The Energon Pub

The Paragon of Virtue wrote:There is no such thing as a "real fan." There are simply fans that like various different things about Transformers and its many versions.

This is the kind of "true fan" you apparently are: http://transformers.wikia.com/wiki/True_fan

Someone is not less of a fan because they like something different. The first link on that page says it best:

"True Fan" is a...term used by insecure, narrow-minded people acting holier-than-thou, trying to make themselves feel better by putting themselves up on the "True Fan" pedestal while kicking others off. There is no such thing as a "True Fan". There is only "Fan". Any measurement of fandom is arbitrary and personal AT BEST. What you know, what you own, or what individual aspects of TFs you like does NOT define whether one is a "Fan" or not, and frankly, doesn't make anybody a bigger or better fan than anybody else.

A True fan is somebody who agrees completely and rigidly with the viewpoint of the person using the term.

Example: "My point of view is the correct one, and if you disagree with me you're not a 'true fan,' and thus not worthy of my time / wrong."

holy crap that sounds like bush.

The Paragon of Virtue wrote:There is no such thing as a "real fan." There are simply fans that like various different things about Transformers and its many versions.

This is the kind of "true fan" you apparently are: http://transformers.wikia.com/wiki/True_fan

Someone is not less of a fan because they like something different. The first link on that page says it best:

"True Fan" is a...term used by insecure, narrow-minded people acting holier-than-thou, trying to make themselves feel better by putting themselves up on the "True Fan" pedestal while kicking others off. There is no such thing as a "True Fan". There is only "Fan". Any measurement of fandom is arbitrary and personal AT BEST. What you know, what you own, or what individual aspects of TFs you like does NOT define whether one is a "Fan" or not, and frankly, doesn't make anybody a bigger or better fan than anybody else.

Did you write that entry in wiki yourself? Because I can easliy go and change it...Or did you forget your citing someone elses bias opinion who took the time to write something on wiki he or she felt ...

wingdarkness wrote:It just happened and hoards of my 1984 brethren feel the same way

That's complete bull. Look around this board. Most of us are old enough to have watched the show when it first aired on TV. Yet only a handful of people are still complaining. Was the movie perfect? No. Was it absolutely horrible? No. Get over yourself. If you didn't like it to friggin bad. But to pull the BS "true fan" flag and claim that everyone that did enjoy the movie for what it was isn't, is crap.

And frankly I have always hated geewuners. Biggest bunch of damn whiners in the fandom. But then again I have always hated people so stuck in the past as to be blindfolded to reality. No wingdarkness it is not that we twist or contort or even care to find a reason to like the movie. It is more the fact that we aren't so stuck on purism that we are blinded to finding enjoyment in what is there.

wingdarkness wrote:

The Paragon of Virtue wrote:There is no such thing as a "real fan." There are simply fans that like various different things about Transformers and its many versions.

This is the kind of "true fan" you apparently are: http://transformers.wikia.com/wiki/True_fan

Someone is not less of a fan because they like something different. The first link on that page says it best:

"True Fan" is a...term used by insecure, narrow-minded people acting holier-than-thou, trying to make themselves feel better by putting themselves up on the "True Fan" pedestal while kicking others off. There is no such thing as a "True Fan". There is only "Fan". Any measurement of fandom is arbitrary and personal AT BEST. What you know, what you own, or what individual aspects of TFs you like does NOT define whether one is a "Fan" or not, and frankly, doesn't make anybody a bigger or better fan than anybody else.

Did you write that entry in wiki yourself? Because I can easliy go and change it...Or did you forget your citing someone elses bias opinion who took the time to write something on wiki he or she felt ...

That's very interesting. Next time, do you want to try and address any part of my argument?

Koloth put things well.

Koloth wrote:

wingdarkness wrote:It just happened and hoards of my 1984 brethren feel the same way

That's complete bull. Look around this board. Most of us are old enough to have watched the show when it first aired on TV. Yet only a handful of people are still complaining. Was the movie perfect? No. Was it absolutely horrible? No. Get over yourself. If you didn't like it to friggin bad. But to pull the BS "true fan" flag and claim that everyone that did enjoy the movie for what it was isn't, is crap.

And frankly I have always hated geewuners. Biggest bunch of damn whiners in the fandom. But then again I have always hated people so stuck in the past as to be blindfolded to reality. No wingdarkness it is not that we twist or contort or even care to find a reason to like the movie. It is more the fact that we are so stuck on purism that we are blinded to finding enjoyment in what is there.

Hey I'm new here, if seibertron don't have people extremely dissapointed in this movie, it's the only TF forum..Maybe you should google a few more...But then again maybe you want to live in this perfect glass world where all of us just fade away...

