The Energon Pub

I own a few repaints but for the most part I have been lucky enuff to get the original figures, like nekoman said if I didn't own cybertron evec I would get springer and I have always wanted a green seekers so I will be buying acid storm. Although I still might by springer because he comes with one of my favorite figures of all time cybertron sideways redone as ratbat.

Tekka wrote:

Dealer wrote:I saw you coming with that one from a million, bazillion, gazillion miles away

Couldn't have been that far. After reading the senseless bashing I almost didn't post at all.

Yeah man, I'm not bashing on purpose either. I'm just tossing out my opinion. I buy a lot of repaints, and if giving my opinion is somehow bashing, then we are all guilty, no matter how many times we may fill posts with comments about how we don't mean this in any negative way.

I love repaints. If I don't like the figure or the mold or the character or think the repaint is crappy I don't buy it. that's my philosophy. If someone else doesn't like that theory then they're welcome to not partake in it.

Some of the 'problem' about repaints I think stems from how we are collectors. If you are a completist, then you'd have to collect all the repaints and whatever in order to feel complete. If you're a collector that is still upset that G1 Ironhide 25 years ago didn't look like his cartoon counterpart then that's going to effect the way you collect. If you only love the movie figures then you don't see the point in spending big bucks for MISB G1s. Without trying to sound like I'm bashing here, what do we want? I have never cared for Arcee, and if they ever did produce a G1-styled Arcee figure, I wouldn't want it in the least. Hate the character, hate the toys we've had for her up til now, hate the complaining unceasing that the fandom engages in on her and other fembots' behalves. However, if the Arcee figure was just super awesome and I liked it, I'd buy it. At any rate, I'd be glad for Arcee fans who finally got what they wanted.

We all collect differently. None of us is doing it 'right', we're all just doing it our own ways. My way includes repaints, an absence of movie toys, and not a sealed box to be seen. Doesn't make me right, just makes me happy, and that's what matters to me.

Nekoman wrote:

Sowndwave76 wrote:I for one am of the mindset that the repaints for Sideswipe, Silverstreak, and if they do a Ratchet from Ironhide,
are AWESOME.

Then put a smile on your face cause they said at Botcon there will be a Ratchet repaint.

Sowndwave76 wrote:And please don't try and make the blanket statement that no one would've bought any of the Seekers now.
That has no validity whatsoever.

Logically someone would’ve bought them, so yes, but no one can say for sure since they were never released at mass retail. This being the case, anything could’ve happened, making it an valid statement.

Also, I’ll be surprised if we get another seeker in Universe, so we may have not seen Hasbro ever make the remaining seekers after the first in this line.

And when Acid Storm comes out I’d love to see how often he’ll be at the store, when he does come out he may be one of the worst self warmers we’ve seen in a while.

Did Hasbro reps. say that the Ratchet would be coming in these waves of Classics?

I'm not trying to argue in an agressive way,
but you saying that no one would buy any of those Seekers
is flat-out wrong,
and "anything could've happened", again, has little to no validity in your defense.
If Hasbro put out 1-2 now, and 1-2 later, they would've sold at least average.
I know there were probably some people who bought the Botcon set STRICTLY because of its exclusiveness and potential value.
But I'd say there were a lot more people who bought it that actually wanted those characters and wanted them enough to pay that high price.

And don't forget, no one is saying that Hasbro could or should release them in the same wave, or now, even in the same year!

I'd assume those with the Botcon set would be willing to spend $33 to buy them in stores over the course of a year+.

Then mix in these consumers:

--people (fans/collectors) who didn't get the Botcon set would probably buy one.
--people like me who would buy 2 of the figures they like.
--people who would buy them because they don't like some of the other figures.
--people who would buy them (even just one) to have more Decepticons in their Classics collection.

And for those who would be considered mass public consumers:

--first time buyers to the line or Transformers in general who don't have any Seeker figures.
--People who would buy them because they pass on more expensive figures.

That last point is almost the strongest imo... It's not like the Seekers are voyager class. If they were, I would NEVER expect Hasbro to make over 3 of them. Ever.

For a kid, or a parent of a kid, if they're going to buy a TF that's bigger than legends class,
$10 is waaay more appealing than $19.99.

For a kid who wants a plane or jet Transformer toy, but has parents who don't want to spend $24-$25.99 on an Ultra Powerglide or Silverbolt,
a $10 Seeker is a lot more realistic.

I'm not saying that the Seekers would've been in any way the best sellers, but to think no one would've bought them is just silly.

Cascadia wrote:I doIn other words, I do not mind repaints if they are entirely different characters. However, when it is the same character that is repainted several times that is when I draw the line.

