The Energon Pub

Starscreams bad comedy wrote:

Robinson wrote:
This is what gets me. You cant stand praise for things that are admittedly dumb yet 2 posts ago you admit that the g1 gartoon was stupid and that is what started it all for everyone on this site. If there was no cartoon then was no marvel comics, no war within, nothing. The very act of posting on this site and making transformers based signatures and avatars and any fan fiction are giving praise to something that is admittedly dumb.

Because somebody can still like something that is "dumb" and or flawed in retrospect. At the very least you can like certain aspects of something like that, in this case the original source material. And yet in spite of liking something that may or may not be dumb you can have a certain level of expectation, that the same "dumb" mistakes wont be present in something that is expected to be on a higher level in terms of quality.

Based on whose notion of what quality actually is? Your's? Mine? Whose? To me it is much higher quality. We wont get some random micolored character in the background to all of a sudden have a name and a made up backstory with this movie. Things were thought out pieced together from 20 years of convoluted crap of canon and made into a coherant movie that fan and nonfan alike will most likely enjoy. To me that is much better than anything done with the "orinials"

oh noes! More (semi-) negative reviews!

http://yourmovies.com.au/movies/index.cfm?action=movie_info&title_id=22418

Did I mention ... *yawn*?

I sometimes wonder why people defend this movie so hard.

And the refferences to french art house films and shakespear are lame. Go watch a decent character driven comic film, like X-men 1 or 2. That's what I want. That's what I won't be getting. And I'm not gonna settle for this film- nor any of it's misguided sequels.

This movie was a bad idea from start to finish.

It is a lazy movie- not clearly though out, or terribly imaginative in its undertaking.

The reason why people like me don't like this film is because it could have been a great movie, and isn't. It's a pop-corn movie at it's worst.

I can say that without even seeing it- because they're selling it that way- with no intention of doing otherwise.

If this movie had memorable Robot scenes, wouldn't they be in the previews somewhere?

None of the reviews talk abnout the robots as characters- they just talk about how cool they are.

SFX shouldn't have to compensate for weak characters and story- they should enhance it. If the story is truely as "by the numbers" as it looks- then I expect this film to tank its second weekend. Why would people go back, when they can take their kids to see:

A) Harry Potter (Good acting, good story, memorable chacters)
B) Ratatoillie (Fantastic story, even better characters, awesom director who also happened to make Incredibles and Iron Giant, two movies with great robots, and great stories)

or C) Just not see the movie again because it was a big dum action movie with no soul?

Those of you on the defense don't get it. The movie should be good all over- not just in places. That's what makes a good movie, ya know?

Burn wrote:
But you want to keep dancing the dance of negativity? Go right ahead, i'm finding it bloody hilarious you negative folk are grasping at ANYTHING to whinge about in regards to this movie.

Took the words right outta my mouth. Funny, fans, even the skeptical ones, are loving this movie. Yet the two(or three) negative nillies left are grasping at straws to find anything to justify hating this movie. Two quasi negative reviews and their screaming "HA, told you so, it's teh suxor!" It's comedy at it's finest, keep it coming.

If this movie had memorable Robot scenes, wouldn't they be in the previews somewhere?

They said from the beginning that you wouldnt see much if any of the"good robot" stuff in the trailers. Save it for the movie.

The reason why people like me don't like this film is because it could have been a great movie, and isn't. It's a pop-corn movie at it's worst.

It was never going to a "great" movie because when all is said and done it is still a "silly toy movie"

If the story is truely as "by the numbers" as it looks- then I expect this film to tank its second weekend.

For this we will have to wait until July 16th to see whether or not you are right.

SoooTrypticon wrote:This movie was a bad idea from start to finish.

Call me when you finish watching the movie.

As for why people defend this movie so hard ... probably because people like you who are pulling it to pieces do so with poor arguments based on opinions of others who have seen the movie and just happen to agree with you. Oh sure you've seen the trailers and read the script, but until YOU actually see the finished product for YOURSELF your arguments really have no basis.

