The Energon Pub

Insurgent wrote:
Nope. The windshield goes fully flat, but that's not a fully closed cockpit. There's a gap at the back. It's animation accurate though. Blurr was always an open top car.

It was a joke. I just meant that those who want that titan master fully locked in can by folding the back piece forward.

william-james88 wrote:

Kurona wrote:Nah, they just share parts.
The whole part-sharing thing is kinda new. We need a name for it.

Cant we just call it... part sharing?

And yeah Logan, it was spotted quite quickly as soon as we looked at Tidal Wave's feet.

This is true, but there's also the matter of the noun rather than just the verb. Such as Retooling is the verb but Retool is the noun. Parts-Sharer doesn't quite sound right.

Kurona wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

Kurona wrote:Nah, they just share parts.
The whole part-sharing thing is kinda new. We need a name for it.

Cant we just call it... part sharing?

And yeah Logan, it was spotted quite quickly as soon as we looked at Tidal Wave's feet.

This is true, but there's also the matter of the noun rather than just the verb. Such as Retooling is the verb but Retool is the noun. Parts-Sharer doesn't quite sound right.

Part mates...PARTners ... ComPARTriots?

OK, but I see the Alpha Trion alt mode and see the classic Broadside alt mode, very similar IMHO

Kurona wrote:A new Nightbeat would be lovely... though I'm very surprised at Nightbeat, Apeface and Snapdragon getting full figures. Makes me wonder what the point of releasing them as Titan Masters was.

It could be that Titan Master Apeface was released to test the response and await public outcry and demand for a full-on triple-changer.

And considering the original G1 Horrorcons' Headmaster became the head for the robot AND the beast, I wonder whether that will be the case for these new Voyagers. With that in mind, clearly the Apeface Titan Master did not also form the head of the beast, but merely its rider.

They are, hence why they kept the feet and probably other parts that make up that alt mode. Anyways, we cant really call these things retools anymore sicne they were all planned at the same time, as Takara pointed out when going over the similarities in Scourge and Highbrow. Its like none of us actually say that Astrotrain is a redeco of Sentinel prime because he came out second right? They just share the same mold. Same here, they share the same parts but one is not a retool of the other. If anything, I would assume Braodside was thought up first.

Deluxe MISFIRE!!! Been waiting years!

Titan Masters are disappointing as hell! Heads without bodies? WTF???I was hoping for a new Arcee. What are we supposed to do with just her head?

I suppose they could have it mind that you use the small one with the large one - if they did make Nightbeat as a Deluxe for example I'd welcome a Neutral expression head.

I suppose it's to much to hope that they give him a Porsche looking alt mode with the idea of re-jigging it into Jazz or Skystalker as well ?
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Oh and to change the Subject - what is going on with Chromedome's car mode ?
The moulded the former faux chest part (hood of the car) as a separate piece and instead of making that part red it's brown - so it's not like they needed to paint it just put it in the same gang moulding as the red pieces.

That is the not the only time odd colouring choices have left be scratching my head with Titans Returns - there is also some strange choices on Scourge, Blurr & Fort Max too. Though I guess some of them are down to Toy Vs cartoon accuracy. some are just strange choices like not painting Fort Max's left forearm partially red.

ThunderThruster wrote:

Nemesis Maximo wrote:

Skull Smasher could make a pretty convincing Snarl, especially if you flip the body around and put a small head where the tail goes and replace the head with a tail.

Why would it be necessary to put Snarl's head where Skullcruncher's tail is? I think a simple new head and stego spikes would be sufficient.

I think the idea is to try and keep close to Snarl's original transformation scheme where his legs become the front of his Steggo mode, and the tail is over his shoulders.

Ah yes! You know, I forgot that's where his tail went in robot mode. Now I get it.

wolverinetodd wrote:

Kurona wrote:A new Nightbeat would be lovely... though I'm very surprised at Nightbeat, Apeface and Snapdragon getting full figures. Makes me wonder what the point of releasing them as Titan Masters was.

It could be that Titan Master Apeface was released to test the response and await public outcry and demand for a full-on triple-changer.

I kind of doubt that. Even if they were to do that sort of thing, I'm not sure if they'd be able to change their wave plans. I get the idea all their wave plans are generally set in stone a year or two before they rolled out.

Cobotron wrote:PARTners ... ComPARTriots?

I thought we were going with the terms Pretool and Shared Engeneering? Didn't the Hasbro designers make pretool an official term along with retool and redeco in that YouTube video a bunch of pages back?

So far I haven't seen too many decepticons that i like from TR. The only one I'm truly interested in is sixshot, but i think ocatane might be interesting. Yes, i know that wolfwire is a great mold, but have a strict policy of only combiner limbs and cars for decepticon deluxes.

Bradimus wrote:I thought we were going with the terms Pretool and Shared Engeneering? Didn't the Hasbro designers make pretool an official term along with retool and redeco in that YouTube video a bunch of pages back?

Yup, pretool is an official Hasbro term.

I'm not sure Astrotrain/Sentinel Prime even count as a Re-tool/pre-tool when the only difference aside from colour is the head. Pre-paint seems not quite right either as there is a different part - but there is also no huge difference in details here either like we would expect to see at least to some degree on Megatron/Blitzing.

But now I'd said that I suppose that means Blitzwing will be Megatron with a new head and a different gun and that is it and likewise for Octane & Optimus.

I hope they do use a few new parts there though other than the head - a new chest for Blitwing might be nice for example.

But they can argue that some paint on the existing chest will make it look not unlike the animation model design - just as Voyager Optimus' chest slightly resembles Henkai Octane's chest.

I'm interested to see if they plan to put more effort in than Sentinel / Astro Train or not with those ones.

