Megatron Gets Weaker Throughout The Films
Silverwing wrote:Also, I feel compelled to give the obligatory:
One for each year of the Movieverse's decade strong tenure. Here's to a few more explosive years!
TurboMMaster wrote:Funny thing, shor before Action o the DotM Movie, Megatron kicks Optimus ass in fight in soviet military base. And Prime use MORE UPREGADES than in both RotF and DotM. Bespite this, he was ben easily handed by Megatron, with was after long battle with Warpath and extermination of many bots.
Here is the fight:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIV6LTtZHQk
Actually, Bay never threat Optimus vs Megatron fight series. He never cares about logic, or fightning style, if one needs to won, he simply won. And since Optimus Prime is main antagonist, it usually won in ridiculus sense of style.
I don't think we should search that kind of deep in Bay's Movies.
Many Optimus Prime Lemmings-fans desperately search for any form excuse to negate this. Usually, they said that Optimus is not fighting at his best, because hew is affraid to harm humans. This is of couse kinda pathetic, bu Optimus fans do anything to neglect the fact that that Idol get his ass kicked.Capt.Failure wrote:Actually there's plenty of logical sense of you pay attention. Megatron was indeed stronger the first time.
Forst Battle is extremly bad done. Megatron from unkown reason changed his fightning style. In first movie he was a heavy wieght wrestler,throwng Prime like a Barbie doll. In second movie he prefering kick-boxing. Actually it was terrible, because he don't use during this fight non of he's adventages: He don't use his size(unless that time when he jump on Optimus), ability to take flight, or fusion canon. And to be honest, I don't think Bay even think about what he done. Also remember that Optimus after all this fight was'nt even able to wound Megatron during Forest Battle.The second time he was rebuilt with random parts, so he was weaker but also not dumb enough to fight alone.
Yet still, this mortally wounded Megatron was been CANONICALLY able to nearly kill Optimus in oficial prequel, witch was not so long before action of the Movie. And Optimus uses his new upregades, along with force field AND Chainsaw. And he isn't tired after fighning, while Megatron was after a long battle with Autobots.Third film he was pretty much suffering mortal wounds while Optimus had been rebuilt with the parts of a very old and powerful (if rusty) Seeker.
Actually, when you see any of Bay's movies, you can see that only logic he use is "As long as it is awesome, it is good for the movie."Refusing to see the logic of the events in the films doesn't mean it isn't there or that Bay doesn't care about consistency.
TurboMMaster wrote:Many Optimus Prime Lemmings-fans desperately search for any form excuse to negate this. Usually, they said that Optimus is not fighting at his best, because hew is affraid to harm humans. This is of couse kinda pathetic, bu Optimus fans do anything to neglect the fact that that Idol get his ass kicked.Capt.Failure wrote:Actually there's plenty of logical sense of you pay attention. Megatron was indeed stronger the first time.Forst Battle is extremly bad done. Megatron from unkown reason changed his fightning style. In first movie he was a veavy wieght wrestler,throwng Prime like a Barbie doll. In second movie he prefering kick-boxing. Actually it was terrible, because he don't use during this fight non of he's adventages: He don't use his size, ability to take flight, or fusion canon. And to be honest, I don't think Bay even think about what he done. Also remember that Optimus after all this fight was'nt even able to wound Megatron during Forest Battle.The second time he was rebuilt with random parts, so he was weaker but also not dumb enough to fight alone.Yet still, this mortally wounded Megatron was been CANONICALLY able to nearly kill Optimus in oficial prequel, witch was not so long before action of the Movie. And Optimus uses his new upregades, along with force field AND Chainsaw. And he isn't tired after fighning, while Megatron was after a long battle with Autobots.Third film he was pretty much suffering mortal wounds while Optimus had been rebuilt with the parts of a very old and powerful (if rusty) Seeker.Actually, when you see any of Bay's movies, you can see that only logic he use is "As long as it is awesome, it is good for the movie."Refusing to see the logic of the events in the films doesn't mean it isn't there or that Bay doesn't care about consistency.
Let me quess, you never heard of Transformers: Dark f the Moon video game, witch is prequel of movie(although, there seems to be some plot holes, yet they can be easily explained ), arent you?Capt.Failure wrote:...
