The Energon Pub

D-340 wrote:Oh, you're definately right about the Energon/Allspark deal. That's one of the things I don't like. ut I wounldn't go as far as to compare this to the Super Mario Bros. movie though. It's not that far removed from the source material as a whole(not just G1, but all the incarnations of TF).

I wasn't trying to compare the film as a whole to Super Mario Bros., I was just using it as an example of a really poorly recieved change made for a film adaptation. I do have some major qualms but I think a lot of the changes made were a reasonable compromise. Unfortunately it also makes the ones that don't feel like a compromise at all (Starscream, for starters) seem all the more glaring.

Leonardo wrote:I hadn't thought of that!

I am confused by what you say, though. At what point, with regards to the Allspark, did they listen to fans? Are you talking about how they changed the name from Energon Cube to Allspark?

Anyway, I don't see why the TFs had to be searching for their source of life. It seems pointlessly grand. Why not just have them searching for energon, that which keeps them alive?

My suspicion is that they probably wanted to avoid at all costs the potential for any real-life parallels that could be construed as anti-war. The bipartisan conflict here in the U.S. is as tense as ever and with the Iraq and Afghanistan wars going on they probably didn't want the press to make a political issue of the film (like they have with Happy Feet and just about every other film in the last 4 years). Two factions of an alien race tearing apart a planet and inflicting mass collateral damage on civilians in a battle over fuel probably wouldn't have sat as well with the military or right-wing fans Bay tends to court as a battle over an all-powerful life-creating relic will.

its B.S. because they say that the fans will trash the movie

"You don't want them to trash your project."
tell me what they mean by that?

D-340 wrote:

Ultra Markus wrote:and another thing that article was an insult to every tf or sci-fi fan
"Hard-core fans represent a small piece of the viewing public, but they influence geek culture, journalists, Wall Street. You don't want them to trash your project." If these fans embrace a project, as they did 300 and Heroes, they can kick-start a hit."

what a bunch of B.S.

Actually it's no where near BS. This film, like most others are made for the general public. In this case, I'm actually kinda glad for certain changes. Yeah some of the designs suck, and the story isn't totally G1, but the movie if successful will make sure TF's are around even longer.

Let's look at Firefly. That was made totally for the fans, and it flopped. Now there's really nothing going on for it or the Serenity series. If TF went the same way, I'd hate to say it, that would kill the franchise. In truth, for this movie, we are a very small fraction of the audience, and if this fails you know Hasbro's would pull the plug on TF's all together. I guess I'm saying I'd rather deal with some change if it's gonna create longevity for the fanchise as whole.

so your OK with them saying that the fans will trash the movie

Ultra Markus wrote:

D-340 wrote:

Ultra Markus wrote:and another thing that article was an insult to every tf or sci-fi fan
"Hard-core fans represent a small piece of the viewing public, but they influence geek culture, journalists, Wall Street. You don't want them to trash your project." If these fans embrace a project, as they did 300 and Heroes, they can kick-start a hit."

what a bunch of B.S.

Actually it's no where near BS. This film, like most others are made for the general public. In this case, I'm actually kinda glad for certain changes. Yeah some of the designs suck, and the story isn't totally G1, but the movie if successful will make sure TF's are around even longer.

Let's look at Firefly. That was made totally for the fans, and it flopped. Now there's really nothing going on for it or the Serenity series. If TF went the same way, I'd hate to say it, that would kill the franchise. In truth, for this movie, we are a very small fraction of the audience, and if this fails you know Hasbro's would pull the plug on TF's all together. I guess I'm saying I'd rather deal with some change if it's gonna create longevity for the fanchise as whole.

so your OK with them saying that the fans will trash the movie

I believe he meant trash as in 'trash-talk' or to discard; reject.

Doesnt really say much about Transformers at all, other than saying it is because of fans that the film is being made, and that it is highly anticipated.
The fans are the reason the film is getting made, but the fans had bare minimal (if any) input to the film.

Fireblast wrote:Seeing your post count allow me to be the first to welcome you here to Seibertron.com! Anyways, I don't know if you know but Bumblebee isn't a Volkswagon because Michael Bay thinks Volkswagon is too much "Herbie the Love Bug" thing. Now in my opinion I think anyone who knew hardly anything about Transformers would look at a Volkswagon and know it's Bumblebee.

