The Energon Pub

It's funny how everyone is posting this variations of this sentence when replying to Conceptron..

"Just because you have a personal preference towards another director it does not mean you go and start some online campaign."

or

"Just because you didn't doesn't mean people have to validate their own opinions"

Quite a few replies like that.. wonder if that means anything?

Conceptron wrote:Guys, I am not trying to force an opinion on anybody, but when guys start talking about how great Bayformers was...I just have to bite back. Because after watching Bayformers, I couldn't believe that as a FILM, a FILM...it was that bad.

Actually, yes...yes you are. You don't like it fine, that I can accept. Please don't try to "correct" others with your viewpoint, and then use sloppy research to back up your arguements. Because a good film is in the eye of the beholder. There are a LOT of people who love Rocky, who love Godfather, and Apocalypse Now. I CANNOT STAND these movies, for the life of me they are living hell. I'm not going to try and correct others to my viewpoint, because I know I'm in the minority.

I have taken filmmaking classes and many friends I know are filmmakers who have gone to film school, so I have a basic idea of what makes a good film. Bayformers, based on the knowledge I have, was a BAD film.

I know someone whose graduated from film school who likes Transformers, who doesn't think is a BAD movie. Which one of you is correct?

Conceptron wrote:I have taken filmmaking classes and many friends I know are filmmakers who have gone to film school, so I have a basic idea of what makes a good film. Bayformers, based on the knowledge I have, was a BAD film.

Meh. A self proclaimed artist. You will not be able to enjoy much with that idea. That you know what is going on and the people who make it dont. When I go to see a movie. Its not to look for every imperfection, its to enjoy myself. Truth is you have no real power to go with this knowledge. And you and all your friends together with all their classes and so called degrees couldnt touch what Bay did. Whats worse is that you are going to see the sequel and it will just be to claim " I just want to see how bad it is going to be". Im not a bay fan, believe me. But youve got to give the devil his due.

Conceptron wrote: I really didn't think he would subject me to his cheesy slo-mo shots and his ANNOYING editing and quick cuts to ensure that you can't follow the story.

I liked His slow mo shots, and the quick editing. The slow mo let me enjoy the detail, the quick cuts kept the pace of the movie. The downside to that was the shaky camera.

Conceptron wrote:BAY OUT, SPIELBERG IN

Honestly the title for your thread is misleading.

I have taken filmmaking classes and many friends I know are filmmakers who have gone to film school, so I have a basic idea of what makes a good film. Bayformers, based on the knowledge I have, was a BAD film.

No, you have a basic idea of what makes a film. It's
your idea of a good movie.

All in all, Bay should not be allowed to make movies. I sincerely hope Spielberg can come onboard to save this movie.

Judging by Michael Bay's past box office numbers I would have to disagree. He's done quite well for himself his movies appeal to the masses and make money. You will never see an indie small budget movie from Michael Bay. It's not his "genre". I think he fits well with the TF series and look forward to the sequel.

This topic is now officially lame... I have decided to stop watching it...

9 pages of garbage, and I helped contribute to it I feel dirty.

Ah well, he'll start another up.

Conceptron wrote:I have taken filmmaking classes and many friends I know are filmmakers who have gone to film school, so I have a basic idea of what makes a good film. Bayformers, based on the knowledge I have, was a BAD film.

Doesn't mean anything, other then some personal opinions of buddies.

This is like a few college graphic artist buddies saying how the RID/Armada/Energon animations were crap and they have experience in drawing, and because of that, we should all take their word for it that the designs are garbage.

Conceptron wrote:A bad film is a bad film. People can just say success is solely based on money made which I cannot agree on. But this Bayformers will not be remembered in the same way that T2 was remembered. Why? Because Bay is a rubbish director and should not be allowed to make anymore movies. He will run Transformers to the ground and make the sequels worse and worse.

No. You want to see someone running a series into the ground? READ EVERY LAST WORD OF EVERY LAST ARTICLE: http://www.startrek.com/startrek/view/s ... index.html

nugget wrote:I liked His slow mo shots, and the quick editing. The slow mo let me enjoy the detail, the quick cuts kept the pace of the movie. The downside to that was the shaky camera.

The shaky camera was a good effect sometimes, though.

Conceptron wrote:A bad film is a bad film. People can just say success is solely based on money made which I cannot agree on. But this Bayformers will not be remembered in the same way that T2 was remembered. Why? Because Bay is a rubbish director and should not be allowed to make anymore movies. He will run Transformers to the ground and make the sequels worse and worse.