I agree, though I do have a few character repaints that I didn't get the orginal version of(like Green Energon Ironhide for example). But I don't get the idea of repainting Prime into Magnus so many times. Yes the original was a white Prime, but he had armor and a new head to help hide that fact, and we never saw him without his armor in the show, so it was practically a new figure.

Oh, and I will be getting Acid Storm, because I missed out on both Magnus/Skywarp and Starscream when they were out, but someday I will pick both of all of them up though. Also, Seekers are cool, and it'll be nice having a "generic" seeker out there.

I dont' have either Hot Shot II or that size Starscream, so I will most definitely get Roadbuster and Dirge. Not sure about Springer/Ratbat(I have Sideways, but I just don't really see Ratbat in him), or Blaster, who is disapointing cause he doesn't have a new head.

RE: Classics Seekers

I'm only going to post this once more, so that it becomes legendary.

Tales will be told, stupid speculation will fade away like aged yellow newspaper, and man, bewildered by the stark contrast of reason to chaos will find G0d himself in the words:

CLASSICS, WAS OVER. DONE. FINISHED. There was to be no more. Both Hasbro and FunPub reps confirmed this. Never again was it to darken the door of the fandom. Classics was a primer for the movie line. FunPub was given the license to do the seeker and Classics in general in order to "Bookend" the series. It was a favor, a way to put closure to the series. Classics, was dead when the deal was made.

Now, the rabid love of the toys from not only collectors saved it. While hindsight might have seen the toys released, for all intents and purposes, there were to be no more Classics toys.

That's it. There isn't any more speculation on it. That's the word and the truth of the situation. Accept it at this point, or choke on the ridiculous ashes of your burned dreams.

Seriously people. Stop speculating as to why this all happened the way it did. Your answer is above. There's no more reason to speculate or perpetrate these armchair theories of what and why.

Just sit back, chill, and hope that small chance Takara makes the damn things for you pays off.

And for the love of God in Heaven, save your money, because even if Tak does release them, they will NOT be cheap.

Repaints are a double edged sword. On one hand repaints can make a mold look much better, like Ransack GTS. On the other hand if you buy an expensive leader class figure and later find out that it's getting a massively improved repaint that makes you regret buying the original. Like Cybertron Galvatron, or the movie premiums.

Nekoman wrote:

Liege Evilmus wrote:And since it happens for EVERY figure, it becomes very discouraging when the only thing new is what you already have.

Well, I own a Cybertron Sideways, but I don’t own a pink one so that’s new. I never was able to get a version of Cybertron Evac, so Springer will work well for me and I don’t own a green seeker from any line so Acid Storm is new.

You do bring up some good points however. I just don’t get what some people were expecting though, Hasbro had already said Sideswipe would be an altered Sunstreaker repaint, and if Silverstreak were to be made, why would Hasbro take the time to retool it, just to make it different from its G1 counterpart and therefore defeat the purpose of an G1 update.

Liege Evilmus wrote:It's discouraging, take things like the recent BotCon displays, those use to be new and exciting and you couldn't wait to see what was going to be new...

This year we got a handful of new molds, which aren't even out yet, but already have 2 or 3 color schemes waiting in the wings. Then the rest of the display is all stuff you most likely already have.

Yes, repaints of figures were shown before the original figure came out, but what’s the big surprise? Sideswipe and Silverstreak are both in wave three and Cliffjumper and Ramjet were also in wave three of original classics, so what’s the big deal here?

My only problem with this rebuttle is that your picking and choosing what part of the initial statment you'd like to address. Some of the points you argue, where covered in the initial stament, but got chopped out.

Still it doesn't change the fact that a new color scheme doesn't equil a new figure. I seriously can't expect Hasbro to issue 100 new molds a year. But I can ask them to stir the pot when we're on our 2nd, 3rd, 4th or more helping.

I buy what I like, so I tend to skip repaints, but it does get real boring seeing the same old thing in a fancey new package over and over again.

The only reason I can see for someone complaining about repaints is if the person is a rabid completist. For example, I once saw someone complaining on their blog that they'd just bought the Classics Constructicons, even though they already owned the earlier version of that mold AND DIDN'T LIKE IT. If you're that kind of collector, I can see why repaints are annoying but... really, it's your problem, not Hasbro's.

I think that some people are a little repainted out because of the movie line. Normally, you don't see 5 repaints of the same figure in one line. Or at least in that short of a time frame. Otherwise, I don't mind repaints at all. I think that the repaints we've been getting of the Cybertron figures look great. Check out Jetstorm! he's awesome. Also, the two repaints of Cybertron Evac that are coming out look fantastic.

I dont mind repaints......i just like 2 know in the future if they goin 2 repaint a figure just let me know like i love this year botcon cause i dont have 2 buy Animated BB but i can jus wait 4 the elite guard version 2 buy instead.

