The Energon Pub

The chrome on Takara TC will be a bit of a giveaway.

ragingtsunami726 wrote:

GetterDragun wrote:

Liege Evilmus wrote:This sucks!!!

I can apreciate you feeling shafted here, alright, but say they did this with this years Shattered Glass set that had a thread with ebay auctions straight from the convention...

...would you still care!?!

Hell I haven't made a single botcon yet, but if all it is is a chance to get some crappy repaints, I can't see any point in going at all.

And don't give me all that BotCon Exclusives can only be bought at BotCon ****, cause BBTS had them too!

Exclusives get revisited just as often as figures get repainted now a days. Get use to it and thanks for the heads up about the rest of the events being a waste of time.

Apparently you don't know what the definition of "exclusive" is. If this is what BotCon considers an exclusive, I'd much prefer getting an early release of a regular figure since you are getting an item early...which is something they can guarantee.

And that BBTS argument is pretty silly, what did they get, their own production run? Maybe e-bay sellers that sell BotCon stuff should make their own convention exclusives next.

And don't put words in my mouth, I never said the event was a waste, that's why there is a $10 ticket to get in. I paid for exclusives and they did not deliver. They should not market these items as such if they can not guarantee it.

Plus maybe people would have spent a few hundred bucks more with the vendors if they knew these "exclusives" would see a release outside of their intended distribution.

Sir, with all due respect, this isn't the first or last exclusive to be re released in such a manner. Many exclusives that say they are exclusive to one place are available elsewhere.

This doesn't mean the company hates you or anything. If the exclusive was only $15 instead of $40 I'm willing to bet you wouldn't care. What about the SDCC Exclusive Nemesis Prime? Japan gets one too! Why do they get our exclusive? Doesn't that make it not exclusive? We get their Alternators/Kiss Players Rodimus too! Do the Japanese never buy from Hasbro again?

The point is, it's happened before and it will happen again. There are plenty of exclusives that have failed to stay that way. Why make such a big fuss now?

And the examples you named off were still exclusives in Japan.

But the point that a lot of you seem to not understand is that, I’m sure nowhere near as many people would have gone to Botcon if they had known this. Why would anyone pay $300 for the Botcon version when they can get this one for $25? And if they cant keep it exclusive, why did they call it “exclusive”?

This is bullshit, no other word could explain it better.

I think it would be ironic and humorous if the Japanese EXCLUSIVE Thundercracker ended up costing as much to import as the aftermarket Botcon Thundercracker. This is possible. Japanese Transformers exclusives are notoriously made in small batches and therefore hard to get. Anyone expecting this to be a $25 figure on BBTS will be in for a big surprise.

Like I said earlier......

I guess the best thing to do is to quit labeling toys as "Exclusives" and just call them "Special Edition", "Botcon Edition", "Anime Edition" or something to that nature, because lets face it, Exclusives are not really exclusives.......maybe

I still want a cartoon-accurate TC.

Maybe Takara will make one someday.

Or Hasbro, and call it something other than Thundercracker.

Lapse Of Reason wrote:I think it would be ironic and humorous if the Japanese EXCLUSIVE Thundercracker ended up costing as much to import as the aftermarket Botcon Thundercracker. This is possible. Japanese Transformers exclusives are notoriously made in small batches and therefore hard to get. Anyone expecting this to be a $25 figure on BBTS will be in for a big surprise.

Well I don't know that I would find it humorous but difinitely ironic. I don't think they will list for what the Botcon figures currently go for on Ebay, but they will probably be pretty expensive.

Geekee1 wrote:If the preorder for this does not sell out within a day I will be VERY disappointed in all of you.

Everybody screamed and yelled for this and you're now given the opportunity. I want those without Botcon Thundercracker to not even give me a chance to order one.

I doubt you'll be disappointed.

I have a feeling it will still cost too much for me to justify to myself though. So I still won't have one.

