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There's a longstanding prejudice that animation is for children, and since the Transformers in these films are animated works (no matter how "realistic" they might be designed to look), they're viewed less as "characters" than the human actors are, as the human actors are live action and "real" people instead of "fake" cartoon creations.Slashercon wrote:I understand that a Transformers movie taking place on Earth pretty much means that humans are going to show up, and that we do have our key humans to the cast of characters, but what makes them so d@%n special where they get top billing over the REAL STARS that are in the movie. I swear, humans being given the main treatment in these movies is the equivalent of an Avengers movie focusing on Shield or a TMNT movie focusing on April O'Neil (). And with news that a whole new trilogy of films are planned, do you really think they learned their lesson at this point? Tying into this news, I honestly don't want to see Mark Whalburg's character or his daughter and smug@#& boyfriend again. Can we please get some Autobots and Decepticons with motives and individual goals instead of "RIVETING" side plots like "who's dating my daughter" or "who's gonna make big bucks off alien technology"? (And please don't try to tell me that all of that was necessary. As much as I don't like Transformers The Movie, At least the focus was on the Transformers.)
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Burn wrote:What lesson is it they're suppose to be learning?
All the movies have been massive financial successes. That tends to say that the MAJORITY of the public like them. So what should they be learning? Because what they're doing is obviously working.
Sabrblade wrote:There's a longstanding prejudice that animation is for children, and since the Transformers in these films are animated works (no matter how "realistic" they might be designed to look), they're viewed less as "characters" than the human actors are, as the human actors are live action and "real" people instead of "fake" cartoon creations.Slashercon wrote:I understand that a Transformers movie taking place on Earth pretty much means that humans are going to show up, and that we do have our key humans to the cast of characters, but what makes them so d@%n special where they get top billing over the REAL STARS that are in the movie. I swear, humans being given the main treatment in these movies is the equivalent of an Avengers movie focusing on Shield or a TMNT movie focusing on April O'Neil (). And with news that a whole new trilogy of films are planned, do you really think they learned their lesson at this point? Tying into this news, I honestly don't want to see Mark Whalburg's character or his daughter and smug@#& boyfriend again. Can we please get some Autobots and Decepticons with motives and individual goals instead of "RIVETING" side plots like "who's dating my daughter" or "who's gonna make big bucks off alien technology"? (And please don't try to tell me that all of that was necessary. As much as I don't like Transformers The Movie, At least the focus was on the Transformers.)
I have a strong feeling that if the Transformers were real people in armored costumed suits instead of all-CGI, there'd be a better chance of them getting more focal characterization than they do now. Or, if the films were completely animated instead of in live action, then the chance would be even more likely. But then that gets back to the "cartoons are for kids" prejudice, and a lot of moviegoers don't want to watch "kids' stuff", preferring live action films instead, which also brings us back to how CGI characters in live action films aren't viewed in the same light as how live human actors in live action films are viewed.
We Transfans don't feel this same kind of prejudice because we are used to robots as human-like characters, having seen them depicted as such in our cartoons and comic books. The common moviegoer audience, however, is less used to such due to a lack of the same degree of material exposure that we fans have had, as most of that material is viewed as "kids' stuff".
ZeroWolf wrote:Burn wrote:What lesson is it they're suppose to be learning?
All the movies have been massive financial successes. That tends to say that the MAJORITY of the public like them. So what should they be learning? Because what they're doing is obviously working.
I quoted this as it's all true, and it's something that a lot lot of people ignore.
You may not like the movies but there is plenty of people out there who did and each film gas made more then they cost to make so they are like golden geese for hasbro.
Ask yourself: how many people would really go and see a humanless tf movie, how many average movie goers would see such a thing
Slashercon wrote:People learned to like the movies despite all their flaws already. Why not improve upon said flaws that many have with the films while engaging the viewers in to something with even grander possibilities?
In your defense, though, AOE did the worst financially of the four domestically, with only the international screenings (especially in China) helping to boost its financial success back up to match with (and even overtake) the first three. So, that it did the poorest in its own country before getting help later does help your case about how AOE could be seen by the moviegoers as more of a downer than the other three.Burn wrote:Slashercon wrote:People learned to like the movies despite all their flaws already. Why not improve upon said flaws that many have with the films while engaging the viewers in to something with even grander possibilities?