On another hand when I wanted a new Transformer movie I specifically rather see recognizable characters than a bajillion of moving parts forming an ape-chicken-pig hybrid.

Wow , after reading that, I wanted to hit myself over the head with a sledgehammer. If your gonna rip on Bay, at least get your facts straight, and save yourself from sounding totally ignorant.

It's very common knowledge that Bumblebee can't, won't, and hasn't been a VW for years because VW does not want their products being associated with war. Bay had nothing, I repeat NOTHING to do with BB not being a VW bug. I thought we were all beyond this sometime last year.

Ultra Markus wrote:

D-340 wrote:

Ultra Markus wrote:and another thing that article was an insult to every tf or sci-fi fan
"Hard-core fans represent a small piece of the viewing public, but they influence geek culture, journalists, Wall Street. You don't want them to trash your project." If these fans embrace a project, as they did 300 and Heroes, they can kick-start a hit."

what a bunch of B.S.

Actually it's no where near BS. This film, like most others are made for the general public. In this case, I'm actually kinda glad for certain changes. Yeah some of the designs suck, and the story isn't totally G1, but the movie if successful will make sure TF's are around even longer.

Let's look at Firefly. That was made totally for the fans, and it flopped. Now there's really nothing going on for it or the Serenity series. If TF went the same way, I'd hate to say it, that would kill the franchise. In truth, for this movie, we are a very small fraction of the audience, and if this fails you know Hasbro's would pull the plug on TF's all together. I guess I'm saying I'd rather deal with some change if it's gonna create longevity for the fanchise as whole.

so your OK with them saying that the fans will trash the movie

Since when has any fan base not talked trash about movie being made on any given property.

Nice to see that TF got reference in a major news mag.

D-340 wrote:

Fireblast wrote:Seeing your post count allow me to be the first to welcome you here to Seibertron.com! Anyways, I don't know if you know but Bumblebee isn't a Volkswagon because Michael Bay thinks Volkswagon is too much "Herbie the Love Bug" thing. Now in my opinion I think anyone who knew hardly anything about Transformers would look at a Volkswagon and know it's Bumblebee.

On another hand when I wanted a new Transformer movie I specifically rather see recognizable characters than a bajillion of moving parts forming an ape-chicken-pig hybrid.

Wow , after reading that, I wanted to hit myself over the head with a sledgehammer. If your gonna rip on Bay, at least get your facts straight, and save yourself from sounding totally ignorant.

It's very common knowledge that Bumblebee can't, won't, and hasn't been a VW for years because VW does not want their products being associated with war. Bay had nothing, I repeat NOTHING to do with BB not being a VW bug. I thought we were all beyond this sometime last year.

It's true. I read it here.

Leonardo wrote:

D-340 wrote:

Fireblast wrote:Seeing your post count allow me to be the first to welcome you here to Seibertron.com! Anyways, I don't know if you know but Bumblebee isn't a Volkswagon because Michael Bay thinks Volkswagon is too much "Herbie the Love Bug" thing. Now in my opinion I think anyone who knew hardly anything about Transformers would look at a Volkswagon and know it's Bumblebee.

On another hand when I wanted a new Transformer movie I specifically rather see recognizable characters than a bajillion of moving parts forming an ape-chicken-pig hybrid.

Wow , after reading that, I wanted to hit myself over the head with a sledgehammer. If your gonna rip on Bay, at least get your facts straight, and save yourself from sounding totally ignorant.

It's very common knowledge that Bumblebee can't, won't, and hasn't been a VW for years because VW does not want their products being associated with war. Bay had nothing, I repeat NOTHING to do with BB not being a VW bug. I thought we were all beyond this sometime last year.

It's true. I read it here.

That's fine, he may not have wanted BB to be a VW(I don't remember seeing that myself), but he's not the reason BB can't be a VW and has not for years. The way that was said, it's blameing Bay for BB not being a VW, totally disregarding the fact that years ago we knew we'd never see a VW TF again. Remember the stink VW raised over the BB Alt. concept? And that was when the TF movie was just a rumor, so say that Bay's responsible for it is like saying Bay is responible for Armada sucking.

