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The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Discuss anything about the Transformers cartoons and comics! You can discuss anything from G1 to Cybertron as well as the comics from Marvel, Dreamwave, IDW and more!

Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrblade » Sun Jun 09, 2013 3:41 pm

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F Prime wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:
Dead Metal wrote:Nope, she's female, the only incarnation of TFs that originally are genderless are the idw G1 TFs, with Arcee being the first Tf with a gender because Jhiaxus decided to introduce genders into his species.
And the Marvel G1 TFs.
I was not aware that the G1 Marvelrun mentioned TFs being genderless. Do you know (roughly) where that occurs?
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Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby F Prime » Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:26 pm

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Sabrblade wrote:
F Prime wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:
Dead Metal wrote:Nope, she's female, the only incarnation of TFs that originally are genderless are the idw G1 TFs, with Arcee being the first Tf with a gender because Jhiaxus decided to introduce genders into his species.
And the Marvel G1 TFs.
I was not aware that the G1 Marvelrun mentioned TFs being genderless. Do you know (roughly) where that occurs?
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Excellent, thanks! Although, Stranglehold stills seems to like the ladies. :) (But that is what I would expect from a Pretender whose shell seems to be based off a 70s porn-star.)

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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby kaijuguy19 » Sun Jun 09, 2013 6:04 pm

I never liked the idea of Cybertronians being genderless to be honest. I mean they're not just machines they're bilogical alien life forms which is further explained in the show in the Opertation Bumblebee arc. I can buy the whole genderless gig if it was in the Quintesson origin but with the other universes I can't. And it doens't help that I'm FAR from being a fan about how females were handled in IDW. :(

I mean for the love of mike guys like Optimus,Bee and others all act like most males do in our planet yet for some reason people can accept that but not females? I get why people want an explanation but if you think about it does it really need to? Can't we just accept that Cybertronians have some form of reproduction for the genders to be there for a reason? And no I'm not promoting fan fic ideas of how it can work.
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrblade » Mon Jun 10, 2013 9:50 am

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kaijuguy19 wrote:I never liked the idea of Cybertronians being genderless to be honest. I mean they're not just machines they're bilogical alien life forms which is further explained in the show in the Opertation Bumblebee arc. I can buy the whole genderless gig if it was in the Quintesson origin but with the other universes I can't. And it doens't help that I'm FAR from being a fan about how females were handled in IDW. :(

I mean for the love of mike guys like Optimus,Bee and others all act like most males do in our planet yet for some reason people can accept that but not females? I get why people want an explanation but if you think about it does it really need to? Can't we just accept that Cybertronians have some form of reproduction for the genders to be there for a reason? And no I'm not promoting fan fic ideas of how it can work.
Well, when once asked about it in an interview, Bob Budiansky gave this response:

One of the things I liked a lot about the Marvel series, it focused a lot on the fact that these characters were, though living, they were actually ROBOTS and there were reasons for their existence and how they came about. This is the ONE part of the Transformers continuity where they don't have (not without a good explanation) "female" Transformers. What are your thoughts on female Transformers and do you think there's room to explore that dichotomy in the Transformers mythology?

BOB: Well, I remember bringing up that question early on with Hasbro, "are any of these female?" And then I think Hasbro's attitude was, 'this is a boy toy. We don't wanna have, you know, girl robots.' So, I said, "OK, just want to clarify that." Then of course, I think it was in 1986 they came out with the movie, and they had the token female character. Don't ask me to explain it. (laughs) I don't understand it. I think what I came up with was Creation Matrix, however that worked out explaining their existence, their 'livingness' was asexual. There was no female, there was no male, there was no need for them having different sexes. So, I just left it at that and what other people have done beyond that, I don't know. I was just… you know, like I said, I early on brought this question up and I was given a certain direction by the Hasbro executives I was dealing with and I went with it. It's their toy, so if that's what they want, that's fine with me. Now, if somebody wants to change their mind and says, 'oh yeah, there should be a whole other bunch of female Transformers,' then again, it's not my toy, they can do that.
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Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Dead Metal » Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:26 am