Geekee1 wrote:Along those same lines of thinking everybody wanted to buy a trailer for Ultra Magnus and said that Hasbro was stupid for not making one. Why then, can I still buy the awesome upgrade kit for him?

Not my fault. Mine is preordered.

I care much more about Ultra Magnus than I do about the seekers!

MagnusPrimal wrote:

Geekee1 wrote:If the preorder for this does not sell out within a day I will be VERY disappointed in all of you.

Everybody screamed and yelled for this and you're now given the opportunity. I want those without Botcon Thundercracker to not even give me a chance to order one.

I doubt you'll be disappointed.

I have a feeling it will still cost too much for me to justify to myself though. So I still won't have one.

Geekee1 wrote:Along those same lines of thinking everybody wanted to buy a trailer for Ultra Magnus and said that Hasbro was stupid for not making one. Why then, can I still buy the awesome upgrade kit for him?

Not my fault. Mine is preordered.

I care much more about Ultra Magnus than I do about the seekers!

It turns out that the original "only 2000 pieces" being made was incorrect. BBTS has changed their description of the Ultra Magnus Kit. So it appears that there will be alot more and that's why they are still up for pre-order

Nekoman wrote:I fully understand Getters comments as someone who DIDN’T go to Botcon.

In essence, this is sad, people will see less incentive for going to Botcon and possibly end the convention. I frown upon TakaraTomys decision as not only a fan, but a collector.

If cheap enough, I may order it. Still, some part of me agonizes over this release. It’s not fair to those who went to Botcon, its not fair to Botcon.

I get the feeling that a greedy side of the fandom will cheer about this for a long time, another side, may just leave forever.

Shame on those who demanded this release, shame on Takara for going through with it and shame on Hasbro for allowing this to happen back in 06...

Shame, SHAME!

Oh, good grief.

So, it was fair that the remaining seekers were unavailable to a large part of the fandom, but it's not fair to botcon that now a single seeker from that set, with a different paint job, is being released in limited numbers in a different country?

Skywarp with Lilac on him! - I came

Also TC looks a hell of alot nicer than the Botcon one... I hope I can get these two, wonder what their production numbers will be.

BB Shockwave wrote:Since I'm in geek heaven thanks to finally being to get TC and NOT having to pay 300$ for him, I decided to quickly photoshop some comparison shots:

Skywarp comparison

Thundercracker comparison





Frankly, Skywarp is the one who's more different then the original - in both cases, Heinkei used the toy colors, not the show colors... And there are many other little differences on both toys, like the 'same color as body' nosecone, the 'stripes' going all over the end of the wing, less silver paint, etc...

Anyway, I hope we can get them from a Hong Kong Ebay seller in a few months, the same way the other Heinkei are avaliable today... 'Cause don't forget, they are made for Japan, but still made in China...

The only part of Henkei Thundercracker that I like better, judging by those pics, are the launchers. Every other difference is negligible, IMO.

Yes, I have BotCon Thundercracker. I got the whole set as part of my "BotCon Experience", and when you divide it up I only payed around 50$ on him individually. I spent a lot of money to go to BotCon with the "whole package", with the exclusive toys and flying to Providence from Montreal on a Canadian holiday weekend. And, yet, I've left my BotCon exclusive box set in the box and on a shelf. To me, the toys were a very secondary thing compared to the memories I have of BotCon and the memories that those toys conjur up.

The Henkei/Botcon toys are different enough from eachother to not, in my mind, change the way I feel about the BotCon Thundercracker. He is, and always will be, the recognizable BotCon toy. For character collectors it won't matter which version they get, but for those who want a BotCon version it will still hold the same value. These are still exclusives, no matter what you say. They won't be unlimited production and will still demand decent prices, either or.

Now, can anyone tell me how much that Clear Convoy might go for?

Nekoman wrote:And the examples you named off were still exclusives in Japan.

