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TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

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TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sun Aug 14, 2022 6:16 am

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TFTM.jpg



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Chris McFeely wrote:I've been so busy at TFNation this week that I've barely had time to post! Last night, Jim Sorenson and I performed a massive two-and-a-half hour presentation going through the original, long-lost first draft of The Transformers: The Movie, for the first time anywhere in the world! If you're at the con today, join us at 12:30 for a much more sedate panel as we talk more about this draft and how we got from there to the film we know!

No video of this panel from me - it's a collaborative effort with Jim and TFNation's team of talented artists, so I don't consider it "mine" to post. I'm unsure if Tfnation are recording it themselves. Check out my twitter feed for a retweet of a thread live-blogging last night's panel as it happened!


I didn't see a thread for TFNation, but whatever. This poster is what intrigued me, more than this weekend's event. Three characters I don't immediately recognise and the bizarre "crowned" look for the Seekers?

Obviously if anyone wants to add either the panel reading or elaboration on the poster, feel free.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Greebtron » Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:51 am

In terms of a proper writeup of the panel and thus the script contents? I believe certain long-term members here have that in hand, so I shall keep schtum.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Sabrblade » Mon Aug 15, 2022 5:48 pm

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Indeed, a full report will be incoming. Stay tuned.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Sabrblade » Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:14 pm

Motto: "Can't do a job halfway. What's worth doing is worth doing well, I say."
Weapon: Saber Blade
This past weekend, TFNation 2022 was held in the United Kingdom, whereat Transformers uber-fans Jim Sorenson and Chris McFeely held a very special presentation on the Saturday night of August 13, which was followed by an extra panel the next day on Sunday, August 14.

This presentation was, without a doubt, the event of the weekend. Back in June, Chris held a livestream on YouTube in which he momentarily hyped up this event as "one of the most important panels ever held at a Transformers convention." He later made this post on his YouTube community portal, which featured the following promotional art:

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To cut to the chase, Jim and Chris held a live presentation of the long lost, original, very first draft script of Transformers: The Movie (1986) written by Ron Friedman!

For about 12 years, this original script was thought to have been lost to time and gone for good. But about two years ago in the summer of 2020, G1 cartoon writer Flint Dille was going through his storage and unearthed this long lost script. Jim Sorenson then flew out to Los Angeles and spent the next week scanning as much of the script as he could. And now, after all these years, Jim and Chris have finally made the contents of this lost piece of Transformers known to the public!

At the presentation, they provided an in-depth summary of the script's events, accompanied by brand new artwork created especially for the occasion. While the artwork is unofficial, it provided visual illustrations of several events described by Friedman's script, each interpreted by the artists who drew them. Said artists included Ed Pirrie, Andy Turnbull, James Marsh, and Kris Carter.

While I, myself, was not present at the event, live updates were provided through both the TFWiki Discord server (most notably from uses Jacob McBaggins, Broadside, and Greeby) and the Twitter of James Bach. It is from these sources that I have compiled the following full report of the presentation.

---

By and large, the script is only vaguely resemblant to the final version of the movie. Some broad strokes are similar, but the biggest differences lie in the details. In fact, Flint Dille has previously gone on record calling this script "incoherent". As you will soon begin to see, "incoherent" is the kindest word one could use to describe it, as it honestly feels like Friedman just made up as he went along.

This script draft was first written in August 1984, before the first episode of the G1 cartoon had even aired. Literally right after the final episode of Season 1, "Heavy Metal War", had been written. Season 2 hadn't even been conceptualized yet. No date is given for when it takes place. Not 2005, not the 1980s, nothing.