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Sabrblade wrote:
F Prime wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:
Dead Metal wrote:Nope, she's female, the only incarnation of TFs that originally are genderless are the idw G1 TFs, with Arcee being the first Tf with a gender because Jhiaxus decided to introduce genders into his species.
And the Marvel G1 TFs.
I was not aware that the G1 Marvelrun mentioned TFs being genderless. Do you know (roughly) where that occurs?
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OK didn't know that, my bad.

On the Dreamwave one though, not really buying it for a couple of reasons:
  • Sunstreaker being gay, he could not be gay if there was no sexuality in the first place, and for sexuality you need genders
  • The Ultimate Guide is well, not exactly a very accurate source of information, even making stuff up for the DW comics that simply never existed in the comics due to still being relatively young
  • It gets the information on other TF incarnations wrong
But we'll never really know for sure, so I'll give you that as well. :P

Sabrblade wrote:
Dead Metal wrote:Nope, she's female, the only incarnation of TFs that originally are genderless are the idw G1 TFs, with Arcee being the first Tf with a gender because Jhiaxus decided to introduce genders into his species.
And the Marvel G1 TFs.

And the Dreamwave G1 TFs, by way of "The Ultimate Guide" book and Dreamwave's own going under before they could introduce more "female" TFs. ;)

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Glad to see you back on the boards. 8)


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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby F Prime » Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:55 am

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Dead Metal wrote:On the Dreamwave one though, not really buying it for a couple of reasons:
  • Sunstreaker being gay, he could not be gay if there was no sexuality in the first place, and for sexuality you need genders

Wait...the Dreamwave Sunstreaker was gay? I am learning all kinds of things today.
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrblade » Mon Jun 10, 2013 11:01 am

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Dead Metal wrote:On the Dreamwave one though, not really buying it for a couple of reasons:
  • Sunstreaker being gay, he could not be gay if there was no sexuality in the first place, and for sexuality you need genders
:shock: What?

*goes looking for a source on this*

Oh, so that's why I never got that impression from him in Dreamwave G1. It was something Matt Moylan said after the comic went under, rather than something the comic actually covered.

But that not only goes into pseudocanonical Authorial Intent, but also recalls how the relationship between Chromedome and Rewind in IDW G1 is at first perceived as homosexual, but that continuity's distinctly genderless nature makes their relationship just be between two robot lifeforms who have no gender.

Even if Sunstreaker had been portrayed as being gay in Dreamwave G1 (which really wasn't made clear by the comics themselves), it'd be a similar case of one genderless robot being into other genderless robots of similar build to himself.

Yes, Dreamwave had Arcee and such, but her existence was never explained and Dreamwave went under before they were about to.

Dead Metal wrote:
  • The Ultimate Guide is well, not exactly a very accurate source of information, even making stuff up for the DW comics that simply never existed in the comics due to still being relatively young
  • It gets the information on other TF incarnations wrong
But we'll never really know for sure, so I'll give you that as well. :P
Yeah, the book was written heavily with the Dreamwave comics in mind, playing favorites with both it and the Marvel comics over the cartoon. But what it does say that conflicts with the cartoons still meshes decently enough with the Dreamwave comics, thanks to them being a separate continuity and all. ;)
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Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby G1 Smoketreader » Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:35 pm

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THE VAMPIRE ZOMBIE APOCALYPSE EPISODE (I forget name).

Way cool.
*Opening lightning sets up the evil laboratory setting perfectly, as Sabr already mentioned.
*Scratches on Breakdown emulate lightning on Frankensteins' monster strapped in his chair. Way cool.

KNOCKOUT: "I have been experimenting on Silas and have concluded that I find interfacing with Humans repulsive, so I have been using Breakdown as a contra-septive. I will now transform into a closet" Nyuk nyuk nyuk.

