60 add on set. That is if they ever make one. Continuities aside, everything is awesome to me except the arms. What you call ruining, I would call enhancing. Just like Headrobots sets.

On this point, have you considered what this might do to the transformation? Not looking to fight, looking to move on and address the mod you propose. The arms are integral parts of the left and right wings and the thrusters in the back. From what you describe, I'm not sure this would look very good in alt mode.

But then I will fully agree that I am biased by the design in the video game.

Agamemnon wrote:

Rated X wrote:<Edited to get this point> I could afford a regular Genesis plus a $60 add on set. That is if they ever make one. Continuities aside, everything is awesome to me except the arms. What you call ruining, I would call enhancing. Just like Headrobots sets.

On this point, have you considered what this might do to the transformation? Not looking to fight, looking to move on and address the mod you propose. The arms are integral parts of the left and right wings and the thrusters in the back. From what you describe, I'm not sure this would look very good in alt mode.

But then I will fully agree that I am biased by the design in the video game.

Just like my FOC Shockwave with Cyclonus legs and no wings, I have pretty much tossed the alt mode out the window. In my honest opinion FOC Omega's spaceship mode looks like his robot mode all folded up rather than a serious looking space ship. Since the Activision artists never envisioned an actual transforming toy being created, they should have went with a more conventional ark style space ship instead of that space station looking jet booster thing they came up with. It worked out real well being that a 3rd party brought the artwork to life in both modes including transformation. But if Hasbro had done it, everyone would have complained about the crappy "fold up the robot" alt mode. (hence re-entry mode ROTF Ravage) Im a G1 fan so Im pretty stuck on the whole reason he has one blaster hand and one claw hand to combine and form a conventional rocket. I understand you favor FOC Omega as a video game fan and want game accuracy. Obviously we cant change the game. But if we could go back in time and stop the activison artists from giving him "monkey arms" would you be opposed to it ? I mean the same FOC Omega transforming into into the same spaceship you seem to like, but with no monkey arms in robot mode...Wouldnt that be cool ???

Rated X wrote:

Agamemnon wrote:

Rated X wrote:<Edited to get this point> I could afford a regular Genesis plus a $60 add on set. That is if they ever make one. Continuities aside, everything is awesome to me except the arms. What you call ruining, I would call enhancing. Just like Headrobots sets.

On this point, have you considered what this might do to the transformation? Not looking to fight, looking to move on and address the mod you propose. The arms are integral parts of the left and right wings and the thrusters in the back. From what you describe, I'm not sure this would look very good in alt mode.

But then I will fully agree that I am biased by the design in the video game.

Just like my FOC Shockwave with Cyclonus legs and no wings, I have pretty much tossed the alt mode out the window. In my honest opinion FOC Omega's spaceship mode looks like his robot mode all folded up rather than a serious looking space ship. Since the Activision artists never envisioned an actual transforming toy being created, they should have went with a more conventional ark style space ship instead of that space station looking jet booster thing they came up with. It worked out real well being that a 3rd party brought the artwork to life in both modes including transformation. But if Hasbro had done it, everyone would have complained about the crappy "fold up the robot" alt mode. (hence re-entry mode ROTF Ravage) Im a G1 fan so Im pretty stuck on the whole reason he has one blaster hand and one claw hand to combine and form a conventional rocket. I understand you favor FOC Omega as a video game fan and want game accuracy. Obviously we cant change the game. But if we could go back in time and stop the activison artists from giving him "monkey arms" would you be opposed to it ? I mean the same FOC Omega transforming into into the same spaceship you seem to like, but with no monkey arms in robot mode...Wouldnt that be cool ???

I actually quite like the video game aesthetics. I always though Omega had a "monkey arms" look, as you put it. I have the G1 encore, and they also look very similar in proportion.

Given how he transforms in the game (and I'm not sure I would agree with your point that the artists didn't think about it) the arms seem to mesh perfectly. Perhaps they could have been slimmer, but I like it the way it is. I had envisioned how the thing transforms. That's why I really like this Genesis. Oh, if only I could win the lottery or something.

The Energon retool also has a pretty enormous forearm, but it seems to not be overly large. And he's a great shout for those who do not want to spend a ton on project Genesis.

I don't think there's much point in tryin g to make Genesis more G1. When you neuter transformation then there's no point ot the thing being a Transformer.

