The Energon Pub

KoH4711 wrote:

Plus, let's be honest here... if you don't like Michael Bay, you're not going to like this movie. In fact, you're going to pick him apart and catch every small mistake in the movie. Most of the negative reviews I've read, fan or professional, usually preface with some sort of comment about their personal opinions on Bay. How fair is that going to be?

This is where we have this big issue. The way Bay has gone about making his movies cannot be considered filmmaking. There shouldn't be a group of people who say Bay is good and others who do not. As far as FILMMAKING goes, Bay is one of the worst out there. We have to look at things objectively and without these opinions.

I did give Bay a chance in the hope that he would at least try to pay some attention in executing a story well and having some good characters. In the end, it did not happen.

I simply have to make it my endeavour to TRY and ensure that Bay does not return for a sequel and make ILM's superior work be mixed with such rubbish.

Conceptron wrote:As far as FILMMAKING goes, Bay is one of the worst out there. We have to look at things objectively and without these opinions.

This is an opinion.

Do you honestly get tired of typing the same crap over and over and over. We get it YOU DON'T LIKE BAY, give it a damn rest. And your argument is nonsense, Bay did not write the script, he was the director. Don't like the plot, blame the writers. You sound like a moron going on the way you do. You don't like the movie, good for you, you've had your say. Now WE DON"T GIVE A DAMN. Just knock off the trolling, eh.

Oh, and I'm sure you're gonna keep this up til this thread gets locked so:

Conceptron wrote: I simply have to make it my endeavour to TRY and ensure that Bay does not return for a sequel and make ILM's superior work be mixed with such rubbish.

If that what it takes for you to stop posting crap threads and repeating yourself with asenine comments without even really "saying" anything, then be my guest. It will give you something else to occupy your time with.

blah... your falling into your own circle of logic.

You've completely failed to respect anyone elses opinion but your own. And it's become painfully obvious that your distaste alone for a specific movie director is blinding any attempt you could have at carrying on a constructive argument against the film. But by all means keep making an ass our of yourself. That would seem to be your goal, since you keep coming back to the same transparent arguments. Bravo...

Conceptron wrote:You guys are just so happy to see Transformers done well in Live Action form that you see past Bay's horrendous directing and the poor plot. Watch it again, and it SUCKS! It's all about those bots. Bayformers is a big THUMBS DOWN! Keep the jokes well away....

I am in this camp. While I don't think the film sucked, because I don't...it left me just very let down.

I did not care so much about the designs, I kind of accepted them, and I still do. But I was very hyped, and I forgot: this is a Michael Bay film. I should have known better.

That said, Bay has talent, but Peter Jackson or Spielberg would have been MUCH better choices for director (IMHO). They would have brought more magic to the screen, and made it more about, I dunno...the TFs, perhaps?

Conceptron wrote: I simply have to make it my endeavour to TRY and ensure that Bay does not return for a sequel and make ILM's superior work be mixed with such rubbish.

Sounds like a threat to me.

Conceptron wrote: This is where we have this big issue. The way Bay has gone about making his movies cannot be considered filmmaking. There shouldn't be a group of people who say Bay is good and others who do not. As far as FILMMAKING goes, Bay is one of the worst out there. We have to look at things objectively and without these opinions.

I did give Bay a chance in the hope that he would at least try to pay some attention in executing a story well and having some good characters. In the end, it did not happen.

I simply have to make it my endeavour to TRY and ensure that Bay does not return for a sequel and make ILM's superior work be mixed with such rubbish.

Same BS, different day.

So its your "endeavour" now is it? So what are you gonna do, assassinate Bay or something? Heh, i bet you was one of those idiots that sent him a death threat.

And i like how you call what he does isnt film making, i would like to know in that case what it is he does? If directing countless blockbusters that do nothing but entertain and make people laugh and make money for the film studios isnt film making then what is?

You say youve taken classes in film making, which means your a snotty nosed academic type who thinks he is right and everyone else is wrong because you have a piece of **** piece of paper "officially" stating that you have taken said class. You think you are qualified in this field and thus what you say is made out of pure gold and not the bullshit that we all see spewing from your keyboard.