But the point that a lot of you seem to not understand is that, I’m sure nowhere near as many people would have gone to Botcon if they had known this. Why would anyone pay $300 for the Botcon version when they can get this one for $25? And if they cant keep it exclusive, why did they call it “exclusive”?

This is bullshit, no other word could explain it better.

I actually agree with you.They shouldnt have called it an exclusive if they couldnt keep it that way.

But the reality of it is that I'm shocked that so many of you really believed that it would remain an exclusive.

Bot-Con ,and Hasbro for that mater, can only make the claim that a product will be an exclusive to the area's of the world that they market their toys in.

In Japan the property owner is Takara and they can do what they like with the molds that they buy....even if they bought it from Hasbro.

Yes Hasbro could have made a side agreement with them asking Takara not to do Thundercracker but I'm sure Takara would have then reduced their offer of payment for the molds.

As I said in another thread ...

Why is no one getting upset about all the other "exclusives" that have been produced over the years but are nothing more than variants?

How many "exclusive" mini-cons were there, some were the same characters, but different colours.

What about the "exclusive" energon weapons? The Energon Spear was still the Energon Spear whether it was coloured green or purple. No one got upset about that.

Frankly the BotCon Exclusive Thundercracker is just that. Exclusive to BotCon. Henkai Thundercracker is NOT BotCon Thundercracker. The colours are different, therefore it is a variant, a different figure.

People will still have their BotCon Exclusive Thundercracker because THAT figure is not getting produced, ANOTHER Thundercracker is getting produced for the Henkai line.

OptimusPrimeRib wrote:

Emperor Galvatron wrote:I don't have the BC set or any parts thereof, or any other vested interest in this set.

Predictions:

1> Hentai* Thundercracker will open on preorders at roughly $100.

2> 'Scalpers'** will drive the price up to $200 by the end of the first week.

3> 75% of you posting that you'll get it regardless of the cost will stop saying that when you have to shell out $100 plus for it.

4> You will still be pissed and moaning that the evil, rich, greedy bastards*** took your toy.

5> And you will sound like my two year old.



It's like CP said earlier in one of his earlier reports and in this very thread: You gotta pay to play. And believe me, you'll be paying to play with this one. Personnally, I don't care either way, it's gonna be fun to watch the fuelshed.****


*- This is gotta be one of the best ideas ever. Kudos!
**- People who beat you to the punch. Not Chinese lunch special sellers.
***- They're probably Republicans to boot!!
****- I know I said some harsh, and some might even say mean-spirited and vindictive, things in this post. To that I say, my name is Emperor Galvatron. WTF did you expect?!

You know I was just thinking about this myself. I have the 07 Botcon set it cost me $279.00 for five figures and a very nice display worthy box. Not even taking into consideration that one of the figures was a Voyager that works out to about $56.00 a figure. Not bad for exclusives. Now people are talking about how they are finally going to have the chance to have the remaining seekers. I don't see anyway these will be for sale here for $56.00. Thess are exclusives, they are imports, and online retailers that will have preorders up know how much people want these. I think I got the better deal.

Well you should all look around on Ebay these days...

I'd say the new Heinkei Astrotrain is VERY highly sought after due to the very different color scheme.

You know for how much it sells?

15 $!!!!

Do you honestly expect some chinese/Hong Kong seller to be aware of the whole Botcon Seeker thing? To them, this'll be just another transformer toy to sell, after all they sell tons of toys on Ebay not just TF. They'll be aware that these are Japanese store exclusives, so I predict the starting price will be around 25-30$. But it will fall below that as the months pass (see that Heinkei BB or Starscream can be bought for 10$ nowadays!).

It'll never be 100$. Sure, scalpers will try to sell it for that much, but scalpers try to sell the KO G1 Casettes for 50-70$ too, and they fail utterly when others sell these for 15$.

NuclearConvoy wrote:
The only part of Henkei Thundercracker that I like better, judging by those pics, are the launchers. Every other difference is negligible, IMO.