The story begins with the Battle of Autobot City. Except, it's not Autobot City, but just a steel mill. The Constructicons steal some steel ore from carts around the plant to build siege towers to attack the place. The Autobots who defend the steel mill are (from left to right):
  • Hot Rod – Depicted here using the earliest known design by Floro Dery.
  • Tanker – Grizzled old Autobot who's missing an eye, transforms into a Sherman tank.
  • Magnus – Not "Ultra" Magnus. Drawn here in Floro Dery's early design that was later used for Orion Pax before the Diaclone Powered Convoy toy was decided to represent him.
  • Arcee – Field medic, shown here in an early Floro Dery design.
  • Wheeljack – Very sexist and misogynistic toward Arcee throughout the entire script, which is played for "comedy".
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As the Decepticons continue their attack on the steel mill, three of them combine into a cannon that begins to shoot "fire snow" at the Autobots. What is fire snow? Napalm. Yes, the Decepticons attack the Autobots... with napalm.

Tanker gets his arm burnt off and, in the heat of the moment, acts rather sexist toward Arcee. Magnus grabs an industrial bucket and, in a very cartoony moment, simply catches the balls of fire snow napalm in the bucket and tosses it back at the Decepticons. He saves Hot Rod in the process. The Decepticons dive for cover but get blown up by their own napalm tossed back at them, and are clobbered by the steel bucket.

Reinforcements for the Autobots arrive aboard an old locomotive train carrying rocket fuel in flatbed cars.

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The train is manned by human allies General Blaze and Colonel Rusty Steel, the latter of whom is described by the script as an "Indiana Jones" type. Hasbro's feedback on the character basically says that his personality would later be applied to Springer.

General Blaze
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Colonel Rusty Steele
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The train carrying the rocket fuel is meant to distract the Decepticons from their attack on the steel mill, making them think the train is just a simple fuel delivery and an easy target, from which the Autobots can ambush Megatron.

Starscream attacks the train and ties it in a pretzel knot. The train then begins to transform from an old locomotive into a bullet train, a process called "Transformation Alpha". Starscream is then run over. (It is at this point that Jim pointed out that Starscream will have a lot to do in this story, only to clarify that he gets his butt kicked a lot.) The train is now revealed to be an Autobot Triple Changer named Rails, who commences "Transformation Beta" into his robot mode... A GIANT SNAKE ROBOT MODE!!

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Hot Rod soon runs out of ammo... in a laser gun. A Decepticon charges at him with a laser chainsaw, but Tanker steps in and trips up the Decepticon, who then falls on his own laser chainsaw and is bisected in half by it.

Then the Optimus and Megatron fight happens... basically the same as it does in the final movie, verbatim even. As the Decepticons retreat from the battle following Megatron's defeat (no Astrotrain here, they all just fly out into space on their own power), Ratchet, Wheeljack, and Arcee perform triage on Prime and determine that the damage is fatal. Rusty Steele objects, stating that they can't make that call in the field. Half the Autobots go with Ratchet to take the dying Optimus back to the Autobots' volcano base, while the other half go with Wheeljack to build ships to chase after Megatron. Gears is here as well, and is an insensitive jerk about the whole thing.

Basically, Friedman was mandated to kill off Optimus, but no other 1984 Autobots die either. The idea behind all this was to make the movie start out like a typical G1 cartoon episode until it wasn't. Hot Rod is very broken up over Optimus's current state ("I don't know how I'll stand it if Prime dies because of me"), but Tanker basically just tells him to suck it up and not be such a wimp. Jerk.

Meanwhile, the Decepticons make it back to Cybertron by just flying all the way there. In the final version of the movie, the place at which Starscream's coronation is held is referred to by its script as the Decepticon Hall of Heroes. In this script, the Hall of Heroes is basically described as a sci-fi version of Adolf Hitler's Nuremburg Rally Hall, in the Third Reich. According to Jim and Chris, the script is practically dripping with full-on Nazi references all over the place.

Megatron is there with them and dies unceremoniously while everyone argues over who gets to be the new leader. A fight soon breaks out. As Starscream and Skywarp fight, they inadvertently blow up the urn that was meant to house Megatron's "life spark". Without it, Megatron's ghost flies out of his body. As he pathetically begs and pleads for the other Decepticons to preserve his essence, they take no notice and continue their fight. Megatron's purple "life spark" ghost helplessly flies off into space.