I still don't know what this damn Bayformers movie that you keep harping on is. And I'm sorry that you did'nt like it.

The "Transformer" movie was a very entertaining movie to a lot of people and many of those people would like the franchise to continue on it's present course. You can have your opinion of what you think a "good movie" is and we can have ours, but you call us crazy and basically insinuate that we don't know squat about movies because "you have taken some film classes", well guess what I've played with google maps before so I think I'm qualified enough to go be a programmer with google now by your logic.

Conceptron wrote:Nah, I ripped mainly into Megan Fox, who I believe should not be in the acting profession because her performance was embarrassingly awful.

this statement is pretty close to truth?

Do you guys REALLY want Bay to return for a sequel? Really. When you have Spielberg as an option, would you still want Bay back? Remember, with its success, Bay wont have to listen to the fans and can put as many jokes into the movie as possible.

Conceptron wrote:Gosh, it pisses me off that I can't really reach you guys. Why do you guys have to settle for tripe like this...TF and you guys deserve better. View it as cheap entertainment, then you are happy...anything else, and it's complete garbage. Read the critic reviews that were negative...read the points they make. The very foundations of what make a good film are not evident or not done well in Bayformers. PLease, you can't walk away from that film and call it either good or okay.

Oh thank you oh wise one for saving me from enjoying a movie. From now on i will always listen to what snotty nosed, narrow minded critics say about a movie before i see it, regardless of wether or not i have been waiting and looking forward to said movie for 20 or so years.

I will completely ignore the fact that i enjoy Micheal Bay action movies and the fact that Transformers was an action packed thrill-fest and the perfect summer blockbuster movie which pays great homage to its original source material and has been enjoyed by most fans of the fandom, as well as non fans alike and has made hundreds of millions of dollars at the box office.

Note: The above comment is 100% sarcastic, and conceptron is an idiot

Conceptron wrote:Do you guys REALLY want Bay to return for a sequel? Really. When you have Spielberg as an option, would you still want Bay back? Remember, with its success, Bay wont have to listen to the fans and can put as many jokes into the movie as possible.

I like the jokes.

And yes, I want Bay to come back.

Well, here is the problem. If guys will have such low standards for a movie, then Bay can always have a place. It's sad that you cannot see that Bayformers had a poor story and plot.

Conceptron wrote:Do you guys REALLY want Bay to return for a sequel? Really. When you have Spielberg as an option, would you still want Bay back? Remember, with its success, Bay wont have to listen to the fans and can put as many jokes into the movie as possible.

In case you can't tell because you seem to not really read peoples responses to you, the general concensus is Yes we want Bay to come back.

There are those that may want another director, but in this particular thread we all seem to be of the same opinion. It differs from your opinion but it does not make us any less of a True Fan.

Conceptron wrote:Do you guys REALLY want Bay to return for a sequel? Really. When you have Spielberg as an option, would you still want Bay back? Remember, with its success, Bay wont have to listen to the fans and can put as many jokes into the movie as possible.

Yes, we do. So long story short....DEAL WITH IT

Conceptron wrote:Well, here is the problem. If guys will have such low standards for a movie, then Bay can always have a place. It's sad that you cannot see that Bayformers had a poor story and plot.

Who are you to tell me what the quality of my standards are? Seriously?

Why does Conceptron have to start a new thread everytime he wants to complain about the movie? At this point in time, now that basically every fan has seen the movie, no one opinion is more important than the rest to the point of deserving its own thread. That's why we put a big sticky at the top for reviews, everybody gets a post, not an entire thread to themselves.

As for Spielberg, I think keeping him as exec. producer is best. That way he can give his creative input (which has a habit of saving otherwise mediocre movies, see: Revenge of the Sith) without having to exhaust himself with directing. Besides, some of the recent Spielberg-directed films have been as great as they could have been, considering Spielberg's amazing track record. (War of the Worlds was very dissapointing)

I still want Spielberg involved in the film - he does great things. I'm sure he had something to do with that Autobot-landing sequence, the way it was handled, it's so Spielberg...

I would prefer Spielberg directing, but if Bay signs on for no.2, I won't complain - after movie no.1, he's earned the right to continue with Transformers.

Conceptron wrote:I have taken filmmaking classes and many friends I know are filmmakers who have gone to film school, so I have a basic idea of what makes a good film. Bayformers, based on the knowledge I have, was a BAD film.

