The Energon Pub

Sowndwave76 wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:It's fine if the artist thinks it's iconic, but that doesn't make it iconic. Anyone can have an opinion on what's iconic, but that doesn't mean that thing actually is iconic. I question your labelling.

Plus, do you have an interview where the designer actually think it's an iconic part of Blitz's design? It seems like an assumption you're making based on it's presence on this toy. That alone doesn't mean anything except that the team thought it should be included. As for their artistic intent, it doesn't matter. I get what their going for. What matters are results.

The difference here is that these designers are using what's been "standard" and a very common part of this character's design. "Iconic" in terms of personal interpretation is of course subjective.
Imo, and I think a ton of people would agree, "iconic" involves the aspect of a span of time.
The fact that this is a design element that is now being used 35-ish years after the original creation...
And that this design decision was clearly intentional...
I would most definitely say this qualifies as an iconic design element for this character, no matter anyone else's opinion, or a lack of "designer interview"...
The proof is literally in the result.

I'll counter with the fact that people had to be reminded that it exists and it's not something included in the TR toy.

Other parts of the design are iconic. The red visor and yellow helmet. The turret sticking upwards at the back. The colors used. But the part that few people remember? Even if it's a part of the original design, it doesn't seem to be an iconic part of that design.

You can't just say the designer thinks it's iconic without any proof. He's not you. He's using an old design element, sure, but you're ascribing it "iconic" status in someone else's eyes just because it's included. Inclusion isn't enough.

Sowndwave76 wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:It's fine if the artist thinks it's iconic, but that doesn't make it iconic. Anyone can have an opinion on what's iconic, but that doesn't mean that thing actually is iconic. I question your labelling.

Plus, do you have an interview where the designer actually think it's an iconic part of Blitz's design? It seems like an assumption you're making based on it's presence on this toy. That alone doesn't mean anything except that the team thought it should be included. As for their artistic intent, it doesn't matter. I get what their going for. What matters are results.

The difference here is that these designers are using what's been "standard" and a very common part of this character's design. "Iconic" in terms of personal interpretation is of course subjective.
Imo, and I think a ton of people would agree, "iconic" involves the aspect of a span of time.
The fact that this is a design element that is now being used 35-ish years after the original creation...
And that this design decision was clearly intentional...
I would most definitely say this qualifies as an iconic design element for this character, no matter anyone else's opinion, or a lack of "designer interview"...
The proof is literally in the result.

I'd argue that given the fact that a lot people needed to be reminded that that's how his vehicle mode was in the cartoon negates the idea that it's iconic to anyone but the designer

Also, and this is a personal nitpick with a lot of the arguing about it, is Blitzwing's cockpit really considered a faux part? Cause looking at the screenshots, it looks like his cockpit is facing the ground, with the detailing appearing on the top in tank mode. So technically, I don't think faux part would be the best descriptor, more a flawed attempt at having a greenhouse cockpit but applied to Blitzwing's jet?

Autobot N wrote:

D-Maximal_Primal wrote:I'm still confused as to why Bulkhead appears to be the one figure that really did not follow his universe of origin design. Everyone else is different stylistically but sort of close (Arcee), pretty dang close (G2 Prime), or utterly slavish (Blitzwing as we've seen), but Bulkhead isn't any of those. That's always been my hangup with him: Prime Universe, but the only thing alike is the head and mace.

I have checked my stores yesterday, still no sign of Legacy, though at this point I'm mainly only looking for Iguanus.

The prevailing theory on TFW was that he was a pretool for an Optimus Prime that was going to be released as a tie-in with the likely-cancelled Rise game, like how the Legacy Armada Starscream is apparently also a retool of the Starscream from that same line

the What game? This is the first I've heard of that (or at least if I had heard of it before I forgot it instantly), and if anything, the idea that 2 of the few non-g1 figures would be pretools for what I can only guess is a G1 inspired game based on current trends makes that design choice even dumber to me?

Either way, that's weird.

DeathReviews wrote:In ye olde days, it was easier to let bygones be, because there was no internet and no forums where everybody could post their opinions, and where everybody could also hide safely at home and insult other people for their opinions.

This right here, way back when you mouthed of to someone you had to look them in the eye then you got the consequences.

