The Energon Pub

Sun Sep 23, 2012 3:57 am

What TF that has never been a Prime, would make the best future Autobot leader, if you had your choice? Any TF comic, cartoon, or movie character of your choosing would be acceptable.

News Credits: 226 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 4:25 am

Ultra Magnus.

From the time I was introduced to him in the animated movie, he's always felt, and looked like the leader to me. More than that annoying Hot Rod character.

Sun Sep 23, 2012 4:47 am

Burn wrote:Ultra Magnus.

From the time I was introduced to him in the animated movie, he's always felt, and looked like the leader to me. More than that annoying Hot Rod character.

Got to agree there, Ultra Magnus seem to have the more natural "leader" personality. It almost seems like making Rodimus Prime as leader in the G1 cartoon was a last second decision by the writers.

Always to the guys (and gals) reading this thread, if you have an entire line of sucession in your mind, go ahead and list it.

News Credits: 226 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 5:38 am

I wouldn't mind seeing Prowl stepping up as a leader as well. In the 80's he seemed a little under-developed but IDW's done a good job of adding more character to him. And he makes more sense as a leader than Bumblebee.

News Credits: 6188 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 5:58 am

Burn wrote:I wouldn't mind seeing Prowl stepping up as a leader as well. In the 80's he seemed a little under-developed but IDW's done a good job of adding more character to him. And he makes more sense as a leader than Bumblebee.

Hasn't he been de facto in charge during some IDW arcs?
I like the new renditions of him, but he is a scary leader.

News Credits: 226 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 6:11 am

Va'al wrote:I like the new renditions of him, but he is a scary leader.

I think at this stage of the franchise it's what the Autobots need. Someone aside from Optimus who's either the boy scout or a goddamn preacher. Someone who just doesn't take crap and is willing to get victory even if it costs the lives of a few innocents.

News Credits: 6188 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 6:30 am

But.. he's actually killing people to further his own goals, be they for the 'greater good' or not.

I don't think I can agree that he would be a suitable leader. He might end up being another Megatron.

At the same time, I do agree on the fact that we need less preachy, avuncular characters.

News Credits: 2 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 6:32 am

To my mind, the characteristics/qualities a leader needs to embody are:

- Strong moral compass
- Flexibility/Adaptability
- The ability to win hearts and minds
- Experience
- Bravery
- The ability to listen

If I had to base my decision on the original G1 fiction, my only answer would be Ultra Magnus. Out of the atributes above, he had most of them. Prime had them all, for sure. Ultra Magnus was relatively inexperienced, but then so was Optimus when it was his time to step up. Ultra Magnus got his ass whupped several times over by Galvatron but never baulked at the challenge, even putting himself on the line so the other Autobots could carry out their plan (Target:2006) He was respected by the other Autobots. In the movie, his actions saved the crew of the shuttle by seperating it, showing his adaptability. You could imaging him making a decent fist of robot-human relations too, being compassionate yet pragmatic. And, most of all, Optimus Prime chose him to succeed.

Other candidates? Prowl was always too inflexible and a bit of a douche in the original fiction, very similar to another candidate in Grimlock, actually. Probably why they hated each other. The only difference between them is that Prowl was determined to follow Prime's word to the letter, no matter what circumstances changed etc. Grimlock was determined to ignore Prime, no matter the inherent wisdom of what was being said. I feel we never saw enough of Jazz to comment, despite his second-in-command status. I guess in time Rodimus may have been a good leader, but he was always going to be a slightly Machiavellian choice (being that he kinda killed Prime originally) with charges of Nepotism levelled (what does the Matrix know?) Rodimus' biggest mistake was not honouring Optimus's wishes and handing the matrix back to Magnus after the events of the movie.

Well, that was a bit of a brainfart.

