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Who is Ultra Magnus?

There is more to Transformers than movies, cartoons, comics and toys. Discuss anything else Transformers here.

Postby Saber Prime » Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:11 am

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Saber Prime wrote:Whatever definition of "Multiverse" DC uses when talking about continuity is entire different from my belife of what the Multiverse is.

In case your wondering, I first came to the conclusion there was a Multiverse in high school. Is was early in the morning, my first day as a Freshman. I was alone in one of the buildings and half asleep still. (I had to be at school earlier than everyone elce that day because my dad was still working summer hours.) So as we walking into one of the faculty rooms I had this day dream where I was rollerskating down the railing at the same time I was actully walking down the stairs.

Now in this universe I hate sports, all sports, can't stand them. Reason for this, when I was about 4 or 5 my brother had a bike. Can't remember if he was just learning or what but I saw him fall off that bike. From that point I was scared away from anything on wheels. Basketball, use to play with my cousin, he broke his arm one day while we were playing. I've hated sports ever sence.

My guess is in this alternate universe I never saw either of these events. I took up sports just as any kid does and there you go another version of me who rollerblades.

This version of me eventually got scared away from going outside at all. I'd either be drawling or watching TV. My dad and my great grandmother (who died shortly before I finished school) got me started on drawling. My dad of course drew Mallardman when he was in High School. He had that drawling along with a bunch of others in a portfolio that I found at a fairly early age. My great grandmother even fighting arthritis and all the way up to her death was still and active artist. She drew pictures of Betty Boop (not profesionally but that same well known character), her dog (now my dog, only thing I have left of her), and verious other things. What that lead to was a verry artistic version of me. By the time I started Kindergarden I had allready outgrown stick figures.

Straingly enough even though I started good I didn't really improve much and instead exspanded to other fourms of art. Got an intrest in acting, went to presue that and still am allthough I haven't been on stage sence high school.

Still you can see how the simple choice of "do I want to go outside and play with my brother/cousin or stay inside and watch Star Trek with daddy" can change my whole life. It's allso kinda ironic that by not going outside to play to begine with would have made me more active later in life.


Well by my standers....if your life were a work of fiction....and there was a alternate universe of you that loved sports and was very out going while you hated sports and was afraid of going out.....then you would be two different characters.....conected on a strange level but still different characters.

But you are intitled to your belief as am I.Its not like we can ever really know in our life times witch view is right. And when it conserens ficstional characters its all up to reader to chose for himself.

Well this was a very long and entertaining debate.....and we didnt even resort to any name calling........we should do this again :grin:


You forgot to say "Only the wrighter knows for sure the rest is open for debate." :lol:
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Postby Deadpool. » Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:15 am

I'm lost..... What exactly is this thread about?
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Postby Saber Prime » Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:17 am

Deadpool. wrote:I'm lost..... What exactly is this thread about?
Optimus Prime in Blue armor.
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Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:25 am

Motto: "Today is a good day to die......but the day is not yet over!"
Saber Prime wrote:
sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Saber Prime wrote:Whatever definition of "Multiverse" DC uses when talking about continuity is entire different from my belife of what the Multiverse is.

In case your wondering, I first came to the conclusion there was a Multiverse in high school. Is was early in the morning, my first day as a Freshman. I was alone in one of the buildings and half asleep still. (I had to be at school earlier than everyone elce that day because my dad was still working summer hours.) So as we walking into one of the faculty rooms I had this day dream where I was rollerskating down the railing at the same time I was actully walking down the stairs.

Now in this universe I hate sports, all sports, can't stand them. Reason for this, when I was about 4 or 5 my brother had a bike. Can't remember if he was just learning or what but I saw him fall off that bike. From that point I was scared away from anything on wheels. Basketball, use to play with my cousin, he broke his arm one day while we were playing. I've hated sports ever sence.

My guess is in this alternate universe I never saw either of these events. I took up sports just as any kid does and there you go another version of me who rollerblades.

This version of me eventually got scared away from going outside at all. I'd either be drawling or watching TV. My dad and my great grandmother (who died shortly before I finished school) got me started on drawling. My dad of course drew Mallardman when he was in High School. He had that drawling along with a bunch of others in a portfolio that I found at a fairly early age. My great grandmother even fighting arthritis and all the way up to her death was still and active artist. She drew pictures of Betty Boop (not profesionally but that same well known character), her dog (now my dog, only thing I have left of her), and verious other things. What that lead to was a verry artistic version of me. By the time I started Kindergarden I had allready outgrown stick figures.

