The Energon Pub

[ZeroWolf]

A lot of Xmas films tend to launch in November as they think people would be too broke to go the cinema at Xmas...not that it stopped the lotr films.

[shajaki]

The dumbest thing they did with Solo was move away from the "traditional" (as traditional as a few years get) December release and instead slapped it in the middle of the Avengers-Deadpool sandwich.

This.

Some speculate one of the issues was "Star Wars fatigue", but I think that's BS. We get a new Marvel movie (or two!) EVERY year, and people clearly aren't sick of that. Solo was simply too soon after after a tremendously upsetting installment, had poor advertising, and was competing with two highly anticipated blockbusters. One of which was ten years in the making!

[william-james88]

I really don't get the point of remaking the last Jedi. If it's a film that many fans disliked, why even bother bringing it up again. Wouldn't the idea instead be to just make a totally new film with a totally new story ignoring that the last Jedi ever existed?

[Burn]

I really don't get the point of remaking the last Jedi. If it's a film that many fans disliked, why even bother bringing it up again. Wouldn't the idea instead be to just make a totally new film with a totally new story ignoring that the last Jedi ever existed?

Or you know, maybe they should just get the **** over it. Yes, it wasn't a great movie (but then again, that comes down to individual opinion) but to remake it, and do what? How would these arse clowns do it any better? Because they're fans? HA! Putting fans in charge of creating is a **** terrible idea.

The Last Jedi happened, these buffoons just need to accept it and move on. There's plenty of other Star Wars lore out there for them (like go read the old expanded universe books!)

[ZeroWolf]

I really don't get the point of remaking the last Jedi. If it's a film that many fans disliked, why even bother bringing it up again. Wouldn't the idea instead be to just make a totally new film with a totally new story ignoring that the last Jedi ever existed?

Or you know, maybe they should just get the **** over it. Yes, it wasn't a great movie (but then again, that comes down to individual opinion) but to remake it, and do what? How would these arse clowns do it any better? Because they're fans? HA! Putting fans in charge of creating is a **** terrible idea.

The Last Jedi happened, these buffoons just need to accept it and move on. There's plenty of other Star Wars lore out there for them (like go read the old expanded universe books!)

This ^

[Ironhidensh]

I really don't get the point of remaking the last Jedi. If it's a film that many fans disliked, why even bother bringing it up again. Wouldn't the idea instead be to just make a totally new film with a totally new story ignoring that the last Jedi ever existed?

Or you know, maybe they should just get the **** over it. Yes, it wasn't a great movie (but then again, that comes down to individual opinion) but to remake it, and do what? How would these arse clowns do it any better? Because they're fans? HA! Putting fans in charge of creating is a **** terrible idea.

The Last Jedi happened, these buffoons just need to accept it and move on. There's plenty of other Star Wars lore out there for them (like go read the old expanded universe books!)

I often wonder how big a part of the problem the old EU plays. I love the EU, and all its other problems aside, when watching the new movies, I find myself thinking that this isn't how it should be, and wishing for the stories I spent over 20 years reading.

Its hard to let go of the old, and accept the new, especially when the new is a bag of dicks.

[Burn]

I often wonder how big a part of the problem the old EU plays. I love the EU, and all its other problems aside, when watching the new movies, I find myself thinking that this isn't how it should be, and wishing for the stories I spent over 20 years reading.

Its hard to let go of the old, and accept the new, especially when the new is a bag of dicks.

I'm a big fan of the EU as well, and I loathe that Disney came along and made it irrelevant. There were a number of fantastic stories.

But my love of the EU didn't blind me to how **** boring The Last Jedi was. From looking doing his best to ignore Rey, to the universes most slowest space-car chase, to a side story that served virtually no purpose ... ugh.

[shajaki]

I really don't get the point of remaking the last Jedi. If it's a film that many fans disliked, why even bother bringing it up again. Wouldn't the idea instead be to just make a totally new film with a totally new story ignoring that the last Jedi ever existed?

Or you know, maybe they should just get the **** over it. Yes, it wasn't a great movie (but then again, that comes down to individual opinion) but to remake it, and do what? How would these arse clowns do it any better? Because they're fans? HA! Putting fans in charge of creating is a **** terrible idea.