STARSCREAM: Enjoyed watching him deal with it under his own autonomy until Megz showed up to gimp him out again. Ho-hum...

Airacchnid: : Welcome back, we were dying of boredom. A Vampire now,my take on her different alteration (to the rest of the zombies)being that she was infected via scratches from the final stab to Cy-down rather than bitten.
A truly iconic image of her with the Cybertron system in the sky at the end there that will go down in legend. I expect to see her in the hall of fame nominations frequently if her story is not treated like a 5 minute wonder.
Better not waste her. She is potential for a whole return to Cybertron spinoff series.

SOUNDWAVE: Says nothing. Does little. Manages a lot: More potential for carrying a spin-off. Would adore to see him with multiple minicon hats, ties, scarves, wigs, boots, vests and whatever else along with his Lazerbeak life jacket.

MEGATRON: He's been a bit idiotic since he got thrown into that Alien Power core that does nothing to anyone.Has he been partially retarded by the experience, or is that just the writing?

I watched it twice. That's a big deal for an episode of Prime. Well done,writers, even tho you should actually get ORIGINAL at some point.
My suggestion: leave the ripoffs of other movies to another spinoff series deliberately advertised to be ripping off other movies in a 'what if' way or a 'short stories' way or whatever.
It would work, I promise (because this episode did), and I personally would enjoy it because it would suit your particular writing style so it would let me enjoy THAT, (but knowing you, you would rewrite it all into a spinoff that actually doesn't copy any movies at all and is COMPLETELY ORIGINAL, because, yeah, well, Prime Seasons 1 and 2 and 3, which had to rewrite a whole continuity just to make 16 last episodes line up straight, incompetence which I will rub in your faces forever).
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby F Prime » Tue Jun 11, 2013 7:45 pm

Motto: "math...thrash...Math....Thrash...MATH....THRASH..."
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G1 Smoketreader wrote:My suggestion: leave the ripoffs of other movies to another spinoff series deliberately advertised to be ripping off other movies in a 'what if' way or a 'short stories' way or whatever.
It would work, I promise (because this episode did), and I personally would enjoy it because it would suit your particular writing style so it would let me enjoy THAT, (but knowing you, you would rewrite it all into a spinoff that actually doesn't copy any movies at all and is COMPLETELY ORIGINAL, because, yeah, well, Prime Seasons 1 and 2 and 3, which had to rewrite a whole continuity just to make 16 last episodes line up straight, incompetence which I will rub in your faces forever).

I'm a little confused...it sounds like you are complaining that they are ripping off movies but then suggesting they rip off movies only to complain that they *wouldn't* rip off movies? (I am assuming I am misreading your post, but was curious what you meant here.)
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Shadowman » Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:22 am

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F Prime wrote:
G1 Smoketreader wrote:My suggestion: leave the ripoffs of other movies to another spinoff series deliberately advertised to be ripping off other movies in a 'what if' way or a 'short stories' way or whatever.
It would work, I promise (because this episode did), and I personally would enjoy it because it would suit your particular writing style so it would let me enjoy THAT, (but knowing you, you would rewrite it all into a spinoff that actually doesn't copy any movies at all and is COMPLETELY ORIGINAL, because, yeah, well, Prime Seasons 1 and 2 and 3, which had to rewrite a whole continuity just to make 16 last episodes line up straight, incompetence which I will rub in your faces forever).

I'm a little confused...it sounds like you are complaining that they are ripping off movies but then suggesting they rip off movies only to complain that they *wouldn't* rip off movies? (I am assuming I am misreading your post, but was curious what you meant here.)


If you're misreading his post, then I am too. It's Smoketreader, though, and it only really makes sense to him.