Bradimus wrote:I thought we were going with the terms Pretool and Shared Engeneering? Didn't the Hasbro designers make pretool an official term along with retool and redeco in that YouTube video a bunch of pages back?

Those are different things.

Kurona wrote:

Bradimus wrote:I thought we were going with the terms Pretool and Shared Engeneering? Didn't the Hasbro designers make pretool an official term along with retool and redeco in that YouTube video a bunch of pages back?

Those are different things.

Here are the generally accepted definitions:

Redeco: same mold, different plastic colors, different paint apps
Repaint: same mold, same plastic colors, different paint apps. Not Uncommon.

Retool: same basic mold with various degrees of changed parts, not limited to just the head (some folks don't count the head however). Officially though, it refers to small, permanent changes to an existing mold, what we fans would call a "mold tweak", for fixing observed problems.
Pretool: same as Retool, except it's planned in advance, usually in the form of multiple exchanged parts, while maintaining (parts of) the same transformation. Starting out with just head switches, CW rose this technique to prominence by switching out whole sections, the most radical being Air Raid vs. Skydive. And yes, pretools can be retooled further at a later date, like Air Raid into Strafe.

Shared Engineering: Usually this refers to two unrelated toys having the same basic transformation scheme, like CW Dead End vs. TR Chromedome.

As said before, we don't have a term for "part sharers" yet as it's a rather new phenomenon, in fact I don't even know the nature behind it. Somebody inquire about Blurr vs. Chromedome please, and maybe Scourge vs. Highbrow.

That said, TR is really stretching and mixing definitions here with the heads being considered separate figures from the bodies. And it's the heads that are usually retooled with body redecos (Soundwave is an exception as he's a total pretool). For instance, Astrotrain is a body redeco of Sentinel Prime, but Darkmoon is a pretool of Infinitus. Confused yet? Wait until Breakaway (redeco of Chromedome) and the revelation of his Titan Master partner "Rev"

Parts-sharers? I mean, there's no better name for it.

SillySpringer wrote:Parts-sharers? I mean, there's no better name for it.

True, but... aside from Shared Engineering, all terms imply a direct physical relation, while Blurr and Chromedome do not have one, just an indirect one with the parts. That's my main sticking point.

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

SillySpringer wrote:Parts-sharers? I mean, there's no better name for it.

True, but... aside from Shared Engineering, all terms imply a direct physical relation, while Blurr and Chromedome do not have one, just an indirect one with the parts. That's my main sticking point.

Technically dont they share as many parts as Offroad and Skydive and every other deluxe combiner do?

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

SillySpringer wrote:Parts-sharers? I mean, there's no better name for it.

True, but... aside from Shared Engineering, all terms imply a direct physical relation, while Blurr and Chromedome do not have one, just an indirect one with the parts. That's my main sticking point.

Part-thieves?

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

Kurona wrote:

Bradimus wrote:I thought we were going with the terms Pretool and Shared Engeneering? Didn't the Hasbro designers make pretool an official term along with retool and redeco in that YouTube video a bunch of pages back?

Those are different things.

Here are the generally accepted definitions:

Redeco: same mold, different plastic colors, different paint apps
Repaint: same mold, same plastic colors, different paint apps. Not Uncommon.

Retool: same basic mold with various degrees of changed parts, not limited to just the head (some folks don't count the head however). Officially though, it refers to small, permanent changes to an existing mold, what we fans would call a "mold tweak", for fixing observed problems.
Pretool: same as Retool, except it's planned in advance, usually in the form of multiple exchanged parts, while maintaining (parts of) the same transformation. Starting out with just head switches, CW rose this technique to prominence by switching out whole sections, the most radical being Air Raid vs. Skydive. And yes, pretools can be retooled further at a later date, like Air Raid into Strafe.

Shared Engineering: Usually this refers to two unrelated toys having the same basic transformation scheme, like CW Dead End vs. TR Chromedome.

As said before, we don't have a term for "part sharers" yet as it's a rather new phenomenon, in fact I don't even know the nature behind it. Somebody inquire about Blurr vs. Chromedome please, and maybe Scourge vs. Highbrow.

That said, TR is really stretching and mixing definitions here with the heads being considered separate figures from the bodies. And it's the heads that are usually retooled with body redecos (Soundwave is an exception as he's a total pretool). For instance, Astrotrain is a body redeco of Sentinel Prime, but Darkmoon is a pretool of Infinitus. Confused yet? Wait until Breakaway (redeco of Chromedome) and the revelation of his Titan Master partner "Rev"

Then there's remold(but i think one or more than one of the above definitions basically covers that

SillySpringer wrote:

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

SillySpringer wrote:Parts-sharers? I mean, there's no better name for it.

True, but... aside from Shared Engineering, all terms imply a direct physical relation, while Blurr and Chromedome do not have one, just an indirect one with the parts. That's my main sticking point.

Part-thieves?

How about part-formers

How would you fine feather folk refer to something like a "Running Change" for example adding the slots in the fists of a 1980's "Seeker".

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A "Redecoration" might also apply to a toy that is more or less the same colour but they change the spray mask or stickers but keep the basic colouring - example being G1 & G2 Jazz.

I guess The various Classics/Henkei/ Universe variations hover around this area as they certainly are not a new colour but they 'tinker' with them - example being Classics/Henkei/Botcon etc.. Thundercracker.

Perhaps Classics Skywarp is an actual repaint though as his deco is completely different and he uses that pinkish purple plastic.

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My submission for a Joke name for "Shared Engineering" would be :
"Share Cropper"

RAR wrote:How would you fine feather folk refer to something like a "Running Change" for example adding the slots in the fists of a 1980's "Seeker".

As a running change.