The Last Jedi happened, these buffoons just need to accept it and move on. There's plenty of other Star Wars lore out there for them (like go read the old expanded universe books!)

Ever since Bay started making TF movies, I've heard the phrase "raped my childhood" on more than one occasion. And I've always thought it was a ridiculous thing to say. Something new, even if it's bad, can't ruin something that was previously great. In the case of my example, the sheer existence of the Bay movies doesn't mean you can't enjoy the old stuff you know and love. It's still there, for playing/viewing pleasure, and will always be there. I don't love the Bay flicks, but I do enjoy them. Because I learned to let go. It's not MY Transformers, but they're brilliantly CGI'd transforming robots on the big screen, and that's pretty neat.

Not a quote because I don't remember exactly, but Kevin Smith once said you need to be able to take a step back and enjoy things for what they are. We're nerds, and nothing is ever going to be made EXACTLY the way we want it. I liked the Ghost Rider movies. They weren't good, but I got to see him on the big screen doing some badass things, and that's awesome.

All said.... The Last Jedi.. is actually the first time I felt like that ridiculous phrase rang true. It sounds lame, and I didn't even realize it until I saw his character completely destroyed in TLJ, but Luke Skywalker was a real hero of mine. And what they did to him was unforgivable. Nothing he did in that movie was appropriate for his character, and all it does is show that Rian Johnson (and everyone above him) has no idea what they're doing, and has no respect for the brand and its fandom.

My old Luke is still there, in my 480p DVD Theatrical Cut Star Wars Trilogy set. But I'll be damned if the stench of The Last Jedi doesn't still linger in my nostrils.

[Nemesis Maximo]

I really don't get the point of remaking the last Jedi. If it's a film that many fans disliked, why even bother bringing it up again. Wouldn't the idea instead be to just make a totally new film with a totally new story ignoring that the last Jedi ever existed?

Or you know, maybe they should just get the **** over it. Yes, it wasn't a great movie (but then again, that comes down to individual opinion) but to remake it, and do what? How would these arse clowns do it any better? Because they're fans? HA! Putting fans in charge of creating is a **** terrible idea.

The Last Jedi happened, these buffoons just need to accept it and move on. There's plenty of other Star Wars lore out there for them (like go read the old expanded universe books!)

Ever since Bay started making TF movies, I've heard the phrase "raped my childhood" on more than one occasion. And I've always thought it was a ridiculous thing to say. Something new, even if it's bad, can't ruin something that was previously great. In the case of my example, the sheer existence of the Bay movies doesn't mean you can't enjoy the old stuff you know and love. It's still there, for playing/viewing pleasure, and will always be there. I don't love the Bay flicks, but I do enjoy them. Because I learned to let go. It's not MY Transformers, but they're brilliantly CGI'd transforming robots on the big screen, and that's pretty neat.

Not a quote because I don't remember exactly, but Kevin Smith once said you need to be able to take a step back and enjoy things for what they are. We're nerds, and nothing is ever going to be made EXACTLY the way we want it. I liked the Ghost Rider movies. They weren't good, but I got to see him on the big screen doing some badass things, and that's awesome.

All said.... The Last Jedi.. is actually the first time I felt like that ridiculous phrase rang true. It sounds lame, and I didn't even realize it until I saw his character completely destroyed in TLJ, but Luke Skywalker was a real hero of mine. And what they did to him was unforgivable. Nothing he did in that movie was appropriate for his character, and all it does is show that Rian Johnson (and everyone above him) has no idea what they're doing, and has no respect for the brand and its fandom.

My old Luke is still there, in my 480p DVD Theatrical Cut Star Wars Trilogy set. But I'll be damned if the stench of The Last Jedi doesn't still linger in my nostrils.

The difference is, that TF had what, at least 7 different versions before the Bay films came around? Star Wars only had 1: the films, and everything else was also just there. And the TF films haven’t systematically destroyed everything that has come before, just...gave it steroids and and a high protein diet.

[fenrir72]

Seems like the soytellers of KK pose have not learned the lessons from history ( cough cough Hasbro 1986 TF Movie cough cough)

Transitioning to new character, if done right would reap monumental profits.Heck it would further enrich the mythos!

But casually discarding iconic characters with nobodies (at least Hotrod from the 1986 Movie was sort off a Luke Skywalker for TFs, a very likeable/relatable character) like the recent ones introduced, you reap the whirlwind you have sown!