In any event, I appreciate you showing me in words why you'll never understand where we are coming from, and that's cool...Again wanting a movie that was just more G-1 friendlier or that simply MAKES SENSE means we are blinded to reality o.O, a reality that means every big movie has to be an souless MTV music video sponsered by Ebay and GMC...I'm sure you're one of the people whose best comebacks is "What did you guys want and Oscar worthy movie?" It's so sad to see people like you who defend this movie use the most static-extreme there is as a counter-point...As if good adaptation = blinded purism...But your right, the reality of the situation is that most blockbusters like Transformers are catered to the lowest common denominator of unevolved apes in the mass society and if I wanna enjoy I simply have to grab a banana, or better yet a banana Camaro...

OK. I just gotta try to clarify what's up here...

I'm 27 years old. I loved G1 when it was on. I own all of the DVDs as well as the movie (I watch the movie at least once a month and know the first 20 minutes by heart). I never saw one episode of Beast Wars or Beast Machines. I thought Armada and Energon both sucked. But since I absolutely LOVED the new movie, that means I'm not what you define to be a "true fan?"

You can have you opinion about the movie, but saying that those of us who enjoyed the heck out of it aren't real Transformers fans makes me pretty pissed off. I hope you have a very full life outside of whining on the internet about how Michael Bay ruined your childhood. I know I have better things to do that cry about how Optimus Prime only had a faceplate for 10 minutes or how Bumbleebee wasn't a VW.

Please...for the love of God...get a life. Generation 1 of the Transformers ended in 1987. LET. IT. GO!

G1 friendlier huh? And what would that be exactly? An exact remake of "More Than Meets the Eye"? A story the makes sense huh? You mean like all those wonderfully logical stories in the G1 cartoon.

First of all wing, I'm getting tired of your BS. I have not defended this movie at all. I have defended the fandom from your bull. Your moronic claims that because your a G1 purist (the worst kind of fan) that you're the only "real fan" here. I could care less if you like the movie or not. I'm just sick of snotty purist that think they know better than the general fandom.

What I see as sad is the purist attidtude that there is only one way to tell this story and that is 100% true to the original cartoon. Your fooling yourself if you EVER believed that was going to happen. I would like to know exactly what kind of story you really expected? Where you think the plot or lack there of could have been improved. Forget your bull about the movie being a commercial. That is business and to be expected. But you think you;re so much smarter than the rest of us fans or the writers in Hollywood. You tell me what it should have been. Fact is I haven't seen one good point as to why the movie is actually bad. Just a butt load of nitpicking over Hollywood business deals.

I haven't defended the movie here either. I couldn't care less if you like the movie or not; that's your own decision. I cannot stand the "true fan" mentality that dismisses everyone else because they don't agree with your opinion of what "true fans" should think of the movie.

There are only fans. If you like some part of Transformers, you're a fan. That's all there is. Beast Wars, comics, Beast Machines, G1, Armada, Energon, just the toys, it doesn't matter. We're all fans. Liking one more than another does not lessen how much of a fan you are.

wingdarkness wrote:But your right, the reality of the situation is that most blockbusters like Transformers are catered to the lowest common denominator of unevolved apes in the mass society and if I wanna enjoy I simply have to grab a banana, or better yet a banana Camaro...

So basically, what you're saying is those who liked and enjoyed the movie aren't real fans because they're unevolved apes?

@Burn - If your not an ape I'm certainley not talking to you, just using that as an extreme overveiw of how hollywood Blockbusters are catered nowadays...And Micheal Bay specifically--the lowest common denominator of generic audiences...

Koloth wrote:G1 friendlier huh? And what would that be exactly? An exact remake of "More Than Meets the Eye"? A story the makes sense huh? You mean like all those wonderfully logical stories in the G1 cartoon.

First of all wing, I'm getting tired of your BS. I have not defended this movie at all. I have defended the fandom from your bull. Your moronic claims that because your a G1 purist (the worst kind of fan) that you're the only "real fan" here. I could care less if you like the movie or not. I'm just sick of snotty purist that think they know better than the general fandom.

What I see as sad is the purist attitude that there is only one way to tell this story and that is 100% true to the original cartoon. Your fooling yourself if you EVER believed that was going to happen. I would like to know exactly what kind of story you really expected? Where you think the plot or lack there of could have been improved. Forget your bull about the movie being a commercial. That is business and to be expected. But you think you;re so much smarter than the rest of us fans or the writers in Hollywood. You tell me what it should have been. Fact is I haven't seen one good point as to why the movie is actually bad. Just a butt load of nitpicking over Hollywood business deals.