Sumtimes they can repaint a figure 2 death like the Crosswise, Evac and the any basics Molds.

Liege Evilmus wrote:My only problem with this rebuttle is that your picking and choosing what part of the initial statment you'd like to address. Some of the points you argue, where covered in the initial stament, but got chopped out.

Of course I’ll pick and chose what I’m addressing, reason being is because that was the only part of your post I wanted to respond to. I didn’t have anything to say in response to the rest of your post.

And I’m sorry if what I said was already addressed, I must have missed it.

Burn wrote:I stopped caring about the opinions of others when it comes to TF's a long time ago.

Nothing someone else says will change my mind from either liking, or disliking a figure.

Do I like repaints? If there's a reasonable amount of thought put into them as well as giving them decent characterisation.

For example, Cybertron Cannonball. A repaint of Cybertron Red Alert. Now the paint scheme in it's self is pretty good, but the characterisation just made it all the more better.

On the other end of the spectrum was the likes of the "Powerlink" repaints. Same characters, but they were supposed to be "upgraded" forms. Little to no effort was put into the characterisations, it was a simple slap a new coat of paint on 'em and pump 'em out.

Then you have the obligatory repaints of Optimus Prime into Ultra Magnus (with no trailer armour) and/or Nemesis Prime. Great idea first time round, maybe even the second, but after the 4th time it gets pretty boring.

my thoughts exactally I hate those powerlinx crap.

Nekoman wrote:

Dagon wrote:How can you damn repaints, and then cry for the other Seekers and Silverstreak and Smokescreen and Bluestreak?

And this is the main reason I’m here. This is what I don’t understand.

People cry blasphemy at Hasbro for making the seekers Botcon exclusives, yet those same people will bash another repaint into the ground.

Big double standard there.

There's no double standard. Those are 2 separate complaints.

I don't think anyone is totally against repaints. We've all come to expect it. But there's times when it should be done, and times where it's just excessive.

The Universe line seems really junked up with repaints. I'm glad they're doing Silverstreak and Sideswipe and Ratchet, but some of the older molds they're bringing in are pointless, and just clash with the style.

People make the argument that repaints help pay for more new molds. Yet when a line is a big hit, you get more repaints than ever. Haven't those molds already paid for themselves several times over? At that point, I don't think they're going to reward us with any more new molds than usual, I just think someone's getting a big bonus this year.

Bumblethumper wrote:

Nekoman wrote:

Dagon wrote:How can you damn repaints, and then cry for the other Seekers and Silverstreak and Smokescreen and Bluestreak?

And this is the main reason I’m here. This is what I don’t understand.

People cry blasphemy at Hasbro for making the seekers Botcon exclusives, yet those same people will bash another repaint into the ground.

Big double standard there.

There's no double standard. Those are 2 separate complaints.

I don't think anyone is totally against repaints. We've all come to expect it. But there's times when it should be done, and times where it's just excessive.

The Universe line seems really junked up with repaints. I'm glad they're doing Silverstreak and Sideswipe and Ratchet, but some of the older molds they're bringing in are pointless, and just clash with the style.

People make the argument that repaints help pay for more new molds. Yet when a line is a big hit, you get more repaints than ever. Haven't those molds already paid for themselves several times over? At that point, I don't think they're going to reward us with any more new molds than usual, I just think someone's getting a big bonus this year.

What better way to make money from repaints?

I thought Universe was crap, and the Allspark Line-ups were absolutely agonizing. But I still buy them.. as I usually miss out on the original lines.

Mr O wrote:What better way to make money from repaints?

Oh yeah, and what better time!

It just puts a minor dent in the whole theory that they 'have to do repaints' to justify the expense of a new mold.

As long as the repaint looks good, has a different character and the original mold was good there is a good chance I'll buy it. Other straight up repaints of the same character I am quite happy to skip.

I'm glad that we often find out whether or not repaints are coming out before the first original figure is released, as it gives me a chance to pick and choose. I waited for Cybertron Dark Crumplezone instead of getting the original because it was a much nicer looking toy.

I'm sure there are many collectors who may have jumped on after the movie who would be very glad to get their hands on some of these great figures that are getting repainted, so it's good in a way that they can get them.

The same can be said for the Allspark line, its a terrible line of repaints, as the figures look more or less the same, but for those who missed out on the original figures it's great.

If you dont like the repaint, dont buy it, I'm sure someone else will.

Nothing at all. I for one, love repaints. 9 times out of ten people always say "phak, I wish I didn't have the original. This one is so much better" and they are usually right.

Personally, I love Prime repaints into Magnus. So many repaints just make a great mold even better.

