Transformers and More @ The Seibertron Store
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Rated X wrote:I mean no disrespect to anyone, but I ask why such negativity on knock offs ???
I dont even own any knock offs, but I support them to the fullest. I own an original G1 Bruticus, Devastator, Piranahcon, and Abominus plus 3 of the Stunticons from the 80's. Instead of worrying about the value of them, Im supporting the ever growing transformers fanbase by endorsing knock offs. If we dont pass on retro style toys to the younger generation at affordable prices, the hobby will die with us and those originals you cherish so much will decline in value like many other 80's collectibles with no fanbase.
Plus, I never got to complete my Menasor in the 80's because I wasnt doing well in school and mom and dad wasnt buying no rewards for F's on the report card...LOL I can finally get my hands on him brand new !!!
HighPrime wrote:Blah blah blah
Autobot032 wrote:HighPrime wrote:Blah blah blah
Here's the problem. Hasbro facilitated this by selling the factory and the molds years ago.
The buyers now own those molds and I'm sure they're entitled to use them. I agree they shouldn't be in TF packaging, but if I buy something, I'm going to use it.
Who wouldn't?
Hasbro and TakaraTomy should've done a much better job of keeping tabs on all of this instead of opening the wound themselves.
Autobot032 wrote:HighPrime wrote:Blah blah blah
Here's the problem. Hasbro facilitated this by selling the factory and the molds years ago.
The buyers now own those molds and I'm sure they're entitled to use them. I agree they shouldn't be in TF packaging, but if I buy something, I'm going to use it.
Who wouldn't?
Hasbro and TakaraTomy should've done a much better job of keeping tabs on all of this instead of opening the wound themselves.
HighPrime wrote:Rated X wrote:I mean no disrespect to anyone, but I ask why such negativity on knock offs ???
I dont even own any knock offs, but I support them to the fullest. I own an original G1 Bruticus, Devastator, Piranahcon, and Abominus plus 3 of the Stunticons from the 80's. Instead of worrying about the value of them, Im supporting the ever growing transformers fanbase by endorsing knock offs. If we dont pass on retro style toys to the younger generation at affordable prices, the hobby will die with us and those originals you cherish so much will decline in value like many other 80's collectibles with no fanbase.
Plus, I never got to complete my Menasor in the 80's because I wasnt doing well in school and mom and dad wasnt buying no rewards for F's on the report card...LOL I can finally get my hands on him brand new !!!
So if you had a million dollar idea, it would be ok with you if I decided to market the same idea, call it the same idea, and be portrayed as the inventor of the idea which originally was yours? That's ok with you?
KOs are not going to keep to this hobby alive, nor do they perpuate the continuation of transformers. Simply more rationalization on the justification for the existance of KOs. If anything, KOs perform the exact opposite. They steal money from the creators, and devalue the originals. It staggers me the number of people who can't or don't want to believe that KOs are a cancer. These aren't products that are taking an existing idea and refining it or introducing new ones, they are out and out thieves leeching off of Hasbro/TT.
I collect transformers because I grew up with them, not to make money on them. If I want to make money, I invest in capital markets, my 401k, or simply work longer hours. Personally, I'd rather pass on decent values and a strong moral center to my children then the ideology that the theft of someone elses ideas and creations is justified if the price is right. That is what KOs are doing. I'm sure a bunch of guys in China aren't thinking, "Hey, the collectors of the world deserve a chance to own these transformers." They are in this for the money. Hasbro may be missing a opportunity, here, but that is their right. Transformers are their creation and they can release, re-release, or not release any product of thier design that they choose. They don't owe us anything except to be thankful we buy their product.
This has nothing to do with being pure, it is about the Transformers brand that belongs to Hasbro. No other company has the right morally or legally to sell a product under this banner.
Rated X wrote:Cant we all just get along, meet up and have a few beers at Botcon, and get wasted and have a good time talking transformers ???
Autobot032 wrote:Rated X wrote:Cant we all just get along, meet up and have a few beers at Botcon, and get wasted and have a good time talking transformers ???
No.
Because it's easier to complain and it gives them something to do.
The level of negativity, in recent months, is astounding.
And that leads me to this next part:
I don't know if it's because our fellow collectors are growing older, too serious, or whatever, but this is getting ridiculous.
If you're losing joy in what you're doing, then what is the point?
A child looks at a TransFormer and says "AWESOME! LOOK WHAT IT CAN DO MOMMY!" and everything is right with his or her world.
We look at it and all we can do is complain, complain, complain.
I understand that we grow up, we all do, we have to, to some extent.
But this is ridiculous. They are TOYS. They are meant to be joyous, fun, playthings. They're meant to be silly, they're meant to entertain.
They are not meant to be a source of future income, an investment, "srs business", or anything of that nature.
You people ARE ruining it for the rest of us. Grown adults fighting over some bootlegs that are older than the children they were made for. Heck, these bootlegged figures are older than some of the people collecting them.
They are not making revenue for Hasbro or TakaraTomy because they are no longer important to them, and haven't been for over TWO DECADES. A decade is 10 years people, think about that for a second. Some people can have their entire lives change in the course of a single decade, not to mention two plus.
With no current plans to reissue them, no complaints from HasTakTom (at this very moment), and no one's being personally affected...there is absolutely no reason for everyone to get so enraged by the fact that these things exist.
I love TransFormers. I love the mythos. I find them to be fun, I find them to be enjoyable, and they let me be a kid at heart again, even if for a moment or two.
That's what these are all about. When you walk down the aisle of any toy department or TRU and you have a giant smile on your face just the same as the kid next to you, that should tell you "Wow. This is awesome. I'm 10 again. YES!"