D-340 wrote:

Leonardo wrote:

D-340 wrote:

Fireblast wrote:Seeing your post count allow me to be the first to welcome you here to Seibertron.com! Anyways, I don't know if you know but Bumblebee isn't a Volkswagon because Michael Bay thinks Volkswagon is too much "Herbie the Love Bug" thing. Now in my opinion I think anyone who knew hardly anything about Transformers would look at a Volkswagon and know it's Bumblebee.

On another hand when I wanted a new Transformer movie I specifically rather see recognizable characters than a bajillion of moving parts forming an ape-chicken-pig hybrid.

Wow , after reading that, I wanted to hit myself over the head with a sledgehammer. If your gonna rip on Bay, at least get your facts straight, and save yourself from sounding totally ignorant.

It's very common knowledge that Bumblebee can't, won't, and hasn't been a VW for years because VW does not want their products being associated with war. Bay had nothing, I repeat NOTHING to do with BB not being a VW bug. I thought we were all beyond this sometime last year.

It's true. I read it here.

That's fine, he may not have wanted BB to be a VW(I don't remember seeing that myself), but he's not the reason BB can't be a VW and has not for years. The way that was said, it's blameing Bay for BB not being a VW, totally disregarding the fact that years ago we knew we'd never see a VW TF again. Remember the stink VW raised over the BB Alt. concept? And that was when the TF movie was just a rumor, so say that Bay's responsible for it is like saying Bay is responible for Armada sucking.

I was agreeing with you, not Fireblast. Bay can't be blamed for everything.

Leonardo wrote:

D-340 wrote:

Leonardo wrote:

D-340 wrote:

Fireblast wrote:Seeing your post count allow me to be the first to welcome you here to Seibertron.com! Anyways, I don't know if you know but Bumblebee isn't a Volkswagon because Michael Bay thinks Volkswagon is too much "Herbie the Love Bug" thing. Now in my opinion I think anyone who knew hardly anything about Transformers would look at a Volkswagon and know it's Bumblebee.

On another hand when I wanted a new Transformer movie I specifically rather see recognizable characters than a bajillion of moving parts forming an ape-chicken-pig hybrid.

Wow , after reading that, I wanted to hit myself over the head with a sledgehammer. If your gonna rip on Bay, at least get your facts straight, and save yourself from sounding totally ignorant.

It's very common knowledge that Bumblebee can't, won't, and hasn't been a VW for years because VW does not want their products being associated with war. Bay had nothing, I repeat NOTHING to do with BB not being a VW bug. I thought we were all beyond this sometime last year.

It's true. I read it here.

That's fine, he may not have wanted BB to be a VW(I don't remember seeing that myself), but he's not the reason BB can't be a VW and has not for years. The way that was said, it's blameing Bay for BB not being a VW, totally disregarding the fact that years ago we knew we'd never see a VW TF again. Remember the stink VW raised over the BB Alt. concept? And that was when the TF movie was just a rumor, so say that Bay's responsible for it is like saying Bay is responible for Armada sucking.

I was agreeing with you, not Fireblast. Bay can't be blamed for everything.

I don't remember where, but Bay has said at one point that as a secondary reason he didn't Want BB to be compared with the love bug, which would be another reason for them making him something other than a VW bug.

....then again, that may have just been something he said to keep VW for suing him for badmouthing them over their anti-war BS.


& yeah, Leo, earlier I was just referring to how they changed the name of of the Allspark from the Energon cube to what it is now. There was enough people complaining about their misunderstanding about TF terminology that they decided to change the name to better suit the cube's purpose.

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:

Leonardo wrote:

D-340 wrote:

Leonardo wrote:

D-340 wrote:

Fireblast wrote:Seeing your post count allow me to be the first to welcome you here to Seibertron.com! Anyways, I don't know if you know but Bumblebee isn't a Volkswagon because Michael Bay thinks Volkswagon is too much "Herbie the Love Bug" thing. Now in my opinion I think anyone who knew hardly anything about Transformers would look at a Volkswagon and know it's Bumblebee.

On another hand when I wanted a new Transformer movie I specifically rather see recognizable characters than a bajillion of moving parts forming an ape-chicken-pig hybrid.

Wow , after reading that, I wanted to hit myself over the head with a sledgehammer. If your gonna rip on Bay, at least get your facts straight, and save yourself from sounding totally ignorant.

