IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Wed Feb 07, 2018 2:18 pm

ZeroWolf wrote:Ahh you're talking about the what if issue where hot rod didn't jump in the way. Has anyone told you yet that megs is an autobot now and that Prowl was part of devestator?

To steal from the G2 comic a little,"IDW is not your father's G1" so don't treat as such and you'll be fine. It's better anyway then the old G1 in my opinion...though that gets tested when the editorial team do crossovers for the sake of launching a different franchise completely


See that doesn't bother me. When I really took interest in Transformers, Prowl was the bot with smoke coming out of his eyes on the Autobot Shuttle and Megatron was replaced by a far superior character.
The way I see it, The Movie moved the plot forward. IDWverse has, for the most part, sidelined the "Future" characters, while holding the rest of the series back with Prime, Thundercracker, Starscream etc as the lead characters.
In my view the most interesting thing Thundercracker ever did was become Scourge.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ZeroWolf » Wed Feb 07, 2018 3:52 pm

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I see your view now, I disagree with it but I understand better. As I said treat this as different from what you know, like beast wars etc. As for the focus? Well G1 nostalgia (remember season 3 and the rebirth are not remembered fondly for different reasons) is key, but overtime IDW has shown a willingness to change hence we have brand new characters taking centre stage like windblade, brand new takes on character's like starscream which evolve well beyond what G1 would of let them. You mention Thundercracker, well he's come a long way, playing a key role in several arcs.

For what it's worth though I would recommend More than meets the eye/lost light as hot rod takes center stage along with a host of other not well known characters and several new ones. It's also the series that most focused on autobot megatron, really delving into his mind set .
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby Burn » Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:03 pm

So after raging like a fanboy over the first issue, I wasn't looking forward to reading the second issue.

How much more could they **** up and make Transformers the back-up characters?

Well, they tried, they gave it a good go. A good portion of the book revolves around the Visionaries. In what came as absolutely no surprise whatsoever, they've already splintered. Good side who wants peace with the Cybertronians, and bad side who just want to wipe said giant robots from the planet.

I'm sure you can guess how the issue ends. Yeah ... the good Visionaries are now best buds with the Cybertronians and they're going to lead a joint effort to stop the naughty Visionaries! Honestly, when you strip it down, it's such a generic story line, and the characters aren't much better.

But hey, at least we got to see some Visionary on Visionary action, and no you pervs, not like that, I mean they fought and used their magical hologram thingies.

So yeah, not as fanboy rage inducing as the first issue. In fact, if you have trouble sleeping at night, this is the sort of thing that will help put you to sleep. It was generic, it's been done before, multiple times, it was just ... meh.

-edit-
I typed this after BEFORE reading ScottyP's review (I don't like to have things spoilt for me) and ... wow. We agree on a fair few points it seems. What does that say when people are agreeing with me? Image
Image
I'll be ignoring Burn's comments from now on
he's just being an @$$hol€!
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ZeroWolf » Thu Feb 08, 2018 4:56 am

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I think there's a proverb that goes like this:
"Agree with burn? Invest in a fallout shelter"
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Thu Feb 08, 2018 8:20 am

ZeroWolf wrote:I see your view now, I disagree with it but I understand better. As I said treat this as different from what you know, like beast wars etc. As for the focus? Well G1 nostalgia (remember season 3 and the rebirth are not remembered fondly for different reasons) is key, but overtime IDW has shown a willingness to change hence we have brand new characters taking centre stage like windblade, brand new takes on character's like starscream which evolve well beyond what G1 would of let them. You mention Thundercracker, well he's come a long way, playing a key role in several arcs.

For what it's worth though I would recommend More than meets the eye/lost light as hot rod takes center stage along with a host of other not well known characters and several new ones. It's also the series that most focused on autobot megatron, really delving into his mind set .


See the thing about G1, when you go back and re-watch it. Season one and two aren't great. Just the pilot alone, with Megatron cackling "excellent" over and over again like a mechanical Mr. Burns, is quite cringe inducing now. See at least in The Movie, Megatron is genuinely intimidating.