Truth is (and this isnt based on my personal opinion but basic facts based on the level of comments you have received from people who DISAGREE with you) you havnt got a clue and you are mearly biased against bay because he has had so much succes with an art form and style that you PERSONALLY do not like. Thats from the film-making standpoint, from a Transformers fan standpoint i am lost as to how a person who calls them self a "fan" can be so negative about this movie that has given us loads of elements that we loved from the original show and characters and turned it all into a revamped, 2007 live action summer blockbuster with a kickass new toyline and has opened up the window for a whole NEW generation of Transformer fans.

So, in conclusion: You are wasting your time with this stupid, unsubstanciated "debate" and it really all boils down to a fanboy on a stupid anger-filled ranting ego parade.

my two cents again...

I'll agree that Bay isn't the best director around. I'm convinced alot of the parts in the movie I liked may be because of Spielberg's creative influence.

Could we have gotten a better film? Yes, indeed.

Could we have gotten worse? Yes!

Sure, it's no "Batman Begins"... but don't treat it like it's "Batman and Robin" either.

Concepi, why don't you just forget about it? You didn't like it, and you've complained about it a million times. We get the point. It's not like you're loosing any sleep over it... You... still sleep at night, right?

(edited for lack of patience with this stubborn fanboy)

Okay, so who wants to help me get a petition going to get this little troll removed from here?


seriously whats with all the hate? Relax dude, its a fun movie to watch. Sure that doesn't make it well written or well directed, but whoe really cares if the cinematography and the plot are amazing, if the movie is boring as hell who the f*** cares?

relax, and just stop trying to defend your self, because everything you're using basically boils down to "you hate bay"

Sonray wrote:

Conceptron wrote: This is where we have this big issue. The way Bay has gone about making his movies cannot be considered filmmaking. There shouldn't be a group of people who say Bay is good and others who do not. As far as FILMMAKING goes, Bay is one of the worst out there. We have to look at things objectively and without these opinions.

I did give Bay a chance in the hope that he would at least try to pay some attention in executing a story well and having some good characters. In the end, it did not happen.

I simply have to make it my endeavour to TRY and ensure that Bay does not return for a sequel and make ILM's superior work be mixed with such rubbish.

Same BS, different day.

So its your "endeavour" now is it? So what are you gonna do, assassinate Bay or something? Heh, i bet you was one of those idiots that sent him a death threat.

And i like how you call what he does isnt film making, i would like to know in that case what it is he does? If directing countless blockbusters that do nothing but entertain and make people laugh and make money for the film studios isnt film making then what is?

You say youve taken classes in film making, which means your a snotty nosed academic type who thinks he is right and everyone else is wrong because you have a piece of **** piece of paper "officially" stating that you have taken said class. You think you are qualified in this field and thus what you say is made out of pure gold and not the bullshit that we all see spewing from your keyboard.

Truth is (and this isnt based on my personal opinion but basic facts based on the level of comments you have received from people who DISAGREE with you) you havnt got a clue and you are mearly biased against bay because he has had so much succes with an art form and style that you PERSONALLY do not like. Thats from the film-making standpoint, from a Transformers fan standpoint i am lost as to how a person who calls them self a "fan" can be so negative about this movie that has given us loads of elements that we loved from the original show and characters and turned it all into a revamped, 2007 live action summer blockbuster with a kickass new toyline and has opened up the window for a whole NEW generation of Transformer fans.

So, in conclusion: You are wasting your time with this stupid, unsubstanciated "debate" and it really all boils down to a fanboy on a stupid anger-filled ranting ego parade.

Makking loads of people laugh and making lots of money does not make you a good filmmaker. To be a good filmmaker is an actual specific talent that guys like Spielberg, Kubrick, Stone, Scorcese and Lee have. Unfortunately, Bay falls WAAAAAY off this line. All because he can have his quick cuts and unecessary use of slo-mo's does not make him an 'auteur' or a filmmaker. Like that dumb scene with the model in a blue dress that Ironhide leaps over. Surely, you can't get dumber than that.