Straingly enough even though I started good I didn't really improve much and instead exspanded to other fourms of art. Got an intrest in acting, went to presue that and still am allthough I haven't been on stage sence high school.

Still you can see how the simple choice of "do I want to go outside and play with my brother/cousin or stay inside and watch Star Trek with daddy" can change my whole life. It's allso kinda ironic that by not going outside to play to begine with would have made me more active later in life.


Well by my standers....if your life were a work of fiction....and there was a alternate universe of you that loved sports and was very out going while you hated sports and was afraid of going out.....then you would be two different characters.....conected on a strange level but still different characters.

But you are intitled to your belief as am I.Its not like we can ever really know in our life times witch view is right. And when it conserens ficstional characters its all up to reader to chose for himself.

Well this was a very long and entertaining debate.....and we didnt even resort to any name calling........we should do this again :grin:


You forgot to say "Only the wrighter knows for sure the rest is open for debate." :lol:


If you read comics on a regular then you would know that even they dont know $hi+ about the characters their writting. :-x Changing personalties from time to time or acting out of character has plagued the common comic reader for decades.
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds

T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach

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Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:26 am

Motto: "Today is a good day to die......but the day is not yet over!"
Saber Prime wrote:
Deadpool. wrote:I'm lost..... What exactly is this thread about?
Optimus Prime in Blue armor.


No its about Optimus Prime in white paint :-P
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds

T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach

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Postby Deadpool. » Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:27 am

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Saber Prime wrote:
Deadpool. wrote:I'm lost..... What exactly is this thread about?
Optimus Prime in Blue armor.


No its about Optimus Prime in white paint :-P
Actually, it's a white Optimus in blue/red armor! :P
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Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:44 am

Motto: "Today is a good day to die......but the day is not yet over!"
Deadpool. wrote:
sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Saber Prime wrote:
Deadpool. wrote:I'm lost..... What exactly is this thread about?
Optimus Prime in Blue armor.


No its about Optimus Prime in white paint :-P
Actually, it's a white Optimus in blue/red armor! :P


O yeah....well if its from Diaclone its blue with grey,red,blue and black armor :-P
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds

T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach

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Postby Saber Prime » Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:54 am

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Saber Prime wrote:
sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Saber Prime wrote:Whatever definition of "Multiverse" DC uses when talking about continuity is entire different from my belife of what the Multiverse is.

In case your wondering, I first came to the conclusion there was a Multiverse in high school. Is was early in the morning, my first day as a Freshman. I was alone in one of the buildings and half asleep still. (I had to be at school earlier than everyone elce that day because my dad was still working summer hours.) So as we walking into one of the faculty rooms I had this day dream where I was rollerskating down the railing at the same time I was actully walking down the stairs.

Now in this universe I hate sports, all sports, can't stand them. Reason for this, when I was about 4 or 5 my brother had a bike. Can't remember if he was just learning or what but I saw him fall off that bike. From that point I was scared away from anything on wheels. Basketball, use to play with my cousin, he broke his arm one day while we were playing. I've hated sports ever sence.

My guess is in this alternate universe I never saw either of these events. I took up sports just as any kid does and there you go another version of me who rollerblades.

This version of me eventually got scared away from going outside at all. I'd either be drawling or watching TV. My dad and my great grandmother (who died shortly before I finished school) got me started on drawling. My dad of course drew Mallardman when he was in High School. He had that drawling along with a bunch of others in a portfolio that I found at a fairly early age. My great grandmother even fighting arthritis and all the way up to her death was still and active artist. She drew pictures of Betty Boop (not profesionally but that same well known character), her dog (now my dog, only thing I have left of her), and verious other things. What that lead to was a verry artistic version of me. By the time I started Kindergarden I had allready outgrown stick figures.

Straingly enough even though I started good I didn't really improve much and instead exspanded to other fourms of art. Got an intrest in acting, went to presue that and still am allthough I haven't been on stage sence high school.

Still you can see how the simple choice of "do I want to go outside and play with my brother/cousin or stay inside and watch Star Trek with daddy" can change my whole life. It's allso kinda ironic that by not going outside to play to begine with would have made me more active later in life.


Well by my standers....if your life were a work of fiction....and there was a alternate universe of you that loved sports and was very out going while you hated sports and was afraid of going out.....then you would be two different characters.....conected on a strange level but still different characters.