As I've said elsewhere, I never really paid all that much attention to the Pre-Movie seasons and so actually watched them properly when they were re-released on DVD about 15 years ago. For all the rose tinted nostalgia, Season 1 & 2 are aimless. Aside from the occasional cliffhanger there is no overall progressing narrative. The serialised nature of Season 3 however, is a noticeable improvement instantly. The Five Faces of Darkness was more engaging a story than any plot from before The Movie. True, Season 3 did also have the single worst episode of G1 ever ( B.O.T.) but no TF series has ever had all winning episodes IE BW 'The Low Road'. At the end of the day the people who didn't like Season 3 & 4 because "_____" wasn't in it, having died in the Movie, that comes down to fans unwilling to accept change,as opposed to any fault of the Seasons themselves.

The characters of Season 3 & 4 looked more like they are supposed to also. Futuristic alien robots, which is the entire point of Transformers. Countless writers and creators seem oblivious to the fact that the Cybertronians aren't just 'people in robot suits' they are a sentient alien race.
So they get dumbed down and humanised instead. A mark I actually hold against MTMTE and Lost Light, from what little I read in Phase Two. Vol.1 of the HC Collection. If you can't write about alien robots as alien robots, write a book about people instead.

Simon Furman gets these characters. The -Ations in particular parallels the alien nature of the Transformers with relateability, without retreading the characterisation of his previous G1 series.
Giving them understandable personalities without forcing human feelings and behaviors upon them. That's what the human supporting cast is for after all, not the Bots themselves.
His Hot Rod Spotlight perfectly encapsulated everything about his character, both as Hot Rod and the doubts that drove him as Rodimus Prime.
A good writer adapts their style to a pre-established series, they don't change a series to suit them. That is how you end up with the Costa run...

End of off topic Rant.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ScottyP » Thu Feb 08, 2018 12:45 pm

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Burn wrote:I typed this after BEFORE reading ScottyP's review (I don't like to have things spoilt for me) and ... wow. We agree on a fair few points it seems. What does that say when people are agreeing with me? Image
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ZeroWolf » Thu Feb 08, 2018 1:33 pm

Motto: "My past no longer binds my future..."
Weapon: Battle Blades
AllNewSuperRobot wrote:
ZeroWolf wrote:I see your view now, I disagree with it but I understand better. As I said treat this as different from what you know, like beast wars etc. As for the focus? Well G1 nostalgia (remember season 3 and the rebirth are not remembered fondly for different reasons) is key, but overtime IDW has shown a willingness to change hence we have brand new characters taking centre stage like windblade, brand new takes on character's like starscream which evolve well beyond what G1 would of let them. You mention Thundercracker, well he's come a long way, playing a key role in several arcs.

For what it's worth though I would recommend More than meets the eye/lost light as hot rod takes center stage along with a host of other not well known characters and several new ones. It's also the series that most focused on autobot megatron, really delving into his mind set .


See the thing about G1, when you go back and re-watch it. Season one and two aren't great. Just the pilot alone, with Megatron cackling "excellent" over and over again like a mechanical Mr. Burns, is quite cringe inducing now. See at least in The Movie, Megatron is genuinely intimidating.

As I've said elsewhere, I never really paid all that much attention to the Pre-Movie seasons and so actually watched them properly when they were re-released on DVD about 15 years ago. For all the rose tinted nostalgia, Season 1 & 2 are aimless. Aside from the occasional cliffhanger there is no overall progressing narrative. The serialised nature of Season 3 however, is a noticeable improvement instantly. The Five Faces of Darkness was more engaging a story than any plot from before The Movie. True, Season 3 did also have the single worst episode of G1 ever ( B.O.T.) but no TF series has ever had all winning episodes IE BW 'The Low Road'. At the end of the day the people who didn't like Season 3 & 4 because "_____" wasn't in it, having died in the Movie, that comes down to fans unwilling to accept change,as opposed to any fault of the Seasons themselves.