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Back on Earth, the entire volcano that houses the Autobots' base now opens up like Tracy Island from Thunderbirds. It's now a whole base for both Autobots and humans. Two such humans are Dr. Ellen Prentiss and her young son Daniel. Yep, that Daniel. In this script, he is not Spike's son. In fact, Spike isn't even in this story at all. Here, Daniel looks up to and idolizes Colonel Rusty, who in turn calls the boy "Dan-o".

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Springer is also one the Autobots there, whom the script describes as "a huge, Arnold Schwarzenegger type". He is also described by the script as turning into something like either a jet-powered missile launcher, or a jet-powered steam roller. He also barely does anything in the whole story.

Out in space, Megatron's ghost is summoned to the planet Unicron. In this version, Unicron is the name of the planet and its leader is a mysterious intelligence simply known as "the Entity". Planet Unicron has tree trunks that resemble a big hand, and trees that are like hair. (Attendee reaction to this described it as "horrid".) The Entity agrees to recreate Megatron into Galvatron in exchange for Megatron/Galvatron going back to Cybertron, bringing all of its Decepticon inhabitants under the Entity's will, and then taking all of the Decepticons to Earth for a more important plan.

Galvatron is apparently described in the script as both looking like a bigger Megatron covered in metal scales, and looking like he's wearing a black military uniform. For the accompanying fanmade artwork, however, he is instead depicted in his early Floro Dery design with toy-accurate colors. He also receives a unique insignia on his chest (looks like the artists chose to base their interpretation of it on the Beast Wars Neo Blentron insignia).

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And now comes Optimus's death scene. In this version, instead of the Matrix of Leadership, a little green baby version of Optimus in energy form emerges from his chest. It is referred to as Optimus's "Matrix", long before the Creation Matrix was a thing in the Marvel Comics. It's basically Optimus's "life spark", like what came out of Megatron earlier when he died. The Baby Optimus goes into Magnus's body, making him "Ultra" Magnus.

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On Cybertron, Galvatron arrives and Starscream recognizes him as Megatron. Starscream gets to live in this version and all of the Decepticons get new upgraded forms by the power of Planet Unicron. For the Seekers, the artists chose to base their interpretation of these upgraded forms off of Starscream's coronation gear from the final movie. In the script, the idea was to just make them bigger.

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Cybertron is then destroyed in a beam of light and NOBODY cares. All except for Galvatron for about 30 seconds. The Decepticons then head for Earth. End of Act 1.

---

Act 2 begins with the Autobots building giant metal shields to protect Earth's cities so that they can take their new fleet of ships Wheeljack is building and go after the Decepticons without worry. The shields are said to be made out of metals with ridiculous names like "titano-rubidium steel" and "durabyl-metal". The script apparently takes two or three whole pages to describe the shields.

Colonel Rusty Steele seems to be taking point in this operation, while a bunch of "comedy" bits are going on around him. Namely, Wheeljack has a running "gag" where Arcee will do something really competent behind his back while he is oblivious to this and makes several sexist remarks about "she-bots". And he does this all throughout the script.

When the Decepticons arrive, Teletraan I cannot even compute their newly-acquired power. The Entity fires a green energy blast from space that strikes Galvatron, goes through him into the other Decepticons, and powers them all up enough for them to blast through all the shields the Autobots just built, destroying them in an instant despite multiple script pages setting up the shields.

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Oh, and Prowl is here and doesn't die. And Starscream gets beaten up a second time, suffering endless slapstick. Even so, the Autobot base is overrun and they have to retreat.

A time-skip occurs. The Decepticons have a "Sweep Party" of black "Gestapo-like" bots searching for the Autobots, who have since set up a guerilla camp. This is from where the idea of the Sweeps originated.

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The Decepticons have apparently taken over and are building an "energy drain cage" around the Earth, in order to siphon its energy and send it all to Planet Unicron.

