The Energon Pub

[Cobotron]

I don't see the immediate need for full-blown pictures. I like the sense of anticipation.

I'm with RhA. Klaus is a hero! The suspense is killing us all. This thread has been off the hizzy since that photo dropped. Having something to look forward too is exciting.

4. The KO and 3rd party problem they have. Where Hasbro needs to reveal newer products as late as possible. So KO and 3rd party companies don't copy it and release it before HasTak does.

I also agree with the few people who've said this is a TOY show, I don't get the whole NDA thing, it's not like Mattel is going to see this and rush out to shelves their 6 robot combining toy Destructor.

As ridiculous as it seems, this is exactly what they are afraid of. I was the admin. at a toy design studio while in college. I spent 50% of my day faxing out and receiving, and signing Non-Disclosure Agreements. Even to and from Hasbro. The toy industry is a intensely guarded one. They have all been burned before. Where I worked, the cleaning company had to sign an NDA just so they could enter the studio. Hell, I had to sign a phone book size stack of legal agreements just to work there.

We're not allowed to see it because it's probably not done yet.

This. All day long. In most cases It's not the product that's not finished, it's the legalities. The copy rights, the trade marks, and most important, the PATENTS! There are a lot of little innovations and technologies inside all of these toys. If any one company can nail down the patent on these things, then they win. They have the legal upper hand.

I'm not defending these practices. In fact I think they are extremely paranoid and over the top. I'm just trying to shed some light on the subject. I want to see Devy just as bad as everybody else.

I agree 100% paying for leaked pics is no different than paying for express EMS shipping to get the new batch of "Must Have" toys to review; even if they were taken off the assembly line.

Competition is fun, as long as no one gets hurt. Bending the rules can be really fun too.

[Sabrblade]

Least we can confirm it is more towards the classic Devastator than IDW,

Before I proceed, I want to point out that the following is not aimed directly at yourself, Roadbuster, but at the general public of this thread.

I see this "Classics vs. IDW" concern floating around enough to make me ask, aside from Prowl being a part of the equation, what exactly is the difference between a Classics-style and an IDW-style Devastator?

Prowl wasn't always a part of Devastator in IDW. That's only been a thing in recent years. Previously, IDW had Devastator formed by all six traditional Constructicons, as early as "All Hail Megatron #2" back in 2008.

I ask everyone who has been concerned about Devy being "more IDW than Classics", had Devy's new toy been designed to look like the following image (but with the iconic chest wings included), would it have been considered "too IDW" or "more like Classics"?

[Desslok2201]

I don't see the immediate need for full-blown pictures. I like the sense of anticipation.

I'm with RhA. Klaus is a hero! The suspense is killing us all. This thread has been off the hizzy since that photo dropped. Having something to look forward too is exciting.

4. The KO and 3rd party problem they have. Where Hasbro needs to reveal newer products as late as possible. So KO and 3rd party companies don't copy it and release it before HasTak does.

I also agree with the few people who've said this is a TOY show, I don't get the whole NDA thing, it's not like Mattel is going to see this and rush out to shelves their 6 robot combining toy Destructor.

As ridiculous as it seems, this is exactly what they are afraid of. I was the admin. at a toy design studio while in college. I spent 50% of my day faxing out and receiving, and signing Non-Disclosure Agreements. Even to and from Hasbro. The toy industry is a intensely guarded one. They have all been burned before. Where I worked, the cleaning company had to sign an NDA just so they could enter the studio. Hell, I had to sign a phone book size stack of legal agreements just to work there.

We're not allowed to see it because it's probably not done yet.

This. All day long. In most cases It's not the product that's not finished, it's the legalities. The copy rights, the trade marks, and most important, the PATENTS! There are a lot of little innovations and technologies inside all of these toys. If any one company can nail down the patent on these things, then they win. They have the legal upper hand.

I'm not defending these practices. In fact I think they are extremely paranoid and over the top. I'm just trying to shed some light on the subject. I want to see Devy just as bad as everybody else.

I agree 100% paying for leaked pics is no different than paying for express EMS shipping to get the new batch of "Must Have" toys to review; even if they were taken off the assembly line.

Competition is fun, as long as no one gets hurt. Bending the rules can be really fun too.

Beautifully worded. To Klaus!

[Desslok2201]

Least we can confirm it is more towards the classic Devastator than IDW,

Before I proceed, I want to point out that the following is not aimed directly at yourself, Roadbuster, but at the general public of this thread.