But what flaws? Are you speaking from your own perspective or from the perspective of the masses that went and made the movies the financial successes they were?
I'm not taking a dig at you, personally I think with each movie they've gotten worse and worse (I've only watched AoE once) and I firmly blame the writers. Even if I weren't a Transformers fan I think I'd still have trouble sitting through AoE.
But that's just me. Clearly there's millions of other movie goers out there that think otherwise. They like the movies for what they are, action movies that are a temporary escape from reality.
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Burn wrote:Slashercon wrote:People learned to like the movies despite all their flaws already. Why not improve upon said flaws that many have with the films while engaging the viewers in to something with even grander possibilities?
But what flaws? Are you speaking from your own perspective or from the perspective of the masses that went and made the movies the financial successes they were?
I'm not taking a dig at you, personally I think with each movie they've gotten worse and worse (I've only watched AoE once) and I firmly blame the writers. Even if I weren't a Transformers fan I think I'd still have trouble sitting through AoE.
But that's just me. Clearly there's millions of other movie goers out there that think otherwise. They like the movies for what they are, action movies that are a temporary escape from reality.
IMO, even with the faulty screenwriting, I thought AoE's biggest problem was its running time. It was just soooooooo loooooooong. 2 hours and 45 minutes IIRC. Add to that the previews and commercials, plus the time it takes to stand in line for tickets and concessions, and a family is at the theater for close to 4 hours. That's hard to manage, especially with children, so I think that had a lot to do with the poorer ticket sales of AoE in relation to its predecessors.Sabrblade wrote:AOE did the worst financially of the four domestically, with only the international screenings (especially in China) helping to boost its financial success back up to match with (and even overtake) the first three. So, that it did the poorest in its own country before getting help later does help your case about how AOE could be seen by the moviegoers as more of a downer than the other three.
Rodimus Prime wrote:IMO, even with the faulty screenwriting, I thought AoE's biggest problem was its running time. It was just soooooooo loooooooong. 2 hours and 45 minutes IIRC. Add to that the previews and commercials, plus the time it takes to stand in line for tickets and concessions, and a family is at the theater for close to 4 hours. That's hard to manage, especially with children, so I think that had a lot to do with the poorer ticket sales of AoE in relation to its predecessors.Sabrblade wrote:AOE did the worst financially of the four domestically, with only the international screenings (especially in China) helping to boost its financial success back up to match with (and even overtake) the first three. So, that it did the poorest in its own country before getting help later does help your case about how AOE could be seen by the moviegoers as more of a downer than the other three.
Yeah, with how long the movie was and all the stuff that was crammed into its story, AOE honestly felt to me like it was two (or even two and a half) completely separate movie scripts that were spliced together. One about the Autobots being on the run and hunted by Lockdown and Cemetery Wind, and one about KSI creating manmade Transformers whom Galvatron secretly manipulates. Then you got the even more vague stuff about the Creators and the Knights which felt like had come from yet another movie script (hence the "and a half" part).D-Maximus_Prime wrote:Rodimus Prime wrote:IMO, even with the faulty screenwriting, I thought AoE's biggest problem was its running time. It was just soooooooo loooooooong. 2 hours and 45 minutes IIRC. Add to that the previews and commercials, plus the time it takes to stand in line for tickets and concessions, and a family is at the theater for close to 4 hours. That's hard to manage, especially with children, so I think that had a lot to do with the poorer ticket sales of AoE in relation to its predecessors.Sabrblade wrote:AOE did the worst financially of the four domestically, with only the international screenings (especially in China) helping to boost its financial success back up to match with (and even overtake) the first three. So, that it did the poorest in its own country before getting help later does help your case about how AOE could be seen by the moviegoers as more of a downer than the other three.