Didn't Hb admit they didn't realize how iconic Optimus was? despite being an expensive toy back in the 80s, his on screen presence had such an effect on the fans that literally Hb had to the a 180 with that snafu (same with Duke).

So hows Ray, Po and Finn now? Are they just as beloved? I still go for the original Pre and main Trilogy and even characters of the Clone Wars. Pure simple fantasy adventure setting! Sure we have allegorical reference to modern issues of reality, it was still a suspension of disbelief for that storyline!.

Also love how Lando was portrayed in Rebels....a coolio hustler and future destroyer of the Death Star! heck, even emo boy Anakin, what a contrast to necker breaker Darth "daddy" Vader! He snaps potential rivals or fools like they were disposable toothpicks!

I can just imagine how Palpatine kept on doing damage control with Imperial HRD! "Vader" quit snapping necks!Good help is so hard to find!"

Change is(?) inevitable.......but handle it with finese for the Force's sake!

[Burn]

And that's another point where The Last Jedi fell over.

We were introduced to Poe, Rey and Finn. We were introduced to Kylo Ren, the son of Han and Leia, we were introduced to this mysterious new villain in Snoke, a potential sub-story was planted in Captain Phasma and Finn.

And what happened?

Poe became a whipping boy for some new Commander that did nothing but die, Rey ... kinda spun her wheels, Finn was used as a side story but with some new character while Phasma was relegated to blink and you miss her dieing, Kylo continued to be an emo and Snoke got offed instead of us leaning anything about him.

Oh and Ackbar got blown up off screen.

It wasn't just Luke that got screwed over as a character, virtually all of them did.

[ZeroWolf]

Given mark hamil isn't getting any younger, wasn't in the best of shape and thus could only do a obi wan...maybe you all expected too much? Hype is a terrible thing (for a games reference, look at happy games and no man's sky. They promised the universe and delievered...a pond in comparison). Also nem@ there's now three versions of star wars (4 if you count the holiday special as it's own thing). You have the old eu (an idea for Disney to try and regain some momentum on this is to come up with a way to give an option on eu stories to be filmed), you have lucas's vision, and you have the current Disney films. Actually you might even have the games as another version of events as I don't think that all of them fit into the events of the eu.

The funny thing here is that when force awakens came out people didn't like the fact that it cut too closely to elements of the original trilogy (mostly new hope but with sprinkles of the others here and there) and say they wanted different...the phrase be careful what you wish for certainly rings true at this point. Disney listened, as did rian johnson and they went very different with the last jedi. So they got lambasted for it. Apparently, everyone wants a star wars movie but what is a star wars movie? It seems that it's something that the original creator and the fans can't agree on.

A lot of you have touched upon why and that's because we formed attachments, and developed our own understandings of them that they prehaps were never meant to have. What I'm about to say may be heresy but as iconic as a twist it was, making luke vaders son may have been a mistep for the franchise. If luke wasnt a skywalker, would people have complained about Rey being a nobody? After all, remove the family connection (which were all developments of ep 5 and 6) and luke is a no one who brought down the empire. A moral saying that anyone can achieve greatness.

[Burn]

My opinions on The Last Jedi don't come from emotional attachment, it's just a really poopy movie that pissed all over the one that came before it and nuked everything Abrams had started to build.

Don't need emotional attachment to know that's seriously **** up.

[ZeroWolf]

That's the risk though of having a story split between different directors, why should rian be beholden to what abrams have done? As it looks to me, rian changed things to try and avoid the criticism that force awakens received. Personally I liked the idea that rey's parents didn't matter. Snoke was a wasted opportunity, no arguments there, but I doubt abrams would have handled him better ultimately.

[fenrir72]

Using the same analogy used by them old fogey knowit alls aka critics back in 1986 that TF the Movie was a very cynical attempt by a big bad corp to cram down the customer's throats a new toyline, the TFA is just the same cynical attempt aka "It's wasa TRAP"! Itself!

If KK's Lucasfilm wanted to continue the SW fresh then they should have started the story several thousand years post RotJ without ANY of the Skywalkers! Putting wimpy boy Kylo as the main villain who at the same time is the grandkid of badass Darth Vader is just a cashgrab wonking on nostalgia!