I see this "Classics vs. IDW" concern floating around enough to make me ask, aside from Prowl being a part of the equation, what exactly is the difference between a Classics-style and an IDW-style Devastator?

Prowl wasn't always a part of Devastator in IDW. That's only been a thing in recent years. Previously, IDW had Devastator formed by all six traditional Constructicons, as early as "All Hail Megatron #2" back in 2008.

I ask everyone who has been concerned about Devy being "more IDW than Classics", had Devy's new toy been designed to look like the following image (but with the iconic chest wings included), would it have been considered "too IDW" or "more like Classics"?

I think the current IDW vs. G1 concern is mainly the inclusion of Prowl, as well as, and to a lesser extent, 5 vs. 6 member teams. The picture you referenced, outside of the missing wing and kind of wonky head really wouldn't cause as much debate over this as much as Prowl's inclusion.

[Cobotron]

Beautifully worded. To Klaus!

Put 'em up, put 'em up!

[Desslok2201]

Beautifully worded. To Klaus!

Put 'em up, put 'em up!

Awesome

[Seibertron]

Regarding some of the comments people are making about Toy Fair being for the industry and for the press. Seibertron.com is part of both. I attend SDCC, Toy Fair, NYC as well as other events as press.

There's also a lot of assumptions being made in this topic about what can and can't be done at this event. As someone who has attended the US Toy Fair as well as the private Hasbro event for the past 8 years (2015 will be my 9th), the rules for what can and can't be done with photography depends 100% on the vendor. Some vendors are OK with it. Others are not OK with photography so they post signage that states something along the lines of "No Photography". Some vendors are OK with some products being photographed but not others. I always just take pictures and then if someone requests otherwise, I'll delete the pics I took and stop photographing something. There are times when it is easier to ask for forgiveness than to ask for permission. I've learned with photography that it is best to just do what I'm there to do as press and if someone needs me to do something differently, they'll let me know.

My exposure to Toy Fair really shook up my view about the segment of toys that we are all into (i.e. Action Figures in general). It is such a small part of the toy industry. The majority of what I see at Toy Fair is stuff none of us care about because it's toys like educational toys, dollar store toys, toddler toys, kites, no-name brand toys, or it's licensed products such as branded backpacks, pencils, school folders, playing cards, board games, etc. Attending Toy Fair each year really puts into perspective for me where our place is with this industry and how truly special it is that we get what we get. For those who are part of the toy industry (specifically from the vendor side), Toy Fair is a place where hopes and dreams are crushed or see fruition.

If the product is able to be photographed, we'd just like to get some pictures of this. Hopefully we can get them first with some exclusivity but we'll see how this all plays out. At this point, I'd just be happy with some pictures of Devastator from where ever possible (so long as NDAs aren't being broken).

As for Combiner Wars Devastator, I have a hopeful theory about Devastator. What if they figured out how to make all 6 of them to be Scramble City style? It would take a bit of effort to get it to work, but I'm still hoping they figured this out so that you can do the G1 style as well as Prowlstator. The biggest reason I'm hopeful for them figuring out a way to do this? Hasbro has been working so closely with IDW over the past few years that it would seem really odd for them to toss out this key part of the story line. Of course, it could also be as simple as Hasbro saying to IDW ... bring Scrapper back. Fix Devastator. Get rid of Prowlstator.

All shall be revealed in 15 days!

[padfoo]

Regarding some of the comments people are making about Toy Fair being for the industry and for the press. Seibertron.com is part of both. I attend SDCC, Toy Fair, NYC as well as other events as press.

There's also a lot of assumptions being made in this topic about what can and can't be done at this event. As someone who has attended the US Toy Fair as well as the private Hasbro event for the past 8 years (2015 will be my 9th), the rules for what can and can't be done with photography depends 100% on the vendor. Some vendors are OK with it. Others are not OK with photography so they post signage that states something along the lines of "No Photography". Some vendors are OK with some products being photographed but not others. I always just take pictures and then if someone requests otherwise, I'll delete the pics I took and stop photographing something. There are times when it is easier to ask for forgiveness than to ask for permission. I've learned with photography that it is best to just do what I'm there to do as press and if someone needs me to do something differently, they'll let me know.

My exposure to Toy Fair really shook up my view about the segment of toys that we are all into (i.e. Action Figures in general). It is such a small part of the toy industry. The majority of what I see at Toy Fair is stuff none of us care about because it's toys like educational toys, dollar store toys, toddler toys, kites, no-name brand toys, or it's licensed products such as branded backpacks, pencils, school folders, playing cards, board games, etc. Attending Toy Fair each year really puts into perspective for me where our place is with this industry and how truly special it is that we get what we get. For those who are part of the toy industry (specifically from the vendor side), Toy Fair is a place where hopes and dreams are crushed or see fruition.