Yes, I have BotCon Thundercracker. I got the whole set as part of my "BotCon Experience", and when you divide it up I only payed around 50$ on him individually. I spent a lot of money to go to BotCon with the "whole package", with the exclusive toys and flying to Providence from Montreal on a Canadian holiday weekend. And, yet, I've left my BotCon exclusive box set in the box and on a shelf. To me, the toys were a very secondary thing compared to the memories I have of BotCon and the memories that those toys conjur up.

The Henkei/Botcon toys are different enough from eachother to not, in my mind, change the way I feel about the BotCon Thundercracker. He is, and always will be, the recognizable BotCon toy. For character collectors it won't matter which version they get, but for those who want a BotCon version it will still hold the same value. These are still exclusives, no matter what you say. They won't be unlimited production and will still demand decent prices, either or.

Now, can anyone tell me how much that Clear Convoy might go for?

Can you or any owner of Botcon TC tell me whether his vertical tailfins are colored blue or are black with the classics stripes? Because on the web, I found pics of both versions...

So basically, everyone who lives outside America is upset that they couldn't get the botcon exclusives first time, and are probably feeling malicious relief right now. Everyone who is in America and could go to botcon is upset that their expensive figures aren't as exclusive and may not be as valuable.

The obvious solution? Have botcon in every country that has Transformers, amirite?

BB Shockwave wrote:

OptimusPrimeRib wrote:

Emperor Galvatron wrote:I don't have the BC set or any parts thereof, or any other vested interest in this set.

Predictions:

1> Hentai* Thundercracker will open on preorders at roughly $100.

2> 'Scalpers'** will drive the price up to $200 by the end of the first week.

3> 75% of you posting that you'll get it regardless of the cost will stop saying that when you have to shell out $100 plus for it.

4> You will still be pissed and moaning that the evil, rich, greedy bastards*** took your toy.

5> And you will sound like my two year old.



It's like CP said earlier in one of his earlier reports and in this very thread: You gotta pay to play. And believe me, you'll be paying to play with this one. Personnally, I don't care either way, it's gonna be fun to watch the fuelshed.****


*- This is gotta be one of the best ideas ever. Kudos!
**- People who beat you to the punch. Not Chinese lunch special sellers.
***- They're probably Republicans to boot!!
****- I know I said some harsh, and some might even say mean-spirited and vindictive, things in this post. To that I say, my name is Emperor Galvatron. WTF did you expect?!

You know I was just thinking about this myself. I have the 07 Botcon set it cost me $279.00 for five figures and a very nice display worthy box. Not even taking into consideration that one of the figures was a Voyager that works out to about $56.00 a figure. Not bad for exclusives. Now people are talking about how they are finally going to have the chance to have the remaining seekers. I don't see anyway these will be for sale here for $56.00. Thess are exclusives, they are imports, and online retailers that will have preorders up know how much people want these. I think I got the better deal.

Well you should all look around on Ebay these days...

I'd say the new Heinkei Astrotrain is VERY highly sought after due to the very different color scheme.

You know for how much it sells?

15 $!!!!

Do you honestly expect some chinese/Hong Kong seller to be aware of the whole Botcon Seeker thing? To them, this'll be just another transformer toy to sell, after all they sell tons of toys on Ebay not just TF. They'll be aware that these are Japanese store exclusives, so I predict the starting price will be around 25-30$. But it will fall below that as the months pass (see that Heinkei BB or Starscream can be bought for 10$ nowadays!).

It'll never be 100$. Sure, scalpers will try to sell it for that much, but scalpers try to sell the KO G1 Casettes for 50-70$ too, and they fail utterly when others sell these for 15$.

sigh. You see, the minor difference between Astrotrain and TC is that Thundercracker is a store exclusive. RARE.Limited quantities. Maybe even to the same extent that BC TC was. Astrotrain is a main figure in the line. Read: NOT RARE. Plentiful. Available to the masses.
Scalpers are going to be all over these things like flies on a turd when it's released. Watch. Scalpers live for stuff like this.