And Smokey, the term is "homage" not "ripoff."
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrblade » Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:26 am

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Shadowman wrote:
F Prime wrote:
G1 Smoketreader wrote:My suggestion: leave the ripoffs of other movies to another spinoff series deliberately advertised to be ripping off other movies in a 'what if' way or a 'short stories' way or whatever.
It would work, I promise (because this episode did), and I personally would enjoy it because it would suit your particular writing style so it would let me enjoy THAT, (but knowing you, you would rewrite it all into a spinoff that actually doesn't copy any movies at all and is COMPLETELY ORIGINAL, because, yeah, well, Prime Seasons 1 and 2 and 3, which had to rewrite a whole continuity just to make 16 last episodes line up straight, incompetence which I will rub in your faces forever).

I'm a little confused...it sounds like you are complaining that they are ripping off movies but then suggesting they rip off movies only to complain that they *wouldn't* rip off movies? (I am assuming I am misreading your post, but was curious what you meant here.)


If you're misreading his post, then I am too. It's Smoketreader, though, and it only really makes sense to him.

And Smokey, the term is "homage" not "ripoff."
If he went nuts over this episode's film references, then his head might explode should he ever see "The Alien Invasion of Griffin Rock". :lol:
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby G1 Smoketreader » Thu Jun 13, 2013 10:47 am

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Sabrblade wrote:
Shadowman wrote:
F Prime wrote:
G1 Smoketreader wrote:My suggestion: leave the ripoffs of other movies to another spinoff series deliberately advertised to be ripping off other movies in a 'what if' way or a 'short stories' way or whatever.
It would work, I promise (because this episode did), and I personally would enjoy it because it would suit your particular writing style so it would let me enjoy THAT, (but knowing you, you would rewrite it all into a spinoff that actually doesn't copy any movies at all and is COMPLETELY ORIGINAL, because, yeah, well, Prime Seasons 1 and 2 and 3, which had to rewrite a whole continuity just to make 16 last episodes line up straight, incompetence which I will rub in your faces forever).

I'm a little confused...it sounds like you are complaining that they are ripping off movies but then suggesting they rip off movies only to complain that they *wouldn't* rip off movies? (I am assuming I am misreading your post, but was curious what you meant here.)


If you're misreading his post, then I am too. It's Smoketreader, though, and it only really makes sense to him.

And Smokey, the term is "homage" not "ripoff."
If he went nuts over this episode's film references, then his head might explode should he ever see "The Alien Invasion of Griffin Rock". :lol:



You're reading it right: I'm saying they have brought me to the expectation that they will botch whatever they do, no matter what faith I put in them:
Even if they were to set out to just do a 'meaningless' series that is about blatantly and deliberately copying/homaging/ripping off other pop culture in a string of unconnected short stories, (or even unconnected short stories in even more unconnected 'what if' settings without even aligned timelines and universes to hinder progress), they are still highly likely to FAIL even at that, and instead, actually write an amazing, groundbreaking saga of linked episodes that is utterly original and copies NOTHING, from Homers' works to today, simply because they set out to do the opposite.

...and for the record, nothing in the last episode made me go nuts (in a bad way- I loved [and went nuts over] A/chnids return, seeing Cylas again, seeing Soundwave handle the bullrush coming at him etc in all the good ways).

How I treat the writers is not some kind of desire by me to always bash the show (check: I compliment generously, WHEN I have a compliment). I just think they have proven how much they suck.
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Dead Metal » Thu Jun 13, 2013 11:55 am

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G1 Smoketreader wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:
Shadowman wrote:
F Prime wrote:
G1 Smoketreader wrote:My suggestion: leave the ripoffs of other movies to another spinoff series deliberately advertised to be ripping off other movies in a 'what if' way or a 'short stories' way or whatever.
It would work, I promise (because this episode did), and I personally would enjoy it because it would suit your particular writing style so it would let me enjoy THAT, (but knowing you, you would rewrite it all into a spinoff that actually doesn't copy any movies at all and is COMPLETELY ORIGINAL, because, yeah, well, Prime Seasons 1 and 2 and 3, which had to rewrite a whole continuity just to make 16 last episodes line up straight, incompetence which I will rub in your faces forever).