If the product is able to be photographed, we'd just like to get some pictures of this. Hopefully we can get them first with some exclusivity but we'll see how this all plays out. At this point, I'd just be happy with some pictures of Devastator from where ever possible (so long as NDAs aren't being broken).

As for Combiner Wars Devastator, I have a hopeful theory about Devastator. What if they figured out how to make all 6 of them to be Scramble City style? It would take a bit of effort to get it to work, but I'm still hoping they figured this out so that you can do the G1 style as well as Prowlstator. The biggest reason I'm hopeful for them figuring out a way to do this? Hasbro has been working so closely with IDW over the past few years that it would seem really odd for them to toss out this key part of the story line. Of course, it could also be as simple as Hasbro saying to IDW ... bring Scrapper back. Fix Devastator. Get rid of Prowlstator.

All shall be revealed in 15 days!

[ZeroWolf]

I can see them trying it (if it succeed is another matter) . I've said it before that hasbro is very entwined with IDW and they're not stupid, they'll have people who read fan sites, they'll know of the demand for prowlastator.

[Rated X]

Regarding some of the comments people are making about Toy Fair being for the industry and for the press. Seibertron.com is part of both. I attend SDCC, Toy Fair, NYC as well as other events as press.

There's also a lot of assumptions being made in this topic about what can and can't be done at this event. As someone who has attended the US Toy Fair as well as the private Hasbro event for the past 8 years (2015 will be my 9th), the rules for what can and can't be done with photography depends 100% on the vendor. Some vendors are OK with it. Others are not OK with photography so they post signage that states something along the lines of "No Photography". Some vendors are OK with some products being photographed but not others. I always just take pictures and then if someone requests otherwise, I'll delete the pics I took and stop photographing something. There are times when it is easier to ask for forgiveness than to ask for permission. I've learned with photography that it is best to just do what I'm there to do as press and if someone needs me to do something differently, they'll let me know.

My exposure to Toy Fair really shook up my view about the segment of toys that we are all into (i.e. Action Figures in general). It is such a small part of the toy industry. The majority of what I see at Toy Fair is stuff none of us care about because it's toys like educational toys, dollar store toys, toddler toys, kites, no-name brand toys, or it's licensed products such as branded backpacks, pencils, school folders, playing cards, board games, etc. Attending Toy Fair each year really puts into perspective for me where our place is with this industry and how truly special it is that we get what we get. For those who are part of the toy industry (specifically from the vendor side), Toy Fair is a place where hopes and dreams are crushed or see fruition.

If the product is able to be photographed, we'd just like to get some pictures of this. Hopefully we can get them first with some exclusivity but we'll see how this all plays out. At this point, I'd just be happy with some pictures of Devastator from where ever possible (so long as NDAs aren't being broken).

As for Combiner Wars Devastator, I have a hopeful theory about Devastator. What if they figured out how to make all 6 of them to be Scramble City style? It would take a bit of effort to get it to work, but I'm still hoping they figured this out so that you can do the G1 style as well as Prowlstator. The biggest reason I'm hopeful for them figuring out a way to do this? Hasbro has been working so closely with IDW over the past few years that it would seem really odd for them to toss out this key part of the story line. Of course, it could also be as simple as Hasbro saying to IDW ... bring Scrapper back. Fix Devastator. Get rid of Prowlstator.

All shall be revealed in 15 days!

No hard feelings, but I liked the stance you first took better when you offered a bounty for clear pics. Just because the toy industry is a weird bunch of paranoid people, doesnt mean we need to support their weirdness. They really aint s**t without us fans who buy the product. If us fans were so unimportant, then they wouldnt have made a G1 Devastator. Us fans are the reason that toy exists. So its time for us fans to start being the puppeteers instead of the puppets. Getting those photos online was a great first step. We need more now, forget the 2 weeks. Just my opinion.

[ZeroWolf]

But we should never bite the hand that feeds in this case. Photos shouldn't cost someone their livelihood. What difference does a few weeks make? You say we need to be puppeteers but that will never be the case. In the grand scheme of things we are a speck to hasbro (this looks at all of hasbros customers across all their products and sub companies). We need them to make the toys for us which are available locally and are affordable. They need customers but at the end of the day they don't care which demographic it is hence why we get children toys with nods and stylings of a thirty year old toyline.