I think it'd be MUCH more viable to try and make YotS OS more G1. At least in robot mode.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:I don't think there's much point in tryin g to make Genesis more G1. When you neuter transformation then there's no point ot the thing being a Transformer.

I think it'd be MUCH more viable to try and make YotS OS more G1. At least in robot mode.

Other than the colors, YOTS Omega is not as "G1" as Genesis. Plus he is asymmetrical. On the other hand, Genesis would just need new arms to be close to the G1 cartoon in my opinion. (Legs and Arms normal human length) I think all the people that like the monkey arms look have become quite accustomed to it because for Bulkhead and a few of the Bayformers. But for me, it looks silly.

Rated X wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:I don't think there's much point in tryin g to make Genesis more G1. When you neuter transformation then there's no point ot the thing being a Transformer.

I think it'd be MUCH more viable to try and make YotS OS more G1. At least in robot mode.

Other than the colors, YOTS Omega is not as "G1" as Genesis. Plus he is asymmetrical. On the other hand, Genesis would just need new arms to be close to the G1 cartoon in my opinion. (Legs and Arms normal human length) I think all the people that like the monkey arms look have become quite accustomed to it because for Bulkhead and a few of the Bayformers. But for me, it looks silly.

I dunno, those legs on Genesis aren't very cartoon true. At maybe the waist, more accurately. I feel the overall proportions of YotS are truer to what OS looked in the toon.

Maybe he's need some chest armour to sell it more. Since we're imaging rails on the back we may as well further imagine some chest armor.

Although I think YotS is pretty good as he is.

i think most people would rather have genesis for the same price as yots os. when has anyone ever wanted a half- assed (red foot, clear HAND not cannon, etc) repaint and partial retool over a completely new, larger, and more detailed version of the same character?

as for alt mode maybe its a stretch for a spaceship but at least i get the mechanics of a spaceship, can anyone describe to me how a space train works or how practical it would be were any of this a reality?

as far as debating whether its cannon or not because its based off of a video game rendition of omega supreme, thats more cannon than a random repaint/retool isn't it?

i think, and this is not directed at anyone in particular, that many people are simply trying to convince themselves and, in turn, others that genesis is inferior to yots os in some way simply because they dont want to spend the mula on genesis,which is understandable i do that all the time, but I mean yots os is based off of a figure that is from a line filled with clunky, blocky, kid-oriented transformers. the only line of transformers for which i cant even think of a reason to buy a single item from it and i own around 1,500 transformers. i dont need much of a reason!

this is all not meant to offend or be caustic but to support the following statement:

planet x done good and we all know it.

of course the first 3rd party to create a giant fig in the scorponok/overlord/unicron size class will be ridiculed the first person or group of people to do anything is always ridiculed. But they have set a standard here that will be hard to match, again, depending on whether or not there are qc issues yet to be revealed. he was holding a supreme class fig over his head with one hand unsupported for hours though......

Agreed.

Coming from someone who, not 10 mins ago, almost pressed "add to cart" on YOTS OS.

I'm very excited to see the actual final product from Planet X, even if I don't plan on buying it.

to be fair, once its in space a train is no less practical than a space ship.

craggy wrote:to be fair, once its in space a train is no less practical than a space ship.

Lol...um...trains require tracks. I see no thrusters on him anywhere for propulsion. Therefore, unless the cosmos are lousy with railroad tracks, OS is SOL when he's in space.

Galaxy Express 999. I rest my case.

I don't see anybody saying Genesis is not a marvel of a figure. I see people saying it's more expensive than they're willing to spend on a WFC Omega Supreme, and that Hasbro's much cheaper alternative fills in their Classics OS needs well enough.

craggy wrote:to be fair, once its in space a train is no less practical than a space ship.

haha thats true as long as there was propulsion and maneuvering thrusters of some sort you're right. hell if os was equipped with an ftl drive it wouldn't even really need propulsion ala battlestar galactica base stars.

But then why be a train unless omega supreme is a railroading entheusiest when he's not obliterating cons. i suppose if i could transform into something i enjoyed rather than an alt mode just being utilitarian i would.

btw i like trains, i have a sizeable collection of those too. i guess my main point about this sub- topic is that if im gonna pay anything above, i dunno, $50 for a transformer, small or large, third party or not, we're talking collector piece dollar amounts so the alt mode should be less of a kids fantasy type mode and more of a war machine or scale model of a car or something.

all just my opinion. anyone that likes yots os is perfectly justified in so doing of course. If genesis was not an option i very well might jump on board the space train!