The instant you look at the pegs and shelves and think "Hmm. That'll be worth a cool hundred in about five years, I better get two.", you've failed. Failed at having fun.
If it floats your boat to take this seriously and act like it's the end of the universe, then there's nothing I can do to stop you. You're entitled to that opinion, no matter how ridiculous it is.
But it also means we don't have to listen to you, after a while, and we might even shun you. And maybe we should. When you ruin it for the rest of us, it's just not right.
Hasbro's told us time and again that we play no important role in their business. They basically swat us with a thank you or two, here and there for our dedication, but first and foremost....their focus is KIDS.
Kids want goofy colors, lights, sounds, and things that look cool. That's what we fell in love with when we were kids. If we don't love that anymore, then we need to get out of this hobby and grow old and rot. Just like every other person who grew old, not grew up.
They are toys.
Why can't anyone just have fun anymore?
Rated X wrote:Now I do my share of complaining too, but about 80 percent of it is complaining about the complainers. When I was ten their were certain figures I thought were stupid looking and I made fun of them. Needless to say I do the same thing with new figures I think look stupid. But I never stop having fun in the process. I enjoy colleting. I agree that some collectors are just getting too old. Kind of like that grumpy old man who wont sell you that classic car rotting in his backyard, but refuses to restore it either.
Negativity + something to do = ruined for the rest of us.Rated X wrote:why should anyone appoint themselves as the Transformers police ???
Rated X wrote:Is the Botcon/Henkei Thrust contraversy that bad to actually remove a thread ??? I was shocked...
Burn wrote:Let it be known, I murdered Amelie.
Accidentally.
Amelie wrote:I don't like knock-offs, and the reason is perfectly simple. Vintage. I'm not being "elitist" nor do I think that Hasbro\Takara are being particually damaged by the knock-off market.
Amelie wrote:Having been stung a couple of times in the past with a loose knock-off, I have become ever more weary of buying vintage online. It's upsetting to buy a figure you thought was something it isn't, to have it produce stress-marks on the first transformation you give it and, very quickly, fall to pieces.With knock-offs, you can't just from a photo - they're bootlegs designed to deceive you into parting with your hard-earnt cash.
Amelie wrote:Saying "I want an original Leo Kaiser but can't afford it, so I want a knock-off" (BTW - I also can't afford many G1 TFs, but I just put up with it) is all well and good, but consider the frustration of those that have bought these frightful, poorly-produced, pieces of junk thinking they'd got the geniune deal.
Jeep! wrote:Why do I imagine Dead Metal sounding exactly like Arnie?
Intah-wib-buls?
Blurrz wrote:10/10
Leave it to Dead Metal to have the word 'Pronz' in his signature.
Jeep! wrote:Why do I imagine Dead Metal sounding exactly like Arnie?
Intah-wib-buls?
Blurrz wrote:10/10
Leave it to Dead Metal to have the word 'Pronz' in his signature.
Dead Metal wrote:I'm pretty certain BBTS recalled a shipment of Encore Metroplexes due to them being KOs, just like TFSource, I think I even newsed that message back then.
HighPrime wrote:Dead Metal wrote:I'm pretty certain BBTS recalled a shipment of Encore Metroplexes due to them being KOs, just like TFSource, I think I even newsed that message back then.
For your reference
BBTS official statement on KO Metroplex
http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/ ... lex/14804/
You did news this, though
Jeep! wrote:Why do I imagine Dead Metal sounding exactly like Arnie?
Intah-wib-buls?
Blurrz wrote:10/10
Leave it to Dead Metal to have the word 'Pronz' in his signature.
Dead Metal wrote:HighPrime wrote:Dead Metal wrote:I'm pretty certain BBTS recalled a shipment of Encore Metroplexes due to them being KOs, just like TFSource, I think I even newsed that message back then.
For your reference
BBTS official statement on KO Metroplex
http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/ ... lex/14804/
You did news this, though
Lol got confused there, then the other store must have been Ages 3 and up. Oh well I can always be right.
Flux Convoy wrote:Hot button issue, these KOs. Here's what it all boils down to every time. "I'm right!" "No, I am". When the truth is, who cares? It's like having a buddy who's reeeeally into something you might find ridiculous or slightly disturbing and how they've finally landed this great new piece. What should you do? I dunno about you but I'd say congrats on your awesome new find! It isn't my thing but it makes YOU happy. That's cool to me. See at this point, nobody is losing anything here. Hasbro and Takara aren't bringing these guys out. Know why? They don't have the molds. Even if they did, they'd most likely require serious, expensive retooling for an uncertain sales return. Could they backwards engineer new molds for G1 and so on? Sure, but it's prohibitively expensive. So much, that unless it has a guaranteed audience, like Soundwave, it's probably not happening. What I don't get is why people get so up in arms over others buying these. You shouldn't care. You should be going about your own collecting nature instead of ranting on about something that has been a constant in the brand since its very inception. It won't ever change, despite your morality, or how much you disagree with the product.
El Duque wrote:I don't understand why reverse engineering a mold is supposedly so expensive. I'm fairly certain that Hasbro has stated in Q&A's that doing this is a piece of cake from a technical stand point. Heck, when I was in college I took a jewelery making class (don't laugh I needed the elective hours) and one of the things we did was recast existing items. I recast some G1 Opimus Prime fists, and they turned out surprisingly decent. Now keep in mind we were using a primitive bare bones set-up and I got decent results, and to be honest I was one of the worst students in the class. Some of the other art major types in there were turning out really nice looking stuff. I'm sure had the professor brought in a G1 era toy and had the entire class work on it, they could have created a a new set of molds that would have made a passable reproduction. You can't tell me that a toy company with all that talent and all those resources can't do this in a economical fashion.
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