It's fascinating that the defenders of the movie get to call the critics names.... but woe and inferno when it's the other way around.

Burn wrote:

SoooTrypticon wrote:This movie was a bad idea from start to finish.

Call me when you finish watching the movie.

As for why people defend this movie so hard ... probably because people like you who are pulling it to pieces do so with poor arguments based on opinions of others who have seen the movie and just happen to agree with you. Oh sure you've seen the trailers and read the script, but until YOU actually see the finished product for YOURSELF your arguments really have no basis.

Its twu, its twu, its twu.

This movie was a bad idea from start to finish.

For you, maybe. For some of us, hell, I'd go so far as to say a majority of us, it was an entertaining film.

It is a lazy movie- not clearly though out, or terribly imaginative in its undertaking.

Er? Have you even -watched- the original cartoons? Each episode travels roughly as follows.

"Prime! The decepticons are attacking ! and stealing Energon!"
"OH NOES! Autobots, transform and roll out!"

"Yay! We won! Probably because of somthing the humans did while we were PEW PEWing and not hitting anything! Hooray!"


And you're worried about unimaginative and lack of forward planning? Pot Kettle?

The reason why people like me don't like this film is because it could have been a great movie, and isn't. It's a pop-corn movie at it's worst.

It is a great movie. One of the best I've seen. Sure, it had its silly bits, but I've yet to see a movie that doesn't.

I can say that without even seeing it- because they're selling it that way- with no intention of doing otherwise.

I get sick of seeing this. "I'm not seeing it because some nerd on the internet with his own web page told me not to!"
Baaaa.

If this movie had memorable Robot scenes, wouldn't they be in the previews somewhere?

Why? So we could not be at all surprised when we go SEE the movie? How many movies come out, where all the best bits are in the commercials? You just leave feeling ripped off. You could just do a commercial montage, and not pay to see all of it.

None of the reviews talk abnout the robots as characters- they just talk about how cool they are.

You have 12 or so characters, and 2 and a bit hours. Just how much character development do you expect?

Just as an example, TF had alot of char dev for Sam. And Bumbles. Thats 2. Now, look at X-men. Alot of char dev for Wolverine and Rogue. Bugger all for, say, storm, or Collossus, or a half dozen other mutants, and yet you tithe xmen as a fantastic well developed film?

Hello Mr Pot? This is kettle.

SFX shouldn't have to compensate for weak characters and story- they should enhance it. If the story is truely as "by the numbers" as it looks- then I expect this film to tank its second weekend. Why would people go back, when they can take their kids to see:

Im going to see it again tomorrow. And Im taking my wife. Then Ill go see it a third time, and take my son. It was THAT good.

A) Harry Potter (Good acting, good story, memorable chacters)

HAHAHA. Are you serious? The acting was -terrible-. The 'memorable characters', frankly, were just whitewash copies of any other fantasy story with kid wizards in it.

B) Ratatoillie (Fantastic story, even better characters, awesom director who also happened to make Incredibles and Iron Giant, two movies with great robots, and great stories)

Yeah. You're comparing an animated childrens movie, with an adult ACTION movie. Uhuh.

or C) Just not see the movie again because it was a big dum action movie with no soul?

It was great. It had soul. It recaptured the awe I felt as a kid watching the 'brainless, badly planned' cartoons in the 80s.

Those of you on the defense don't get it. The movie should be good all over- not just in places. That's what makes a good movie, ya know?

I enjoyed -every last second-. Sure, some of it was silly, or amusing, or not quite believable, but even the parts I disliked, I basically enjoyed.

[/b]

In regards to the X-men comparison. What about a memorable villain- like Magneto, and his great relationship with Mystique? Or how about the few great scenes with Jean Grey- setting up her character for down the line. Well, that, plus Rogue and Wolverine totals to five. But let's not forget Prof X- that's six. We can also add the Senator- the token human- who goes through quite a bit- that's seven. Seven great character arcs in one film- with cool scenes for the bit players in the back.