I will pick up blitzwing as it in my eyes is way better than previous versions.

D-Maximal_Primal wrote:

Autobot N wrote:

D-Maximal_Primal wrote:I'm still confused as to why Bulkhead appears to be the one figure that really did not follow his universe of origin design. Everyone else is different stylistically but sort of close (Arcee), pretty dang close (G2 Prime), or utterly slavish (Blitzwing as we've seen), but Bulkhead isn't any of those. That's always been my hangup with him: Prime Universe, but the only thing alike is the head and mace.

I have checked my stores yesterday, still no sign of Legacy, though at this point I'm mainly only looking for Iguanus.

The prevailing theory on TFW was that he was a pretool for an Optimus Prime that was going to be released as a tie-in with the likely-cancelled Rise game, like how the Legacy Armada Starscream is apparently also a retool of the Starscream from that same line

the What game? This is the first I've heard of that (or at least if I had heard of it before I forgot it instantly), and if anything, the idea that 2 of the few non-g1 figures would be pretools for what I can only guess is a G1 inspired game based on current trends makes that design choice even dumber to me?

Either way, that's weird.

An obstenisbly upcoming transformers game with a development name of Transformers: Rise, currently caught somewhere between development hell and secretly cancelled. According to rumors/leakers, there were going to be four new molds split into 2 bot vs. con 2-packs, featuring optimus, starscream, soundwave, and iirc bumblebee, using the new designs of those characters in the game.

I can't remember where the line between rumor and speculation was drawn, but iirc soundwave was going to be a panel van/fbi surveillance van, and starscream was going to have a g1-inspired robot mode and turned into either an f-22 or an f-35 (can't remember which) in g1 colors. I don't remember hearing anything about the bots, but leakers stating that one of jhiaxus or armada starscream (they said which one I just forget) is retooled from rise starscream lends credence to the speculation of bulkhead=optimus pretool.

I found it interesting that with all the comparison shots with new Blitzwing not one was with my favorite bad-ass rep of Blitzy.....




'nuff said!

alekese wrote:

D-Maximal_Primal wrote:

Autobot N wrote:

D-Maximal_Primal wrote:I'm still confused as to why Bulkhead appears to be the one figure that really did not follow his universe of origin design. Everyone else is different stylistically but sort of close (Arcee), pretty dang close (G2 Prime), or utterly slavish (Blitzwing as we've seen), but Bulkhead isn't any of those. That's always been my hangup with him: Prime Universe, but the only thing alike is the head and mace.

I have checked my stores yesterday, still no sign of Legacy, though at this point I'm mainly only looking for Iguanus.

The prevailing theory on TFW was that he was a pretool for an Optimus Prime that was going to be released as a tie-in with the likely-cancelled Rise game, like how the Legacy Armada Starscream is apparently also a retool of the Starscream from that same line

the What game? This is the first I've heard of that (or at least if I had heard of it before I forgot it instantly), and if anything, the idea that 2 of the few non-g1 figures would be pretools for what I can only guess is a G1 inspired game based on current trends makes that design choice even dumber to me?

Either way, that's weird.

An obstenisbly upcoming transformers game with a development name of Transformers: Rise, currently caught somewhere between development hell and secretly cancelled. According to rumors/leakers, there were going to be four new molds split into 2 bot vs. con 2-packs, featuring optimus, starscream, soundwave, and iirc bumblebee, using the new designs of those characters in the game.

I can't remember where the line between rumor and speculation was drawn, but iirc soundwave was going to be a panel van/fbi surveillance van, and starscream was going to have a g1-inspired robot mode and turned into either an f-22 or an f-35 (can't remember which) in g1 colors. I don't remember hearing anything about the bots, but leakers stating that one of jhiaxus or armada starscream (they said which one I just forget) is retooled from rise starscream lends credence to the speculation of bulkhead=optimus pretool.

Armada Screamer is the one who is supposed to share a mold/engineering with the Rise Screamer (although I don't remember it being said that that figure was to be as G1 as is being said here), and I believe it was said that Bee was going to be some variety of off-road design.