But you are intitled to your belief as am I.Its not like we can ever really know in our life times witch view is right. And when it conserens ficstional characters its all up to reader to chose for himself.

Well this was a very long and entertaining debate.....and we didnt even resort to any name calling........we should do this again :grin:


You forgot to say "Only the wrighter knows for sure the rest is open for debate." :lol:


If you read comics on a regular then you would know that even they dont know $hi+ about the characters their writting. :-x Changing personalties from time to time or acting out of character has plagued the common comic reader for decades.
I think that's why I never got into comics. They make no gawd damn sence.

Alot of comics form their own continuity away from their animated counterparts. Like I know G1 characters have appered in the Armada comics but they never have on the cartoon. The other major differences between the Armada Cartoon and Comics is the Mini-cons and Overload.

Mini-cons actully talk in the comics. In the cartoons they just beep.

Overload in the comics is an actuall sentient character. In the cartoon considering you only see him once, he has no lines, Optimus imidiatly uses him as a weapon, and they LAUNCH him into space, I seriouly doubt Cartoon Overload is sentient. :lol:

Cartoons tend to have a little more consistantcy in their story telling than comics do. I think because the comics tend to be wrighten each issue by entirely different people who completly ignore every comic before them where as useually in cartoons it looks like the wrighters actully do some research. It allso helps that they actully have actors playing the parts who can say "wait a min. I can't say that line, it completly goes agenst what my character said last week."

Comic wrighters can't talk to the characters they're wrighting, TV/Movie wrighters can.

In fact some episodes of some shows have been wrighten and directed by actors who stared in them.

William Shatner and Lenord Nimoy I know have both taken turns behind the camera directing the movies.

I belive (can't remember his name right now) the actor who plays Commander Riker wrote and directed a few episodes of TNG.

This is allso somewhat funny because that would mean that off camera lower crew men are telling their captain what to do. :lol:

The actor who plays Jordy Leforge and hosts Reading Rainbow allso dedicated an entire episode of Reading Rainbow to showing what goes on behind the sceens of Star Trek TNG. Straingly enough he did that episode without ever even mentioning he was was Jordy. It wasn't like "here's my dressing room now watch these guys glue a visor to my face." there was no mention at all that he was the actor playing that part on the show.
Last edited by Saber Prime on Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:03 am

Motto: "Today is a good day to die......but the day is not yet over!"
Saber Prime wrote: I think that's why I never got into comics. They make no gawd damn sence.

Alot of comics form their own continuity away from their animated counterparts. Like I know G1 characters have appered in the Armada comics but they never have on the cartoon. The other major differences between the Armada Cartoon and Comics is the Mini-cons and Overload.

Mini-cons actully talk in the comics. In the cartoons they just beep.

Overload in the comics is an actuall sentient character. In the cartoon considering you only see him once, he has no lines, Optimus imidiatly uses him as a weapon, and they LAUNCH him into space, I seriouly doubt Cartoon Overload is sentient. :lol:

Cartoons tend to have a little more consistantcy in their story telling than comics do. I think because the comics tend to be wrighten each issue by entirely different people who completly ignore every comic before them where as useually in cartoons it looks like the wrighters actully do some research. It allso helps that they actully have actors playing the parts who can say "wait a min. I can't say that line, it completly goes agenst what my character said last week."

Comic wrighters can't talk to the characters they're wrighting, TV/Movie wrighters can.


You have brought up some valid points....but I wouldnt have used the Armada toon as a point of refrance for consistent writting.That show and the ones after had hudge continuitiy issues.

Also it wasnt in the Armada comic that we see a few G1 characters it was the Energon comic but they were connected and by the way we do see a few G1 characters in Energon and Cybertron but they dont have any lines.
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds

T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach

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Postby Saber Prime » Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:22 am

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Saber Prime wrote: I think that's why I never got into comics. They make no gawd damn sence.

Alot of comics form their own continuity away from their animated counterparts. Like I know G1 characters have appered in the Armada comics but they never have on the cartoon. The other major differences between the Armada Cartoon and Comics is the Mini-cons and Overload.

Mini-cons actully talk in the comics. In the cartoons they just beep.