[Tsutsukakushi]

and more about the Computron 'leak'. In the original post, it sure sounded like an offhand remark, almost wishful thinking.

As speculated by some online fans, Including myself. A CW Computron should be a easy one for HasTak to release. As some are guessing it will be mostly repainted and retooled figures from othe CW Teams.

[Nemesis Maximo]

I call for "a countdown of days until the unveiling" to go on the main page.

[ZeroWolf]

I call for "a countdown of days until the unveiling" to go on the main page.

Now that would be cool

[Seibertron]

No hard feelings, but I liked the stance you first took better when you offered a bounty for clear pics. Just because the toy industry is a weird bunch of paranoid people, doesnt mean we need to support their weirdness. They really aint s**t without us fans who buy the product. If us fans were so unimportant, then they wouldnt have made a G1 Devastator. Us fans are the reason that toy exists. So its time for us fans to start being the puppeteers instead of the puppets. Getting those photos online was a great first step. We need more now, forget the 2 weeks. Just my opinion.

The "bounty" is still out there. I'd like to see pics as much as all of you. My stance hasn't changed. The only thing I've done since the original post is clarify that I don't want people doing things they're not supposed to be doing. I value my relationship with Hasbro and would like to maintain a good relationship with them because that is in all of our best interests.

Your mistrust in Hasbro and the corporate world is what really stands out in your above statement. They do an incredible amount of really cool things for us fans. Your comments come across as ungrateful or unappreciative. Maybe you don't have any need to feel those things, which is fine ... you don't have to. But your tone is harsh. It puts others on the defensive, which is what you may or may not intend.

Hasbro does an amazing job of doing this balancing act between doing things they think are going to make money (the most important thing here), making children, parents, fans, and collectors happy and obviously doing things that make investors or stock holders happy. It's a tough position to be in. Do they make all of those groups happy all of the time? Of course not, but I think they're certainly doing a great job of trying to find that perfect balance.

[william-james88]

I call for "a countdown of days until the unveiling" to go on the main page.

Now that would be cool

I would love that. But 2 things:

How do we know which day of the show they will unveil it?

How can we be certain they will unveil it at all? A rep said it, but if they were mistaken and the countdown goes and we dont get an image, wont we all want to join in a mass suicide? I can get started on the punch.

[Seibertron]

I call for "a countdown of days until the unveiling" to go on the main page.

Now that would be cool

I would love that. But 2 things:

How do we know which day of the show they will unveil it?

How can we be certain they will unveil it at all? A rep said it, but if they were mistaken and the countdown goes and we dont get an image, wont we all want to join in a mass suicide? I can get started on the punch.

February 14th at the Hasbro press event. We can't be certain, but since it's at the Germany toy fair and Hasbro seems to like to reveal a big product at the show every year, I'm betting it's Devastator. Metroplex two years ago, Jetfire and AOE products last year, etc. Toy Fair is their flagship event followed up by SDCC 5 months later.

[Nemesis Maximo]

February 14 because Hasbro loves us.

[Desslok2201]

I think the existence of the generations line in itself is proof that Hasbro loves us. All these complaints about Hasbro not revealing pics yet just reminds me of Christmas. When I was a kid, I knew there was stuff under the tree, but I didn't hate my parents for making me wait until Christmas. The wait fellt like it was killing me, sure, but I never petitioned against them

[shajaki]

I value my relationship with Hasbro and would like to maintain a good relationship with them because that is in all of our best interests.

Hasbro does an incredible amount of really cool things for us fans.

Hasbro does an amazing job of doing this balancing act between doing things they think are going to make money (the most important thing here), making children, parents, fans, and collectors happy and obviously doing things that make investors or stock holders happy. It's a tough position to be in. Do they make all of those groups happy all of the time? Of course not, but I think they're certainly doing a great job of trying to find that perfect balance.

[william-james88]

I think the existence of the generations line in itself is proof that Hasbro loves us. All these complaints about Hasbro not revealing pics yet just reminds me of Christmas. When I was a kid, I knew there was stuff under the tree, but I didn't hate my parents for making me wait until Christmas. The wait fellt like it was killing me, sure, but I never petitioned against them

Also, its not like we'll be able to buy it the day we see the pictures, so waiting for pictures makes us wait less for the toy itself.

[ZeroWolf]

Looking forward to the toy show then. Still undecided so it will be down to a good look of the individual constructicons themselves that may win me over.

Then of course it will be waiting to see about the rumoured yellow exclusive SDCC set...Then takara's offering. How many releases of metroplex were there again?