I think I've lost the Bulkhead/Optimus narrative at this point, I'm still sure I remember one of the leakers (I think it was Wreckgar) blatantly stating in one of the now-deleted/locked leak threads that Bulkhead shares a mold with "Prime Optimus", which people speculated had to be specifically the Beast Hunters design to make it work, and yet now there's people over there saying that never happened and being an Optimus mold-share was just speculation to begin with? I don't care enough to try to figure it out, at this point.

I am gonna get the retail Bulkhead rather than wait for the Wreckers one though, as I'm still holding out hope the Wreckers repaint will actually be a different character like Pyro, and if it isn't and it is just an Animated Bulkhead repaint, then those colors on this body would make him look even MORE like Hound and I would rather stick with the retail lighter green.

The real question about Legacy: What dress will best fit Kickback?
</Insecticomics>

Razorbeast88 wrote:

Wolfman Jake wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:I don't think mine are. Sure it's subjective, but nobody talking about it seems to be thrilled it's there. At best I'm seeing people as being tolerant.

If it were an iconic part of his alt mode, I think people would be as happy about seeing it there as they were with Netflix Bee's alt. mode. Unless you're seeing posts I haven't about how much it adds to the look.

Here's the thing, though. You don't have to believe that cockpit on the tank mode is iconic. That's because, you didn't make this. A team of engineers and artists at Hasbro and Takara did. You're just a consumer. There is always going to be a disconnect between the artist and the consumer of the art.

Finally, someone who wrote exactly what I think is correct, amidst the majority of people here who rationally stated the opposite of what I believe.

Fixed it for you.

primalxconvoy wrote:

Razorbeast88 wrote:

Wolfman Jake wrote:

Gauntlet101010 wrote:I don't think mine are. Sure it's subjective, but nobody talking about it seems to be thrilled it's there. At best I'm seeing people as being tolerant.

If it were an iconic part of his alt mode, I think people would be as happy about seeing it there as they were with Netflix Bee's alt. mode. Unless you're seeing posts I haven't about how much it adds to the look.

Here's the thing, though. You don't have to believe that cockpit on the tank mode is iconic. That's because, you didn't make this. A team of engineers and artists at Hasbro and Takara did. You're just a consumer. There is always going to be a disconnect between the artist and the consumer of the art.

Finally, someone who wrote exactly what I think is correct, amidst the majority of people here who rationally stated the opposite of what I believe.

Fixed it for you.

It's not a matter of correct or incorrect, considering almost all of the conversation about blitzwing is exchange of opinion. It's just nice to see when someone points out potential reasons why the design is what it is and attempts to understand it, instead of just whining. You of course are my favorite whiner in these forums, especially when you whine about the same toy reviewer over and over and over again. Never gets old

Nemesis Destron wrote:I found it interesting that with all the comparison shots with new Blitzwing not one was with my favorite bad-ass rep of Blitzy.....




'nuff said!

I stated, a while back, that I would be keeping my TR version, but failed to say that it was actually the Japanese version. Even with the irrelevant headmaster gimmick and slightly elongated proportions, overall it's far superior to the Legacy version, IMO. So far, Hasblo has failed to make any good, updated G1 triple-changers of late. Springer was covered in cr@pple-damage paint, Astrotrain had a naked rear/back to his shuttlemode, cr@ppie-damage paint and had useless accessories that jacked-up the price and finally, Blitzwing glaring design flaws.

I'm still gobsmacked at how the whole "WFC/G1 SSl Legacy" line has had some amazing sculpts, that were let down by extremely poor distribution (in both Japan and the US, UK, etc), bad paint choices, adding unwanted "bulk" (be it accessories or extra figures) to increase the price, and sub-par engineering.

As a collector, I usually buy most of any "collector" lines like these, but recently, Hasblo has left a LOT of my money on the table.

They need to do better.

Sorry, I had to use Google translate for your last one there. I think you meant this?

Razorbeast88 wrote: Even though it all boils down to opinion It's just nice to see when someone, anyone even, aggrees with my own rational POV, because I feel many other people here don't and are not rational at all. Thus, any other poster with a contradictory opinion on this thread is a "whiner" and I've no need to offer a rational argument to back this claim up. If anyone calls me out on this hypocritical viewpoint, I can engage in "whataboutism" and devolve into petty insults that are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Everybody knows that this is a guaranteed way to prove my point and engender myself to the community.