The characters of Season 3 & 4 looked more like they are supposed to also. Futuristic alien robots, which is the entire point of Transformers. Countless writers and creators seem oblivious to the fact that the Cybertronians aren't just 'people in robot suits' they are a sentient alien race.
So they get dumbed down and humanised instead. A mark I actually hold against MTMTE and Lost Light, from what little I read in Phase Two. Vol.1 of the HC Collection. If you can't write about alien robots as alien robots, write a book about people instead.

Simon Furman gets these characters. The -Ations in particular parallels the alien nature of the Transformers with relateability, without retreading the characterisation of his previous G1 series.
Giving them understandable personalities without forcing human feelings and behaviors upon them. That's what the human supporting cast is for after all, not the Bots themselves.
His Hot Rod Spotlight perfectly encapsulated everything about his character, both as Hot Rod and the doubts that drove him as Rodimus Prime.
A good writer adapts their style to a pre-established series, they don't change a series to suit them. That is how you end up with the Costa run...

End of off topic Rant.

Actually season 3 had another contender for worse episode ever, carnage in c-minor.

Your point seems to boil down to that once something is set, that's the way it must stay. Also arguing about how fictional giant robots would behave (how do you know they wouldn't have interpersonal relationships and be capable of emotions?) Is probably a good sign that the debate has gone on long enough :-P

Personally I love this humanised take as you put it, it makes the characters feel developed, Furman was no stranger and he employed it frequently after all, and I'm sure he would be happy with the stuff that's been added to the IDW mythology (okay, not all of it, he'll have turned his nose up at tf v visionaries)

On topic, I feel like there's an injustice here that scarlet strike force is cancelled, till all are one was cancelled yet we get this in return?
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ScottyP » Thu Feb 08, 2018 2:11 pm

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ZeroWolf wrote:On topic, I feel like there's an injustice here that scarlet strike force is cancelled, till all are one was cancelled yet we get this in return?
Publicly available comic sales data is terrible. That said, for what is around, SSF 1 did less than 4,000 copies in numbers sold by Diamond in the US to comic shops. That's real low for a #1. Really, really low, even for IDW. I think that stinks but there's at least some truth to the numbers doing it in, with the rest filled in to some degree by controversy/marketing/whatnot. Just for comparison: OP and Lost Light, despite being (effectively) at issues 72/71 with all the attrition that comes along with it, are at around 6,000 copies (give or take a bit) each month.

TAAO is a weird case but I'd guess now that Scott stepped away once she saw the editorial concept for TF vs Visionaries, which led to that separate launch rather than it being an attempted jumpstart for TAAO's sales. This is speculation of the highest order, just to be clear!
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Thu Feb 08, 2018 3:14 pm

ZeroWolf wrote:Your point seems to boil down to that once something is set, that's the way it must stay. Also arguing about how fictional giant robots would behave (how do you know they wouldn't have interpersonal relationships and be capable of emotions?) Is probably a good sign that the debate has gone on long enough :-P


My point is, in an established series, you build on the foundations already laid out before you. For example, from his Spotlight debut, develop IDW "Judge Dredd in Space" Ultra Magnus, not try to pass him off as the same character as MTMTE's Version. It doesn't mesh.
Again, a good writer can still put their own spin on pre-existing canon without walking over it EG Joss Whedon's Astonishing X-Men. A series with far more years of established canon than Transformers. Change from within.

I'm also not arguing about how fictional giant Alien robots behave, their relationships or their potential feelings etc I'm just saying they wouldn't be human ones EG Galvatron randomly referencing the Mary Celeste, because that makes no sense. It's like accepting the Japanese dub of Beast Wars Season one over the Western original, as canon after the fact.