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Daniel gets the camp found by the Sweep Gestapo by accidently setting off Teletraan I, who mistakes him for an intruder.

Now engaged in a guerilla war, Tanker and Hot Rod go off to recruit a crack squad of the best of the best to help everyone get to the one remaining Autobot ship, so they can go find the source of the Decepticons' new powers.

First is Chemico, "the walking laboratory". He literally just pops up to make a smokescreen and never appears again.

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Magnus also transforms... into either a truck or a combine harvester. The idea behind what his altmode should be was "What's the coolest vehicle to run someone over with?"

The Autobots knock away the Decepticons with baseball bats and escape via a river raft. Yes, really.

Springer is also here. As is Starscream. You know what that means? It's clobbering time, Screamer! Springer uses his jumping power, which Jim compares to bouncing like Tigger. Springer grabs Starscream and a generic Decepticon and bonks their heads together, which also results in the two 'Cons impaling each other with their limbs. Starscream is furious and threatens to boil the Autobots in their own pee (yes, really!), and demands "UNKNOT MEEEEE!!" (Chris McFeely did his best and most throat-hurting Chris Latta impression for this line).

Other Autobot recruits include Blurr (who in this version talks reeeeeeeaallly slow, like Jimmy Stewart), Grimlock, Swoop, Sludge (but no other Dinobots) and Mentlar (a "Carl Sagan" type whose role as the "smart guy" is later taken by Perceptor).

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Don't confuse his name with "Metlar", who is one of the Inhumanoids. He's "Mentlar", because of his great "mental" capacity. He turns into a radar truck.

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Mentlar presses a button that activates a giant energy grid that he uses like a big flyswatter to disable the Insecticons and strip them of their Unicron upgrades, allowing the Dinobots to defeat them. Afterward, this grid is never used or brought up again.

The Autobots reach the last ship they still have, which is hidden inside an ice cave.

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As Rusty, Daniel, and Ellen board the ship, Rusty gives Daniel his lucky silver dollar as a promise that they'll get through this. As the ship takes off, Hot Rod, Tanker, and the Dinobots are still fighting on the ground and just fly up alongside the ship, flying through space outside the vessel. Bumblebee shows up here just to get blasted off-screen by a cluster bomb. Wheeljack and Arcee remain on Earth to keep fighting the Decepticons and Wheeljack has more misogynist moments with Arcee.

Galvatron is mentally tortured by the Entity, who calls him an imbecile and tells him to destroy the fleeing Autobot ship. He give Galvatron a ship of his own, which resembles an aircraft carrier (this was the prototype version of Galvatron's ship from the final movie). Rusty and Daniel man the Autobot ship's guns like Han and Luke in Star Wars: A New Hope. And then a random space hurricane interrupts the battle, destroying Galvatron's ship and hurling Hot Rod, Tanker, and the Dinobots off into space. Galvatron emerges from the wreckage of his ship, sees no Autobots, and thinks he's won. End of Act 2.

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---

Act 3 begins with the Autobots' ship crash-landing on Planet Unicron's moon, drawn there by a tractor beam brainwave.

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Back on Earth, Arcee twirls Starscream around like a wrestler and tosses him at a freeway overpass, collapsing it on top of other Decepticons. Despite this, Wheeljack is still sexist to her. This is also Starscream's last scene.

Hot Rod, Tanker, and the Dinobots end up on a planet that would later become Quintessa in the final movie. Sharkticons proceed to eat Swoop, but only nibble on him rather than consume him entirely.

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The script keeps cutting back and forth between the moon with Magnus's team, the planet with Hot Rod's team, and Earth with Wheeljack and Arcee, the latter of whom ends up kissing Wheeljack on the cheek at one point.

Galvatron is told by the Entity to go into space and kill the Autobots stranded on the moon. His army flies off from Earth in space cruisers they just suddenly have now. As they approach Unicron's moon, the Autobots there trick the Decepticons with cardboard cutouts as decoys.