Hope that's fixed it for you.

primalxconvoy wrote:Sorry, I had to use Google translate for your last one there. I think you meant this?

Razorbeast88 wrote: Even though it all boils down to opinion It's just nice to see when someone, anyone even, aggrees with my own rational POV, because I feel many other people here don't and are not rational at all. Thus, any other poster with a contradictory opinion on this thread is a "whiner" and I've no need to offer a rational argument to back this claim up. If anyone calls me out on this hypocritical viewpoint, I can engage in "whataboutism" and devolve into petty insults that are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Everybody knows that this is a guaranteed way to prove my point and engender myself to the community.

Hope that's fixed it for you.

Lol what language did you use on Google translate? Definitely not fixed. But if you need me to slow things down for you I'd be happy to

You may have stumbled onto a trampoline section of Google with all the conclusions you're jumping to. I dont think anyone that disagrees with me is automatically irrational or a whiner. There are plenty of people that have mentioned what they don't like about this figure and/or that they prefer a previous figure of the character in rational ways. If you don't know what a whiner is, im sure YouTube has plenty of educational videos for you, and if you're lucky maybe a cocomelon video will play afterwards so you can jam out. I dont really have a point to prove lol I made a comment that you took offense to and you started making assumptions. That along with petty insults seem to be more in your expertise, not mine

Razorbeast88 wrote:

primalxconvoy wrote:Sorry, I had to use Google translate for your last one there. I think you meant this?

Razorbeast88 wrote: Even though it all boils down to opinion It's just nice to see when someone, anyone even, aggrees with my own rational POV, because I feel many other people here don't and are not rational at all. Thus, any other poster with a contradictory opinion on this thread is a "whiner" and I've no need to offer a rational argument to back this claim up. If anyone calls me out on this hypocritical viewpoint, I can engage in "whataboutism" and devolve into petty insults that are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Everybody knows that this is a guaranteed way to prove my point and engender myself to the community.

Hope that's fixed it for you.

Lol what language did you use on Google translate? Definitely not fixed. But if you need me to slow things down for you I'd be happy to

You may have stumbled onto a trampoline section of Google with all the conclusions you're jumping to. I dont think anyone that disagrees with me is automatically irrational or a whiner. There are plenty of people that have mentioned what they don't like about this figure and/or that they prefer a previous figure of the character in rational ways. If you don't know what a whiner is, im sure YouTube has plenty of educational videos for you, and if you're lucky maybe a cocomelon video will play afterwards so you can jam out. I dont really have a point to prove lol I made a comment that you took offense to and you started making assumptions. That along with petty insults seem to be more in your expertise, not mine

Except that is exactly what you did. Instead of just writing "It's nice to read a rational argument that supports my idea", you dishonoured that viewpoint by soiling it with your own, which included insults to anyone else in this thread that held a contradictory view.

I would advise you to be more careful with your choice of lexis in the future.

primalxconvoy wrote:

Razorbeast88 wrote:

primalxconvoy wrote:Sorry, I had to use Google translate for your last one there. I think you meant this?

Razorbeast88 wrote: Even though it all boils down to opinion It's just nice to see when someone, anyone even, aggrees with my own rational POV, because I feel many other people here don't and are not rational at all. Thus, any other poster with a contradictory opinion on this thread is a "whiner" and I've no need to offer a rational argument to back this claim up. If anyone calls me out on this hypocritical viewpoint, I can engage in "whataboutism" and devolve into petty insults that are irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Everybody knows that this is a guaranteed way to prove my point and engender myself to the community.

Hope that's fixed it for you.

Lol what language did you use on Google translate? Definitely not fixed. But if you need me to slow things down for you I'd be happy to

You may have stumbled onto a trampoline section of Google with all the conclusions you're jumping to. I dont think anyone that disagrees with me is automatically irrational or a whiner. There are plenty of people that have mentioned what they don't like about this figure and/or that they prefer a previous figure of the character in rational ways. If you don't know what a whiner is, im sure YouTube has plenty of educational videos for you, and if you're lucky maybe a cocomelon video will play afterwards so you can jam out. I dont really have a point to prove lol I made a comment that you took offense to and you started making assumptions. That along with petty insults seem to be more in your expertise, not mine

Except that is exactly what you did. Instead of just writing "It's nice to read a rational argument that supports my idea", you dishonoured that viewpoint by soiling it with your own, which included insults to anyone else in this thread that held a contradictory view.

