The Energon Pub

[Deadput]

In my opinion, the best way to introduce new things is to mix them with the old, going 100 percent new right off the bat I feel is a recipe for turning away fans.

I'll always be a fan of having legacy characters among casts of new guys.

RID sorta is what I was thinking in a way, you had Bumblebee as both the leader and a familiar face, Sideswipe and Grimlock are sorta not new characters in name and basic traits but they were also pretty different from their G1 counterparts, Strongarm and Fixit were pretty much new characters entirely even if they shared names with previous Transformers.

Anyways if the War for Cybertron trilogy was a show I would love the main Autobot cast to comprise of Hound as the leader and legacy character and then Cog, Ironworks and the Powerdashers to fill in the rest of the squad.

Other familiar characters like Cliffjumper and Ironhide can be guest stars from time to time as plot would need, I would have Optimus Prime as an important character but not one actually seen a lot since he's busy and would be more of a legend who is spoken about a lot but only ever makes rare appearances and most of those would be in general messages to the Autobot army and besides a prologue or a season finale would not have direct interactions with the main cast.

[Ironhidensh]

We don't need more beast wars but more new things like beast wars. Something that takes the old concept and turns it on it's head.

Iron works here is a step in the right direction, taking something old (micromaster bases) and doing something new with it (robot mode)

We need more ideas like that

Then you guys better be prepared to buy, at least, 10 copies of Ironwerks each. Mass amounts of sales are the only thing that will encourage hasbro to continue with newer ideas.

[Jeddostotle7]

I know and accept that G1 will always win out in the mind of the overall fandom. Right now its fine but after this trilogy, if we get another G1-accurate line with the '84 cast AGAIN...

Edit: Look guys, I'm a 'convert' to the G1 hypetrain and have gotten on board with the Generations when I got back into collecting with Titans Return. If I didn't have some massive appreciation ans growing love for the G1 designs and cast I wouldn't be collecting this stuff. Its just I worry a lot about stagnation once the initial 'whoa' factor of these mini-Masterpiece, mass retail G1 remake figures runs out.

I still think, as has been mentioned in this thread before I believe, that since the main generation that grew up with G1 is getting older, and thus is soon going to be much less likely to be getting toys, they're doing everything they can to basically "finish up" G1 characters and make as new toys of as many of them as possible, and that whatever comes after this trilogy, while it may not be a straight-up full-on switch to focusing on other aspects of the franchise, it'll start the transition away from primarily G1.

[AcademyofDrX]

Aside from the '84 and '85 crew, many of the WfC characters and play themes correspond to the 30 year anniversary concept. Micromasters debuted in '89, and came to Generations in 2019's Siege. Action Masters were '90, and they loosely correspond to Battle Masters, who will continue into Earthrise in 2020.

Beast Wars will get its turn, y'all are just impatient. Check back in ... 2026!

[AllNewSuperRobot]

There is the crux of it all, right there. WFC so far doesn't correspond to the 35 anniversary of Transformers. It is catering almost exclusively to the first 3-5 years.

It is a fallacy to believe G1 fans are still the majority of the fanbase. Three and a half decades later there are several generations of fans now with no attachment to the 80's at all. Those that grew up with Unicron Trilogy, Bayformers, Prime etc Their Transformers, the one that was part of Their childhood.

Why should they wait for new versions of old characters they don't care about, before their turn comes?

Beast Wars saved Transformers from Nostalgia entrenched oblivion. It doesn't need any reinvention because it already did that and wasn't the relatively blank creative canvas its predecessor was, to begin with.

Maybe with a little luck, as Jeddostotle7 said, WFC is in fact the swan song of G1. A greatest hits to end on, before we get the New Beast Wars/Machines/Car Robots/UT/Animated/Prime/RiD/Cyberverse et al NOT just endlessly recycling the old.

A Rebirth for Transformers as a franchise. Shying away from dated roots and seriously embracing change.

[Sentinel_Primal]

I truly would love to believe that we'll move past G1 after WFC, but at this point, I wouldn't be surprised if HasTak is doing the MP route of "Well, time to update a figure that's already good enough". I mean, we get a new Prime every year that updates the G1 design more and more. Aside from the evolution gimmick, POTP Prime was a fairly decent budget MP. It had the trailer, the right size for bot mode, and the removable matrix. But now we have the new Prime that's closer to MP10. Only negative is the replacement of blue hands for grey hands and the yellow eyes. I wouldn't be surprised if next year they announced the Prime for part 3 is basically a "perfect version" of this year's. At this point, I'd even settle for going back to what Prime Wars did in terms of design, or even switching over to the IDW-1 designs for a year.

