The Energon Pub

[Rodimus Prime]

I guess with that, Earthrise comes to a close...

A solid ending to a pretty good middle chapter. What's odd is despite the general superiority of the toys, I find myself having spent overall less money on ER than I did on Siege.

I'm The other way around. I have 6 or 7 Siege figures And almost the entirety of the ER line.

And if Kingdom is any indication, I'll be spending far less on it, than I did on ER...I mean the toys are great, I guess the character choices just aren't necessary to my collection.

Agreed.

[Nuclearxpotato]

I'm at the point where I'm pretty much done with G1, I have what I feel is the "Best" version of the characters I care about... and then other characters I don't care about.

With G1, many of the characters are just a checklist: "Datsuns, Check. Grapple, Check. Skids, ch- oh wait". For me, it's probably the Cartoon-accuracy problem (Cartoon models removed many details that'd make the character more interesting compared to the Toys) and the generic characterisation of many of them / lack of time to get connected to them. It's especially noticeable when there's like fourteen sports cars.

But if Hasbro is introducing more generations as leaks are leading us to believe, I'm definitely more interested. It also helps that UT is next up on Hasbro's reintroduction list (rip Car Robots lmao) seeing as they've made multiple references to it over WFC.

[sol magnus]

I can't ever say I'm 'done' with G1, but I do think I'm getting close to getting done with my collection. And the ground has been mostly covered in the last three years with mainly WFC stuff. That's kind of amazing when the characters Hasbro put out have covered 84-89, with many of them being Cybertronian versions.

To me, it's all G1 now anyway with many outside characters being integrated, like Barricade.

[Emerje]

Well, Amazon just informed me that the Galactic Odyssey Botropolis Rescue Mission 6-pack will be here tomorrow. I guess with that, Earthrise comes to a close...

What about Deep Cover?

Emerje

Technically part of Generations Selects.

Still part of War for Cybertron Trilogy. Though now I see someone on Tfwiki moved him from ER to Kingdom so I guess it's a moot point.

Emerje

[sol magnus]

Well, Amazon just informed me that the Galactic Odyssey Botropolis Rescue Mission 6-pack will be here tomorrow. I guess with that, Earthrise comes to a close...

What about Deep Cover?

Emerje

Technically part of Generations Selects.

Still part of War for Cybertron Trilogy. Though now I see someone on Tfwiki moved him from ER to Kingdom so I guess it's a moot point.

Emerje

Add to that it's a Siege figure.

[Nuclearxpotato]

With planes and tanks you can't win. But there are so many cars. I want them all to be deluxe size. The cars, at least, can have some consistency. I'm not an expert on which cars should be which size, but as long as they're all deluxe it's something I can live with.

And, while I think ER Prime is better designed (and do have him), Henkei Prime has not been displaced in my heart. Again, vehicle mode and robot mode both win out for me. I think his vehicle mode works better with deluxe cars. Or near enough at least.

Late response, but I wanted to build off this point. Car-to-Car scale is infinitely more important than Car-to-Military Vehicle scale imo. The only solution to the Seeker issue is if they're specifically designed around small fighter jets (which I imagine are rare).


But seeing this conversation made me curious, so I grabbed eight deluxes and one legends car from my army and compared them.

I don't know the specifics of each car's scale... so I went exclusively off of the door and windshield scaling. Starting on the left are vehicles that are way too big and further right are undersized. Interestingly, both ends of the scale are bookended with 2006 figures with the three WFC examples being right next to each other. However, there is a large gap in the scale between Ironhide and Hubcap (which may just be a fault of the selection)


Basically what I'm saying is that it's criminal we don't have a Voyager Payload.

[Gauntlet101010]

In this pic I probably wouldn't include Payload or the other blue one. They're trucks and trucks ... you're lucky if your TF truck looks right.

It'd be interesting for a car enthusiast to go through the CHUG series and give us a real good idea of what's in scale and what's really, really not in terms of the deluxe cars. Although if I had more proof that the deluxe cars I have are all just wildly off it'd bother me a lot, so maybe not, lol.

