Twincast / Podcast Episode #351 "Ask Your Dad"

Maybe I had to grow up in the UK to appreciate it, but as a G1 comics fan, I did not like Man of Iron. At all. It had to do with the artwork as much as the story itself, but it didn't appeal to me. When Titan reprinted the G1 comics 20 or so years ago, I'm glad they left issues 33 and 34 out of the collection.

Rodimus Prime wrote:Maybe I had to grow up in the UK to appreciate it, but as a G1 comics fan, I did not like Man of Iron. At all. It had to do with the artwork as much as the story itself, but it didn't appeal to me. When Titan reprinted the G1 comics 20 or so years ago, I'm glad they left issues 33 and 34 out of the collection.

I get that. The way it was released here was super unappealing and it just didn't fit with anything by that point. I didn't appreciate it until getting the full backstory - realizing how early it was meant to be helped so so much. That and experiencing it with the hand painted coloring found in CC 3, which elevates the art in a way the Marvel US recoloring does not. Still a weird story, but as time goes on it's that weirdness that makes it really cool, to me.

ScottyP wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:Maybe I had to grow up in the UK to appreciate it, but as a G1 comics fan, I did not like Man of Iron. At all. It had to do with the artwork as much as the story itself, but it didn't appeal to me. When Titan reprinted the G1 comics 20 or so years ago, I'm glad they left issues 33 and 34 out of the collection.

I get that. The way it was released here was super unappealing and it just didn't fit with anything by that point. I didn't appreciate it until getting the full backstory - realizing how early it was meant to be helped so so much. That and experiencing it with the hand painted coloring found in CC 3, which elevates the art in a way the Marvel US recoloring does not. Still a weird story, but as time goes on it's that weirdness that makes it really cool, to me.

I actually found out why "Man of Iron" was printed in the US run after asking Bob Budiansky at BotCon 2022. He told me that it was printed because he needed more time to work on the next proper US issue ("Child's Play"), as he hadn't met his deadline in time. He said the same was true with the other two Marvel US issues that he likewise didn't write ("Plight of the Bumblebee!" and "The Big Broadcast of 2006"), that he didn't meet his deadlines for "The Smelting Pool!" and "The Cosmic Carnival" in time, so those two other stories were added to fill-in for those publications to give Bob more time to finish the next chapters.

ScottyP wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:Maybe I had to grow up in the UK to appreciate it, but as a G1 comics fan, I did not like Man of Iron. At all. It had to do with the artwork as much as the story itself, but it didn't appeal to me. When Titan reprinted the G1 comics 20 or so years ago, I'm glad they left issues 33 and 34 out of the collection.

I get that. The way it was released here was super unappealing and it just didn't fit with anything by that point. I didn't appreciate it until getting the full backstory - realizing how early it was meant to be helped so so much. That and experiencing it with the hand painted coloring found in CC 3, which elevates the art in a way the Marvel US recoloring does not. Still a weird story, but as time goes on it's that weirdness that makes it really cool, to me.

Same here. I really appreciate the feel it was going for, trying to capture how alien an encounter with TFs would be from a child's POV. Still, now that I've read all of Marvel U.S. and U.K. (except a few annual text stories), it doesn't quite feel like it fits. Whenever I reread Man Of Iron, I feel like what I'm reading is the adaptation of some live-action TF movie that was released in England in early 1985, then vanished without any other trace; even knowing better, sometimes when I'd pick the carcass of a dying video store, I'd look through the piles of tapes thinking, "If only...", for just a second or two. For all its faults, it's haunting.

In fact, despite there being so many superior Marvel stories, if Michael Bay had asked me to recommend just one comic arc (after he reportedly watched all the Sunbow 'toon), I'd have had to recommend Man Of Iron for that very reason (well, after I tried and failed to get him to read ALL of Marvel continuity), even describing it as "Spielbergian", and therefore appropriate for what that 2007 film had to try and achieve. That's why I got so excited for The Last Knight, and why that movie hurt even worse than it should have; I just happened to have received a mild concussion before driving to the theater, which actually helped a bit.

Bumblevivisector wrote:

ScottyP wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:Maybe I had to grow up in the UK to appreciate it, but as a G1 comics fan, I did not like Man of Iron. At all. It had to do with the artwork as much as the story itself, but it didn't appeal to me. When Titan reprinted the G1 comics 20 or so years ago, I'm glad they left issues 33 and 34 out of the collection.

I get that. The way it was released here was super unappealing and it just didn't fit with anything by that point. I didn't appreciate it until getting the full backstory - realizing how early it was meant to be helped so so much. That and experiencing it with the hand painted coloring found in CC 3, which elevates the art in a way the Marvel US recoloring does not. Still a weird story, but as time goes on it's that weirdness that makes it really cool, to me.