I would advise you to be more careful with your choice of lexis in the future.

Thats what you think I did because youre suffering from a mild case of butt hurt, yes. So let me say this slower so you can understand: I don't think anyone that disagrees with me is a whiner. There are plenty of people in this thread that have said things I agree and disagree with. But there's a difference between voicing criticisms/negative opinions about a figure and whining. I dont think everyone is a whiner, I think there were some overreactions from a few people. If you were offended by the mention of whiners, you were probably one of them. I'll make sure to be extra careless with my choice of lexis in the future now, especially because you advised it. Thanks!

Ah, so reiterate:

-

Razorbeast88 wrote:So let me say this; I don't think anyone that disagrees with me is a whiner. There are plenty of people in this thread that have said things I agree and disagree with. I think there were some overreactions from a few people, but basically, my initial statement was inaccurate. I'm sorry for the misunderstanding

Thank you for the clarification.

primalxconvoy wrote:Ah, so reiterate:

-

Razorbeast88 wrote:So let me say this; I don't think anyone that disagrees with me is a whiner. There are plenty of people in this thread that have said things I agree and disagree with. I think there were some overreactions from a few people, but basically, my initial statement was inaccurate. I'm sorry for the misunderstanding

Thank you for the clarification.

My initial statement was misinterpreted, yes. You're welcome!

@WolfmanJake, I'll grant you that it's possible having the jet cockpit visible there in tank mode is iconic to one of the designers. However:
1. That still doesn't mean the cartoon's funky "naked" depiction of it there (how/why did that even happen, anyway? Did Floron the Moron forget the lines for the surrounding tank hull? Was he trying to be crude? It's particularly odd given that it makes the area more complex to draw) is necessarily a good look
2. Saying that comes across, at least to me, as you grasping at straws to make the choice acceptable.
3. If it was iconic to them, I would think they'd have gone for a less-confused execution. It has a faux-canopy instead of the abstracted stripes to match the toy having the canopy up top, but it's naked like the cartoon version, and both the canopy and faux-canopy are cast in red so they don't match either.

Ugh, this sort of cartoon accuracy is the new "Electronic sounds are compulsory and must be powered by AA or AAA batteries" (*glares at 2007 Leader Megs, ROTF Leader Megs and Jetfire, and DOTM Ironhide*).

primalxconvoy wrote:So far, Hasblo has failed to make any good, updated G1 triple-changers of late.

Disagree hard. In my book, we've had four or five (depending on whether Astrotrain's flaws knock him down to just "alright" for you). Three of whom you overlooked lol. And two of those overlooked three are simply brilliant in how they tidy up what were easily the messiest triple-changer designs of all G1.

primalxconvoy wrote:Springer was mildly speckled with cr@pple-damage paint,

Fixed that for you The WFC battle damage isn't the most attractive (and almost as much of a joke as weathering as HFTD Optimus' face paint), but it's a mild speckling that's easily tuned out; you're making a mountain of a molehill. You want "covered in cr@pple damage", I'll show you my 2005 Obi-Wan's Jedi Starfighter, which feels like it wound up with as much of the randomized carbon scoring as it did red.
Also, minor cosmetic issue =/= fundamentally bad figure. Get some freaking perspective.

primalxconvoy wrote:Astrotrain had a naked rear/back to his shuttlemode,

I'll give you that that's irksome, but I can deal with it (admittedly, due in no small part to my delight he finally has the smegging steam engine mode back; screw you, Aaron Archer). And he would have still had it (and probably to a worse degree, since a Voyager has less overall meat to work with) at Voyager level, because his feet are to blame. But hey, at least that's a case of form taking it on the chin for function.

primalxconvoy wrote:cr@ppie-damage paint

Again, minor.

primalxconvoy wrote:and had useless accessories that jacked-up the price

I'll give you that some of the guns may not have been needed, but the tender is hardly useless (especially for those who were into the Micromasters); it completes the steam engine mode at long last, provides a launch pad for the shuttle mode, and provides the Decepticons with a semi-equivalent to ER Optimus' trailer in terms of being a flat platform with A.I.R.Lock connectors (all the more appreciable with the arrival of ER Airwave and Scorponok).

primalxconvoy wrote:and finally, Blitzwing glaring design flaws.