[AcademyofDrX]

If I was doing this exercise, the methodology I would use is identifying equivalent real world vehicles, measure the toys, and then compare the scale ratios. That would help with comparisons between different vehicle types.

My solution is to not worry about scale. The G1 toys and the cartoon had different sets of scales, to say nothing of "mass shifting." I love the G1 minibots and I like that scaling and SD nature to be reflected in the Generations equivalents. It's much easier to satisfy than any real-works consistency in a design with the Generations philosophy instead of, say, Alternators.

[TF-fan kev777]

In this pic I probably wouldn't include Payload or the other blue one. They're trucks and trucks ... you're lucky if your TF truck looks right.

It'd be interesting for a car enthusiast to go through the CHUG series and give us a real good idea of what's in scale and what's really, really not in terms of the deluxe cars. Although if I had more proof that the deluxe cars I have are all just wildly off it'd bother me a lot, so maybe not, lol.

I couldn't view the pics, so I can't comment on that selection. I'm not a car guy either, but just looking at the WFC deluxe cars so far, my guess is that most of them are roughly in scale with each other, and possibly with Hoist/Trailbreaker too.

One of the easiest reference points for scale is actually the width of the wheels. Most cars and light trucks will have between a 5 foot and 6.5 foot width on the wheelbase. A few relevant examples, Chevy Tahoe 77 inch, Lambo Countach 74 inch, WV Beetle 60 inch.

For WFC, the Lambros and pickups have the widest wheel base on par with OP as well. The not-datsuns are a little thinner but not much and seem to be the skinniest deluxe cars except for the Cliff/Bee mold.

In anything the Cliff/Bee mold might be a little off, but mainly in the width, as in a little too skinny. My guess is the width they used was needed to get the roof/chest and the fenders/feet to look right in bot mode.

[sol magnus]

I think Hasbro's scale doesn't go farther than the robot mode. If you tried to scale everything to the vehicle (which isn't the main toy, it's the alternate of the toy), nothing would ever make any kind sense. Bumblebee would be bigger than the Datsuns!

[Gauntlet101010]

I don't mind it if Bee's bot mode is taller than the cartoon. Or if Classics Bee is taller than the ER Dastuns (I actually haven't checked). If that's the robot mode form the car, so be it.

Even when I was a kid I just couldn't get into Minibots, Micromasters or car-based Minicons. If the vehicle mode is a car it shouldn't be so much shorter than other car based robots. For planes, it doesn't bug me (much, no winning as I said earlier), but there's so many cars all standing next to each other.

[Kyleor]

Well, Amazon just informed me that the Galactic Odyssey Botropolis Rescue Mission 6-pack will be here tomorrow. I guess with that, Earthrise comes to a close...

Mine literally just arrived.

They're preeeeeeety.

[Nuclearxpotato]

I think Hasbro's scale doesn't go farther than the robot mode. If you tried to scale everything to the vehicle (which isn't the main toy, it's the alternate of the toy), nothing would ever make any kind sense. Bumblebee would be bigger than the Datsuns!

Vehicle mode scale was a bit more important back in the day for CHUG but Character scale has definitely taken priority.

Also, how big are Fairlady Zs, Are they actually smaller than a Beetle? I've never seen one in person so I always assumed they were somewhere on the larger end of cars.

[sol magnus]

I think Hasbro's scale doesn't go farther than the robot mode. If you tried to scale everything to the vehicle (which isn't the main toy, it's the alternate of the toy), nothing would ever make any kind sense. Bumblebee would be bigger than the Datsuns!

Vehicle mode scale was a bit more important back in the day for CHUG but Character scale has definitely taken priority.

Also, how big are Fairlady Zs, Are they actually smaller than a Beetle? I've never seen one in person so I always assumed they were somewhere on the larger end of cars.

They are freaking tiny.

[Sowndwave76]

I can't ever say I'm 'done' with G1, but I do think I'm getting close to getting done with my collection.