I'm a little confused...it sounds like you are complaining that they are ripping off movies but then suggesting they rip off movies only to complain that they *wouldn't* rip off movies? (I am assuming I am misreading your post, but was curious what you meant here.)


If you're misreading his post, then I am too. It's Smoketreader, though, and it only really makes sense to him.

And Smokey, the term is "homage" not "ripoff."
If he went nuts over this episode's film references, then his head might explode should he ever see "The Alien Invasion of Griffin Rock". :lol:



You're reading it right: I'm saying they have brought me to the expectation that they will botch whatever they do, no matter what faith I put in them:
Even if they were to set out to just do a 'meaningless' series that is about blatantly and deliberately copying/homaging/ripping off other pop culture in a string of unconnected short stories, (or even unconnected short stories in even more unconnected 'what if' settings without even aligned timelines and universes to hinder progress), they are still highly likely to FAIL even at that, and instead, actually write an amazing, groundbreaking saga of linked episodes that is utterly original and copies NOTHING, from Homers' works to today, simply because they set out to do the opposite.

...and for the record, nothing in the last episode made me go nuts (in a bad way- I loved [and went nuts over] A/chnids return, seeing Cylas again, seeing Soundwave handle the bullrush coming at him etc in all the good ways).

How I treat the writers is not some kind of desire by me to always bash the show (check: I compliment generously, WHEN I have a compliment). I just think they have proven how much they suck.

:michaelbay:
So let me get this straight, you enjoy a really good episode of a pretty damn good show, but because it's an episode about vampires, a concept mostly found in the horror genre, and thus it plays with tropes found in that genre and does a few homages you scrutinize them for it?
This episode wasn't just "pointless ripping off" this episode ended plot threads and opened up new ones, so what it had tropes and homages from and to the Horror genre, it all worked perfectly together and made sense.

Also you keep bring up "original ideas" and "not copying from", have you ever, and i mean ever seen/read/heard something that is completely original and does not copy/homage/pay tribute to something else? Here's a hint: Nope. You never have and you never will.
Everything borrows from something else, be it on purpose or by accident, even the greats that are constantly imitated and hommaged borrow from work that came before them.
Guess what the following have in common:
Conan, Star Wars, Superman, Avatar (both the Cameron movie and the awesome cartoon), Star Trek.
They're all basically "ripoffs", to put it in your words, of John Carter (the Mars guy).

Sorry, but the moment you said "original" you lost every argument in the history of arguments - for ever.
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby PrymeStriker » Thu Jun 13, 2013 2:23 pm

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Dead Metal wrote:Have you ever, and i mean ever seen/read/heard something that is completely original and does not copy/homage/pay tribute to something else? Here's a hint: Nope. You never have and you never will.


QFT. :APPLAUSE:
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Va'al » Fri Jun 14, 2013 11:27 am

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Because reasons.



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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrblade » Fri Jun 14, 2013 11:39 am

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Va'al wrote:Because reasons.

:shock: Major. Epic! WIN! :lol: :APPLAUSE: :BOWDOWN:

And, it was through this video that led me to happen upon this:



As for the second video... eh. :|
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Dead Metal » Fri Jun 14, 2013 12:51 pm

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All three of those videos are hilarious, although he KO Starscream moment is kinda hurt by KO probably actually meaning it in a gay way.
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby G1 Smoketreader » Fri Jun 14, 2013 5:12 pm

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Dead Metal wrote:




:michaelbay:
So let me get this straight, you enjoy a really good episode of a pretty damn good show, but because it's an episode about vampires, a concept mostly found in the horror genre, and thus it plays with tropes found in that genre and does a few homages you scrutinize them for it?
This episode wasn't just "pointless ripping off" this episode ended plot threads and opened up new ones, so what it had tropes and homages from and to the Horror genre, it all worked perfectly together and made sense.