Here, now, I completely agree with you. Going for the cartoon cockpit in tank mode is an iffy look, especially with the confused execution (although it personally doesn't irritate me; it makes me shake my head, but it doesn't piss me off). And pulling a TR Mindwipe with the wings was completely unnecessary to achieve a good Geewun robot look, and had very aggravating knock-on effects in jet mode. Blitzwing never had a tidy undercarriage, but this stupidity pushed him into ROTF Jetfire/CW Silverbolt territory. It's a far greater degree of damage than the hollowness on Astrotrain's shuttle mode, and doesn't have the defense of being in the name of an added function; this mess was purely done in a fruitless, needless attempt to aesthetically "improve" the robot mode aesthetics. His execution is so poor I think he should be scrapped and his energon weapons donated to a Titans Return reissue.

primalxconvoy wrote:I'm still gobsmacked at how the whole "WFC/G1 SSl Legacy" line has had some amazing sculpts, that were let down by extremely poor distribution (in both Japan and the US, UK, etc)

Yeah, well, HasTak couldn't stop the world from going crazy around them now could they?

primalxconvoy wrote:, bad paint choices,

IMO the battle damage is only an outright bad choice on Megatron, where the paint budget should instead have gone to silvering his chest to at least partly save him from looking bland. Otherwise, it's just a "meh" choice and easy. To. Tune. Out.

primalxconvoy wrote:adding unwanted "bulk" (be it accessories or extra figures) to increase the price,

Nope.
Nope.
That is literally not a thing in Transformers.
Because Transformers, to the endless frustration of the Takara designers, uses a fixed. Price-point. System.
The added stuff you see with Leaders is not to "increase the price", but rather to use up whatever budget the figure and its main accessor(y/ies) did not. It's a thing that's been going on ever since the price-point system crystallized.
If anything can be said to increase their price, it's the death of the Ultra price-point that once existed between Voyager and Leader. And I don't know that the market or the retail situation can support resurrecting that.

primalxconvoy wrote:and sub-par engineering.

There has been that - Blitzbungle here and "Let's adapt the unused PotP Evolution design as a standalone Deluxe instead of adapting the actually-integrated T30 design" Arcee come to mind - but IMO it's been the minority.

...Can someone please lock this thread until we get some more news pics or people here actually get some Legacy figures in hand? Because it seems all this thread is going to be until then is The Kvetch Back and Forth About Blitzwing Show. And it feels like everyone, myself included, keeps getting sucked into it to the detriment of activity everywhere else.

NERRRRRRRRRRD FIGHHHHHHHT!

Rtron wrote:NERRRRRRRRRRD FIGHHHHHHHT!

Wrote the nerd in a nerd forum, in a nerd thread, in a nerdy manner.

Just curious...
Relative to the criticisms of this new Blitzwing, did Siege Astrotrain get hate?
I've wanted a new Astrotrain in my collection ever since the Henkei version.
The Siege greebling of his bot mode kept me from looking at him very closely.
But a few days ago I started looking with more intent to buy, and wow, both of his alt modes are pretty horrendous.
Half of the shuttle is... Severely incomplete, to put it lightly.
And that train mode... Pshhhhh... That's one of the worst alt modes I can remember, especially for being a fairly recent figure.
And again, the greebling of the bot mode... That ruins what would've been the one decent mode.
I'd only pay for that thing if I could get it for under $30.

Imo this new Blitzwing makes Astrotrain look like ASStrotrain.

Sowndwave76 wrote:Just curious...
Relative to the criticisms of this new Blitzwing, did Siege Astrotrain get hate?
I've wanted a new Astrotrain in my collection ever since the Henkei version.
The Siege greebling of his bot mode kept me from looking at him very closely.
But a few days ago I started looking with more intent to buy, and wow, both of his alt modes are pretty horrendous.

I was saying earlier in the thread that I was disappointed with AT for the same reasons. I have it, but I guess I have buyers remorse.

I don't know how popular he is overall.