And you know, if all you wanted is a "silly toy movie" then good for you. I didn't, and I'm mad that after all the cool stuff that came before it- they couldn't make anything better, and just settled for mediocre. And I don't think it's better. At least the "dumb" shows had cool characters. I still hate the designs for this one. And at least the comics were centered on the robots. I don't care is Shia gets a girl or fights and iPOD or whatever. I want to know what Megatron's super-evil scheme is. Oh wait, he doesn't have one cause he's barely in the movie. Or what evil scheme does Starscream have cookin? Oh wait, none there to. But how will Prime come to deal with his robots put in danger and potentially starving on this hostile alien world? Maybe the thought crosses his mind... maybe?

I can't think of another film that has been such a constant stream of dissapointments- BEFORE it's even been released.


When I see the movie, I doubt my opinion will change- but I'll have ammo to back up my feelings.

Until then, these reviews, aside from the Dark Horizons one, haven't told me anthing I don't already know. The story is weak, the characters are simple at best, and the 'splosion rock. What that review did was present the goods and bads even handedly, without using a "random word + gasm" once.

It seems me and a few others kinda want 'splosions and then something a little more.

And here's my last bit. Some big questions for those who have seen the movie.

1) Does Bumblebee still pee?
2) Does Prime say "My Bad?"
3) Do Shia's mad football skillz help save the day?
4) How many lines (aside from growls) does Megatron have?
5) Are Megatron and Optimus still brothers?
6) Does Ratchet even talk, and if so, please quote a really great line from him.
7) Do the humans still use "nick-o-time" technology to defeat the Decepticons?
Does Jazz really, actually, break-dance?

In regards to the X-men comparison. What about a memorable villain- like Magneto, and his great relationship with Mystique? Or how about the few great scenes with Jean Grey- setting up her character for down the line. Well, that, plus Rogue and Wolverine totals to five. But let's not forget Prof X- that's six. We can also add the Senator- the token human- who goes through quite a bit- that's seven. Seven great character arcs in one film- with cool scenes for the bit players in the back.

Yeah, the senator. He bad mouths mutants, then gets zapped, and dies. Yep, thats some great character development there.
Magneto and Mystique? Were we even watching the same movie? There's the same amount of character interplay there as there is between, say, Oh I dunno, Ill just pull some names out of the air here, Prime and Ironhide? Jean Grey? What, so being a wishy washy girl with some psychic powers is now a compelling plot line and subtle char dev? And yeah, Prof X. I'm pretty sure he did alot of bossing about, really, and saying he'll help everyone.

You enjoyed X-men, because you SAW it. You have yet to see TF.

I want to know what Megatron's super-evil scheme is. Oh wait, he doesn't have one cause he's barely in the movie.

You would know what it is, if you'd seen the moofie. Which you haven't.

Or what evil scheme does Starscream have cookin? Oh wait, none there to.

You know what, you're quite correct. He doesn't. I wish he'd had some complicated scheme like he did in Armada. Oh, wait. He didn't.

But how will Prime come to deal with his robots put in danger and potentially starving on this hostile alien world? Maybe the thought crosses his mind... maybe?

Again, watch the moofie. As for the starving, I'll admit, they didn't delve into what the Autobots like to chow down on in their spare time. Frankly, I couldn't care less, really. Energon cubes haven't made an appearance in the cartoons in what, 15 years?

I can't think of another film that has been such a constant stream of dissapointments- BEFORE it's even been released.

You're a glass half empty kinda guy, aren't you? I mean, you would be, but the glass is in another room, with no windows, that you can't see, and someone TOLD you it was half empty, so you're just going to take their word for it, because they wouldn't LIE to you!

When I see the movie, I doubt my opinion will change- but I'll have ammo to back up my feelings.