Had it been kept closer to that initial running time of 2 hours 7 minutes, it may have been better, even going to 2 hours 17 minutes would not have hurt![]()
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Sabrblade wrote:Yeah, with how long the movie was and all the stuff that was crammed into its story, AOE honestly felt to me like it was two (or even two and a half) completely separate movie scripts that were spliced together. One about the Autobots being on the run and hunted by Lockdown and Cemetery Wind, and one about KSI creating manmade Transformers whom Galvatron secretly manipulates. Then you got the even more vague stuff about the Creators and the Knights which felt like had come from yet another movie script (hence the "and a half" part).D-Maximus_Prime wrote:Rodimus Prime wrote:IMO, even with the faulty screenwriting, I thought AoE's biggest problem was its running time. It was just soooooooo loooooooong. 2 hours and 45 minutes IIRC. Add to that the previews and commercials, plus the time it takes to stand in line for tickets and concessions, and a family is at the theater for close to 4 hours. That's hard to manage, especially with children, so I think that had a lot to do with the poorer ticket sales of AoE in relation to its predecessors.Sabrblade wrote:AOE did the worst financially of the four domestically, with only the international screenings (especially in China) helping to boost its financial success back up to match with (and even overtake) the first three. So, that it did the poorest in its own country before getting help later does help your case about how AOE could be seen by the moviegoers as more of a downer than the other three.
Had it been kept closer to that initial running time of 2 hours 7 minutes, it may have been better, even going to 2 hours 17 minutes would not have hurt![]()
It honestly felt as coherent as TF: Prime's "Darkness Rising" five-parter (which also has a similar "two different stories merged together" feel), and its length rendered it being more of a four-act movie than a three-act one.
ZeroWolf wrote:You missed out Hot Rod
Between his producing duties and directorial work, Bay usually has a half-dozen projects going at once. Right now, in addition to 13 Hours, he's doing post-production on the next Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, which he's producing and which is due in 2016, and pre-production for the next Transformers, which he's directing for summer 2017. "I'm doing Transformers ... 5, is it?" Bay says, temporarily losing track. He shakes his head. "I've taken on a lot of work."
Finally, there's Transformers. They show Bay an underwater rendering of a crash-landed alien spaceship, then a new dump-truck Transformer with a cloak. Neither are up to snuff. "Boy, I've got a lot of work to do," Bay says, shaking his head. "I better finish this **** 13 Hours movie." He thanks ILM and kills the video link, then turns to me. "It's not good when I'm not involved."
"The movie industry has really changed," Bay says, apropos of nothing. "The middle-[budget] movie is basically gone. They just want these big movies." (The irony of this statement goes unremarked-upon.) "Transformers, I still have a great time. It's fun to do a movie that 100 million people will see. But this is the last one. I have to pass the reins to someone else."
I remind Bay that he said the same thing before each of the last two Transformers movies. "I know," he says. "J.J. [Abrams] told me, 'You're the only guy that could do this.' But it's time to move on. One more."
BeastProwl wrote:So can I give up yet? Ive defended the films, but after 4 I just can't handle it anymore, it needs to be rebooted NOT CONTINUED
Yeah money talks. And the lowest common denominator is unfortunately the majority of movie goers nowadays, so pander away I guess.
I liked TF4. While I was watching it. You ever see a movie and think, wow, I suddenly dislike it? That was TF4 for me. 3 wasn't great, and 2 is a generally hated train wreck (wHich I'll admit I enjoy it for what it's worth.)
The first one's the only one I can consistently return to and enjoy, and even then it's VERY flawed. Either return to what made the first one at least the best out of a series of bland movies with okay designs, and good cgi, or reboot it and let a company that gives a crap a shot. Look how marvel's handling its films. Even the bad ones are usually good.
william-james88 wrote:If ever Sabrblade decides to go on vacation, I am glad to know we can rely on you.
More like, "They're never letting him go, are they?"Noideaforaname wrote:He's never leaving, is he?
Shadowman wrote:This is Sabrblade we're talking about. His ability to store trivial information about TV shows is downright superhuman.
Caelus wrote:My wife pointed out something interesting about the prehistoric Predacons. I said that everyone was complaining because transforming for them mostly consisted of them just standing up-right. She essentially said, 'So? That's what our ancestors did.'
Va'al wrote:Deadput wrote:Actually I don't know my mother's name is Valerie so is Va'al actually my mother?
Yes. Now go to your room and don't play with yourself.
mirageandjazz1197 wrote:Anyways construction vehicles with cloaks hmmm...
That you Scavenger old friend?
william-james88 wrote:If ever Sabrblade decides to go on vacation, I am glad to know we can rely on you.
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