You haven't seen one good point on why this movie is bad? DO you live in a Cocoon? Is Steve Guttenberg there with you? Are you Steve Guttenberg? LMAO...Wow, so you thought the plot made sense? You thought the glasses wound up meaning $hit? You thought every Transformer was aesthetically great? You thought Mike Bay's half-beaten baby seal mind-frame for cut-editing was great? You think raping clichés from Independence Day, Men In Black, Jurassic Park 2, Godzilla, King Kong, and God knows what other movie blockbusters all scored to generic infomercial music was great? A movie where transformers lore is cherry-picked from one episode Bay watched and served as the true-story? The Transformers pilot PWNs any story this movie had to offer, and while the cartoons weren't complex in story they sure the hell were straight-forward and coherent for the most part (Something this movie wish it could be--Oh wait Optimus and company got to earth surfing fiery Asteroids like in the movie right? >.>)

God there's so much I can Pwn you with on story alone I'm gonna just do you a favor and leave it alone...sheesh...Or maybe I should put a gun to your head and force you to take me to Bumble-Bee so he can show us how to save the world....What? Huh? What's a Bumble-bee? Shut-up Tyrese and read your lines...

You really don't know $hit about me...I was cool with Megatron not being a gun (However Gay it is that Bay thought re-sizing was cheesy when the friken All-Spark turned into size of a vodka bottle so a human could carry it)..I understood Soundwave, Blaster and the rest of the floating tapes had to be vanquished because their outdated...I didn't want something that was totally a g1 cartoon episode, but what I didn't want was a 100% totally generic adaptation that could have been a movie about anything else if you just took the Transformers out of it...SO if you call that a purist attitude, then damn right I'm a purist! Baptize my a$$ in energon cubes!

You said you loved Beast Wars? How about a movie where Optimus Primal is a smart chimp with a Nascar jacket... That's updated an cool huh? Let's just put a purple cape on Superman that's hip huh? Batman in hot-red? That's different and realistic...That's how I feel when I see flames on Prime, he's just as iconic...Then I have to put up with a guy who didn't want to direct the film, hung up the phone on Speilberg when offered it, FORCED ILM to make his Bayformers when they walked outta the room on him when he first suggested the changes, and all this laffing and pi$$ing on the g1 fanbase because he had no clue how popular TF's really were...Puh-leeeze, keep defending the fruits of his car-engine loins...

And please spare me your idioms that fall far short of my cranial region...If I say true-fan and that offends you there's probably a reason for that...I won't explore it, but I can't believe a 1984 tru-fan would champion the whole of this movie and that's my god-honest opinion...You don't agree that's totally fair, I get it, I'm crazy for wanting a better TF movie, but your last post has only reinforced my assessment of you as hopefully this post has for you about me... Now if you'll excuse me, me and Sparkplug have to place some freshly picked gardenias near Jazz's grave...

Obi-Wan Kenobi wrote:No...I think he has some valid points, like it's annoying when you're camcorder battery dies when you're on a roll.

I agree with the camera dying thing.. so annoying

wingdarkness wrote:@Burn - If your not an ape I'm certainley not talking to you, just using that as an extreme overveiw of how hollywood Blockbusters are catered nowadays...And Micheal Bay specifically--the lowest common denominator of generic audiences...

And yet, so many of his films are successful.

Says a lot about the human race doesn't it?

And me too considering I don't mind his films.

But then i'm not a true fan. So what would I know?

windarkness, you type to much.

@Blackout - Prime is as iconic....Not just to me but to the millions and millions of fans who gave Transformers it's relevance...You are not understanding me, without the fanbase that made TF explode from a trial-run 13 ep series to a cultural phenomenon, THERE IS NO MOVIE! We made Transformers relevant...Us insane 5-11 year olds (now 27-35) who had to have and watch everything Transformers are the roots of this franchise existing the way it does....Everything else that follows is merely an extention of that (however great or bad it is deemed)...SO hell yeah Prime is as iconic as Batman and Superman for TF Lore and putting Flames on him (not for a practical reason, but) because Micheal Bay "wanted a green house instead of a yellow house" is pathetic IMO...Couple that with Don Murphy's promises that Bay totally ignored and you have what is called backlash...

And at the same time he's reinvigorated the franchise, created new fans (with their new prime), and brought more attention to the old comics than ever before. TFs are more popular now than ever. Stop talking as though YOUR precious G1 setting is all that counts. If he 'pissed' on your toys, he's shot TFs into stardom instead.