They trapped the viewers using iconic characters then puked on the fans when they complained! Rogue One is an exception (wished they kept John Williams though). Not to mention Lucasfilm's cronies' plodding attempts to put horse blinders denying the fact there's something really wrong with their version of the franchise.

One example of this I read is a so called TLJ defender in one of them Hollywood online shill sites ribbing at fans that TFA was actually a dig at ALL fans who are still OCD with the Skywalkers (aka Ren with Vader's mask) who just can't move on!

Talk about adding insult to injury yet didn't KK's Lucasfilm also used the "past" to lure in the fans again? If they really wanted to be bold and daring, start the franchise WITHOUT any of the Skywalkers!

That would take someone with balls to pull such a stunt!

But the damage is already done (see how the toys are selling like hotcakes ). The I want them toys factor is just gone! A really really bad symptom that Disney should rectify (if they still can)

[ZeroWolf]

Imagine if they did feature a movie trilogy with no link to skywalker at all...they would have been crucified for it. Though I do wonder if they really would have been better just doing old Republic era...but that would have presented its own problems no doubt.

Now who has had it easier then, the films or the department in charge of rebels?

[Ironhidensh]

Imagine if they did feature a movie trilogy with no link to skywalker at all...they would have been crucified for it. Though I do wonder if they really would have been better just doing old Republic era...but that would have presented its own problems no doubt.

Now who has had it easier then, the films or the department in charge of rebels?

Would they have been crucified? One of the all time best selling line of EU books was the X-Wing series.

[ZeroWolf]

That was the books though, they and the games seem to have much more room to maneuver in these regards.

[shajaki]

I'm going to drop it after this. I don't want to dwell on TLJ much more, but this video explains virtually EVERY problem I had with it. Minus the gripe about the throne room battle, and the hyperspace suicide (even though I do understand his point).

[Burn]

That's the risk though of having a story split between different directors, why should rian be beholden to what abrams have done?

Because it was the second part in a three movie series. Why would you not continue on with what had been established in the previous movie? It's a direct continuation.

But wait, here's Rian Johnson who nukes the foundations that Abrams established to build his own ... then wonders why people complain, and what does he do? Write the detractors off as "crying man-babies". Yeah, that's professional. Sure, some of them were crying man-babies, and any twats that went out of their way to send death threats and stuff to some of the female staff can go **** themselves sideways with a cricket bat wrapped in rusty barbed wire, but a LOT of fans were able to express their disappointment in a civil manner, but were lumped in with the man-children.

[ZeroWolf]

Ah that's because it's always easier to lump people in with the extremes, happens every where these days, not helped of course by the fact that the extremes can drown out everyone else. Any middle ground of wanting to hear civilised constructive criticism is rapidly disappearing. It's the same with the reverse, in some circles, merely liking something isn't enough anymore.

[shajaki]

Death threats and the like... I don't think I've ever been that passionate about anything

[shajaki]

Oh my god... I'm doing a Jurassic Park marathon, just finished III, and who produced it? Kathleen Kennedy

[ZeroWolf]

:lol:

Oh my god... I'm doing a Jurassic Park marathon, just finished III, and who produced it? Kathleen Kennedy

Wasn't it ILM who did some of the effects for jurassic park? You know, really I think the only person who really made out like a bandit when Disney got sw was Harrison Ford...He got killed off, just like he wanted to finally, and he nabbed a indy 5 film. Not to bad Harrison, not too bad.

[fenrir72]

:lol:

Oh my god... I'm doing a Jurassic Park marathon, just finished III, and who produced it? Kathleen Kennedy

KK just produced it. Same with Who Framed Roger Rabbit and a bunch of other hits. She did NOT have any creative INPUT.

In SW, when Disney bought Lucasfilm, KK, she took on the role of George Lucas as SW Czarina! She herself admitted it directly that she was force feeding her "agenda" into the franchise.

Lucas was anti Nixon but (he too had his liberal agenda)the way he weaved it into the character Palpatine was sheer luck or genius or both. The rest is history!

Here? You got nuthing!

Also, the Manbaby diatribes by old basketball head Johnson............heeeeeeeeeeello?! Manbabies are the sorry sods who got the cash to buy your franchise products! Not the noisy too assertive and triggered for their own good "not" manbabies shilling for KK.

When will they ever LEARN?!