ZeroWolf wrote:Personally I love this humanised take as you put it, it makes the characters feel developed, Furman was no stranger and he employed it frequently after all, and I'm sure he would be happy with the stuff that's been added to the IDW mythology (okay, not all of it, he'll have turned his nose up at tf v visionaries)

Well, IDWverse started with Megatron: Origin. The story of a simple miner leading an oppressed underclass in revolt. Since then, how many retcons are we upto? Because apparently Megatron having humble and insignificant origins like that wasn't enough for some, so we get some rubbish about him being a poet, protester and intellectual. Why? It only serves to convolute the canon of IDWverse. Much like the Primacy Trilogy
Adding completely unnecessary narrative exposition, which I doubt Editorial or Hasbro mandated it's existence. If you're going to retcon significant storybeats, justify it to a greater degree than merely to serve a single current plot point.
ZeroWolf wrote:On topic, I feel like there's an injustice here that scarlet strike force is cancelled, till all are one was cancelled yet we get this in return?


I have a question on this too. Instead of Hasbro forcing all of these 80's human series in with the Transformers (excluding GI Joe, as that history existed for decades) why have they not pushed the Go-Bots into the mix? They still own them, don't they?
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby Sunstar » Thu Feb 08, 2018 3:58 pm

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ZeroWolf wrote:I think there's a proverb that goes like this:
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I thought it was if you play with fire you get Burn.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ZeroWolf » Thu Feb 08, 2018 5:18 pm

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ScottyP wrote:
ZeroWolf wrote:On topic, I feel like there's an injustice here that scarlet strike force is cancelled, till all are one was cancelled yet we get this in return?
Publicly available comic sales data is terrible. That said, for what is around, SSF 1 did less than 4,000 copies in numbers sold by Diamond in the US to comic shops. That's real low for a #1. Really, really low, even for IDW. I think that stinks but there's at least some truth to the numbers doing it in, with the rest filled in to some degree by controversy/marketing/whatnot. Just for comparison: OP and Lost Light, despite being (effectively) at issues 72/71 with all the attrition that comes along with it, are at around 6,000 copies (give or take a bit) each month.

TAAO is a weird case but I'd guess now that Scott stepped away once she saw the editorial concept for TF vs Visionaries, which led to that separate launch rather than it being an attempted jumpstart for TAAO's sales. This is speculation of the highest order, just to be clear!

That makes sense I guess but still sucks :-(

Megatron origins has been diluted but we've had a decade of tf stories so it makes sense that things would be added in, it's just the same as Marvel or DC. As for Magnus, with what Roberts has done with his backstory, there's no problem with different takes as we don't know at what point Minimus Ambus took over the suit.

It sounds like you would rather it be like the old dreamwave series which hewed very close to G1 toon, which I didn't care for.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby Coptur » Fri Feb 09, 2018 5:53 am

The sales for SSFF speak for themselves and the GIJoe series before it (Sitterson-era).

The combined universe has not been very good for GIJoe.

4000 - 6000 comics order for Billion dollar franchises is terrible. In terms of actual comic shop sales i'd say it's probably less than half of the diamond orders. my limited evidence is seeing the unsold copies in three local comic shops (note: i recognise this evidence isn't quantifiable)
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ThunderThruster » Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:24 am

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:True, Season 3 did also have the single worst episode of G1 ever ( B.O.T.) but no TF series has ever had all winning episodes IE BW 'The Low Road'.


B.O.T. is a late season 2 Episode.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ScottyP » Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:47 am

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Coptur wrote:The sales for SSFF speak for themselves and the GIJoe series before it (Sitterson-era).

The combined universe has not been very good for GIJoe.

4000 - 6000 comics order for Billion dollar franchises is terrible. In terms of actual comic shop sales i'd say it's probably less than half of the diamond orders. my limited evidence is seeing the unsold copies in three local comic shops (note: i recognise this evidence isn't quantifiable)
Ten years ago, I didn't think piracy was a big problem. It is now, at least for comics. A quick google search will give you basically any comic you want to read shortly after it comes out (sometimes just hours after!) and you don't have to pay for it. That's patently insane and no other entertainment industry would stand for it.

There are a lot of crap thinkpieces on what's wrong with comics sales in general, but the answer is right in front of everyone, one search away.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby Sunstar » Fri Feb 09, 2018 9:24 am

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I do admit, I tend to read those until I can get my hands on a paper copy.