Overload in the comics is an actuall sentient character. In the cartoon considering you only see him once, he has no lines, Optimus imidiatly uses him as a weapon, and they LAUNCH him into space, I seriouly doubt Cartoon Overload is sentient. :lol:

Cartoons tend to have a little more consistantcy in their story telling than comics do. I think because the comics tend to be wrighten each issue by entirely different people who completly ignore every comic before them where as useually in cartoons it looks like the wrighters actully do some research. It allso helps that they actully have actors playing the parts who can say "wait a min. I can't say that line, it completly goes agenst what my character said last week."

Comic wrighters can't talk to the characters they're wrighting, TV/Movie wrighters can.


You have brought up some valid points....but I wouldnt have used the Armada toon as a point of refrance for consistent writting.That show and the ones after had hudge continuitiy issues.

Also it wasnt in the Armada comic that we see a few G1 characters it was the Energon comic but they were connected and by the way we do see a few G1 characters in Energon and Cybertron but they dont have any lines.


I know I hate Armada. It just happens to be the only series I know anything about the comic version. I can't compair show versions to comic versions of anything else.

G1 Galvatron along with Scourge and Cyclonus were in fact in an Armada comic. I know it was Armada because Megatron was still in his tank form and the comic was "Over-run" with Mini-cons (excuse the pun).

I don't remember much of it but I do remember Over-run exsplaining how he and the G1 guest stars were from the same Universe and that G1 Galvatron had destroyed their universe and every universe he'd appered in which makes no gawd damn sence and I imediatly stoped reading after that.

Over-run is the Mini-con that comes with Delux Armada Prime. Mini-cons and that character didn't even exsist in G1 so for him to exsplain that he did exsist back then ruined that entire story before it ever started.

G1 characters never appeared in any cartoons of A/E/C their likenesses have in cameo appearences. That's like the equivilant of Lue Farigno (The origina Hulk) appearing in HULK with Stan Lee.
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Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Mon Nov 05, 2007 4:05 am

Motto: "Today is a good day to die......but the day is not yet over!"
Saber Prime wrote:
sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:
Saber Prime wrote: I think that's why I never got into comics. They make no gawd damn sence.

Alot of comics form their own continuity away from their animated counterparts. Like I know G1 characters have appered in the Armada comics but they never have on the cartoon. The other major differences between the Armada Cartoon and Comics is the Mini-cons and Overload.

Mini-cons actully talk in the comics. In the cartoons they just beep.

Overload in the comics is an actuall sentient character. In the cartoon considering you only see him once, he has no lines, Optimus imidiatly uses him as a weapon, and they LAUNCH him into space, I seriouly doubt Cartoon Overload is sentient. :lol:

Cartoons tend to have a little more consistantcy in their story telling than comics do. I think because the comics tend to be wrighten each issue by entirely different people who completly ignore every comic before them where as useually in cartoons it looks like the wrighters actully do some research. It allso helps that they actully have actors playing the parts who can say "wait a min. I can't say that line, it completly goes agenst what my character said last week."

Comic wrighters can't talk to the characters they're wrighting, TV/Movie wrighters can.


You have brought up some valid points....but I wouldnt have used the Armada toon as a point of refrance for consistent writting.That show and the ones after had hudge continuitiy issues.

Also it wasnt in the Armada comic that we see a few G1 characters it was the Energon comic but they were connected and by the way we do see a few G1 characters in Energon and Cybertron but they dont have any lines.


I know I hate Armada. It just happens to be the only series I know anything about the comic version. I can't compair show versions to comic versions of anything else.

G1 Galvatron along with Scourge and Cyclonus were in fact in an Armada comic. I know it was Armada because Megatron was still in his tank form and the comic was "Over-run" with Mini-cons (excuse the pun).

I don't remember much of it but I do remember Over-run exsplaining how he and the G1 guest stars were from the same Universe and that G1 Galvatron had destroyed their universe and every universe he'd appered in which makes no gawd damn sence and I imediatly stoped reading after that.

Over-run is the Mini-con that comes with Delux Armada Prime. Mini-cons and that character didn't even exsist in G1 so for him to exsplain that he did exsist back then ruined that entire story before it ever started.

G1 characters never appeared in any cartoons of A/E/C their likenesses have in cameo appearences. That's like the equivilant of Lue Farigno (The origina Hulk) appearing in HULK with Stan Lee.


The only way that it would be the equivilant is if Lue were waering grean paint on his skin.As far as the trademark laws are conserend the likeness of a charater are tied to the character it's self.And besides theres dialoge from an other character [dont remember who] indecating that the G1 characters we see in energon were Autobots from the past or an other Cybertron.G1 Prime was among the ones we saw in Energon.