Hot Rod, Tanker, and the Dinobots witness the arena-style execution of a rock-based alien named Granix. Yep, before he was Kranix, he was Granix, his name based on "granite". And the Sharkticon pit was a battle arena rather than a shark tank.

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Here, the Sharkticons have sensors that direct them to eat whatever they bump into, likely explaining what those antennae they have are supposed to be.

When Hot Rod's group stands trial, they are found "Innocent of trespassing but guilty of insolence". Hot Rod blinds the Sharkticons, but the Quintesson uses its mental powers to just make more Sharkticons from scrap. Hot Rod subdues the Quint and orders it to use its mind powers to find the other Autobots. It ends up finding Planet Unicron.

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On Unicron's moon, the Decepticons have found the Autobots' three human allies, who all wear exo-suits implied to work by telekinesis. Rumble forces Daniel to watch Dirge try to crush Ellen to death, but Daniel saves his mother by crushing Dirge's torso inward and tossing him onto Rumble.

Then the Junkions show up, the leader of which is literally described by the script as wearing a Nazi helmet. The artists chose instead to draw him wearing a WWI German helmet because there's just so much Nazi stuff in this script!!!

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Elsewhere on Unicron's moon, Galvatron just straight up murders Magnus, Mentlar, and Blurr. Like, he just kills them. Dead. No repairs, no rebuilding them. Just dead. And Hasbro was furious.

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Galvatron steals the glowing baby Optimus from Magnus and puts it in a jar around his neck.

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What comes next are a couple of big reveals: The Junkions built Unicron! It was originally built to be a protector, but something went wrong. The Junkions then reveal a flaw in Unicron that serves as its weakness. And that weakness is... MISSING from the script! Yep, unfortunately, the script that Flint Dille found in storage was missing three whole pages that detail this very important part of the story. One of these pages also presumably sees Hot Rod, Tanker, and the Dinobots reuniting with the others on the moon, with Tanker freeing the Autobots from the Junkions with the Universal Greeting.

As Planet Unicron absorbs the siphoned energy from Earth, the Entity is powered up enough to transform the planet into a humanoid robot form. It heads towards Earth, munching other planets along the way. And at this point, Wheeljack FINALLY apologizes to Arcee for being such a sexist misogynist.

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A Junkion named Scrapo befriends the Dinobots, whose role was presumably later taken by Wheelie in the final movie.

In a surprise twist that shocks absolutely no one, the Entity and Unicron are revealed to be one and the same. In order to defeat him, the Autobots must fight their way into Unicron's core. Once there, Daniel is the only one small enough to fit into the area they need to get into to destroy Unicron. But then, they suddenly remember that they also need the Baby Optimus that Galvatron still has. So they go all the way back out to go get it. Hot Rod and Rusty corner Galvatron, who tries to fuse the Baby Optimus with himself into nothingness. But he is defeated by Dr. Ellen.

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The Autobots and humans go all the way back into Unicron's core, where Daniel takes the Baby Optimus and puts it into the core, blowing by Unicron. Galvatron gets blasted off on one of Unicron's severed fingers.

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In the aftermath, Earth just gets all better after being shriveled up from its massive energy drain. A parade is held and Hot Rod holds Daniel up on his shoulders. The End.

---

The day after this presentation was given, Chris and Jim held a follow-up panel with more information and artwork.

It is speculated that Rails was replaced with the Anibots (Autobot versions of the Predacons before those toys were decided to be Decepticons) in later script drafts, and then ultimately replaced by just the Dinobots defending Autobot City in the final movie. (The concept of Rails as a large, multi-changing transport Autobot with a bestial robot mode may have possibly even evolved into Sky Lynx.)

"Life Spark" came from a memo note from Sunbow to refer to the leadership aspect of "the Matrix", which had yet to be a thing at the time. "'Til all Matrixes are One" evolved into "'Til all Life Sparks are one", which after a game of telephone became just "'Til all are One".