With that said, I recently bought a humble bundle of digital copies a while back, which allowed me to get caught up on most books to where I was able to go out and buy again. (I would like paper copies of those books because I enjoy relaxing in my Seeker Sanctuary and reading them surrounded by all my glorious Starscreams. And yes the Seeker Sanctuary is a physical place now <3

As for the visionaries - the copies I have are in the pull file - I am still trying to decide if I want to buy them or not (hard to decide with my intense dislike of the series thus far) I kinda feel compelled since I do read them online.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby Coptur » Fri Feb 09, 2018 10:01 am

Sunstar wrote:I do admit, I tend to read those until I can get my hands on a paper copy.

With that said, I recently bought a humble bundle of digital copies a while back, which allowed me to get caught up on most books to where I was able to go out and buy again. (I would like paper copies of those books because I enjoy relaxing in my Seeker Sanctuary and reading them surrounded by all my glorious Starscreams. And yes the Seeker Sanctuary is a physical place now <3

As for the visionaries - the copies I have are in the pull file - I am still trying to decide if I want to buy them or not (hard to decide with my intense dislike of the series thus far) I kinda feel compelled since I do read them online.


if you're not enjoying the story don't buy them.

save your cash for more seekers :D
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Fri Feb 09, 2018 12:02 pm

ZeroWolf wrote:Megatron origins has been diluted but we've had a decade of tf stories so it makes sense that things would be added in, it's just the same as Marvel or DC. As for Magnus, with what Roberts has done with his backstory, there's no problem with different takes as we don't know at what point Minimus Ambus took over the suit.

It sounds like you would rather it be like the old dreamwave series which hewed very close to G1 toon, which I didn't care for.


(I think this reply was to me :???: )

Marvel and DC retcon and change things because they are forever trying to streamline and modernise 50+ years of convoluted backstory.

Megatron: Origin, The Backstory of IDWverse, came out in 2007. Infiltration, the first IDWverse story came out in 2006. The series isn't old enough to need any retcons or alterations to it's default beginnings. If anything, all the retcons actually did was convolute the entire series, which wasn't the case before.
When it comes to Magnus, what they should have is expand on the Enforcers of the Tyrest Accord using the palette swaps. Have the MTMTE version be Delta Magnus and have Ultra Magnus as a separate character. That way there is no conflicting characterisation. Also as Delta, it would have been easier to sell the character as using some weird variant of Pretender Shell.

What I would rather is IDWverse to expand on the original ideas it began with. I never read Dreamwave (although I am current collecting a TF part-work that is chronicling all TF comics)
however, I did read Transformers IDW Collection book one and was instantly hooked on such a fresh beginning for Transformers overall. Because ultimately what I take from descriptions of the cast now, is what they have done by adding New, BW and Takara characters around the base G1 cast will lead to such stagnation that there will be no alternative but to reboot the series. The Takara series and Beast Wars represent future generations of G1, something IDWverse no longer has.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ZeroWolf » Fri Feb 09, 2018 3:25 pm

Motto: "My past no longer binds my future..."
Weapon: Battle Blades
Well there's always how Unicron will impact things but I think you're wrong about IDW not having a future.

