The Energon Pub

Well while the ethical/moral debate over KOs rages on, I'll be over here enjoying this wonderful new toy.



KuBianBao Oversized KBB AD31+ Alloy Dark Edition.



This mutha is gorgeous in all it's ethics slashing glory!
First off, He's huge! Also, the packaging and photos I saw looked like some of his chrome was gold, which I figured wasn't great but I would live with it. Turns out all the chrome is a dark smoked gun metal grey. It looks amazing with all that black and teal.



The bot mode is intense. They copied the Takara sculpt with all the extra knight armor details, which I always felt did this toy a huge favor. the paint work on this KO is amazingly good. The plastic is really solid, and while the die cast parts aren't that huge of an improvement, they are executed very nicely. Smooth casting and well painted.



The joints are strong and the ratchets are extra loud and clicky. Posing this guy is a little figity, but once you get him there, he stays.



He comes with two sets of weapons. Both are great! They are sturdy and have really nice paint. He will definitely wield the standard Nemesis Laser Pink. Love that thing and all it's translucency!
That means The White Knight of Cybertron will get a new sword!



Another feature they threw in is a removable back pack. An nice touch, but honestly I like him better with it. It's an ugly kibble shelf, but it fills him out and adds those cool kamas to his thighs.



Did I mention he's big? Here's some scale reference.



The quality of these KOs is alarmingly good. With the quality and bang-for-your-buck, it's really easy to say yes to these things. Interesting times we're living in.

hastaks gotta step up their game. its bad when a ko has quality that out shines an official when the official is supposed to be top dog

Bumblebee21 wrote:hastaks gotta step up their game. its bad when a ko has quality that out shines an official when the official is supposed to be top dog

You have to understand that these KOs are not designed by the KO manufacturer. It is a stolen and slightly modified design. Meaning while HasTak has to make more money to support their design teams, these KO companies need to worry little about that. That means they can be much cheaper in price with the same or more quality.

I am wondering though, I know KOs don't normally license the vehicles of the Transformers they are stealing designs from, but does HasTak pay to use real world vehicles in their toys, or do the car companies pay them?

Also @Cobo: That think sure is huge! Though, something about the silver paint looks a bit... off to me. Almost as if it's digibashed silver, yet it's not...

Also, is that G2 Bruticus something worth getting? I love me some silly gaudy G2 colors!

SillyMcGilly wrote:You have to understand that these KOs are not designed by the KO manufacturer. It is a stolen and slightly modified design. Meaning while HasTak has to make more money to support their design teams, these KO companies need to worry little about that. That means they can be much cheaper in price with the same or more quality.

i know that it. it cost them no r&d to make. its the simple thiings they addd tat takara could've done if they put some extra work into it. mp-28 ko with matrix,(plastic)mp-25 with tighter backpack and rubber tires. mp-26 with a flight stand and rubber tires, thf soundwave with the extra piece to cover the back in cassette mode.

it still doesnt excuse takaras quality being off. theres no excuse for that.

Bumblebee21 wrote:i know that it. it cost them no r&d to make. its the simple thiings they addd tat takara could've done if they put some extra work into it. mp-28 ko with matrix,(plastic)mp-25 with tighter backpack and rubber tires. mp-26 with a flight stand and rubber tires, thf soundwave with the extra piece to cover the back in cassette mode.

it still doesnt excuse takaras quality being off. theres no excuse for that.

But it costs money to add rubber wheels especially. Rather than simply mold the wheels in a similar plastic to the ones for the rest of the body, they would need to add a whole extra step of manufacture. It's not only material that costs, but also labor. They have a price limit, and most of the price is taken up by design, whereas KOs like I said don't design them themselves and only add a thing or two at most.

But anyway, let's not clog Cobo's thread anymore!

Not sure if I missed it Cobo, but did you find Octone and Blitzwing at a brick and mortar location? What outlet? I hope I can find those two this coming July! Sorry for all the questions!

SillyMcGilly wrote:I am wondering though, I know KOs don't normally license the vehicles of the Transformers they are stealing designs from, but does HasTak pay to use real world vehicles in their toys, or do the car companies pay them?


Also, is that G2 Bruticus something worth getting? I love me some silly gaudy G2 colors!