SPIELBERG IN, BAY OUT

P.S. Bay, I am begging you. Please don't sign that contract to do more sequels...I beg you!

Conceptron wrote:Makking loads of people laugh and making lots of money does not make you a good filmmaker. To be a good filmmaker is an actual specific talent that guys like Spielberg, Kubrick, Stone, Scorcese and Lee have. Unfortunately, Bay falls WAAAAAY off this line. All because he can have his quick cuts and unecessary use of slo-mo's does not make him an 'auteur' or a filmmaker. Like that dumb scene with the model in a blue dress that Ironhide leaps over. Surely, you can't get dumber than that.

That's your opinion, and you're entitled to it.

You didn't like the movie. We get that. It could have been better. We get that too.

Do you get though that people have a different taste to you? Do you get that people liked and enjoyed the movie and that their opinion is relevant as much as yours?

You know, if the "haters" of this movie simply accepted that there are opinions different to theirs then maybe there wouldn't be so much hostility. Instead most (most, not all) of these "haters" seem intent on ramming their opinions down the throats of others and insulting others like it's their right to do so.

Sorry kids, no opinion is right, no opinion is wrong.

You like it.
You didn't like it.

No need to insult those who think otherwise or force your views down their throats.

If you feel the need to do otherwise then don't be suprised when people insult in return.

Head Shot wrote:(edited for lack of patience with this stubborn fanboy)

Okay, so who wants to help me get a petition going to get this little troll removed from here?

i'll sign it.

Sonray wrote:

Head Shot wrote:(edited for lack of patience with this stubborn fanboy)

Okay, so who wants to help me get a petition going to get this little troll removed from here?

i'll sign it.

Me too.

Night Raid wrote:

Sonray wrote:

Head Shot wrote:(edited for lack of patience with this stubborn fanboy)

Okay, so who wants to help me get a petition going to get this little troll removed from here?

i'll sign it.

Me too.

Let's have none of this, please. Although he continues to rant with his dislike of Bay and his absent-mindedness that he isn't the only individual with an opinion, we have to keep in mind that he is still allowed to post his opinions even if they are drivel and narrow-minded as long as he doesn't break any rules and, even then, it is up to Ryan and the fantastic crew of Seibertron to deal with the situation.

All right. If he keeps his ranting confined to one thread, he can do as he pleases.

Predaprince wrote:

Night Raid wrote:

Sonray wrote:

Head Shot wrote:(edited for lack of patience with this stubborn fanboy)

Okay, so who wants to help me get a petition going to get this little troll removed from here?

i'll sign it.

Me too.

Let's have none of this, please. Although he continues to rant with his dislike of Bay and his absent-mindedness that he isn't the only individual with an opinion, we have to keep in mind that he is still allowed to post his opinions even if they are drivel and narrow-minded as long as he doesn't break any rules and, even then, it is up to Ryan and the fantastic crew of Seibertron to deal with the situation.

I wasn't being totally serious... but if it was gonna get worse I'd get a list going and then submit it to seibertron, and let him decide.

I'm assuming that it's not possible to just ignore a specific users posts on this forum? I was trying to figure that out, but couldn't seem to find any appropriate settings.

Wow. This stuff is still going on? I thought it would have died down by now.

Was there stuff about the movie that was good? Yes.
Was there stuff about the movie that sucked out loud? Absolutely.

Both sides are right on many counts.

It's out, it's over for now. Hopefully we'll get more characterization of the TFs themselves(It WAS nice to get that 10 seconds of Megatron/Starscream in the movie...here's looking foward to more fleshing out of the bots) and less "Were you...masturbating?" in the sequel (Yes, admitedly I was a hater on the movie for many reasons...but at the same time was happy to see them on the big screen again).

Personally, I have a distaste for Michael Bay and his movies...but he's who we've got, folks. Personal feelings aside, let's just remember that it's TRANSFORMERS. We all love Transformers(at least I ASSUME that's why we've all signed up here) in it's many incarnations, so let's all just suck it up and support the franchise we're all here to enjoy.