So basically it doesn't matter if someone points out the facts, you'll just deny it and live in your own little world? I see, so this entire "discussion" is pointless.
Edit: You are aware that the order of canon with the films is movie > book = comic right?
TurboMMaster wrote:Let me quess, you never heard of Transformers: Dark f the Moon video game, witch is prequel of movie(although, there seems to be some plot holes, yet they can be easily explained ), arent you?Capt.Failure wrote:...
So basically it doesn't matter if someone points out the facts, you'll just deny it and live in your own little world? I see, so this entire "discussion" is pointless.
Edit: You are aware that the order of canon with the films is movie > book = comic right?
TurboMMaster wrote:Let me quess, you never heard of Transformers: Dark f the Moon video game, witch is prequel of movie(although, there seems to be some plot holes, yet they can be easily explained ), arent you?Capt.Failure wrote:...
So basically it doesn't matter if someone points out the facts, you'll just deny it and live in your own little world? I see, so this entire "discussion" is pointless.
Edit: You are aware that the order of canon with the films is movie > book = comic right?
-Kanrabat- wrote:Sigh... Megatron was perfect in the first movie but he was treated like **** in the others. He better revive as Galvatron in the fourth film and be a real threat this time around.
SKYWARPED_128 wrote:-Kanrabat- wrote:Sigh... Megatron was perfect in the first movie but he was treated like **** in the others. He better revive as Galvatron in the fourth film and be a real threat this time around.
Not too likely, I'm afraid. Kurtzman and Orci did think about renaming Megatron as Galvatron when they revived him in ROTF, but decided against it because they thought it might confuse the audience.
Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:-Kanrabat- wrote:Sigh... Megatron was perfect in the first movie but he was treated like **** in the others. He better revive as Galvatron in the fourth film and be a real threat this time around.
Not too likely, I'm afraid. Kurtzman and Orci did think about renaming Megatron as Galvatron when they revived him in ROTF, but decided against it because they thought it might confuse the audience.
Did I ever mention how much I hate those two?
SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:-Kanrabat- wrote:Sigh... Megatron was perfect in the first movie but he was treated like **** in the others. He better revive as Galvatron in the fourth film and be a real threat this time around.
Not too likely, I'm afraid. Kurtzman and Orci did think about renaming Megatron as Galvatron when they revived him in ROTF, but decided against it because they thought it might confuse the audience.
Did I ever mention how much I hate those two?
Well, they did pretty good as producers of the TF Prime series. I just hate whoever was responsible for the dumb jokes in the movies, and it seems the two and Kruger had their hands in it as well.
Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:-Kanrabat- wrote:Sigh... Megatron was perfect in the first movie but he was treated like **** in the others. He better revive as Galvatron in the fourth film and be a real threat this time around.
Not too likely, I'm afraid. Kurtzman and Orci did think about renaming Megatron as Galvatron when they revived him in ROTF, but decided against it because they thought it might confuse the audience.
Did I ever mention how much I hate those two?
Well, they did pretty good as producers of the TF Prime series. I just hate whoever was responsible for the dumb jokes in the movies, and it seems the two and Kruger had their hands in it as well.
Their efforts show they don't care about what they're writing. With the writer's strike inbound they worked double time to finish the Star Trek script and gave Bay an unfinished script. When they cut their cancer out of the series we got Dark of the Moon.
SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:-Kanrabat- wrote:Sigh... Megatron was perfect in the first movie but he was treated like **** in the others. He better revive as Galvatron in the fourth film and be a real threat this time around.
Not too likely, I'm afraid. Kurtzman and Orci did think about renaming Megatron as Galvatron when they revived him in ROTF, but decided against it because they thought it might confuse the audience.
Did I ever mention how much I hate those two?
Well, they did pretty good as producers of the TF Prime series. I just hate whoever was responsible for the dumb jokes in the movies, and it seems the two and Kruger had their hands in it as well.
Their efforts show they don't care about what they're writing. With the writer's strike inbound they worked double time to finish the Star Trek script and gave Bay an unfinished script. When they cut their cancer out of the series we got Dark of the Moon.
They went half-assed with ROTF while focusing on Star Trek? I didn't know that.