This is where I'm at as well.
After the plentiful good (imo) from the ER and SS86 lines, I'm kind of betting that the next round of "G1" figures will include some sort of gimmick that will completely keep me away.
Obviously I could be wrong... But is Hastak really going to try and go "more G1" with the very next release of the seekers, datsuns, Sunstreaker, Grapple, etc., etc., etc.??'
Just seems really doubtful.

As is happening right now with the Kingdom line, I'll dip back into collecting whenever there's that couple figures I really like, but honestly, that could be 2 figures per year...
Is that still even collecting?
My hope, and maybe this is more of a wish, is that Hastak adds 1 or 2 figures every couple waves of the Generations line that is dedicated to animated character likeness, with essentially SS86 quality... But no 5mm ports all over the place, no gimmicks, and no extras that drive the costs up.

I know there's rumor of all 5 G1 Dinobots at leader class size...
This is probably my biggest want right now.
After that, G1 animation accurate Insecticons.
Blitzwing would be nice...
Reflector in a legit 3 pack...

Is this asking too much??

[Changewinds]

I think Hasbro's scale doesn't go farther than the robot mode. If you tried to scale everything to the vehicle (which isn't the main toy, it's the alternate of the toy), nothing would ever make any kind sense. Bumblebee would be bigger than the Datsuns!

Vehicle mode scale was a bit more important back in the day for CHUG but Character scale has definitely taken priority.

Also, how big are Fairlady Zs, Are they actually smaller than a Beetle? I've never seen one in person so I always assumed they were somewhere on the larger end of cars.

My coworker has an original Z car so I can tell you they are definitely compact cars. Long, but not very high. Definitely a low slung car, which means a Beetle would probably be taller and maybe only a bit shorter.

[Rodimus Prime]

I think Hasbro's scale doesn't go farther than the robot mode. If you tried to scale everything to the vehicle (which isn't the main toy, it's the alternate of the toy), nothing would ever make any kind sense. Bumblebee would be bigger than the Datsuns!

Vehicle mode scale was a bit more important back in the day for CHUG but Character scale has definitely taken priority.

Also, how big are Fairlady Zs, Are they actually smaller than a Beetle? I've never seen one in person so I always assumed they were somewhere on the larger end of cars.

They are freaking tiny.

i don't think they are. Years ago I had the chance to buy one from 1982 and I remember it being a decent sized car. Probably the size of a midsize sedan, Maybe a bit smaller. It's a sports car afterall. There's limited space inside, but from bumper to bumper, they hold their own.

[Emerje]

I think Hasbro's scale doesn't go farther than the robot mode. If you tried to scale everything to the vehicle (which isn't the main toy, it's the alternate of the toy), nothing would ever make any kind sense. Bumblebee would be bigger than the Datsuns!

Vehicle mode scale was a bit more important back in the day for CHUG but Character scale has definitely taken priority.

Also, how big are Fairlady Zs, Are they actually smaller than a Beetle? I've never seen one in person so I always assumed they were somewhere on the larger end of cars.

They are freaking tiny.

i don't think they are. Years ago I had the chance to buy one from 1982 and I remember it being a decent sized car. Probably the size of a midsize sedan, Maybe a bit smaller. It's a sports car afterall. There's limited space inside, but from bumper to bumper, they hold their own.

A Bumblebee style Beetle is 13' 4.5", an '82 Fairlady Z is 14' 6", a Countach LP500 S (Sideswipe) is 13' 6.6", Bumblebee isn't a small as he seems like he should be. What's real surprising is the Nissan Sunny-Vanette Coach SGL (Ironhide and Ratchet) is somewhere between 13' and 14', couldn't find the exact length for the coach, just the cargo and truck. By comparison a 2021 Prius is 15' long.

Emerje

[Sabrblade]

Here's another way to look at it, guys. Bumblebee is a small Cybertronian who doesn't size-change when he transforms, so his altmode will be scaled according to his mass in robot mode. Little bot = little car, even if said car is much bigger in real life.

Same thing with the other Minibots, and with Micromasters, Mini-Cons, Maximals, and Predacons. Small bots who don't size-change will turn into smaller-sized vehicles.