I'm sure you will. You're determined to hate the movie, before you've seen it. So, if you'd never had chocolate, and some random stranger said it sucked, coz, you know, raw cocoa tastes horrible, and chocolate is made from cocoa, so it MUST be gross, you'd be the kind of guy who'd just run with that. Even when you'd had it, and liked it, you'd made such a huge noise about how horrible it would be, you'll just keep floggin that horse so you don't embarrass yourself.

1) Does Bumblebee still pee?

Yep. And no one in the cinema said 'oh thats just so tasteless.' Actually, everyone laughed. Quite loudly. See how Bay is making a movie for everyone to enjoy, not just the rabid fanboys who just want to relive a cartoon that DIED, quite severely, 20 odd years ago?

2) Does Prime say "My Bad?"

Yep. And?

3) Do Shia's mad football skillz help save the day?

If by 'mad football skillz' you mean, does he kick frenzies head away, like, well, anyone would do really, then yes. Are you going to make some sort of 'mad football skillz' reference for every movie where someone kicks somthing?

4) How many lines (aside from growls) does Megatron have?

I didn't actually count, but he talks quite a bit in the last 30 odd minutes of the movie.

5) Are Megatron and Optimus still brothers?

Sure are. But considering how many times the damn mythos has changed over the years, with the various cartoons, it's hardly a stretch.

6) Does Ratchet even talk, and if so, please quote a really great line from him.

Yep, he has about 4 lines. Mostly talking about Bumbles and trying to repair his voice.

7) Do the humans still use "nick-o-time" technology to defeat the Decepticons?

You know, I'm not entirely sure what you mean here. Are you talking about how they shoot decepticons for like, 3/4 of the movie before figuring out that the only thing that -slightly- damages them is some sort of heat seeking round, but mostly, the decepticon bashing is done by the Autobots?

8) Does Jazz really, actually, break-dance?

Not that I saw. He does bounce around alot though.

HTH. HAND.

SoooTrypticon wrote:In regards to the X-men comparison. What about a memorable villain- like Magneto, and his great relationship with Mystique? Or how about the few great scenes with Jean Grey- setting up her character for down the line. Well, that, plus Rogue and Wolverine totals to five. But let's not forget Prof X- that's six. We can also add the Senator- the token human- who goes through quite a bit- that's seven. Seven great character arcs in one film- with cool scenes for the bit players in the back.

And you know, if all you wanted is a "silly toy movie" then good for you. I didn't, and I'm mad that after all the cool stuff that came before it- they couldn't make anything better, and just settled for mediocre. And I don't think it's better. At least the "dumb" shows had cool characters. I still hate the designs for this one. And at least the comics were centered on the robots. I don't care is Shia gets a girl or fights and iPOD or whatever. I want to know what Megatron's super-evil scheme is. Oh wait, he doesn't have one cause he's barely in the movie. Or what evil scheme does Starscream have cookin? Oh wait, none there to. But how will Prime come to deal with his robots put in danger and potentially starving on this hostile alien world? Maybe the thought crosses his mind... maybe?

I can't think of another film that has been such a constant stream of dissapointments- BEFORE it's even been released.


When I see the movie, I doubt my opinion will change- but I'll have ammo to back up my feelings.

Until then, these reviews, aside from the Dark Horizons one, haven't told me anthing I don't already know. The story is weak, the characters are simple at best, and the 'splosion rock. What that review did was present the goods and bads even handedly, without using a "random word + gasm" once.

It seems me and a few others kinda want 'splosions and then something a little more.

And here's my last bit. Some big questions for those who have seen the movie.

1) Does Bumblebee still pee?
2) Does Prime say "My Bad?"
3) Do Shia's mad football skillz help save the day?
4) How many lines (aside from growls) does Megatron have?
5) Are Megatron and Optimus still brothers?
6) Does Ratchet even talk, and if so, please quote a really great line from him.
7) Do the humans still use "nick-o-time" technology to defeat the Decepticons?
Does Jazz really, actually, break-dance?