Also you keep bring up "original ideas" and "not copying from", have you ever, and i mean ever seen/read/heard something that is completely original and does not copy/homage/pay tribute to something else? Here's a hint: Nope. You never have and you never will.
Everything borrows from something else, be it on purpose or by accident, even the greats that are constantly imitated and hommaged borrow from work that came before them.
Guess what the following have in common:
Conan, Star Wars, Superman, Avatar (both the Cameron movie and the awesome cartoon), Star Trek.
They're all basically "ripoffs", to put it in your words, of John Carter (the Mars guy).

Sorry, but the moment you said "original" you lost every argument in the history of arguments - for ever.


Incorrectly interpreted, I think:

*The idea that these writers will come up with something perfectly original is used OBVIOUSLY by myself in the context of an anecdote and an insult, not an actual expectation, so it's your counter-argument that's invalid, because I am not even submitting an argument for you to counter-argue with in the first place.



*This entire series was incapable of telling its' own story without hamstringing its' own continuity past, and the whole series has erased 'lore' in order to provide 'lore' for no good reason other than inability of the writers to conform with the work of other writers working in the same continuity, let alone the idea that this continuity would be a "platform for all TF fans of all [eras] to be able to [meet and move forward] on together".
The idea that this episode closed and opened plot threads is a matter of illusion when you look at what the series closed off permanently in order to be competent enough to tell the story it is now telling.It was going to open and close plot threads anyway no matter who wrote it and whether or not zombies were in it.
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Va'al » Fri Jun 14, 2013 5:28 pm

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Dead Metal wrote:All three of those videos are hilarious, although he KO Starscream moment is kinda hurt by KO probably actually meaning it in a gay way.


Hurt?
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby G1 Smoketreader » Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:54 pm

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Out of curiosity, I just want to ask about ppls views on the, lets say, insinuation that Knockout is Gay.

These are my thoughts (which are likely to evolve over the next few weeks):
I don't have a problem with it as it is right now, even in a kids cartoon (or a maybe-not-for-kids-cartoon-on-a-kids-channel, depending on individual take), on the grounds that this is the year 2013 and yeah, it's worth trying it out,even in a kids' show, PROVIDED (my personal stand-point): that the room is left to imply that it was his choice and nobody expressly built him that way. I think its' important for the young observer to be permitted the opportunity to tolerate a Gay in a 'daily' group of ppl (in this case the cast of Prime) but also left able to know (or assume) that knockout (or whoever else is 'the gay') thought about it and decided it was best for him.
Also I don't see a reason why it should be a fixed life choice. For a kids show I'd rather a "Yeah, I was, then I wasn't, I can be again if it will be cool for me" as opposed to a "Primus made me this way" scenario.

I don't know how I would feel about a more popular Decep or Autobot being portrayed (or insinuated) as being gay.Especially exclusively Gay. I think the degree of 'sterotypical' and/or 'typical' behavior would be the decider for me. Most ppl argue Starscsream is the comic relief, for me Starscream is a subject of pity. Knockout is the clown who I laugh at (and who, by the way,I have been calling 'the Gaylord' since last year). The more in-your-face the character is, the less I, personally, think I will tolerate it.

Of course, the whole reproduction thing has never really been fleshed out, so as long as reproduction isn't established in the overall Prime continuity I can only treat Knockout as a mimic who will do what he sees the locals do for recreation. Whether or not heimmediately gets the point or is forced to guess at the benefit initially and work out later what it is he is doing is open to exploration.

Then again, he specifically discusses/declares his views on 'interfacing', but what exactly is interfacing to him? A deeper (or more superficial/only as deep as necessary) level of traditional Cybertronian intimacy than Human intercourse? A clumsy attempt to translate the earth concept from his Cybertronian vocabulary once again using an Earth word? Or a generalization, where 'interfacing' includes 'talking to' and 'carrying as passengers' as well as anything more.