As everyone could probably tell by now, the concept of Tanker would eventually evolve into Kup. Jim reasoned that Tanker changed into Kup because Hasbro, at the time, was looking at the next generation of Autobots and Decepticons being cars and jets, not tanks.

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At some point in the script, Grimlock sees Arcee and thinks she's so cool that he want there to be female Dinobots.

A few more pieces of the fanmade artwork:

Granix
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Quintesson (the name "Quintesson" originally came from a restaurant)
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This Quintesson is based on Floro Dery's early Quintesson design.

Sweep Gestapo-bot
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Junkion (who's meant to look like something out of the Road Warrior)
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Q&A

The suspected intended runtime for this script is two hours.

Unicron's backstory as having originally been created as a protector is removed from later script iterations, and is ultimate made as vague and undisclosed as it is in the final movie.

Galvatron's original altmode in this script is basically a cannon covered in guns all over.

Hot Rod has no Autobot symbol in these art pieces because the design notes in the script simply don't mention it. The second design iteration does put it on, though.

Now that we know where the Sweeps came from, what about Cyclonus's armada from the later script drafts? They would have been just a bunch of Cyclonus duplicates.

Colonel Rusty Steele was never Daniel's father. Daniel just had hero worship for him.

And most importantly of all, the script itself WILL eventually be uploaded online for all eyes to see. We don't know when, but it is definitely planned to be released at some point later on.

FIN
Last edited by Sabrblade on Fri Aug 19, 2022 1:15 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Burn » Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:55 pm

Motto: "Freedom is the right of all sentient beings to randomly click things in the Admin Panel to see what it breaks."
Bloody hell that's a lot to take in.

Rusty Steel? ugh ... just ... no.
Tanker - Oh man, I want a figure of this guy.
Rails - Love the "snake oil" tanks, very interesting concept.
Gestapo Sweep - Gestapo part aside, I'd love to see a black Scourge redeco with a one-eyed Whirl head.

Reading all that as an adult, I wouldn't have enjoyed it. But as a 10 year old who knew no better? I probably would have loved it.

And that's tragic. :lol:
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Greebtron » Wed Aug 17, 2022 6:04 am

As you will soon begin to see, "incoherent" is the kindest word one could use to describe it, as it honestly feels like Friedman just made up as he went along.


I agree that "incoherent" is too kind. Personally, I would go for "abysmally incompetent".

Something that has been out there for a while, but now gains new context: Floro Dery's first sketch of The Entity:
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And of course, there's the outline for the second script. Which is clearly drawn up by the Sunbow office and handed to Friedman. To metaphorically grab this first script by the scruff of the neck and make it get with the program. Pay particular attention to Friedman's handwritten notes scrawled throughout the document.

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https://drive.google.com/file/d/1tAWJAG ... sp=sharing
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby AbdulHannan » Wed Aug 17, 2022 12:14 pm

Thank you for such a through post. Can anyone give me the discord server link that I can join here? Would greatly appreciate it.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Sabrblade » Thu Aug 18, 2022 10:42 am

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Looking over my report, I just now realized there was one image I meant to post during the Act 3 portion but forgot to (it's there now, though): The Entity transforming Planet Unicron:

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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Thu Aug 18, 2022 10:52 am

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The main thing I notice is how much better the Decepticons are treated in the final script as opposed to this one. This still had the slapstick nature of the series in play. Which doesn't really work within the tone of the film. Hence why you notice, more so now, that all associated humour with the Decepticons was scrapped completely. Hence why, for possibly the only time in Sunbow, the Decepticons were treated as a very real threat in TFTM.

Also kind of prefer Wheeljack dying offscreen. Than suffering this depiction onscreen.

Really like the idea of a Triple Changer, going from train to snake to..? Would have definitely preferred this to the eventual Sky-Lynx (who I can't stand).

Well done to Sabr and associates for gifting us with the script breakdown.

Lastly, as a kid who adored TFTM. I would have hated this first script.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Sabrblade » Thu Aug 18, 2022 11:01 am

Motto: "Can't do a job halfway. What's worth doing is worth doing well, I say."
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AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Really like the idea of a Triple Changer, going from train to snake to..?
Rails transformed from an old locomotive to a bullet train to a snake robot. Two train altmodes.