Dude, if this is true why don't you in turn realize that you should be focusing more of the blame on the screenplay writers.

A lot of your arguments are related to what you consider a crappy story and plot. This can't be completely thrown on Michael Bay. If you hate the overall plot of the story, wouldn't you hate the movie just as much if someone else directed it?

Conceptron, grow up.

I'm not saying that this first live-action film was perfect, but it was better than I thought it was going to be.

If you really care about improving the next one, then maybe you should have topics that truly address the small issues in the first film that brought it down in your eyes instead of just stating that Bay needs to go.

Are you the master of cinema? Do you have the final word in deciding who will be directing a film?

The answer is no. If Bay returns for the next one, then he returns. The best thing for us as TF fans to do would be to use our time and resources to try and get our opinions to Bay and Co. in a civilized and non-threatening manner.

I don't like Bay films, but that is because I enjoy films that aren't action like other people who have posted in this thread do. Therefore, I can see and understand why other people do enjoy Bay films, in general, but why not state what needs to be improved upon for the next one.

1.) The TFs need more character development and screen-time (especially the Decepticons)

2.) We need to have correct camera angles that don't require the viewers to have hawk-like eyesight to decipher who is doing what to whom.

The only other issue I had with this film, which I knew a year ago was Megs and SS's designs, but there is nothing that I can do about that because this isn't my film.

This is what we should be doing on this forum, but instead we get threads about people complaining that the film wasn't what they would have done or some other director instead of Bay would have done.

Tough Luck!

Conceptron wrote:Well, here is the problem. If guys will have such low standards for a movie, then Bay can always have a place. It's sad that you cannot see that Bayformers had a poor story and plot.

Woah don't say things like that

Everybody is different. Its your opinion that Bay is horrible

Hell we all thought that when we first seen what the characters looked like but the story made us over look such things

By saying things like this your asking to be flamed and there will be more negatvity torwards you.

Conceptron wrote:It's sad that you cannot see that Bayformers had a poor story and plot.

I know it had a poor story and little to no plot.

Sounds suprisingly similar to the G1 cartoon actually.

And yet I still enjoyed both immensley.

Burn wrote:

Conceptron wrote:It's sad that you cannot see that Bayformers had a poor story and plot.

I know it had a poor story and little to no plot.

Sounds suprisingly similar to the G1 cartoon actually.

And yet I still enjoyed both immensley.

After all the hype I think I want to see this "bayformers" movie. I wonder if it holds up to the recent Transformers one. Or if its like transmorphers.

damn, I read the thread title, and thought it meant bay was out of the sequal.


to be honest, i think bay did alright, better then I expected anyway, i would have liked some things to be different, but overall, it kicked ass, and whining isn't going to fix anything anyway, movie's made, out, and seen

A few people have already pointed it out, but if you feel the movie has a poor plot, character development, etc... that falls on the screenwriters, as opposed to Bay. While it is true he can set a direction, and give major plot points, he's not the one writing the characters. And, as far as how they're developed, some people don't care for it, but others have been inspired to write stories about the characters and this universe, and these are people I've known who've never ventured into fan fiction before. So, some people disagree with that assessment.

As far as having a film school education, that statement usually makes me LESS inclined to listen to an opinion. For one, it doesn't make your opinion of the film any more or less valid. For another, that education really changes the way a person sees a movie. My fiancee has a BFA in illustration, and while I can just look at a piece of art and say, "That's really cool", she'll notice problems with anatomy, perspective, etc. that escape my attention. On the other hand, because of my English and writing courses, I sometimes find books with bad technical writing difficult to get into, while other folks can just let the plot take over. As most film students will study for years on every aspect of a film, from lighting to editing to sound, they tend to view film the same way. They rarely can see the forest for the trees. I once had a friend who couldn't get into a movie because they saw a boom mic shadow in the first few minutes.

Plus, let's be honest here... if you don't like Michael Bay, you're not going to like this movie. In fact, you're going to pick him apart and catch every small mistake in the movie. Most of the negative reviews I've read, fan or professional, usually preface with some sort of comment about their personal opinions on Bay. How fair is that going to be?

And, again back on topic here... Spielberg WON'T be available to do Transformers 2. He's only just now filming Indy 4, and will likely be working on postproduction about the same time as Transformers 2 starts serious pre-production.