Just curious. Is it time to put gays in cartoon shows, do yuz reckon, or not yet?

I've seen some European cartoons, particularly this one French (I think) one, where I wouldn't be worried about one (or two) characters being openly Gay and my Son watching it, or me watching it as a kid. This has to do, in my opinion, with the overall amount and types of characters incorporated in this show, which is far richer than something like Prime, and the overall portrayal of 'real life issues' which seem more uncamoflaged and streetwise to me in this particular show. It's some cartoon about a soccer club, don't even know the name- point is that I CAN immediately think of a platform that could deliver the subject of accepting 'the gay' to a younger audience, so there ARE writers out there who can do the particular job.
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrblade » Sat Jun 15, 2013 12:17 am

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Official word on Knock Out's orientation from the show's creators at BotCon 2011:
When asked at BotCon 2011, the Prime writers said that there is no designation for gay, or straight, for that matter, on Cybertron, where Transformers are created by the AllSpark, not through sexual reproductions. They also said that Knock Out is a knock out, and that the Nemesis is a very "don't ask, don't tell" place. And then they jokingly deflected the matter, claiming that Knock Out's mannerisms are not caused by any particular orientation, but are simply eccentricities caused by "a glitch in the AllSpark" the day he was created.

In other words, it's just Daran Norris having fun playing the character in a campy, over-the-top manner. :P
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Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby King Kuuga » Sat Jun 15, 2013 12:58 am

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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Dead Metal » Sat Jun 15, 2013 3:10 am

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G1 Smoketreader wrote:Incorrectly interpreted, I think:

*The idea that these writers will come up with something perfectly original is used OBVIOUSLY by myself in the context of an anecdote and an insult, not an actual expectation, so it's your counter-argument that's invalid, because I am not even submitting an argument for you to counter-argue with in the first place.




Oh no no no, I interpreted that correctly, it was very obviously meant to be an insult to the writers.
The moment I read your first comment I've seen on this board I knew you hated the show and only watched it because you had too much time and love to pile hate on something other people enjoy. You're not the first to do this, nor will you be the last.
And nope, that wasn't a counter argument, notice that in order for it to be a counter argument I would have to bring up an argument you made and then bring up a different view point to counter yours. All I did was point out how stupid your post is and how you're wasting your time.

*This entire series was incapable of telling its' own story without hamstringing its' own continuity past, and the whole series has erased 'lore' in order to provide 'lore' for no good reason other than inability of the writers to conform with the work of other writers working in the same continuity, let alone the idea that this continuity would be a "platform for all TF fans of all [eras] to be able to [meet and move forward] on together".
The idea that this episode closed and opened plot threads is a matter of illusion when you look at what the series closed off permanently in order to be competent enough to tell the story it is now telling.It was going to open and close plot threads anyway no matter who wrote it and whether or not zombies were in it.

What "lore" has it erased exactly?
Cartoon G1? Marvel G1? Marvel UK G1? Beast Wars? RID? Unicron Trilogy? Dreamwave G1? Animated? Movies?
Guess what all that still exists, especially G1 which currently has 4 ongoing comics, a miniseries and boat loads of new toys in the form of most of the 30th anniversary Generations line, Masterpieces and reissues of the original super dated toys.

Or do you mean Aligned? As in this show doesn't quite add up to the novels and the games? Because if it's that, guess what - this show has been longer in production that any of those, War for Cybertron for instance was originally intended by the creators to be a version of G1, it was later int he production that Hasbro told them to rework it as a prequel to Prime.
And if you're going to fault the show for not being 100 per cent consistent with the crappy Novels by Alex Irvin, well then :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Alex Irvin is such a crappy writer he can't even keep one book consistent with itself. Let alone write compelling enough to make you overlook the inconsistencies. Well, unless one has the short-term memory of a goldfish and forgets what happened just two pages ago.

G1 Smoketreader wrote:I don't understand how sexuality works.