[SW's SilverHammer]

Looking forward to the toy show then. Still undecided so it will be down to a good look of the individual constructicons themselves that may win me over.

Then of course it will be waiting to see about the rumoured yellow exclusive SDCC set...Then takara's offering. How many releases of metroplex were there again?

4, two for conventions SDCC and Animation-Comic-Game Hong Kong, then 2 standard retail, hasbro and takara tomy

[Tsutsukakushi]

Don't get why this whole hating on HasTak and calling them the big bad corporation. needs to exist on a toy forum dedicated to Hasbro's toy products.

Agree with others, HasTak does more than other toy companies do. by attending all of these toyfairs in other countries with newer products they unveil. Going out of there way to please the fans by attending all of those conventions. Creating Two whole entire Transformers toy lines for the older fans called Masterpieces and Generations.

Agree that some need to be more appreciative and less demanding, less harsh. While this bashing behavior might be amusing at first or funny to some. It gets old real fast when it gets kicked up a few notches and dominates threads with over Twenty Five bashing replies repeating the same thing over and over.

HasTak did not need to create the Combiners Wars toy line. They did it because they love the fans. HasTak is trying real hard here to please the fans.

HasTak could gave just done Rid2015 toys and thats it. Maybe instead of CW, Made more rescue bots toys for the younger kids.

HasTak did not need to create that 30th Transformers toy line last year. It was done to make the fans happy and to show Hasbro appreciates them. Other toy companies don't even bother to celebrate toy line anniversaries. The fact HasTak does a G-1 TF toy line anniversary every Five years says they care. Guessing 2016 HasTak will do a Beast wars 20th anniversary toy line, Showing those fans they care.

[Rated X]

No hard feelings, but I liked the stance you first took better when you offered a bounty for clear pics. Just because the toy industry is a weird bunch of paranoid people, doesnt mean we need to support their weirdness. They really aint s**t without us fans who buy the product. If us fans were so unimportant, then they wouldnt have made a G1 Devastator. Us fans are the reason that toy exists. So its time for us fans to start being the puppeteers instead of the puppets. Getting those photos online was a great first step. We need more now, forget the 2 weeks. Just my opinion.

The "bounty" is still out there. I'd like to see pics as much as all of you. My stance hasn't changed. The only thing I've done since the original post is clarify that I don't want people doing things they're not supposed to be doing. I value my relationship with Hasbro and would like to maintain a good relationship with them because that is in all of our best interests.

Your mistrust in Hasbro and the corporate world is what really stands out in your above statement. They do an incredible amount of really cool things for us fans. Your comments come across as ungrateful or unappreciative. Maybe you don't have any need to feel those things, which is fine ... you don't have to. But your tone is harsh. It puts others on the defensive, which is what you may or may not intend.

Hasbro does an amazing job of doing this balancing act between doing things they think are going to make money (the most important thing here), making children, parents, fans, and collectors happy and obviously doing things that make investors or stock holders happy. It's a tough position to be in. Do they make all of those groups happy all of the time? Of course not, but I think they're certainly doing a great job of trying to find that perfect balance.

I understand what you’re saying. I just don’t agree with the whole “top secret” marketing strategy. It always fails so why even bother. Hasbro’s target audience is kids. Kids aren’t tuning in to toy fair updates online for the latest smuggled photos of a G1 Devastator character from 30 years ago. Kids are playing video games, watching TV or out playing sports or whatever. The only people glued to these updates is us 30 something G1 fans. So by Hasbro being all touchy about “unauthorized” reveals, they are taking a direct shot at us because we are the only ones who give a crap. As I said earlier, if Hasbro was worried about secrets so bad, they should stop sending TRU product information so many months early. All kinds of TF fans and scalpers work in TRU so the cat was let out the bag a long time ago. 2 weeks is a lot of time to someone who might have to make a financial decision based on a few pics. Some people want to sell their Hercules or Giant. Some people who hate the large size might now want to buy Hercules or Giant. Either way, I think the concept of secret reveals has failed. It’s time for a new strategy that supports the fans instead of belittles them for showing anticipation.

Let me pose an interesting question…

Let’s say someone answers your bounty this weekend. You already know Hasbro wouldn’t appreciate this site leaking the image. But you know your website’s fan base would appreciate it greatly. You would have a tough choice to make. Who takes preference? Hasbro’s business interests or your own? Assuming increased web traffic translates to increased profits; would you be willing to miss out on an opportunity to see Hasbro’s failed secrecy practices continue?