To start with let's agree that IDW did start on the right foot with the new implementation of the franchise. We got new takes on familiar characters and depth was added to ones who never really got much of a starring role. I mean one of the first major antagonists was a new character more or less. Megatron origins provided a glimpse of megs the early years but left things open still to be explored further (say what you will about the cracy series but they helped show that the system was broken back then) then came all hail megatron which I felt was a step back, even going back to the 80s designs when it made no sense. Still I think it was important that it happened as it provided hooks to greater things later on (it never pays to be too tidy when you're telling stories, leave some hooks there for later use) then we got the first ongoing which was hit or miss in places. Then of course came the chaos event which was were the biggest change came to the status quo that I loved...the war ended, the decepticons lost but the autobots...also lost? Yes, things werenth rosy for them as the Cybertronians who had fled the war returned and decided they wanted rid of both factions. Enter starscream who got the biggest shot in the arm he's ever had, as he got elected leader and got rid of the badges. While this sets up the Dark Cybertron event it also represents a point where new ground was being broken. The G1 toon had ended the war in the Movie but the Seasons that followed didn't do anything with it as the cons were still the antagonists and the cons were actually the outnumbered force as the Bots clearly outnumbered them (after all, bad guy toys never sold as well as good guys). I digress but the IDW peace meant it could offer new takes on where the agression would come from, if it was because prime took it upon himself to annex earth or starscream and windblade trying to get other colony world's on board with the council of worlds. Even storylines like soundwave trying to build a safe haven for cons so they could live to their own ideals. We were even able to get a comedy road trip series (MTMTE/lost light) which gave us new reasons to fear overlord, a new take on star saber which shown what zealotry was like (which was hard for me at first as I love victory but I know they are separate), we were given renditions of chromedome and rewind which part of the fandom took to heart and it allowed one dimensional characters like cyclonus to live again and develop.

Now you may ask what the point of this is, so let me ask you, if you had started reading the IDW series when all hail megatron ended and someone asked you what you thought was going to happen in the series, how much of what happened would you really have guessed? I wouldn't of saw nearly any of these developments (save Unicron but it was just when IDW were going to play that card). So you say IDW doesn't have a future, well I say we just can't see what it is yet :-)*

*unless things really get messed up by the end of the visionaries series then please someone reboot it so the joes are the first ones to meet them on earth through a magic portal...
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby primalxconvoy » Sat Feb 10, 2018 1:28 am

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"...the panel above of Leoric guaranteed to wash away any desire you had left to see the 80s cartoon Burt Reynolds looking version of the character..."


Nope.

I think it's completely possibly to bring back a design that homages they original look, without it looking cheesy.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ZeroWolf » Sat Feb 10, 2018 1:42 am

Motto: "My past no longer binds my future..."
Weapon: Battle Blades
primalxconvoy wrote:
"...the panel above of Leoric guaranteed to wash away any desire you had left to see the 80s cartoon Burt Reynolds looking version of the character..."


Nope.

I think it's completely possibly to bring back a design that homages they original look, without it looking cheesy.

That’s certainly a tall order, personally his redesign is one of the best things about this comic...it might be the only good thing about it actually.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sat Feb 10, 2018 8:14 am

Leoric's redesign would be good, if it were Lion-O :roll: Their Original aesthetic was clearly depicting armoured medieval knights with magic infused chest plates and staffs. The redesigns completely fail in that aspect alone.

ZeroWolf wrote:Well there's always how Unicron will impact things but I think you're wrong about IDW not having a future.

To start with let's agree that IDW did start on the right foot with the new implementation of the franchise. We got new takes on familiar characters and depth was added to ones who never really got much of a starring role. I mean one of the first major antagonists was a new character more or less. Megatron origins provided a glimpse of megs the early years but left things open still to be explored further (say what you will about the cracy series but they helped show that the system was broken back then) then came all hail megatron which I felt was a step back, even going back to the 80s designs when it made no sense. Still I think it was important that it happened as it provided hooks to greater things later on (it never pays to be too tidy when you're telling stories, leave some hooks there for later use) then we got the first ongoing which was hit or miss in places. Then of course came the chaos event which was were the biggest change came to the status quo that I loved...the war ended, the decepticons lost but the autobots...also lost? Yes, things werenth rosy for them as the Cybertronians who had fled the war returned and decided they wanted rid of both factions. Enter starscream who got the biggest shot in the arm he's ever had, as he got elected leader and got rid of the badges. While this sets up the Dark Cybertron event it also represents a point where new ground was being broken. The G1 toon had ended the war in the Movie but the Seasons that followed didn't do anything with it as the cons were still the antagonists and the cons were actually the outnumbered force as the Bots clearly outnumbered them (after all, bad guy toys never sold as well as good guys). I digress but the IDW peace meant it could offer new takes on where the agression would come from, if it was because prime took it upon himself to annex earth or starscream and windblade trying to get other colony world's on board with the council of worlds. Even storylines like soundwave trying to build a safe haven for cons so they could live to their own ideals. We were even able to get a comedy road trip series (MTMTE/lost light) which gave us new reasons to fear overlord, a new take on star saber which shown what zealotry was like (which was hard for me at first as I love victory but I know they are separate), we were given renditions of chromedome and rewind which part of the fandom took to heart and it allowed one dimensional characters like cyclonus to live again and develop.