All that said, if HasTak decides to throw a wrench in the works after Earthrise and do a leader Thunderclash instead of Prime (with the obvious recolor being Machine Wars Prime), bring in a Commander Class Star Saber, leader Victory Leo, and/or have a leader class Deathsaurus, then I will officially give up making predictions for where they're going, shut up and just enjoy the figures they put out

[ZeroWolf]

I truly would love to believe that we'll move past G1 after WFC, but at this point, I wouldn't be surprised if HasTak is doing the MP route of "Well, time to update a figure that's already good enough". I mean, we get a new Prime every year that updates the G1 design more and more. Aside from the evolution gimmick, POTP Prime was a fairly decent budget MP. It had the trailer, the right size for bot mode, and the removable matrix. But now we have the new Prime that's closer to MP10. Only negative is the replacement of blue hands for grey hands and the yellow eyes. I wouldn't be surprised if next year they announced the Prime for part 3 is basically a "perfect version" of this year's. At this point, I'd even settle for going back to what Prime Wars did in terms of design, or even switching over to the IDW-1 designs for a year.

All that said, if HasTak decides to throw a wrench in the works after Earthrise and do a leader Thunderclash instead of Prime (with the obvious recolor being Machine Wars Prime), bring in a Commander Class Star Saber, leader Victory Leo, and/or have a leader class Deathsaurus, then I will officially give up making predictions for where they're going, shut up and just enjoy the figures they put out

Hasbro wouldn't get my money fast enough if they announced a Victory Starsaber for the third part (leader/voyager or commander/leader I'm fine with either!)

[Skritz]

I truly would love to believe that we'll move past G1 after WFC, but at this point, I wouldn't be surprised if HasTak is doing the MP route of "Well, time to update a figure that's already good enough".

This is what I fear will happen after this trilogy and eventually even the diehard GEEWUN fans will go 'Waaah waaah why can't we get something new?' and everyone else who wasn't raised on Generation 1 will glare at them and mutter something along the lines of 'making their bed and getting **** in it'.

Of course, at the same time from a business standpoint I understand they will want to keep all those marketable basic characters on shelves as much as they can on a X year span so anyone who jumps into collecting after Prime Wars and WFC want to collect stuff without relying on the after market. Still, you know the shark will have been jumped when they redo the Scramble City Combiners to be 1:1 accurate to the G1 toys since people complained so much about retooling in Combiner Wars.

[Sentinel_Primal]

Of course, at the same time from a business standpoint I understand they will want to keep all those marketable basic characters on shelves as much as they can on a X year span so anyone who jumps into collecting after Prime Wars and WFC want to collect stuff without relying on the after market.

That's the thing though. I don't think anyone's saying ditch Optimus and Megatron for completely new characters. Or if they are, they're in the minority. I think everyone's saying that they would like different versions of those characters. Recently I've been seeing a lot of people wanting proper updates or straight up reissues of Unicron Trilogy designs. I think Armada designs definitely need some attention, either to fix them in the cause of Sideswipe, or improve them in the case of Armada Prime's supermode.

Luckily, Takara seems to be willing to "take the risk" and is doing an update to Prime which will hopefully lead to more updates in the future if it sells well

[Skritz]

I'd never want them to ditch Optimus and Megatron completely. After all, not even Beast Wars which was at the time controversial and the first major reboot understood that each faction needed an Optimus, helmet and mouthplate and all versus a Megatron, bucket helmet and all. The core design elements are so ingrained into the franchise as a whole, especially in the west, that RiD2001 took the once distinct-yet-clearly-archetype-derived Fire Convoy and Gigatron and made them into new incarnations of the iconic duo.

Having an Optimus and Megatron is just part of the brand's identity as a whole. However that doesn't mean every line need a cubic red '80 semi truck and a gray tank (or upside down gun, maybe). Ever since the Movie era has, Hasbro has taken less and less creative risks with those designs. I understand Earthrise is very much a 'modern G1' line and that's fine. Since I'm being a broken record: I'm not too bothered now but I will be if the next major chunk of Generations after WFC is just more of the same.