Same here. I really appreciate the feel it was going for, trying to capture how alien an encounter with TFs would be from a child's POV. Still, now that I've read all of Marvel U.S. and U.K. (except a few annual text stories), it doesn't quite feel like it fits.

I actually somewhat recently figured out a good place for "Man of Iron" to fit into the larger Marvel G1 continuity, in regards to both the US and UK continuities.

While the UK-published "Robot War" recaps placed it during the time of the four-issue limited series, that honestly feels like an impossible placement. The Autobots' energy situation on Earth in the four-issue limited series is dire. They are desperate for more energy, and their reserves are practically running on empty. While "Man of Iron" takes the cast halfway around the world on a full three-day adventure with a more explosive and destructive battle between the 'Bots and 'Cons that yields heavy damage to both sides, consequently feeling like so many more resources are expunged during the story. Not to mention the fact that "Robot War" placed it during a montage seen in US issue #3 "Prisoner of War!", a montage that only spans a single night, while "Man of Iron" takes place across three consecutive days, making just too big an event to have occurred during that time.

So, disregarding where "Robot War" placed it, I find that "Man of Iron" best fits coming right after US issue #12 "Prime Time!". In the US continuity, this would put it before "Shooting Star!", and in the UK continuity, before "Christmas Breaker!", "Crisis of Command!", "The Icarus Theory", "Dinobot Hunt!" and then "Shooting Star!".

At the very end of "Prime Time!", Optimus says to Buster Witwitcky, "You have taught me something of value today, Buster Witwicky...and that is that one human life knowingly endangered by our struggle is one life too many. By the Primal Program itself, I pray we Autobots have the wisdom to learn that lesson well!" Placing the events of "Man of Iron" right after he says this now gives more context to Optimus's decision to have the buried ship destroyed in "Man of Iron", as he seems to be taking that lesson to heart at its fullest extreme by destroying the vessel to keep the humans of Stansham safe from the Autobot/Decepticon war (and we know that this Optimus sometimes takes his moral code a little too far, like how he chose to kill himself over a video game after some NPCs got killed off when playing said game in US issue #24 "Afterdeath!").

There's also this other really odd bit near the end of "Man of Iron" where, right before Optimus tells Jazz that they must destroy the ship, he says, "We have won this skirmish, but who knows how fast the Decepticon threat is growing? We cannot leave the Earth now, Jazz. The Decepticons would soon overrun the planet. Only we few stand in their way. We cannot leave." It seems odd that either Optimus or Jazz would entertain the notion of leaving the Earth during the time of the four-issue limited series (where "Man of Iron" was originally placed by "Robot War"), as not only are their resources so limited that even leaving the planet is pretty much an impossibility for the Autobots at that point, but they know good and well that the Decepticon threat is something that must be stopped and only by them. So it reads as if Optimus is just stating the obvious to Jazz for no good reason since at no point prior did Jazz or anyone else ever bring up the idea of the Autobots leaving the Earth.

BUT, were this story to instead come right after "Prime Time!", it would then come at a point after Megatron has been defeated, Shockwave has been defeated, and the now-leaderless Decepticons are pretty much on the losing side of the war. By now, it would make more sense for some of the Autobots to be discussing the possibility of leaving the Earth, considering the Decepticons as good as done for. In this context, Optimus's line now reads more as him reminding Jazz that, while the Autobots pretty much have this war won by now, their mission isn't fully over until the Decepticons threat is completely neutralized for good, that it's still too early to start celebrating and calling it quits just yet.

What's more, on the UK-only side of things, the sudden outrage that the Autobots feel with Optimus at the start of "Crisis of Command!" would now have even more context in light of Optimus's callous decision to order Jazz to destroy the buried Autobot vessel at the end of "Man of Iron", when the Autobots could have salvaged any resources from that ship for them to use in their war against the Decepticons, instead of Optimus simply having the ship destroyed. Prowl and Bluestreak grumbling to themselves in "Christmas Breaker!" about how Optimus has been acting "strange" lately would also have more context from that decision in "Man of Iron", since that decision always felt strangely out of character for Optimus.

So in the end, I'm perfectly comfortable with placing "Man of Iron" right after "Prime Time!" in both the US and UK continuities. While this would instead set "Man of Iron" during the Autumn of 1985 instead of 1984, the story was originally published in January 1985, so it's at least still within the same year it was originally published.

Wow we really called it Ask Your Dad

:-0

Starscream wrote:Wow we really called it Ask Your Dad

:-0

Yeah, most of us who grew up with the G1 comics are now in our 40s...

Oh, I know.