Depends. Most vehicles in the main lines HasTak put out (Generations/Legends, RiD/Adventure) are either made-up vehicles or sort-of-look-like-real-vehicles-but-just-a-bit-off-to-not-require-a-license vehicles. I think that likely hints at them not wanting to pay money to car companies for every Bumblebee and Starscream and Hardhead they put out, while Takara can get away paying companies to use their cars for Masterpiece because there's only a few of those per year at most - not to mention repaints and made-up vehicles like Hot Rod not requiring them to buy a license. It's also one of the main arguments for why we don't have certain characters like Cliffjumper and Mirage yet; they can't get ahold of the permission to use their original car modes' likenesses.
That last part does make me wonder if we're likely to get more obscure characters before popular ones purely on the basic that Takara doesn't have to get permission to make them. Who's up for getting an MP Cosmos before Jazz?

G2 Bruticus does look awesome, but I'm only slightly put off due to the use of G1 Decepticon symbols and that the 'camo paint' isn't used as crazy over-the-top as it could have been. I forget if Reprolabels helps out with the latter part...

SillyMcGilly wrote:But anyway, let's not clog Cobo's thread anymore!

I appreciate that Sill, and I anticipated the idea that getting some KOs might stir the pot. Your heart is in a good place Silly, and KOs are a form of bad ethical business practice, but Hasbro is no angel. They know how to stretch the rules and hop through legal loop holes.

Here's a good example and it answers one of your questions. Hasbro does have to pay a licensing fee to auto manufacturers to use exact replicas of automobiles. Plains and trains too. But, they get away with not doing it all the time by simply just barely changing the form from the actual model. The new TLK Deluxe Barricade is a great example of this.

You made a comment about stealing directly from the designers. At Hasbro, the designers (very much artists in my eyes) are paid salary under contract. They retain no residuals rights or royalties from the art they produce. Once their designs are finished, they become the property of Hasbro. A multi-million dollar corporate entity that is in no means hurting for money. The designers make their salary, and can feed their families, or pay off their student debt, or buy a boat, or whatever American capitalist endeavors they see fit. I'm guessing they make a pretty nice sum too. It's a good job.

Anyway, it's a tricky battle. It's definitely thievery, and how China gets away with it, I have no idea. But my soul is at peace with it. Between my Star Wars collection and my TF collection, and what ever other pile of Hasbro toys I've collected over the years, I've given Hasbro plenty of my money. I can dip my toe in the naughty world of KOs with no shame knowing this and knowing I will most likely give Hasbro plenty more.

Now for your other questions.
The silver paint on that Prime is AWESOME! I use a super high wattage photography light when I take my pics, and I've noticed that the lens on my iPhone does some weird things interpreting the reflectiveness of metallic surfaces. That might be what you are seeing.

I found Blitzwing and Octone at Target. They also had a full spread of wave 4 Deluxes that day. I payed full price, giving both the retailer and the manufacturer the incentives they need to keep the Transformers coming.

Edit: Like Kurona said!
And thanks for reminding me K, G2 Fruiticus is fun. He is as good as any other combiner. He's loose here and there, and he's tight here and there. I will say my G2 Brawl is a lot better than my G1. He tabs better and his shoulders aren't quite as loose. And what makes him really fun are those Gawd awful colors! Sill, if you can find him for a good price, he's worth it.

Kurona wrote:Who's up for getting an MP Cosmos before Jazz?

I would say "ME!", but it would probably be too pricey, and I'm not planning on collecting G1 or Beast Wars MPs anyway.

Kurona wrote:G2 Bruticus does look awesome, but I'm only slightly put off due to the use of G1 Decepticon symbols and that the 'camo paint' isn't used as crazy over-the-top as it could have been. I forget if Reprolabels helps out with the latter part...

I know! I think those are the only two parts that put me off as well. It just doesn't work as well without the accurate G2 symbols! Superion got his! Why not Bruticus? Also I do agree that the plain yellow thighs with no cammo also looks pretty plain and meh.

Edit: Also regarding CW G2 combiners in general, the one I was mostly excited to hopefully get was G2 Defensor. But, guess what? We never got him. Bah!

So here's the last of this recent taste of KOs. It was a fun ride.