Beside, I'm so weirded out by the fact people seem to see this as a zero sum game. Why can't we have a half G1, half 'other stuff that is redesigned and updated'? Galaxy Upgrade Optimus Prime is a good example of that being done right even if its just an Ultra Magnus retool Seriously, for example, why not retool Impactor into Armada Demolishor? Why not make a G1-ified Crumplezone, Lugnut or Lockdown?

[Wolfman Jake]

Let's consider a few things before we just descend (again) into the "G1 vs. everything else" arguments.

1) Siege wasn't entirely based on G1. We got a few nice nods to other continuities thrown in for good measure. There's Galaxy Upgrade Optimus Prime and Hot Shot, both homaging Transformers: Cybertron, and Barricade, homaging his live action movie incarnation rather than his G1 Micromaster self, in a line that has very specifically revived the G1 Micromasters!

2) Siege has also brought us a LOT of brand new stuff. Several of the Battle Masters are all new characters, specifically Dazzlestrike, Pteraxadon, Smashdown, and Terror-Daxtyl.

3) Siege has delivered on some G1 stuff we've NEVER had before, like Greenlight and Lancer to finish off the female Autobot team. This also gave us a brand new all-female combiner named Orthia! We also got a redeco and retool of Chromia as Nightbird for the first time in a non-Takara Tomy market! We got Red Wing for the first time ever in toy form too!

4) Siege has given us updates of characters that haven't seen ANY exposure since G1. The Powerdashers have been revived for the first time ever, giving us cannon names for them as well: Cromar, Zetar, and Aragon.

5) Earthrise will likely continue the trends above, giving us some new characters, like Battle Master "Soundbarrier," obscure homages, more G1 characters we haven't had before directly from Hasbro (probably the Omnibots), as well as more nods to other Transformers continuities thrown in for good measure.

[Skritz]

Yeah, I know: odds are Earthrise just started off with ye olde classic G1 stuff because its a safe bet. Same way Siege did.

Edit: Powerdasher already had names, btw.

[Sabrblade]

Hot Shot is part of the Selects line, not Siege itself.

[Wolfman Jake]

Hot Shot is part of the Selects line, not Siege itself.

Hot Shot is part of the Siege sub-brand of the "Generations Selects" line, though, so he fits with Siege just as well as someone like Red Wing does. Remember, Red Swoop and Ricochet came in "Power of the Primes" boxes under Selects instead, so Selects isn't something wholly unto itself, but rather an online outlet for figures that aren't slated to be released and wide brick and mortar retail for a given line.

[blackeyedprime]

Technically Crosshairs could count as an Armada figure as he's in the super short shots of cybertron when the minicons reactivate, episode 1 around 14 mins mark and the same could be said of skyfire (who has a bit more red on him, cybertron robot mode Hound, looks to be cybertron mode red alert with the shoulder rocket launcher. I'm sure Earthrise will have some of the oddities and throwbacks like Siege does.

[Wolfman Jake]

So, with the conclusion of Siege, we'll still be two major Soundwave minions short: Buzzsaw and Frenzy (blue guy). These are easy repaints and should eventually show up in some way or another. They can easily be slotted into Earthrise as a third and final "Soundwave Spy Patrol" of the Micromaster assortment. But, would Hasbro hesitate to do so if there is no compatible Soundwave toy to go with them? Might that mean that, like Optimus Prime and Starscream, we'll be getting an "Earthmode" Soundwave in Earthrise? Or, maybe Ratbat and Frenzy will be relegated to the Generations Selects line? Or maybe Hasbro doesn't care about having Soundwave on the shelves "concurrent" with these last two Micromasters?

[Microbot]

So, with the conclusion of Siege, we'll still be two major Soundwave minions short: Buzzsaw and Frenzy (blue guy). These are easy repaints and should eventually show up in some way or another. They can easily be slotted into Earthrise as a third and final "Soundwave Spy Patrol" of the Micromaster assortment. But, would Hasbro hesitate to do so if there is no compatible Soundwave toy to go with them? Might that mean that, like Optimus Prime and Starscream, we'll be getting an "Earthmode" Soundwave in Earthrise? Or, maybe Ratbat and Frenzy will be relegated to the Generations Selects line? Or maybe Hasbro doesn't care about having Soundwave on the shelves "concurrent" with these last two Micromasters?