Most likely Yes, Yes,Yes,Yes,Yes and YES. We all know that you won't change your opinion, that you are stuck in good ol' 1985 and have fun with your vision skateboards and top gun soundtrack while most of us that are able to accept new things have fun in the theaters and wait for the next installment of this new franchise.

Peace out.

Are Prime and Megatron brothers? I thought Prime referred to him as a friend that turned on them.

Burn wrote:Are Prime and Megatron brothers? I thought Prime referred to him as a friend that turned on them.

It was right at the end, after Sam rips Megs a new one, Prime calls him 'Brother'.

They didn't really harp on about it much. They'll probably bang on about it in the next one.

Autobot City wrote:

Burn wrote:Are Prime and Megatron brothers? I thought Prime referred to him as a friend that turned on them.

It was right at the end, after Sam rips Megs a new one, Prime calls him 'Brother'.

They didn't really harp on about it much. They'll probably bang on about it in the next one.

hmmm...seems like a good reason to watch it again.

hmmm...seems like a good reason to watch it again.

Heh, Like I need a reason to see it again. And again

Mind you, my son wants to see it. So does my wife. So thats two very good reasons. Shame I must take them one at a time. Bwahaha.

I don’t want the cartoon, so stop saying that for starters. I want a well written movie with characters, not big toy/car commercials.

Actually, what people liked the most was how well developed the characters were in X-men.

Jean Grey is introduced not as a pair of breasts, but speaking at the senate- that’s a pretty good start. And then there’s her toss up between Cyclops and Wolverine.

Magneto and Mystique are a great duo because they have time to interact, and it seems like they have a history together. You can feel it just by how the actors work together.

Don’t forget the great opening with the holocaust that explains why Magneto is the villain he is.

The Senator has that awesome scene before he DIES, where he apologizes (kinda) to Storm- and Storm gets that one GREAT character moment with him.

Professor X gets to interact with Magneto quite a bit, and mirrors Magneto’s own philosophy.

What I’m getting at is that the characters had layers to them, and changed through the film- or more fully revealed their personalities to either be courageous, to downright dangerous. But the key idea here is that they’d changed somehow by the end of the film.

Aside from being killed, do any of the Transformers even have problems to overcome in this film? What are they even fighting about in this version? It’s not terribly clear in the trailers, nor very compelling it seems.

The “mad football skillz” applies to a rather lame subplot in the old script (I’m hoping they changed it) where Shia wants real bad to be on the school football team- but doesn’t cut it. But when he’s up against Megatron, he “goes the distance” and runs fast using “mad football skillz” to outrun Megatron before “spoilering him.”

SO did Ratchet actually say anything memorable? Or what about Ironhide? Bumblebee- he says something at the end, right? Can you remember it?

And those heat seeking rounds- I’m so glad the military just happened to have them handy laying about in case a Decepticon with wildly advanced mechanics comes along. While they were at it, did they upload a computer virus into Megatron using a laptop?

As far as 1985 goes. (shivers) I’m sure we all want Reagan back, along with neon pink windbreakers and puffy pants. C’mon, I want good characters and decent scripting, not the 80s!

But Bumblebee pees huh? That’s class.

edit:
What about the glasses? Was that winning plotline ever ditched? You get to write a script about alien robots, and you choose to include magic glasses?

SoooTrypticon wrote:I don’t want the cartoon, so stop saying that for starters. I want a well written movie with characters, not big toy/car commercials.

Actually, what people liked the most was how well developed the characters were in X-men.

Jean Grey is introduced not as a pair of breasts, but speaking at the senate- that’s a pretty good start. And then there’s her toss up between Cyclops and Wolverine.

Magneto and Mystique are a great duo because they have time to interact, and it seems like they have a history together. You can feel it just by how the actors work together.