Basically, all three of his modes would have been a rectangle. :P
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Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Thu Aug 18, 2022 11:03 am

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Sabrblade wrote:
AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Really like the idea of a Triple Changer, going from train to snake to..?
Rails transformed from an old locomotive to a bullet train to a snake robot. Two train altmodes.

Basically, all three of his modes would have been a rectangle. :P


Oh right? I didn't pick up on that reading through. His figure would have been quite easy within G1 then :lol:
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby sol magnus » Fri Aug 19, 2022 7:52 am

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A lot to unpack, but great work compiling this. The tone and tenor of what you've described - even the slapstick nonsensical comedy - is a lot like My Little Pony the movie, if any of you have seen that...it was much more 'cartoony' fare.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Greebtron » Fri Aug 19, 2022 8:12 am

sol magnus wrote:A lot to unpack, but great work compiling this. The tone and tenor of what you've described - even the slapstick nonsensical comedy - is a lot like My Little Pony the movie, if any of you have seen that...it was much more 'cartoony' fare.


If we're talking about the G1 movie in 1986, then no. George Arthur Bloom on his worst day could run circles around Ron Friedman when it came to storytelling.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby sol magnus » Fri Aug 19, 2022 8:14 am

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Greebtron wrote:
sol magnus wrote:A lot to unpack, but great work compiling this. The tone and tenor of what you've described - even the slapstick nonsensical comedy - is a lot like My Little Pony the movie, if any of you have seen that...it was much more 'cartoony' fare.


If we're talking about the G1 movie in 1986, then no. George Arthur Bloom on his worst day could run circles around Ron Friedman when it came to storytelling.


I'm talking about the above first draft of TF:TM. Not the final draft.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Sabrblade » Fri Aug 19, 2022 9:22 am

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sol magnus wrote:
Greebtron wrote:
sol magnus wrote:A lot to unpack, but great work compiling this. The tone and tenor of what you've described - even the slapstick nonsensical comedy - is a lot like My Little Pony the movie, if any of you have seen that...it was much more 'cartoony' fare.


If we're talking about the G1 movie in 1986, then no. George Arthur Bloom on his worst day could run circles around Ron Friedman when it came to storytelling.


I'm talking about the above first draft of TF:TM. Not the final draft.
So is Greebtron. Ron Friedman wrote the first draft of TFTM described above. George Arthur Bloom wrote the MLP movie you mentioned. What Greebtron is saying is that that MLP movie is far more competently-written than what Friedman wrote in the first TFTM draft.
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Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby sol magnus » Fri Aug 19, 2022 9:37 am

Motto: "This is the most beautiful thing in the entire universe. Ok, give me the bomb."
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Sabrblade wrote:
sol magnus wrote:
Greebtron wrote:
sol magnus wrote:A lot to unpack, but great work compiling this. The tone and tenor of what you've described - even the slapstick nonsensical comedy - is a lot like My Little Pony the movie, if any of you have seen that...it was much more 'cartoony' fare.


If we're talking about the G1 movie in 1986, then no. George Arthur Bloom on his worst day could run circles around Ron Friedman when it came to storytelling.


I'm talking about the above first draft of TF:TM. Not the final draft.
So is Greebtron. Ron Friedman wrote the first draft of TFTM described above. George Arthur Bloom wrote the MLP movie you mentioned. What Greebtron is saying is that that MLP movie is far more competently-written than what Friedman wrote in the first TFTM draft.

Yeah, but I'm not talking about the competency, either. I'm talking about the type of action and comedic bits such as Arcee spinning Starscream like Popeye and Bluto and all that kind of stuff, as well as weird nonsencial train-bots that seem fine for 'fantasy', but not for the real worldesque feel of Transformers. Almost in a 'house style' kind of way. I never said MLP:TM was bad or anything. I wasn't making a qualitative comparison. Just that this version of the script has that cartoony quality to it (which works for MLP, but not Transformers). I just see a certain parallel in the style of the action (minus perhaps the Galvatron mercing a bunch of Autobots near the end). That's all.