Okay, now I'm officially pissed off with these two. With the massive budget and popularity the first movie created, ROTF had massive potential. Granted, ROTF has some of the most unforgettable scenes in the 3 movies, but in some other areas, it could have been a lot better.
Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:-Kanrabat- wrote:Sigh... Megatron was perfect in the first movie but he was treated like **** in the others. He better revive as Galvatron in the fourth film and be a real threat this time around.
Not too likely, I'm afraid. Kurtzman and Orci did think about renaming Megatron as Galvatron when they revived him in ROTF, but decided against it because they thought it might confuse the audience.
Did I ever mention how much I hate those two?
Well, they did pretty good as producers of the TF Prime series. I just hate whoever was responsible for the dumb jokes in the movies, and it seems the two and Kruger had their hands in it as well.
Their efforts show they don't care about what they're writing. With the writer's strike inbound they worked double time to finish the Star Trek script and gave Bay an unfinished script. When they cut their cancer out of the series we got Dark of the Moon.
They went half-assed with ROTF while focusing on Star Trek? I didn't know that.
Okay, now I'm officially pissed off with these two. With the massive budget and popularity the first movie created, ROTF had massive potential. Granted, ROTF has some of the most unforgettable scenes in the 3 movies, but in some other areas, it could have been a lot better.
Yeah, they gave Bay 14 pages of script to work with. The film leading up to Optimus' death was so padded since they had to stretch the original script as far as they could.
SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:-Kanrabat- wrote:Sigh... Megatron was perfect in the first movie but he was treated like **** in the others. He better revive as Galvatron in the fourth film and be a real threat this time around.
Not too likely, I'm afraid. Kurtzman and Orci did think about renaming Megatron as Galvatron when they revived him in ROTF, but decided against it because they thought it might confuse the audience.
Did I ever mention how much I hate those two?
Well, they did pretty good as producers of the TF Prime series. I just hate whoever was responsible for the dumb jokes in the movies, and it seems the two and Kruger had their hands in it as well.
Their efforts show they don't care about what they're writing. With the writer's strike inbound they worked double time to finish the Star Trek script and gave Bay an unfinished script. When they cut their cancer out of the series we got Dark of the Moon.
They went half-assed with ROTF while focusing on Star Trek? I didn't know that.
Okay, now I'm officially pissed off with these two. With the massive budget and popularity the first movie created, ROTF had massive potential. Granted, ROTF has some of the most unforgettable scenes in the 3 movies, but in some other areas, it could have been a lot better.
Yeah, they gave Bay 14 pages of script to work with. The film leading up to Optimus' death was so padded since they had to stretch the original script as far as they could.
That certainly explains all the college shenanigans that Bay and his producer had to stuff into the movie. I always felt the forest trap thing was a little awkward. I kept thinking the whole plan was to kidnap Sam and get the code from his brain, and that they simply turned around to stop Optimus from getting away with Sam.
It was only after listening to the commentaries that I realized it was supposed to be a trap.
Capt.Failure wrote:Indeed. What it amounts to is the script when filming began only went up to the forest battle, so they brought in another writer to finish it on the fly. From what I gather Bay tried to get filming delayed, but the studios told him to slag off in no uncertain terms. This isn't the first time this happened to Bay. His only film I consider truly terrible, Pearl Harbor, was a war movie that got hijacked by the studio and implanted with a new writer (Randal Wallace, who's responsible for Braveheart) who took the original script and wrote a love story around it. They did this to try and ape the success of Titanic.
The result was a bloated mess that left the titular battle feeling like a completely separate and superior film inside a poorly written romance movie. They also were forced to tack the Dolittle Raid sequence on to resolve the film's romantic plot tumor, since the film originally ended with the end of the Pearl Harbor attack.
It's Pearl Harbor and Revenge of the Fallen that cause the Bay hate train, and it's funny since neither film's problems were his fault. Hell I even consider RotF largely salvaged considering the problems they had. At least that film was entertaining in the end. Pearl Harbor ranks with The Last Airbender as tied for first "Worst Movie of All Time" on my personal list.
SKYWARPED_128 wrote:I don't remember much of anything from the one time I watched Pearl Harbor, which probably says a lot about the movie. All in all, it was literally quite forgettable.