Sowndwave76 wrote:Just curious...
Relative to the criticisms of this new Blitzwing, did Siege Astrotrain get hate?
I've wanted a new Astrotrain in my collection ever since the Henkei version.
The Siege greebling of his bot mode kept me from looking at him very closely.
But a few days ago I started looking with more intent to buy, and wow, both of his alt modes are pretty horrendous.
Half of the shuttle is... Severely incomplete, to put it lightly.
And that train mode... Pshhhhh... That's one of the worst alt modes I can remember, especially for being a fairly recent figure.
And again, the greebling of the bot mode... That ruins what would've been the one decent mode.
I'd only pay for that thing if I could get it for under $30.

Imo this new Blitzwing makes Astrotrain look like ASStrotrain.

Yes, he got hate, but it was different. While I personally think Hasbro did go out of their way to make him boxier in shuttle mode to conform to the G1 model and toy, that wasn't the main gripe shared by people. Instead it was how ununiform the shuttle looked with lots of empty space. But there wasn't ridicule to the same point as Blitzwing, that's for sure. Also, the higher leader price went down a bit easier since many cold understand it better and the extra accessories (which we do not know account for how much of the difference in price between voyager and leader) did work with the toy and made much more sense. Plus they added playability due to the locking feature so you had lots of neat display options, which includes elevating his height for those who still wanted a taller toy for the price point. Basically, he filled that leader class slot as well as leader Optimus Prime did and there was no outlandish fake kibble. It does help that both his modes were more obvious in the G1 cartoon in terms of issues so there was no surprise as there is now with Blitzwing.

Now just to reiterate something, while I have seen plenty of people fine with how slavishly G1 that tank mode is on Blitzwing, I have come across no one that was hoping it would look like this. The expectation from everyone, die hard G1 accuracy fan or not, was of a standard tank mode. Some welcome the design, others do not, but no one was clamoring for it.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Sowndwave76 wrote:Just curious...
Relative to the criticisms of this new Blitzwing, did Siege Astrotrain get hate?
I've wanted a new Astrotrain in my collection ever since the Henkei version.
The Siege greebling of his bot mode kept me from looking at him very closely.
But a few days ago I started looking with more intent to buy, and wow, both of his alt modes are pretty horrendous.

I was saying earlier in the thread that I was disappointed with AT for the same reasons. I have it, but I guess I have buyers remorse.

I don't know how popular he is overall.

Because he'd stay in bot mode, if that stupid greebling wasn't so pronounced and ugly, I probably would be considering going back for him.
Especially knowing it will be so long before he gets a new version, and I plan to be out of the game well before that happens.

Sowndwave76 wrote:Just curious...
Relative to the criticisms of this new Blitzwing, did Siege Astrotrain get hate?
I've wanted a new Astrotrain in my collection ever since the Henkei version.
The Siege greebling of his bot mode kept me from looking at him very closely.
But a few days ago I started looking with more intent to buy, and wow, both of his alt modes are pretty horrendous.
Half of the shuttle is... Severely incomplete, to put it lightly.
And that train mode... Pshhhhh... That's one of the worst alt modes I can remember, especially for being a fairly recent figure.
And again, the greebling of the bot mode... That ruins what would've been the one decent mode.
I'd only pay for that thing if I could get it for under $30.

Imo this new Blitzwing makes Astrotrain look like ASStrotrain.

Although I didn't fully like the Takara Tomy Titanmaster version, I bought it, just as I bought the other equivalent G1 triple changers in that line. However, I've refrained from buying any recent iterations of those characters, due to the design flaws mentioned by myself and others, in the posts above. I would rather make-do with a "good enough" version, rather than expend more money to get another figure that is, IMO, simply more of the same.

Astrotrain's added "fluff" pieces and lack of finished shuttle mice have been, from my observations, well-documented. I think it was puzzling for me why Hasbro didn't use part of the "fluff" as parts to "fix" the "naked" rear of the shuttle.

I think another factor here is that it seems that as many characters seem to get continuously updated iterations (Hotrod/Rodimus Prime, Ultra Magnus', Grimlock, Arcee, etc spring to mind), I feel it will be only a few more years for an updated/improved version of (Astrotrain/Blitzwing), so why waste money getting something that's lacking?