Personnally, I hope everyone who wants one can get one. I'm just saying don't expect it to be cheap by any means. I expect the same bitching and whining when it's too expensive for everyone like the Botcon set was.

Emperor Galvatron is so right... if you live in the USA, you still would have been better off just ordering the box set last year. I would be pretty surprised if this sells for under 100. I will be even more surprised if it doesn't end up costing more than the BC TC in a year.

And if you think the online retailer in Hong Kong doesn't know that a Botcon TC fetches 250, then you don't buy a lot of stuff from there.

And none of you will buy it regardless of price. That is just a stupid statement, as if money didn't matter, you'd already have the Botcon TC.....

Its gret that more people will get a chance to own TC, but, really, don't expect it to be 40 or 50 bucks. JP store exclusives tend to become the rarest and most expensive TFs.

Bonger wrote:Emperor Galvatron is so right... if you live in the USA, you still would have been better off just ordering the box set last year. I would be pretty surprised if this sells for under 100. I will be even more surprised if it doesn't end up costing more than the BC TC in a year.

And if you think the online retailer in Hong Kong doesn't know that a Botcon TC fetches 250, then you don't buy a lot of stuff from there.

And none of you will buy it regardless of price. That is just a stupid statement, as if money didn't matter, you'd already have the Botcon TC.....

Its gret that more people will get a chance to own TC, but, really, don't expect it to be 40 or 50 bucks. JP store exclusives tend to become the rarest and most expensive TFs.

Not all Japan exclusives hold their value, but TC in addtion to SW will for the Henkei line.
Many of you are going to flip your wig if you have to pay $100 or more for each. But my spidey sense says this will be
a two-pack, I could be wrong, btu since they aren't releasing SW with Ultra Magnus like the Target two pack, this may be their Two pack Store exclusive.

EDIT:
I see Botcon TC is going for $200+ by itself. If you get the Henlei TC for under $100, then that is a deal.

Good luck hunting!

Yup, good luck hunting. If it is a 2 pack, I would guess the price to be around the 150 mark, which is still a good deal comparatively.

BB Shockwave wrote:Well you should all look around on Ebay these days...

I'd say the new Heinkei Astrotrain is VERY highly sought after due to the very different color scheme.

You know for how much it sells?

15 $!!!!

Do you honestly expect some chinese/Hong Kong seller to be aware of the whole Botcon Seeker thing? To them, this'll be just another transformer toy to sell, after all they sell tons of toys on Ebay not just TF. They'll be aware that these are Japanese store exclusives, so I predict the starting price will be around 25-30$. But it will fall below that as the months pass (see that Heinkei BB or Starscream can be bought for 10$ nowadays!).

It'll never be 100$. Sure, scalpers will try to sell it for that much, but scalpers try to sell the KO G1 Casettes for 50-70$ too, and they fail utterly when others sell these for 15$.

You are wrong and your opinion on the matter is wrong.

Read up on what the more experienced collectors have put down and respect that they're taking time to give out good advice next time.

Diem wrote:The obvious solution? Have botcon in every country that has Transformers, amirite?

I think it's a bit crap that Hasbro only seem to care about the American market. It would be a nice gesture to the fans if, each year, they produced an exclusive set, and made it available to a convention in each country. So Botcon would get some, Auto Assembly would get some, the Aussies would get some, etc.

Sledge wrote:

Diem wrote:The obvious solution? Have botcon in every country that has Transformers, amirite?

I think it's a bit crap that Hasbro only seem to care about the American market. It would be a nice gesture to the fans if, each year, they produced an exclusive set, and made it available to a convention in each country. So Botcon would get some, Auto Assembly would get some, the Aussies would get some, etc.

They could.

MasterCollector bought a license to do exclusives. Presumably, when those foreign conventions get big enough, someone will do the same for those countries.