Yea, decided the quote was too long so I boiled it down to its core.
Sexuality, is not a choice. One does not decide to be gay or straight, just like one does not decide to be white, black, Asian or middle eastern. It doesn't work that way, if Knock-Out does get revealed as actually being gay, he would have been "created" that way.
So no need to worry, your sons won't become gay from watching a cartoon in which a character is gay from birth, the only way they'll be gay is if they already are gay.

But going by your logic of homosexuality being a "life-choice", wouldn't a cartoon in which a character says he's gay because he wants to be gay not be the real "threat", since then he could become a role model and influence them into taking on his decisions? ;)
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Intah-wib-buls?

Blurrz wrote:10/10

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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby njb902 » Sat Jun 15, 2013 3:28 am

Sabrblade wrote:Official word on Knock Out's orientation from the show's creators at BotCon 2011:
When asked at BotCon 2011, the Prime writers said that there is no designation for gay, or straight, for that matter, on Cybertron, where Transformers are created by the AllSpark, not through sexual reproductions. They also said that Knock Out is a knock out, and that the Nemesis is a very "don't ask, don't tell" place. And then they jokingly deflected the matter, claiming that Knock Out's mannerisms are not caused by any particular orientation, but are simply eccentricities caused by "a glitch in the AllSpark" the day he was created.

In other words, it's just Daran Norris having fun playing the character in a campy, over-the-top manner. :P


That's fine and all, but then why do they have genders?
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Re: The Official Transformers: Prime Discussion Thread

Postby Dead Metal » Sat Jun 15, 2013 3:30 am

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Sabrblade wrote:Official word on Knock Out's orientation from the show's creators at BotCon 2011:
When asked at BotCon 2011, the Prime writers said that there is no designation for gay, or straight, for that matter, on Cybertron, where Transformers are created by the AllSpark, not through sexual reproductions. They also said that Knock Out is a knock out, and that the Nemesis is a very "don't ask, don't tell" place. And then they jokingly deflected the matter, claiming that Knock Out's mannerisms are not caused by any particular orientation, but are simply eccentricities caused by "a glitch in the AllSpark" the day he was created.

In other words, it's just Daran Norris having fun playing the character in a campy, over-the-top manner. :P

Firstly, that was two years ago and secondly.

Man, I hate bringing this argument, but it's been used against me so many times, and a few times by yourself, that I feel like I can do this as well, even if it actually physically hurts while typing it.

Authorial intent.

F**k that hurt.

But yea, authorial intent man, that has been the death of many a joke, reference, and plot thread in this franchise.
Just because the creators meant to build in a Star Wars reference/ bring in TF version of "Son of a B**ch/ have campy fun, doesn't stop the fanbase from being to stupid to realize and understand that fact and over time turn it into canon. Which is how we now got to call the Predacon ship in Beast Wars "Darkside" #-o , Tarantulas is now a agent of Unicron #-o #-o , and so on.

Knock-Out being gay, was originally just fans being stupid and ignoring the last half of Starscream's "Oh you're one of those ..." comment, the part that made it clear he despises Cons with a ground-based alt-mode and isn't homophobic.
KO is being more and more in your face gay in season 3, that I believe they now actually decided to make him canon gay after seeing how popular the idea has become.

And you know, this is the first time this has happened that I'm OK with it and actually like it. Bout time we got ourselves a gay TF, after all, there are loads of homosexuals in our fandom and it's about time they get "their" TF.

Va'al wrote:
Dead Metal wrote:All three of those videos are hilarious, although he KO Starscream moment is kinda hurt by KO probably actually meaning it in a gay way.


Hurt?


Yea, that kind of clip would work better if it would take a moment in which a straight character says something that accidentally kinda sounds gay, and then makes it look so over the top because it would be too far from reality to be true.
As it stands, it just extends (and maybe shows us what KO was thinking while saying that) a moment that was meant to actually look gay.

But I still think it's hilarious.
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