I also find the ...symbiosis...of Optimus Prime/Orion Pax/ Ultra Magnus and all these alternate uses of one or the other to be quite fascinating as well. Looks like they didn't do a lot of stuff they didn't use in some form or fashion.

I also find it at least somewhat appropriate for Wheeljack to be this weird Misogynist - maybe it's the accent.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Sabrblade » Fri Aug 19, 2022 9:49 am

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sol magnus wrote:I also find it at least somewhat appropriate for Wheeljack to be this weird Misogynist - maybe it's the accent.
Heh, it wouldn't surprise me if Chris Latta ever made such remarks back in his stand-up routines, what with his having needed to be bailed out of jail so often in order for him to record his lines for Transformers and G.I. Joe back in the day, and even getting fired from King Koopa's Kool Kartoons for alleged misconduct with the kids in the audience and making casual onscreen threats to fan mail writers for comedy (but some speculate said threats were merely scripted since he was playing a villain after all, and that the fan mail may not have even been real).
Last edited by Sabrblade on Sun Jan 29, 2023 6:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Greebtron » Fri Aug 19, 2022 11:22 pm

First 5 or 6 minutes of the panel at time index 6:28 :
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby sol magnus » Sat Aug 20, 2022 7:21 am

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Sabrblade wrote:
sol magnus wrote:I also find it at least somewhat appropriate for Wheeljack to be this weird Misogynist - maybe it's the accent.
Heh, it wouldn't surprise me if Chris Latta ever made such remarks back in his stand-up routines, what with him having had to be bailed out of jail so often order for him to record his lines for Transformers and G.I. Joe back in the day, and even getting fired from King Koopa's Kool Kartoons for alleged misconduct with the kids in the audience and making casual onscreen threats to fan mail writers for comedy (but some speculate said threats were merely scripted since he was playing a villain after all, and that the fan mail may not have even been real).

He was probably 'the most interesting man in the world' when he was alive...at least to ua geek types.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Greebtron » Sat Aug 20, 2022 5:26 pm

Chris McFeely has started redoing the panel in twitter thread form. Currently at the end of Act I at time of writing: https://twitter.com/chrismcfeely/status ... 8771748865
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Jelze Bunnycat » Mon Aug 22, 2022 11:17 am

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Wow... Only now got done reading the summary and... Wow. :shock:
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Hero Alpha » Mon Aug 22, 2022 5:59 pm

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Well, thats pretty bad, but very interesting to see now. Basically everything was better in the final movie. But hindsight and all. One thing I do notice is they pretty much used the character design of Col Rusty as Lt Falcon later in the GI Joe movie. Very cool of Sabr to put this up here and Jim, Chris to put it all together and present it. What a find. I can only imagine some of the stuff Flint Dille and others from back then have in closets or have thrown away, hehe. Thanks everyone involved.
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Sabrblade » Mon Aug 22, 2022 6:16 pm

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Moonshot wrote:Well, thats pretty bad, but very interesting to see now. Basically everything was better in the final movie. But hindsight and all. One thing I do notice is they pretty much used the character design of Col Rusty as Lt Falcon later in the GI Joe movie. Very cool of Sabr to put this up here and Jim, Chris to put it all together and present it. What a find. I can only imagine some of the stuff Flint Dille and others from back then have in closets or have thrown away, hehe. Thanks everyone involved.
All the new character designs in this are fan art. They are not actually what they would have all looked like.
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Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: TFTM: The First Draft @ TFNation 2022

Postby Stormshot_Prime » Mon Aug 22, 2022 7:07 pm

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I know the 86 Movie doesn’t have the most Oscar worthy plot, but damn it could have been a lot worse. Still interesting though, can’t wait to read through it when it gets released online.
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