Now you may ask what the point of this is, so let me ask you, if you had started reading the IDW series when all hail megatron ended and someone asked you what you thought was going to happen in the series, how much of what happened would you really have guessed? I wouldn't of saw nearly any of these developments (save Unicron but it was just when IDW were going to play that card). So you say IDW doesn't have a future, well I say we just can't see what it is yet :-)*

*unless things really get messed up by the end of the visionaries series then please someone reboot it so the joes are the first ones to meet them on earth through a magic portal...



The bits I didn't know about gave me a lot to digest there, but first: I didn't say IDWverse doesn't have a future, they have no future generations. They are mashing all the characters together in the present. The Takara series took place in the future of G1, Beast Wars took place in their distant future. It's all well and good giving a boon to fans, "Oh look, here's your favourite" But who will actually be left in reserve? Who is there they could show as Future Transformers? G2? Unicron Trilogy? BW2 & Neo characters?

While I mull over the rest, a point of contention. Maybe it was true of the G1 comics, but Cyclonus was never one dimensional in Sunbow. His personality serving as the prototype to BW Dinobot. In fact, none of The Trinity were one dimensional in Sunbow. Shockwave or Megatron could be considered one dimensional in Sunbow, but certainly not Cyclonus.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ZeroWolf » Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:20 am

Motto: "My past no longer binds my future..."
Weapon: Battle Blades
I think you're being generous there in regards to G1 characterisations :-P especially putting cyclonus on the same shelf as Dinobot, who's final episode is one of my favourites of beast wars. As for generatons, does it really matter when there's still some corners of G1 and the Unicron trilogy to mine? Not to mention all the new ones that we'll see created and hopefully immortalised in toy form like nautica and chromia. I guess when it comes down to it I'm very optimistic about the future of IDW tfs...as long as tf v visionaries isn't a sign of things to come where every other hasbro based series has to launch from transformers...
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby AllNewSuperRobot » Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:51 am

Cyclonus demonstrated the same dubious sense of "honour" that would later become a defining trait of Dinobot's character. No one in Sunbow was ever that deep, yet there was some nuance.

Code of Hero is the not only one of the best TF stories ever, but absolutely the greatest death in the entire series. I do think Dinobot 2 was a mistake, maybe if they'd called him "Grimlock" instead?

Although, when I think about it, one particular set of characters hasn't been touched on at all in IDWverse - The alternate Primes and Megatrons. For example, Gigatron, the Ten-Former or Optimus Primal. Variants that had enough distinguishing personality to exist as separate characters among G1 Prime and Megatron. As for these new characters, I can't help but notice the lack of New Decepticons. Although arguably Tyrest and Star Saber do veer towards that line..
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby ZeroWolf » Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:23 pm

Motto: "My past no longer binds my future..."
Weapon: Battle Blades
I didn't mind Dinobot 2 as I could understand why megs made him, though he should of anticipated the end result.

Gigatron has already appeared in the drift miniseries empire of stone written by the guy who did all hail megatron.
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Re: IDW Transformers vs Visionaries Discussion Thread

Postby primalxconvoy » Sat Feb 10, 2018 3:49 pm

Motto: "私はルールに違反している"
This coming isn't good unless Blurr gets Witterquick's staff, uses it on Velocitron, whilst at top speed, and then breaks the world...

- https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ybb7_N6xpec

I never understood why each Visionary figure never came with a clear hard/rubbery plastic animal. In fact, they could have sold larger totem/summoned monsters, too.

PicsArt_1518301317190.jpg



And why the heck wasn't there a Final Fantasy style RPG ever made? Not even a ROM-hack?
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