Except Override GTS. The mould sucks. No excuse for that one

I really wasn’t expecting this, but it seems most people DO like repaints, in a sense I didn’t think that many people even cared about them.

Makes me as someone who loves repaints feel good.

Counterpunch wrote:RE: Classics Seekers

I'm only going to post this once more, so that it becomes legendary.

Tales will be told, stupid speculation will fade away like aged yellow newspaper, and man, bewildered by the stark contrast of reason to chaos will find G0d himself in the words:

CLASSICS, WAS OVER. DONE. FINISHED. There was to be no more. Both Hasbro and FunPub reps confirmed this. Never again was it to darken the door of the fandom. Classics was a primer for the movie line. FunPub was given the license to do the seeker and Classics in general in order to "Bookend" the series. It was a favor, a way to put closure to the series. Classics, was dead when the deal was made.

Now, the rabid love of the toys from not only collectors saved it. While hindsight might have seen the toys released, for all intents and purposes, there were to be no more Classics toys.

That's it. There isn't any more speculation on it. That's the word and the truth of the situation. Accept it at this point, or choke on the ridiculous ashes of your burned dreams.

Seriously people. Stop speculating as to why this all happened the way it did. Your answer is above. There's no more reason to speculate or perpetrate these armchair theories of what and why.

Just sit back, chill, and hope that small chance Takara makes the damn things for you pays off.

And for the love of God in Heaven, save your money, because even if Tak does release them, they will NOT be cheap.

I don't think people are questioning or arguing what
Hasbro's statement was about the "end" of Classics.

I wish there was a better way than bold type to emphasize that "end".
Look at where we are now.
And I understand the movie line has given a lot of flex for the company to branch out.
But if there was truly no breath of potential left in Classics,
why are we getting more?
Why have Hasbro already stated that after TF2 toys we would see a return of Classics and Universe?
I don't think there's a lot of reason for them to build up false hope,
and I also don't think they would've had a problem with saying something like, "After TF2 toys, there's no guarantee we'll get back to Classics/Universe."

My arguments are based on this:

Those 3 Seekers, if released with a little common sense, would sell good enough for being repaints.

Hasbro was stupid in making their initial decision for the Botcon set, whether or not Classics was suppose to be dead.
Would those people have their complete set? No.
Not yet.
My previous argument would've solved this for EVERYONE interested.

So was it stupid of them to not wait to see how much kickback of interest would be generated from the movie,
or because original G1 characters should never be released as exclusives?

Either way.

With or without the movie, why would you think that characters that started this whole business would never ever have the potential of coming back?

I wrote a big response to this subject which my dozy computer lost. I'll sum it up by saying you like what you like, never mind the rest. Certain repaints have given me the chance to get figures I wanted and probably couldn't have gotten otherwise. Certain repaints have nurtured interest in molds I didn't care about before, Cybertron Swerve for example. If you like it, get it. There's a lot going on and there is no yes or no answer to repaints, they've been with us since day one and they're here to stay.

Counterpunch wrote:RE: Classics Seekers

CLASSICS, WAS OVER. DONE. FINISHED. There was to be no more. Both Hasbro and FunPub reps confirmed this. Never again was it to darken the door of the fandom.

I don't see how you can make a solid argument for the end of any line when it comes to repaints.

We're still getting repaints from Armada and tons from Cybertron.

Personally I don't mind all the repaints. If there's a figure I liked the first time, and I like the new colors on the repaint, I may buy it. Like Cybertron Undermine, I liked the mold when I bought it, but when I saw the Repugnus colors, I liked it even more and bought that one. Then there's times where I go to buy one version, like Cybertron Crumplezone, and end up buying the other, Dark Crumplezone, because I thought it looked better. I'm among the people who'll probably be buying the Inferno/Red Alert repaint when it comes out cause I like the colors better than the original. Also, I'm hoping to buy the Wingblade/Wing Saber repaint because I missed the figure the first time. Finally, I get figures like Armada/Cybertron Blurr. I loved the Armada version so I bought the Cybertron one. I hate the fact that it has to hold its guns instead of holding them in the holes in its arms because my figure's hands aren't tight enough to keep them on.

Bumblethumper wrote:

Counterpunch wrote:RE: Classics Seekers

CLASSICS, WAS OVER. DONE. FINISHED. There was to be no more. Both Hasbro and FunPub reps confirmed this. Never again was it to darken the door of the fandom.

I don't see how you can make a solid argument...

Then you didn't read the whole post.

...actually I did. I fully accept the way events turned out.

I don't see that there was anything to stop them dumping seeker repaints into some of the various succeeding lines in the years after the end of classics. In much the way that we're still getting Armada repaints in the Allspark line.

I don't see that there's any mold from the past few years that you can point to and definitively say that we've seen the last of it.