Don’t forget the great opening with the holocaust that explains why Magneto is the villain he is.

The Senator has that awesome scene before he DIES, where he apologizes (kinda) to Storm- and Storm gets that one GREAT character moment with him.

Professor X gets to interact with Magneto quite a bit, and mirrors Magneto’s own philosophy.

What I’m getting at is that the characters had layers to them, and changed through the film- or more fully revealed their personalities to either be courageous, to downright dangerous. But the key idea here is that they’d changed somehow by the end of the film.

Aside from being killed, do any of the Transformers even have problems to overcome in this film? What are they even fighting about in this version? It’s not terribly clear in the trailers, nor very compelling it seems.

The “mad football skillz” applies to a rather lame subplot in the old script (I’m hoping they changed it) where Shia wants real bad to be on the school football team- but doesn’t cut it. But when he’s up against Megatron, he “goes the distance” and runs fast using “mad football skillz” to outrun Megatron before “spoilering him.”

SO did Ratchet actually say anything memorable? Or what about Ironhide? Bumblebee- he says something at the end, right? Can you remember it?

And those heat seeking rounds- I’m so glad the military just happened to have them handy laying about in case a Decepticon with wildly advanced mechanics comes along. While they were at it, did they upload a computer virus into Megatron using a laptop?

As far as 1985 goes. (shivers) I’m sure we all want Reagan back, along with neon pink windbreakers and puffy pants. C’mon, I want good characters and decent scripting, not the 80s!

But Bumblebee pees huh? That’s class.

Hey, how was the movie? Because it sounds like you've seen it.

It was great- and the part where Bumblebee peed made me laugh so hard I snorted up all the coke me and the producers were sharing. But hey, that's Hollywood.

SoooTrypticon wrote:It was great- and the part where Bumblebee peed made me laugh so hard I snorted up the all the coke me and the producers were sharing. But hey, that's Hollywood.

Excellent. I'm gonna go see it opening night, with a couple of buddies, and we'll enjoy a movie based on a children's toyline.

So, I sat down and talked with a friend about this movie. I picked him because, while he’s not a geek, or a transfan, or even really interested in toys- he’s a smart guy, an excellent teacher, and a very talented artist. I thought his opinion on what’s going on here was very helpful in chilling me out, and setting this in perspective.

After filling him in on Transformers, the movie, my feelings on it, and other people’s feelings; I asked him “Is it okay for a movie to be dumb, if it’s based on dumb material?”

His response was: “Toys aren’t dumb, it’s how people play with them.”

I thought it was a really simple, and elegant analysis for this whole mess, and I’ll leave it at that for now.

That really makes no sense.

Or i'm just dumb. hmmmm...

Burn wrote:

SoooTrypticon wrote:I did think Garth's review sorta confirmed everyone's fears about the film though.

No, it is not "everyone's" fears. Don't presume you're in the majority when it comes to not liking what this movie is offering. You never were, and will more than likely never will be the majority.

But you want to keep dancing the dance of negativity? Go right ahead, i'm finding it bloody hilarious you negative folk are grasping at ANYTHING to whinge about in regards to this movie.

Here here


that review didn't comfirm **** when it comes to the movie.. It is well done and the first time in 20 years that you have seen a transformer on the screen. Most people that had issues didn't like some of the designs and yeah some of them sucked, but at the same time, they were going to give the movie a chance. and from my review and the reaction of the people in the theater a few weeks ago that loved it. it is going to be the blockbuster of the summer.



you can complain about the movie all you want, but i bet most of the people that are complaining are going to see the movie... and u will probubly not like it if u set out thinking it is going to suck. but a few people might see they are wrong...

even if they would of made the charectors so much like the g1's someone would still have a problem with it. it is called compromise and realizing that this is transformers on the big screen and you see lots of action and stuff blowing up along with robots transforming into vechicles (and it is sweet)

Even bay deserved credit, he handled the movie well.