First up is KuBianBao Walthertron
I remember deliberating over the actual 3P figure this is a copy of. I really wanted a Legends scale G1 style Megatron, but wasn't all that ready to drop $35 bucks for it. Especially since it was an unpainted model kit.



It was fun to assemble this guy, and he's more than just a model kit. He really is a disassembled toy with screws and all. For a fun look at the process check out Cary's awesome post regarding this toy.



Since I don't speak metric, Will pointed out to me that he is actually bigger than a Legends Class Transformer, but I had already ordered him, and I mean, when has scale ever really mattered.



For what he is he looks pretty dang good in both modes. I had debated painting him, but I think he holds up pretty well without it. I will say, after spending so much time putting him together, that first transform was pretty nerve racking. He has some crazy tight tolerances and some of the pieces are crazy thin. I did hear a few reports of parts breaking on the 3P version. So I was extra careful. I did get a few stress marks here and there.





I don't mind Megatron being bigger than Prime. Just like the CW Leader Megatron, I think it helps inflate that sense of unbeatable odds.




Next up might just be my favorite of these three KOs.

Wei Jiang T-Warrior
Yup! That's all you get. T-Warrior




Big Ol' Rook! I love Rook. Probably one of my favorite CW Deluxe molds. And I love this new paint job on him. He is part of a set Known as Patron Saint from Wei Jiang consisting of all oversized versions of Hot Spot, two Rooks, regular and this one, and Blades and Alpha Bravo. The combined mode is GIGANTIC!



So much fun to have a huge version of this toy. I mean Rook is bruiser right? This version is super beefy. The entire front plate of his torso is die cast, and adds an awesome weight and stability to the figure.


The Rook Army

Just another shot to show, he is Voyager scale.


Triple change THIS!


I think I can be happy with just Rook here. The idea of a Voyager size Alpha Bravo does tickle my inner Va'al. I'm not really interested in a OSed Hot Spot. I hope Wei Jiang keeps doing this though. I might be coerced into cobbling together a giant Randotron.

...Wow. SUPER ROOOOOOOOOK!

Prime, Rook and Buildatron are looking great. Man I want one of those Rooks.

I feel like I forgot to mention that I had to file the red waist peg on Megatron. The only other issue I have is with the barrel pegging securely on his back.

Fun build and toy eh? He's a nice large cyberverse legends class huh? Good stuff

... kiiiiinda want that Rook...

Unfortunately turned off that Megs now. He's just a bit too big for Legends Anyone know a decent Legends-sized Megatron aside from the T30 one? I'm looking to use the Legends class for a general Expanded G1/Aligned collection at this point. Including TFP Arcee, Cybertron Hot Shot and RiD Strongarm

Cobotron wrote:I think I can be happy with just Rook here. The idea of a Voyager size Alpha Bravo does tickle my inner Va'al. I'm not really interested in a OSed Hot Spot. I hope Wei Jiang keeps doing this though. I might be coerced into cobbling together a giant Randotron.

*cough* I might be interested in a voyager sized Alpha bravo, *cough*

SW's SilverHammer wrote:

Cobotron wrote:I think I can be happy with just Rook here. The idea of a Voyager size Alpha Bravo does tickle my inner Va'al. I'm not really interested in a OSed Hot Spot. I hope Wei Jiang keeps doing this though. I might be coerced into cobbling together a giant Randotron.

*cough* I might be interested in a voyager sized Alpha bravo, *cough*

There is no like system and using shift-6 would feel awkward on forums, so I'm just quoting this to show that, yes, this is most certainly how I feel.

but I also need a voyager Offroad to go with him...

I'd like a big Alpha Bravo as well...but, I'd rather get the original, for two reasons.

The KO doesn't have a matching Offroad.

The KO DOESN'T HAVE THE RIGHT HEAD

Sigma Magnus wrote:The KO doesn't have a matching Offroad.

Ah, but they do!

Kurona wrote:Unfortunately turned off that Megs now. He's just a bit too big for Legends Anyone know a decent Legends-sized Megatron aside from the T30 one?

Unfortunately your choices aren't so hot. One's too big one's to small.


Of course there is this feller.

Might still be a bit too big for ya.



The search for baby bear continues....

Sigma Magnus wrote:I'd like a big Alpha Bravo as well...but, I'd rather get the original, for two reasons.