It's very common knowledge that Bumblebee can't, won't, and hasn't been a VW for years because VW does not want their products being associated with war. Bay had nothing, I repeat NOTHING to do with BB not being a VW bug. I thought we were all beyond this sometime last year.

It's true. I read it here.

That's fine, he may not have wanted BB to be a VW(I don't remember seeing that myself), but he's not the reason BB can't be a VW and has not for years. The way that was said, it's blameing Bay for BB not being a VW, totally disregarding the fact that years ago we knew we'd never see a VW TF again. Remember the stink VW raised over the BB Alt. concept? And that was when the TF movie was just a rumor, so say that Bay's responsible for it is like saying Bay is responible for Armada sucking.

I was agreeing with you, not Fireblast. Bay can't be blamed for everything.

I don't remember where, but Bay has said at one point that as a secondary reason he didn't Want BB to be compared with the love bug, which would be another reason for them making him something other than a VW bug.

....then again, that may have just been something he said to keep VW for suing him for badmouthing them over their anti-war BS.


& yeah, Leo, earlier I was just referring to how they changed the name of of the Allspark from the Energon cube to what it is now. There was enough people complaining about their misunderstanding about TF terminology that they decided to change the name to better suit the cube's purpose.

I read the love bug thing too but wasn't sure how true it was.

I see what you mean about the Allspark, as well.

Leonardo wrote: I was agreeing with you, not Fireblast. Bay can't be blamed for everything.

I'm sorry if that came off as confronting. Didn't mean it that way. Just saying I don't remember Bay saying that. But it seems like he's some sorta pariah to some fans though, eh?

He certainly is! Fandoms can be vicious, though.

Liege Evilmus wrote:We kept the name alive and proved that a following of the name was large enough to draw in a crowd.

So they took the name and and made a film that they had in mind.

The End

Well put.

I understand the constraints involved in translating a cartoon into a live-action film. Yes, I know CGI G1-style would look lame. I know this, but just because Sherk and every other mass-produced piece of crap is now CGI does not mean TF has to be. Has anyone even considered that they might have gone a more traditional route...animation, perhaps?

Can you imagine a 2 hour long story drawn by the best hands in the industry...not cutsey Disney crap, eithier. Manga-style animation, with a subtle dose of realism.

Oh yeah, and lots of violence.

That for me, would be the ultimate translation from the original source material, while still taking it up several notches. But it would never happen.

Just my thoughts, thats all.

1Big\"F\"ingRayOfSunshine wrote:

LuckytheWonderLlama wrote:Good article.

This movie is going to be great! Thanks to all the hard work that the crew put into it. I'm sorry that there are people out there that can not see beyond their own shallow expectations and do not understand that every incarnation of Transformers has been different than the one before it. Forgive those that have criticised your hard work all along. For they can do no better.

Exactly, what is the point of 25 years of canon if it is nothing but different universes and alternate timelines that rewrites itself as it see fit. Between the old marvel comic, the cartoon, the newer stuff there is no canon but merely origins and deaths that fit in with the current storyline at the time. People want to cry and whine because its different and the quote of "people fear change" is an ideal example of how a lot of the fandom is acting, a lot of people have had change of hearts and some are still adament but no matter who made the movie and who did the designs someone will always complain about something.


Edit: Theres a reason "they" are writing movies and "we" are on websites dissecting their every decision.

I call BS.

If IDW were given the keys to this baby, don't you think they would have crafted a story with more care to the mythos? Hearts of Steel is a prime example. Take the TFs, place them in another period of time, alter them completley, but show RESPECT to the original designs in the process.

Not saying I will not see the film. I will, but after the credits roll, I am pretty sure that I will walk out disgusted. How do I know this, you ask?

Because I have watched all of Bay's films. They are all the same, and they all suck with the worst of them.

But, I will give it a chance, as a fan, and I will see it.

Then, "...let the verbal beatings begin!" to paraphrase someone's sig here.

Pretty stereotyped....

GetterDragun wrote:We got Cullen in Time Magazine. Mission accomplished.

Excellent point.

Nico wrote::-x Pretty stereotyped....

Could you perhaps expand on that?

With Steven Spielberg producing and Michael Bay directing this $150 million effects-ravaganza about dueling alien robot races, the protagonist could have been Will Smith or magazine-cover bait like Justin Timberlake

WTF!? Justin Timberlake? If he was in it that movie it would have been an 2 hours song video

YouFearGalvatron wrote:

Liege Evilmus wrote:We kept the name alive and proved that a following of the name was large enough to draw in a crowd.