I think we will get an earthrise Soundwave mode for getting Blaster too

[D-Maximal_Primal]

Considering the Micromasters are continuing, I'm willing to bet we get the final 2 "standard" cassettes next year in some fashion

[Skritz]

So, with the conclusion of Siege, we'll still be two major Soundwave minions short: Buzzsaw and Frenzy (blue guy). These are easy repaints and should eventually show up in some way or another. They can easily be slotted into Earthrise as a third and final "Soundwave Spy Patrol" of the Micromaster assortment. But, would Hasbro hesitate to do so if there is no compatible Soundwave toy to go with them? Might that mean that, like Optimus Prime and Starscream, we'll be getting an "Earthmode" Soundwave in Earthrise? Or, maybe Ratbat and Frenzy will be relegated to the Generations Selects line? Or maybe Hasbro doesn't care about having Soundwave on the shelves "concurrent" with these last two Micromasters?

I think we will get an earthrise Soundwave mode for getting Blaster too

That's what I expect too and I'm on board for it. I'll likely skip any new Soundwave, obviously, but I'm all up for Blasters.

[Microbot]

..And ok I know it's impossible, but I really hope they re-release Fortress Maximus but without lights & sounds and with better points of articulation and more cartoon accurate accessory ( like guns and blade)

[Jelze Bunnycat]

Hot Shot is part of the Selects line, not Siege itself.

Hot Shot is part of the Siege sub-brand of the "Generations Selects" line, though, so he fits with Siege just as well as someone like Red Wing does. Remember, Red Swoop and Ricochet came in "Power of the Primes" boxes under Selects instead, so Selects isn't something wholly unto itself, but rather an online outlet for figures that aren't slated to be released and wide brick and mortar retail for a given line.

My Red Wing box has the War For Cybertron Trilogy logo on it, but not the Siege part. So it would be more accurate to say Selects has a "WFC Trilogy" subsection, not limited to Siege or Earthrise.

[Sentinel_Primal]

I just had a thought: Will Fasttrack be coming in Earthrise, or will we have to wait for the next part of the trilogy for Scorponok's little friend? Or will we see a new trend/exception to the previous titans where Fasttrack will actually come with Scorponok instead of being a separate figure? I'm sort of hoping Fasttrack's separate for weaponizer purposes, but I'd be happy to see him included

[Zeedust]

I still think, as has been mentioned in this thread before I believe, that since the main generation that grew up with G1 is getting older, and thus is soon going to be much less likely to be getting toys, they're doing everything they can to basically "finish up" G1 characters and make as new toys of as many of them as possible, and that whatever comes after this trilogy, while it may not be a straight-up full-on switch to focusing on other aspects of the franchise, it'll start the transition away from primarily G1.

I'd love to share your optimism, but with Cyberverse also being retro-G1, I'm inclined to be skeptical.

[Sentinel_Primal]

I still think, as has been mentioned in this thread before I believe, that since the main generation that grew up with G1 is getting older, and thus is soon going to be much less likely to be getting toys, they're doing everything they can to basically "finish up" G1 characters and make as new toys of as many of them as possible, and that whatever comes after this trilogy, while it may not be a straight-up full-on switch to focusing on other aspects of the franchise, it'll start the transition away from primarily G1.

I'd love to share your optimism, but with Cyberverse also being retro-G1, I'm inclined to be skeptical.

Cyberverse I wouldn't actually call retro-G1. Personally, I haven't watched it yet, but from what I hear, it's actually doing something similar to Animated where it mixes things up but still keeps characters recognizable. Especially with Grimlock being inspired by Dr. Jekyll/Mr. Hyde in terms of robot mode and beast mode

[AcademyofDrX]

I don't think there's any chance that G1 goes away. Animated, Prime, RiD, and Cyberverse all have G1 characters and aesthetics, though with enough unique visual and design flair that they're not "just" G1. Cyberverse has a model that is consistent with the Generations line-wide approach: G1 core, but multiple characters from other franchises with distinct roles.

It's also possible that post-WfC, the IDW comics may find a way to integrate the franchises like they did pre-reboot. I loved the concept of planetary colonies with distinct franchises, like Eukaris with the Beast Wars characters.

I would also appreciate if at least one thread on these boards wouldn't devolve into factional bickering, but Earthrise is too new to be anything but baseless speculation and territorial conflict.