News Credits: 22 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:51 am

Going with the Marvel comics version of G1, I always thought Fortress Maximus would have been great. Personally, he was my 2nd favorite character after Grimlock. I would have loved to see Grimlock be a true leader, as he was towards the end, but as it's been pointed out, he was a bit of a hardass. (OK, that might be understating it.) I always thought Optimus was too preachy and whiny (no wonder he died so many times) even if he was deemed the "greatest." But Grimlock might have been too much in the opposite direction. Anyway, back to Maximus. He was (before, and after the Headmaster process) level-headed, compassionate, selfless, physically superior to both his allies and enemies, and very smart. He would have made a really good successor, probably even better than Magnus. I almost picked up iDW's MTMTE series, until I found out they turned him into a pu**y. I like Overlord's total badassery, but I always thought Maximus could have beat him. Hopefully in ReGeneration 1 he returns just like Scorponok did, and has a fitting place in the overall story instead of being that emo douche Spike's toy.

My other choice (also from the Marvel G1 comics, along with DW's mini-series) would be Jetfire. He was kind of abandoned in the story, especially later by Furman, but what we saw of him, he had leadership qualities. He was a formidable fighter, a flyer, and he was also compassionate and selfless. Too bad his personality was never really explored more, I would have liked to see that scientist personality come out that he had glimpses of in the cartoon. And the DW mini-series with Sunstorm in it? That's all the argument anyone should need to make for his leadership skills.

News Credits: 2 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 9:06 am

D'oh, I forgot about Jetfire. Well he certainly had the physical prowess and leadership skills, but he was an ex-Decepticon. Would he ever be fully trusted? I'd like to think so, but what if he was in very, very deep cover all along? :-$

News Credits: 15 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 12:52 pm

Magnus. Always.

News Credits: 226 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:56 pm

Banjo-Tron wrote:D'oh, I forgot about Jetfire. Well he certainly had the physical prowess and leadership skills, but he was an ex-Decepticon. Would he ever be fully trusted? I'd like to think so, but what if he was in very, very deep cover all along?

Well they keep putting faith in that idiot Drift so ...

News Credits: 2 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 3:09 pm

Burn wrote:
Banjo-Tron wrote:D'oh, I forgot about Jetfire. Well he certainly had the physical prowess and leadership skills, but he was an ex-Decepticon. Would he ever be fully trusted? I'd like to think so, but what if he was in very, very deep cover all along?

Well they keep putting faith in that idiot Drift so ...

I remember when 'Drift' was the name of a pretty nice chocolate bar. Now I am reminded of that risible pantomime 'OMG teh ninja swordz!' turncoat contrived douche and can't even enjoy confectionary in peace :sad:

Excuse my rant. Another possible candidate for leadership would be Ratchet. He was extremely well-written in the G1 comics and had his fair share of issues to deal with. Shame he bought the farm in the movie I guess.

News Credits: 226 · Sun Sep 23, 2012 3:40 pm

Comics Ratchet was awesome, I always enjoyed his "rivalry" of sorts with Megatron. He was after all, just a medic, but he got thrust into a situation against the big bad and frankly, he held his ground.

Mix him with Prime Ratchet, who is crotchety and cranky and doesn't hesitate to speak his mind, and THAT could be a good leader.

Tue Sep 25, 2012 2:53 am

Good jobs guys :APPLAUSE:

. Here is a side question for you. In the G1 cartoon, Orion Pax didn't exhibit much the future Optimus Prime leadership skills until we was rebuilt after Megatron tried to kill him, Ariel, and others. Is there an Autobot out there would be leadership material they matured naturally or was a direct victim of the horrors of war and grew up traumatically?

Wed Sep 26, 2012 12:30 am

I would choose Hound. He always had a good head on his shoulders and seemed to get along with everyone. Although his fighting skills weren't the best, he could no doubt become a skilled warrior.

Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:50 am

Silverbolt of the Aerialbots would have made a pretty good successor.

http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Silverbolt_%28G1%29

News Credits: 20 · Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:58 pm

I think Trailbreaker would make an excellent Prime. He's good natured, he's good in a fight, he has a goddamn forcefield! If you look in the comics then you'll see that he can take a beating and keep coming, if you watch the cartoon you can see that he's useful as a warrior and a defender, all we'd really need to see from him is the "strategist" part of his "Defensive Strategist" function. He's a really under-used character and that's always bothered me because he's got plenty of potential.

His secretly depressed "I'm a drain on resources" attitude would be replaced with a cheerful confidence and his force field would go from a static wall/dome/sphere, to one he could shape Green Lantern style! His new moniker would be Champion Prime!

Also: This would be his vehicle mode!

News Credits: 37 · Wed Sep 26, 2012 9:07 pm

MEGATRON!!!

Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:50 pm

Jazz all the way

News Credits: 22 · Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:51 pm

SlyTF1 wrote:MEGATRON!!!

Serious or not, that's a great choice.

:lol:

Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:42 pm

G1: Ultra Magnus for sure; He deserves it, the Autobot cause deserves it and we should get a chance to see it, but also:

*Defensor (a hidden Prime)
*Prowl (He would know what murderous traits to reign in and when if all the Autobots are watching him and interpreting their role in the Autobot cause through their following of him)
In an emergency/as a temporary Prime or Matrix bearer: Trailbreaker, Ratchet, Hoist, Red Alert, Perceptor, Ironhide, Kup, Aerial/Elita-one.

Unicron Trilogy: Override, hands down.

Movieverse: Bumblebee, provided the Matrix turned him into a bigger bot- I started a thread on it once and figured school bus might be a useable example. Otherwise Ironhide, Mudflap or Jazz (all dead, leaving behind nobody). From the expanded toyline I'd choose Longarm just by going off the AltMode since the rest are dead.

TF: PRIME: Arcee or Smokescreen, with intent to pass the Matrix on to Alpha Trion.

Beast Wars (I know Primal isn't Optimus, but): Tigertron, Rattrap, Rhinox, the Hawk-femmebot (I suddenly forget the name) in that order.

News Credits: 20 · Thu Sep 27, 2012 5:33 pm

G1 Smoketreader wrote:Mudflap

News Credits: 15 · Thu Sep 27, 2012 5:37 pm

Fires_Of_Inferno wrote:
G1 Smoketreader wrote:Mudflap

If Mudflap is leader of the Autobots, fanbase go kaboom. :BOOM:

Fri Sep 28, 2012 2:00 am

PrymeStriker wrote:
Fires_Of_Inferno wrote:
G1 Smoketreader wrote:Mudflap

If Mudflap is leader of the Autobots, fanbase go kaboom.

Respectfully- screw the fanbase. They attack other fans for what Bay changes and call him MISTER Bay. Fanbase already went kaboom.

My evaluation/reasoning as to why i included Mudflap as Prime:
It depends on what gets done with the chapter of his story: Just because the movieverse is an insult to a lot of things, including Transformers themselves, doesn't mean Mudflap is not Prime material: Movieverse Mudflap is a street fighter who can rival Devastator.He and his brother are also open to various alternatives to straight out warfare, eg. 'blending in like a ninja'.

If there was absolutely no other candidate for a Prime around he would take up the mantle because 'dat'z how it goez'-the Primes lead to the death and their troops carry on as the next primes. Mudflap wouldn't baulk at the responsibility for a second, because it would be very ancient tradition by his time.
( Don't assume the twins aren't experienced. They are war babies and the adaptation to that all is already in their veins. How Bay, Dorky and Klutzman convert them into comedy relief is not our problem, it's their loss).

VERY IMPORTANT EDIT: Where I say 'screw' I mean it in the Cybertronian context, as in 'approach with intent to apply torque where needed'. I felt 'scrap the fanbase' is something I would never wish on us, so I changed it.

In regards to doing something with Mudflaps' chapter- they idea of a non-Prime wannabe bearing the matrix to a true-Prime candidate should be a normal concept to us (Hot Rod/imus).