And you are right it was issue 14 of the Armada comic.It was the first part of the last 4 issues.But your wrong about what you said about Over Run didnt say that the G1 guest stars [as you put it] came from his universe....just that they destroyed his universe.As a matter of fact ,there's no real reason to believe that their G1 characters at all besides them looking like them.Over-Reun said that they all came from different Universe's that Unicron destroyed.He took those few characters and forced them to work for him.The Galvatron actuly looks a bit different on the arms.

Here is what Over run says about the guest stars.

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Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds

T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach

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Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Mon Nov 05, 2007 4:15 am

Motto: "Today is a good day to die......but the day is not yet over!"
The energon toon thing I was talking about may have come from cybertron instead.....I get those showes mixed up some times.
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds

T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach

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Postby Leonardo » Mon Nov 05, 2007 4:26 am

Saber Prime wrote:Makes perfect sence actully. If you think from my point of view for a sec.

Forget everything you think I said because you got the wrong meaning anyway and I did a crappy job of exsplaining.

Just read the quotes you posted again but think of the word multiverse in my definition rather than whatever Hasbro thinks it is.

If you go by my definition of multiverse, that each universe is a continuity of the same starting point you'll realize that the movie and G1 are not the same Multiverse.

The characters would have to age and there would have to be some reasoning for a character such as Mr. Freeze to be a jewel thief weather or not he has a wife. Sence there is no reasoning and Batman is not older than he was it can not be the same Multiverse.

New continuity = new multiverse I can't exsplain it any simpler than that so if you still don't understand than we have a lost cause.


I'm confused by this idea. You're saying that various DC Comics universes can be clumped together into separate multiverses, so that the animated multiverse is a separate multiverse from the comic multiverse?

If you believe there is a multiverse in real life, do you believe there are other, separate, different multiverses in real life?
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Postby Saber Prime » Mon Nov 05, 2007 4:38 am

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:As far as the trademark laws are conserend the likeness of a charater are tied to the character it's self.
By that standard than every form of Optimus is the G1 Optimus even Primal because they all have likeness to the original.

However we know Primal is not the original because the character himself tells us that. Other versions of Optimus Prime are debateable but I don't belive any of them to be G1 Prime.

And besides theres dialoge from an other character [dont remember who] indecating that the G1 characters we see in energon were Autobots from the past or an other Cybertron.G1 Prime was among the ones we saw in Energon.
I belive you're thinking of when Vector Prime is exsplaining about the Cyber Planet Keys in Cybertron. They show 4 transformers in the flash back that look verry much like Optimus Prime, Ultra Magnus, and two others I can't quite remember at this moment. I think Jazz was one of them. But they were all looked like G1 characters however the way Vector Prime describes them they should like they're as old as he is so they can't be the same characters from G1, they just look like them.

The Galvatron actuly looks a bit different on the arms.
Galvatron's not even in the picture you posted.
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Postby Saber Prime » Mon Nov 05, 2007 4:42 am

Leonardo wrote:If you believe there is a multiverse in real life, do you believe there are other, separate, different multiverses in real life?
Nope only in fiction. Different Multiverse is created when a wrighter breaks from continuity. In order to belive in seperate multiverse in real life there'd have to be a God and I don't belive in God.
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Postby Saber Prime » Mon Nov 05, 2007 4:54 am

So I was thinking. I'm going to use one of my fav. episodes of Star Trek as an example.

You remember in TNG when Q made Picard jump between 3 different time period versions of himself? One was his present self, one was back when he first started as Captain of the Enterprise D, and the 3rd was the future.

Now in the future Picard saw he had Married and divorced Beverly Crusher. Jordy had his "hologrphic eyes" or whatever it was that allowed him to see without haveing to wear his visor. I can't remember weather or not Data had an emotion chip in that future. I don't think he did but I do remember his grey hair dye. All of the crew had kida drifted apart and not really kept in touch in that future.

It was stated at the end of that episode that Picard had told everyone the future he saw knowing that it would turn out differently anyway just because he had seen it.

So my question to you is this. Are the characters of the current time as seen in recent movies and guest appearances on DS9 and Voyager the same characters or different characters than in the alternate future that Picard saw in that episode of TNG?