Blackout wrote:

Conceptron wrote:I have taken filmmaking classes and many friends I know are filmmakers who have gone to film school, so I have a basic idea of what makes a good film. Bayformers, based on the knowledge I have, was a BAD film.

Please. That doesn't make your opinion any more valid than the opinions of others here. Quoting that you are going to film school means nothing; to wit, you may be lying, we don't know how well (or bad) you are doing, we do not know the quality of the course or the type of information you are receiving. The moral of this little story is, don't quote crap like this. The only valid statement you can make is "in your opinion".

So far, you have not proven how Bay is a bad director (and I might add, ignored a very very important fact with Michael Bay [and the movie itself]), so really, all your arguments boil down to is something subjective. The movie is not objectively bad or good - it's just what is to the viewer. Any attempt to get between the viewer and 'art' is a futile effort (and for someone who is supposedly a film student, a strange thing to do). At the moment, all you are doing is showing how much a snob you are. I could go on about how I've been published, how I am mainly interested in German and Russian cinema, etc etc. But since I know that my views on Transformers are entirely personal, I have the politeness to simply not force my beliefs down others' throats.

Exactly. Going to film school or whatever doesnt make his points more valid than others. Its like someone who has graduated from art school thinks they are better than EVERYONE just because they have a diploma and a snotty nosed attitude, despite the fact that they may indeed suck at art and someone who hasnt taken an art class in their life can totally own them when it comes to raw skill.

Just because you have an academic background doesnt make your opinions, or you as an individual, more important than other peoples.

Again i ask if what Bay does isnt film making, then what is it? As usuall conception or whatever his name is failed to answer the important question.

Conceptron wrote:

Robinson wrote:

Conceptron wrote:Gosh, it pisses me off that I can't really reach you guys. Why do you guys have to settle for tripe like this...TF and you guys deserve better. View it as cheap entertainment, then you are happy...anything else, and it's complete garbage. Read the critic reviews that were negative...read the points they make. The very foundations of what make a good film are not evident or not done well in Bayformers. PLease, you can't walk away from that film and call it either good or okay.

Once again. What is this "Bayformers" you speak of?

Bayformers was the rubbish I was subjected to for 2 hours. The bad comedy, and weak plot. Again? THE BAD COMEDY AND WEAK PLOT. Film was BAD, B.A.D....BAD. BAY IS A RUBBISH DIRECTOR WHO GETS TROUNCED BY CRITICS WHO KNOW ABOUT THE ART OF MAKING FILM.

This is TRANFORMERS you're speaking about! They never were meant to be a story along the lines of "Shawshank Redemption" or other great films. It will never be in the AFI's top 100 list of all time great films. But it probably might make the top 100 of sci-fi films. Probably. But if you just sit back and watch the movie for what it is then you might actually have fun with it. That's what it was... a FUN and ENTERTAINING movie. Nothing more!!

G1 Transfomer cartoons were nothing more than a 25 minute commercial for the toy line. Did you really expect this movie to flush out some serious character development?! You set your sights waaaayyyy to high for this flick.

My $0.02: I loved it. I had my reservations about the character designs and development like everyone else. But I realized that this was a different continuity and went in with that idea in mind. And walked out very satisfied!


B-)

Let's give credit were credit is due: With his degree in film making, Conceptron could have a part to play in the next movie...

Those BK Kidz-Meal toys are not going to sell themselves.

Me_Grimlock_King wrote:Wow. This stuff is still going on? I thought it would have died down by now.

Yup, and it was requested that the crap stop but since no one can listen I am locking this down.

Conceptron it does not matter how many film classes you or anyone you know took it is your OPINION.
You are entitled to your OPINION.
Others are entitled to their OPINIONS.

As long as there is some sort of mutual respect then things are ok, HOWEVER, YOU seem to have some sort of mission to force everyone to take your opinion gospel.. And that is not going to fly.