I simply felt a sort of compulsion to defend genesis and planet x because they did way more work in creating genesis than did hasbro in lazily retooling and recoloring a pre existing figure, removing electronics, and doubling the price! I think planet x went through alot of work to bring something really special to us fans whereas, as usual, hasbro simply saw a way to use our love of the hobby to get more money out of a mold. A sound financial strategy to be sure but ultimately why they will lose my money, and others money, to a third party.....again.....

That Bot wrote:Galaxy Express 999. I rest my case.

I don't see anybody saying Genesis is not a marvel of a figure. I see people saying it's more expensive than they're willing to spend on a WFC Omega Supreme, and that Hasbro's much cheaper alternative fills in their Classics OS needs well enough.

^ Uh, yuppers!

I like Genesis because of the video game aesthetics. I do not care for the direction the Bayformers have gone. (I'm about ready to sell my set. Somewhere my wife just cheered.) So, I don't think I'm all in for the monkey arms. I mean, really, I've got G1 Omega in my display case fighting Herc and he has wimpy upper arms, and overly long, bulky fore arms. I'd say that there is still that monkey arm aesthetic you describe, Rated X.

And md88prime, there were a lot of great toys in the Energon line (where YOS Omega came from). Downshift was a fantastic homage to Wheeljack that was fun to play with. I liked Starscream and Galvatron. Battle ravage was cool. The Fansproject add-ons made them awesome, but there's the combiner teams of Bruticus and Superion, and a version of Devastator that wasn't completely horrible. Grimlock and Swoop were fun in all their modes, even combined, though it was hard to pose them. Insecticon, Arcee, Rodimus, Shockblast, and the almighty Scorponok. It was a fun line. I even liked the dual combiners like Hotshot, Jetfire, Inferno, and the rest.

I don't even know where to go with the Train Bots. If ever there was a cartoon intended to sell toys, it was the Headmaster series. Suspension of disbelief? Phaw! This is almost worse than the mass shifting from Soundwave and Megatron to the Pretenders.

What were we talking about again? Oh, yes. If Genesis was the price of YOS Omega, I'd be all over it like dark energon on Cliffy.

That Bot wrote:Galaxy Express 999. I rest my case.

I don't see anybody saying Genesis is not a marvel of a figure. I see people saying it's more expensive than they're willing to spend on a WFC Omega Supreme, and that Hasbro's much cheaper alternative fills in their Classics OS needs well enough.

not in so many words no but after a few dozen ape arm, color nitpick, and aesthetic comments they might as well be.

anyway the complaints ive seen on this forum are no more or less than usual, again, i just felt the need to defend planet x

agamemnon, whats good is relative so we're both right which means hasbro wins haha

Agamemnon wrote:
I like Genesis because of the video game aesthetics. I do not care for the direction the Bayformers have gone. (I'm about ready to sell my set. Somewhere my wife just cheered.) So, I don't think I'm all in for the monkey arms. I mean, really, I've got G1 Omega in my display case fighting Herc and he has wimpy upper arms, and overly long, bulky fore arms. I'd say that there is still that monkey arm aesthetic you describe, Rated X.

There seems to be alot of confusion about what people mean when they say the term "G1". Some people use it to describe G1 toy accuracy. Others use it to describe G1 cartoon accuracy. I ALWAYS use it to describe CARTOON accuracy. If I wanted toy accuracy, I would just buy the 80's toys and not worry about a classics upgrade that has more cartoon aesthetics that the original toys lacked. With that being said, Im not seeing any monkey arms here:





Although the G1 toy does have sort of monkey arms, the G1 cartoon and comic book artists must of saw how stupid it looked and said f**k that...

So the FOC designers decided to bring the monkey arms back and make them even BIGGER than the G1 toy's arms. I say that s**t looks ugly as f**k. And even if I was a video game fan, I would still say the same s**t. Just my opinion.

Also, I dont understand why people keep saying Year of the Snake Omega is supposed to be FOC Omega. It is clearly meant to homage G1 Omega. The arms are not red like FOC Omega. And while the claw on YOTS Omega does slightly resemble the FOC claw, everything else on the repaint and the new head screams G1.