So they took the name and and made a film that they had in mind.

The End

Well put.

I understand the constraints involved in translating a cartoon into a live-action film. Yes, I know CGI G1-style would look lame. I know this, but just because Sherk and every other mass-produced piece of crap is now CGI does not mean TF has to be. Has anyone even considered that they might have gone a more traditional route...animation, perhaps?

Can you imagine a 2 hour long story drawn by the best hands in the industry...not cutsey Disney crap, eithier. Manga-style animation, with a subtle dose of realism.

Oh yeah, and lots of violence.

That for me, would be the ultimate translation from the original source material, while still taking it up several notches. But it would never happen.

Just my thoughts, thats all.

No. Just...no.

I don't know if you live here or not, but in America, unless the names "Trey Parker" "Matt Stone" "Matt Groening" or "Williams Street" is attached to a cartoon movie, it's meant for kids.

It doersn't matter if it's gory or not, no adult is going to take his buds to see a cartoon movie about TRANSFORMERS, which has a long standing rep of being a kids show, and not one of the best, at that.

EDIT: And before I forget: We had a fully cartoon movie of Transformers before. The art was fantastic, beautiful for an '80s movie.

Oh, and it bombed harder than Hiroshima.

Yeah, I'm not to keen on how they're spitting all these stereotypes out. I'm not a "nerd" or "geek" especially not by their definition. The general public are all stupid. F**K them and all their lame-a$$ taste in life. These so called "people" are boring husks, laying around, trying hard not to think, watching boring crap like sports, just wasting time before they die. They are all afraid of people like us. We have the power to out do them in every way. We are sort of like "the mutants" in X-Men. So i could care less about the general movie going public. They probably wont even go see Transformers on the basis of their already mindless assesment of it and the franchise, so pi$$ on what they think. If this film were going to be any sort of "why the TF's are cool", it would have been directed and overseen by a fan. Like the Spiderman films, we needed someone who has been a life long fan, and therefore, has probably been thinking about how it would look for years, not some stupid jock, who's pointless, misplaced confidence has led him to believe his vision is better than artist's.

Shadowman wrote:

YouFearGalvatron wrote:

Liege Evilmus wrote:We kept the name alive and proved that a following of the name was large enough to draw in a crowd.

So they took the name and and made a film that they had in mind.

The End

Well put.

I understand the constraints involved in translating a cartoon into a live-action film. Yes, I know CGI G1-style would look lame. I know this, but just because Sherk and every other mass-produced piece of crap is now CGI does not mean TF has to be. Has anyone even considered that they might have gone a more traditional route...animation, perhaps?

Can you imagine a 2 hour long story drawn by the best hands in the industry...not cutsey Disney crap, eithier. Manga-style animation, with a subtle dose of realism.

Oh yeah, and lots of violence.

That for me, would be the ultimate translation from the original source material, while still taking it up several notches. But it would never happen.

Just my thoughts, thats all.

No. Just...no.

I don't know if you live here or not, but in America, unless the names "Trey Parker" "Matt Stone" "Matt Groening" or "Williams Street" is attached to a cartoon movie, it's meant for kids.

It doersn't matter if it's gory or not, no adult is going to take his buds to see a cartoon movie about TRANSFORMERS, which has a long standing rep of being a kids show, and not one of the best, at that.

EDIT: And before I forget: We had a fully cartoon movie of Transformers before. The art was fantastic, beautiful for an '80s movie.

Oh, and it bombed harder than Hiroshima.

I disagree. Our culture has changed a lot since '86. I know, I was there.

I also did not mean those people doing it necessarily. But conventional animation is a much better medium to convey a story than CGI. Just my opinion.

It is also cheaper, I understand.

And I am from the US. You cannot compare the '86 film to what is wanted today. Tastes have changed. We have moved on.

At least I have. I am ready for intense violence and traditional animation, damnit.

Not that I will ever see it, mind you.

While I don't think it's necessarily better to be cel-animated, I do agree in as much as I, on an aesthetic level, prefer watching 2D cel-animated films over CGI films or films with CGI in. I saw Spiderman at the IMAX and I can't stress enough how shoddy it looked.