As for ROTF, it was a shame about the timing and the fact that Kurtzman and Orci decided to focus on Star Trek. Actually, it's infuriating, when you think about just how much potential it had.
But it's good to know that Bay actually tried to delay the filming for the good of the movie--in my book, that's responsible directorship, especially for someone who's known to be a bit of a workaholic. A pity Paramount refused to listen. The thing about being the director of a movie is that, besides the main actors, you're the face of the movie. And whatever bouquets or brickbats the movie earns is attributed the the director and the actors.
Capt.Failure wrote:SKYWARPED_128 wrote:I don't remember much of anything from the one time I watched Pearl Harbor, which probably says a lot about the movie. All in all, it was literally quite forgettable.
As for ROTF, it was a shame about the timing and the fact that Kurtzman and Orci decided to focus on Star Trek. Actually, it's infuriating, when you think about just how much potential it had.
But it's good to know that Bay actually tried to delay the filming for the good of the movie--in my book, that's responsible directorship, especially for someone who's known to be a bit of a workaholic. A pity Paramount refused to listen. The thing about being the director of a movie is that, besides the main actors, you're the face of the movie. And whatever bouquets or brickbats the movie earns is attributed the the director and the actors.
With film criticism becoming the kind of circlejerk you see on Reddit nowadays the so called "Single-man Fallacy" (the false belief that one person is responsible for a large problem caused by many) is trendy to use against Bay. Take for example Prometheus. It went through a complete rewrite with a pretty lousy writer and turned out be be a below par film. But critics love Ridley Scott, so he got a free pass and the writer took the blame.
Capt.Failure wrote:The trend on the cesspool that is Rotten Tomatoes is that Bay deserves nothing but negativity. Due to this if one of his films has issues for outlying reasons (writers, time and budget problems, etc) the blame will always fall on him and him alone. Hell, look at when that extra got hurt during Dark of the Moon's filming. People blamed Bay like he did it on purpose, lest we recall he didn't use the footage from that event in the final film. He repurposed chase scene footage from the Island to replace it. To me it says a lot about him that he wouldn't put that footage in, that he wouldn't want to profit off an event where someone got seriously hurt.
But not in the minds of mainstream and armchair critics. To them Bay can do no right because the hivemind says so.
-Kanrabat- wrote:I once said it and I'll say it again. The main problem with the movies is that they focused way too more on the humans. I can understand it for the first movie because we discover them (and I love Shia's act.) Unfortunately, there's way too much human slapstick in RotF and DotM. It feel like poor and cheap filler. Sure, these scenes were way less expensives to shoot than the scenes with the bots. Man, the bots do have personalities and feelings too. If you have to pad the movie, pad it with scenes that make us discover the and so that se care about them. This way, when a bot die, instead of doing "meh", we may actually feel something.
Also, it snowed two days ago. 30 cm of white ****. It's Bay's fault.
-Kanrabat- wrote:I once said it and I'll say it again. The main problem with the movies is that they focused way too more on the humans. I can understand it for the first movie because we discover them (and I love Shia's act.) Unfortunately, there's way too much human slapstick in RotF and DotM. It feel like poor and cheap filler. Sure, these scenes were way less expensives to shoot than the scenes with the bots. Man, the bots do have personalities and feelings too. If you have to pad the movie, pad it with scenes that make us discover the and so that se care about them. This way, when a bot die, instead of doing "meh", we may actually feel something.
Also, it snowed two days ago. 30 cm of white ****. It's Bay's fault.
TurboMMaster wrote:Actually, Kurtzman and Orci are good writes, after all, what they done with Transformers:Prime is a masterpice. Also, original script of RotF was far different from what we got, thanks to Michael Bay. I belive that the worst part of Bayformers is Michael Bay itself. The universe is intersting and have a lot of potential, however, Bay have some strange tendency to belive that he can do anything, and he can do it better. Pretty much all things fans hate in Bayformers are his personal ideas.
About Ironhide: I feel relief when he was killed, to be honest I think he should end killed in first movie, by Megatron. Mostly because when Autobots engade Megatron, Jazz should be already dead. Simply, when Brawl catch Jazz and thrown him away, he should tear Autobot apart instead.
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