I see them as the same characters but I'm just wandering what your opinion is.
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Postby Leonardo » Mon Nov 05, 2007 4:57 am

Saber Prime wrote:
Leonardo wrote:If you believe there is a multiverse in real life, do you believe there are other, separate, different multiverses in real life?
Nope only in fiction. Different Multiverse is created when a wrighter breaks from continuity. In order to belive in seperate multiverse in real life there'd have to be a God and I don't belive in God.


A new writer doesn't mean a new multiverse, though. They can create a new continuity and can create a new universe but where's the evidence that a new multiverse is created? A writer breaking from continuity doesn't mean there is a new multiverse; they have just created a new continuity or a new universe within the pre-existing multiverse.
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Postby Saber Prime » Mon Nov 05, 2007 5:16 am

Leonardo wrote:
Saber Prime wrote:
Leonardo wrote:If you believe there is a multiverse in real life, do you believe there are other, separate, different multiverses in real life?
Nope only in fiction. Different Multiverse is created when a wrighter breaks from continuity. In order to belive in seperate multiverse in real life there'd have to be a God and I don't belive in God.


A new writer doesn't mean a new multiverse, though. They can create a new continuity and can create a new universe but where's the evidence that a new multiverse is created? A writer breaking from continuity doesn't mean there is a new multiverse; they have just created a new continuity or a new universe within the pre-existing multiverse.
You didn't read any of the conversation before this did you?

Go back a page.

-=edit=-

Actully here I quoted myself for you.

Saber Prime wrote:Makes perfect sence actully. If you think from my point of view for a sec.

Forget everything you think I said because you got the wrong meaning anyway and I did a crappy job of exsplaining.

Just read the quotes you posted again but think of the word multiverse in my definition rather than whatever Hasbro thinks it is.

If you go by my definition of multiverse, that each universe is a continuity of the same starting point you'll realize that the movie and G1 are not the same Multiverse.

The characters would have to age and there would have to be some reasoning for a character such as Mr. Freeze to be a jewel thief weather or not he has a wife. Sence there is no reasoning and Batman is not older than he was it can not be the same Multiverse.

New continuity = new multiverse I can't exsplain it any simpler than that so if you still don't understand than we have a lost cause.
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Postby Leonardo » Mon Nov 05, 2007 5:25 am

I did read it, actually, but all you seem to describe is the creation of different universes, not different multiverses. Take your Batman example; there's no reason why Batman: The Animated Series and The Batman can't be part of the same multiverse. They can be just two different universes in the same multi-verse. Why do you say that they "can NOT exsist in the same Multiverse"?
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Postby Saber Prime » Mon Nov 05, 2007 5:48 am

Leonardo wrote:I did read it, actually, but all you seem to describe is the creation of different universes, not different multiverses. Take your Batman example; there's no reason why Batman: The Animated Series and The Batman can't be part of the same multiverse. They can be just two different universes in the same multi-verse. Why do you say that they "can NOT exsist in the same Multiverse"?


Because if they were the same Multiverse

A. sence in one universe Mr. Freeze only became a jewel thief to help his wife in the other universe where he has no wife he would not be a jewel thief yet he is so different multiverse.

B. Batman: The Animated Series takes place in the late 90's and The Batman takes place in 2007 (current time) yet TheBatman now is the same age or about the same age as Batman was over 7 years ago. Not to mention Robin/Dick Greyson actully looks to be 3-5 years younger than he was 7 years ago. Can't be the same multiverse if they're all differnet ages.

If they were the same multiverse TheBatman would have to take place 3-5 years before the events of Batman: The Animated Series to make the two Dick Greysons the same age.

Bruce Waynes age is fairly unknown. Dick Greyson of TheBatman seems to be 13. Dick Greyson of Batman: The Animated Series was about 16-18.
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Postby Leonardo » Mon Nov 05, 2007 5:55 am

Saber Prime wrote:
Leonardo wrote:I did read it, actually, but all you seem to describe is the creation of different universes, not different multiverses. Take your Batman example; there's no reason why Batman: The Animated Series and The Batman can't be part of the same multiverse. They can be just two different universes in the same multi-verse. Why do you say that they "can NOT exsist in the same Multiverse"?


Because if they were the same Multiverse

A. sence in one universe Mr. Freeze only became a jewel thief to help his wife in the other universe where he has no wife he would not be a jewel thief yet he is so different multiverse.