Dude, anybody could have done that, James Cameron, Peter Jackson, John Woo, etc., it just happened to fall in Bay's greasy hands...Transformers sells itself, it didn't need Bay to revigorate it, any of those directors could have done atleast the generic job he did of bringing it back...The CGI alone sold that movie not Bay...C'mon dude, you gotta think ahead...

As for your comments on insults, all I said was that confirmed what type of person I thought he was...Nothing more nothing less...He's the one calling me a moron and that I'm spewing bull...For once it would be nice to have a heated and passionate debate where we throw away our facades and after it's over still be cool..As I think about it, I guess when I say stuff like "true-TF fan" I'm morso saying the people who were apart of the orginal cultural phenomenon not necessarily that I'm better than you or some crap like that...I'm just saying without that orginal base none of this is possible and many of us feel the reward for making TF the $hit it is today is a smack in the face from Mike Bay...Do you understand a little more clearer now??

windarkness, you type to much

It's wingdarkness, and thanx^^...I'm a writer in real-life so my natural word count is usally like this wherever I go...I just type until I feel my thoughts are complete...

wingdarkness wrote:Do you understand a little more clearer now??

Writer, huh. Good luck with that.

I love when you use red text to highlight your points. Reminds me of when tabloid NEWSPAPERS use CAPITALS to OVEREMPHASISE certain to make them sound more SHOCKING.

I'd like to think everyone has outgrown terms like 'real fan' by now. Is there some sort of test?

I can live with people bitching about how they dislike the fact that the movie is more about action than plot, but to still be whining about flames... dear god, get out more.

Well Prowl like I said before, I'm new to these particular TF boards and can't be sure everyone can read my mind...Honestly I'm past the Flames on Prime as of today 7/07, but in the context of debating people who have no source material on my likes and dislikes about the ENTIRETY of my feelings on this movie pre and post production I thought I'd include it...By the time I went to the theater whatever hate I had for the Flames were just apathy...AS for my red-text that's been my posting style for some years now and I do it on every board I'm apart of...Some people love it and some hate it...


@Blackout - We'll just have to agree to disagree...I disagree with every point you just made in your last post and passionately to be honest...I don't remember the last time somebody thought "Dude" was an insult though? I'm a real talker so I apologize because smilicon pleasantries just aren't my thing...I come from a family of peeps who just say it how it is, and I try to do the same...In the spirit of that I have to tell you I think you're fooling yourself if you don't think any of those other directors couldn't have done atleast what Bay did if not better...

Writer, huh. Good luck with that

I'd say freelance writing for 7 years and getting paid to do so ain't so bad...BTW I type far less grammatically correct on forums...shhhhhhhh, our secret xD...

And it goes back to the whiny geewuner fanboy pissing and moaning about Prime's flames. I love how they can't help but grasp at straws now. It's ok though, his long winded rants are hilarious.

D-340 wrote:And it goes back to the whiny geewuner fanboy pissing and moaning about Prime's flames. I love how they can't help but grasp at straws now. It's ok though, his long winded rants are hilarious.

Care to do me a summary of the good bits? Because I can't be arsed reading all that dribble.

I mean there's just so many times you can see a "true fan" whining before it gets boring.

@Blackout - Thanx...I'm really just a passionate fan when it's all said and done and in the end I really mean no harm...So sorry if I offended you...

D-340 wrote:And it goes back to the whiny geewuner fanboy pissing and moaning about Prime's flames. I love how they can't help but grasp at straws now. It's ok though, his long winded rants are hilarious.

Wow a lazy and passive-aggressive post aimed at getting people on your side when you're incapable of breaking down my actual statements...Hmmm never seen that before :rollseyes:...Glad you LOL'd though I thought my Sparkplug and Jazz satire was pretty funny myself, along with some other stuff I wrote specifically for chuckles...I try to make my long posts enjoyable to read atleast...Awaits your next defense-mechanism disguised as a audience pleasing post..

wingdarkness wrote:

Writer, huh. Good luck with that

I'd say freelance writing for 7 years and getting paid to do so ain't so bad...BTW I type far less grammatically correct on forums...shhhhhhhh, our secret xD...

I'm telling everyone

Burn wrote:

D-340 wrote:And it goes back to the whiny geewuner fanboy pissing and moaning about Prime's flames. I love how they can't help but grasp at straws now. It's ok though, his long winded rants are hilarious.

Care to do me a summary of the good bits? Because I can't be arsed reading all that dribble.

I mean there's just so many times you can see a "true fan" whining before it gets boring.

K, here goes, The movie wasn't G1

I always laugh when I here people whine the movie wasn't G1. It's even funnier when post 5 or 6 multi paragraphed posts saying that they're the true fans for hating the movie and those who liked are just stupid.