[Gauntlet101010]

Here's another way to look at it, guys. Bumblebee is a small Cybertronian who doesn't size-change when he transforms, so his altmode will be scaled according to his mass in robot mode. Little bot = little car, even if said car is much bigger in real life.

Same thing with the other Minibots, and with Micromasters, Mini-Cons, Maximals, and Predacons. Small bots who don't size-change will turn into smaller-sized vehicles.

While that's a good way of looking at it, it doesn't alleviate my pet peeve.

I mean it's just my own personal gripe with Transformers toys. It bugs me in my own collection.

In the same way I feel like the Arealbots should be the same size as the Seekers (since they're all planes) which makes the KO of CW Superion really tempting. Although I do have TFC's take. But that opens up a whole can of worms in regards to the combined mode height. And where does that leave Powerglide?

Maybe just put Classics Seekers with CW Arealbots if I want them in the same display, lol.

Although CW Menasor is pretty much perfect as far my TF pet peeves go. Too bad he's kinda ****.

[sol magnus]

Here's another way to look at it, guys. Bumblebee is a small Cybertronian who doesn't size-change when he transforms, so his altmode will be scaled according to his mass in robot mode. Little bot = little car, even if said car is much bigger in real life.

Same thing with the other Minibots, and with Micromasters, Mini-Cons, Maximals, and Predacons. Small bots who don't size-change will turn into smaller-sized vehicles.

I don't have a problem with it. I'm just saying using vehicles as the scaling standard with throw things off.

[Sabrblade]

Here's another way to look at it, guys. Bumblebee is a small Cybertronian who doesn't size-change when he transforms, so his altmode will be scaled according to his mass in robot mode. Little bot = little car, even if said car is much bigger in real life.

Same thing with the other Minibots, and with Micromasters, Mini-Cons, Maximals, and Predacons. Small bots who don't size-change will turn into smaller-sized vehicles.

I don't have a problem with it. I'm just saying using vehicles as the scaling standard with throw things off.

Indeed.

[sol magnus]

Bravo.

[chuckdawg1999]

I can't ever say I'm 'done' with G1, but I do think I'm getting close to getting done with my collection.

This is where I'm at as well.
After the plentiful good (imo) from the ER and SS86 lines, I'm kind of betting that the next round of "G1" figures will include some sort of gimmick that will completely keep me away.
Obviously I could be wrong... But is Hastak really going to try and go "more G1" with the very next release of the seekers, datsuns, Sunstreaker, Grapple, etc., etc., etc.??'
Just seems really doubtful.

As is happening right now with the Kingdom line, I'll dip back into collecting whenever there's that couple figures I really like, but honestly, that could be 2 figures per year...
Is that still even collecting?
My hope, and maybe this is more of a wish, is that Hastak adds 1 or 2 figures every couple waves of the Generations line that is dedicated to animated character likeness, with essentially SS86 quality... But no 5mm ports all over the place, no gimmicks, and no extras that drive the costs up.

I know there's rumor of all 5 G1 Dinobots at leader class size...
This is probably my biggest want right now.
After that, G1 animation accurate Insecticons.
Blitzwing would be nice...
Reflector in a legit 3 pack...

Is this asking too much??

Reflector was done as a three-pack in toy accurate colors. It was going to be exclusive to Hascon 2 if it had happened.

[Wolfman Jake]

I can't ever say I'm 'done' with G1, but I do think I'm getting close to getting done with my collection.

Reflector in a legit 3 pack...

Is this asking too much??

Reflector was done as a three-pack in toy accurate colors. It was going to be exclusive to Hascon 2 if it had happened.

Also, the Siege release is probably the last we'll get for a long while. That Reflector is VERY accurate to the G1 cartoon character model. Yes, it doesn't turn into an Earth-based alt mode alone, but with three together, it makes a convincing enough camera. The 3-Pack in original toy colors does an even better job with the extra parts contained to add more camera pieces. Plus, the cartoon colors versions didn't even come with battle damage paint apps, so there really isn't a need for another release for a long while.