B. Batman: The Animated Series takes place in the late 90's and The Batman takes place in 2007 (current time) yet TheBatman now is the same age or about the same age as Batman was over 7 years ago. Not to mention Robin/Dick Greyson actully looks to be 3-5 years younger than he was 7 years ago. Can't be the same multiverse if they're all differnet ages.


Of course it can be the same multiverse. Those two differences don't mean that they are in a different multiverse. They mean they are in different universes. Why do you think they can't be part of the same multiverse?
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Postby Saber Prime » Mon Nov 05, 2007 6:04 am

Leonardo wrote:
Saber Prime wrote:
Leonardo wrote:I did read it, actually, but all you seem to describe is the creation of different universes, not different multiverses. Take your Batman example; there's no reason why Batman: The Animated Series and The Batman can't be part of the same multiverse. They can be just two different universes in the same multi-verse. Why do you say that they "can NOT exsist in the same Multiverse"?


Because if they were the same Multiverse

A. sence in one universe Mr. Freeze only became a jewel thief to help his wife in the other universe where he has no wife he would not be a jewel thief yet he is so different multiverse.

B. Batman: The Animated Series takes place in the late 90's and The Batman takes place in 2007 (current time) yet TheBatman now is the same age or about the same age as Batman was over 7 years ago. Not to mention Robin/Dick Greyson actully looks to be 3-5 years younger than he was 7 years ago. Can't be the same multiverse if they're all differnet ages.


Of course it can be the same multiverse. Those two differences don't mean that they are in a different multiverse. They mean they are in different universes.


There's no point in continueing this conversation you're just makeing me repeat stuff I allready posted. Go back and read man.

Serious everything you just said was allready posted and answered before you posted anything. At least sto_vo_kor_2000 actully read my replys and attempted to understand me.

Get back to me when you have something to ask me that hasn't allready been asked by sto_vo_kor_2000.

Where is sto_vo_kor_2000 anyway? I'm still waiting his reply on my quesion about TNG.
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Postby Leonardo » Mon Nov 05, 2007 6:34 am

But you haven't answered anything. If you were arguing that they resulted in different universes, I'd agree with you, but you're saying they result in different multiverses when you haven't provided any reasons why that's the case.

It could well be that there are multiple multiverses. It's not your statement or point that I disagree with, as such. At the very least, one could say that there are multiple multiverses in fiction as Star Trek has a multiverse, Batman has a multiverse, Transformers has a multiverse, etc. It's just your reasoning that I'm trying to understand. As I read it, all your evidence is more in line with arguing the case for multiple universes rather than multiple multiverses.
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Postby Sledge » Mon Nov 05, 2007 10:46 am

Tell you what, Saber. If you want to stop arguing the mess of junk you've tangled yourself up in, we can return to an earlier point: why on Earth do you think identical twins have different DNA?
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Postby sto_vo_kor_2000 » Mon Nov 05, 2007 1:57 pm

Motto: "Today is a good day to die......but the day is not yet over!"
Saber Prime wrote: By that standard than every form of Optimus is the G1 Optimus even Primal because they all have likeness to the original.

However we know Primal is not the original because the character himself tells us that. Other versions of Optimus Prime are debateable but I don't belive any of them to be G1 Prime.


No not at all.I'm not sayin that any character with SOME likeness is tied in by trademark law.The characters you mentioned baer only some likeness and differ in many ways.The law applys when the likeness is undeniable as is the case with the apperance's of those G1 characters I mention on the toon.


Saber Prime wrote:I belive you're thinking of when Vector Prime is exsplaining about the Cyber Planet Keys in Cybertron. They show 4 transformers in the flash back that look verry much like Optimus Prime, Ultra Magnus, and two others I can't quite remember at this moment. I think Jazz was one of them. But they were all looked like G1 characters however the way Vector Prime describes them they should like they're as old as he is so they can't be the same characters from G1, they just look like them.


Why should they look as old as he is????He may have been seeing then trew time.

Saber Prime wrote:Galvatron's not even in the picture you posted.


I said it was a pic of what over-run was saying if you want a pic of Galvatron just ask.
Predaprince wrote:I am very thankful to have posters like sto_vo_kor_2000 who is so energetic about improving others' understanding and enjoyment of the TF universe
Stormrider wrote:You often add interesting insights to conversations that makes the fledglings think and challenges even the sharpest minds

T-Macksimus wrote:I consider you and editor to be amongst the most "scholarly" in terms of your knowledge, demeanor and general approach

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