Hasbro participates, but actually has little to do with the convention.

BB Shockwave wrote:Well you should all look around on Ebay these days...

I'd say the new Heinkei Astrotrain is VERY highly sought after due to the very different color scheme.

You know for how much it sells?

15 $!!!!

Do you honestly expect some chinese/Hong Kong seller to be aware of the whole Botcon Seeker thing? To them, this'll be just another transformer toy to sell, after all they sell tons of toys on Ebay not just TF. They'll be aware that these are Japanese store exclusives, so I predict the starting price will be around 25-30$. But it will fall below that as the months pass (see that Heinkei BB or Starscream can be bought for 10$ nowadays!).

It'll never be 100$. Sure, scalpers will try to sell it for that much, but scalpers try to sell the KO G1 Casettes for 50-70$ too, and they fail utterly when others sell these for 15$.

Flawed logic in your post all the way

Henkei Starscream is going for $25, so is Classics Starscream.

Chinese sellers are FULLY aware of any Botcon exclusisve. They are getting these directly from the factory.
They know how much quantities are being produced, and such.

The problem is demand. Botcon exclusives are one thing, becuase either way you put it, you are going to pay dearly.
But the insane prices for TF Animated are all becuase "we" impatient americans can't wait for it to be mass retail,
so we out bid each other until some realize, "I'm gald he outbid me....look at how much of an idiot I am!!"

Now the debate of the Botcon seekers being made by TakTomy, which have occurred due to specualtion, rumor, and now actual product shot, which has been stated as well to be a japanese store exclusive, will....drive up demand.

Now I'll agree with you, they won't be that expensive, probaly $50 to $60. But most idiots won't go the distance to obtain these, and rather wiat on import stores to get them. There is a differecne between a Hot Wheel Scalper, becuase he has to be ultra cunning to get treasure hunts, but most TF scalpers are those who have to wait for initial stock to be put out on the shelves. With the caseof a store in Japan, the channels will be limited to damn near all.

Look at that Lawson's Pepto Bismol Movie Starscream...BBTS wants $340 bucks. probaly a one-third mark up to help you get one, because you had to buy a DVD player to get one.

Think of quantity that the store exclusive might be. BBTS can use there channels probaly to get 5 to 10, possibly more depending on the quantity released. Once they get enough, then the mark-up begins. Also, if some of the product is stolen, and gets put up by a Chinese epay seller, then the ebayees will go on a bidding rampage, and probaly regrat paying what they could have paid for the botcon version, and on top of all that, pay $45 to ship something that would have cost abiut $8 in the US.

1. Ok, average cost of Botcon TC, is $200 (average) with shipping probaly maxes to $215

2. BBTS gets Henkei TC, pays $60 + $xx to ship to them, depending on the mark-up, it may got for $110 to $150 + $12 to ship...and we still have no data on quantity or price. Still speculation for and this is a low ball price figure.

3. Stolen from factory, a sample of Henkie TC, or the stolen product on a Chinese epay auction. If it's the first run of the Henkei version, it willbe the same price as the Botcon version, with the ridiculous high shipping to send it to you.

I suggest you do your research, and find a Hekei TC ans SW with out the grubby hand mark up.

The bickering, the ill-informed, the whining, the child-like behaviour...ahhh Seibertron. I've missed you baby. Feh, I attended the last 3 years and got those seekers, love them. I want these too. When we got TC for Botcon it WAS an exclusive. It's been so for over a year now. Takara fires up their own version of the line and BAM! They can do whatever they like. Literally. I'm not bitching, I don't care really except for the fact I'll be buying these guys again. It makes me happy that others now get the opportunity. What doesn't is that people will still whine and complain and quite possibly not buy them because of the price points they will be demanding. My immediate thoughts are pony up or shut up. See, this is exactly why I don't post so often anymore. Makes me feel angry and negative. The very thing I despise. Eh, there are enough folks that know Flux is a jerk!