The KO doesn't have a matching Offroad.

The KO DOESN'T HAVE THE RIGHT HEAD

Yeah I saw that when I looked them up which sucks because I might have bought it. Must've only got the Blades mold.

Dang do those KOs look good Cobo. But they pale in comparison to the holy grail of KOs, which Thew got this weekend. I'm all the jelly.

carytheone wrote:

Kurona wrote:Unfortunately turned off that Megs now. He's just a bit too big for Legends Anyone know a decent Legends-sized Megatron aside from the T30 one?

Unfortunately your choices aren't so hot. One's too big one's to small.

20170521_200928.jpg

Of course there is this feller.

Might still be a bit too big for ya.



The search for baby bear continues....

Man that's frustrating... ah well, I can have Shockwave and Rodimus leading for now

edit: Though do hold the Marvel-level leadership squabbles for a bit because a friend of mine found this little picture on the net. I know that's THS Soundboard beside him, but does anyone know the Megs?

Oh! That's DX9's Mightron. Not to be confused with the Masterpiece-alike, that's part of their War in Pocket series.
https://tfsource.com/dx9/mightron/

I must say I do kind of like the scale with Prime on KOatron. Reminds me of Animated.

SureShot18 wrote:Oh! That's DX9's Mightron. Not to be confused with the Masterpiece-alike, that's part of their War in Pocket series.
https://tfsource.com/dx9/mightron/

I must say I do kind of like the scale with Prime on KOatron. Reminds me of Animated.

Gaaaah, that price... there any KOs out there?

Kurona wrote:

SureShot18 wrote:Oh! That's DX9's Mightron. Not to be confused with the Masterpiece-alike, that's part of their War in Pocket series.
https://tfsource.com/dx9/mightron/

I must say I do kind of like the scale with Prime on KOatron. Reminds me of Animated.

Gaaaah, that price... there any KOs out there?

Not that I'm aware of. There does seem to an interest in legend sized figures in the KO market. Iron Factory's UM just had a KO pop up.

https://tf-direct.com/mechfanstoys-mf-0 ... p1693.html

And I spotted a KO legends Galvatron just last week. I have no idea what it's a KO of though. DX9 war in pocket? Hulkie (in green and yellow) has gotten the KO treatment.

http://s.aliexpress.com/meAfqmEn

And a KO of the Warbotron legend Shockwave model.

https://tf-direct.com/kubianbao-shockwa ... p1758.html

I'd say with the growing interest in legend sized figures KO'd from IF and the WiP line, patience will pay off in the long run

Ah yes, my favourite Trsfarmer chracter... Ultrl Magenus.

I am unbelievably tempted to go for KOs of 3P toys right now. Like... you know that feeling where you know something is a bit iffy but no-one's really done anything about it and it's not that terrible anyway so no point fighting it; but you do this one little seedy loophole that makes you feel like such an ass but you love that it makes you feel that way? That's me right now. Over considering getting KOs of 3Ps. Fight the establishment with an arguably worse establishment!

Kurona wrote:Ah yes, my favourite Trsfarmer chracter... Ultrl Magenus.

I am unbelievably tempted to go for KOs of 3P toys right now. Like... you know that feeling where you know something is a bit iffy but no-one's really done anything about it and it's not that terrible anyway so no point fighting it; but you do this one little seedy loophole that makes you feel like such an ass but you love that it makes you feel that way? That's me right now. Over considering getting KOs of 3Ps. Fight the establishment with an arguably worse establishment!

Cobotron stated the worries with the grey territory very well. Me? I have very little honor when it comes to plastic. I've got a room full of Has/Tak figures and I'm sure I won't stop throwing money at them anytime soon. I do however feel no guilt in buying KOs of 3p figures. I'll see how it goes when I pick up a KO of a 1st party figure. In my opinion there is no difference in buying 3p or KO and to double down (for certain markets), buying Takara is the same as not buying Hasbro

If you are on the fence though, I'll give you this piece of advice. Much like potato chips, you can't just have one. Or to keep on theme and rip off a trademark: "once you pop you just can't stop"

carytheone wrote:

Kurona wrote:Ah yes, my favourite Trsfarmer chracter... Ultrl Magenus.

I am unbelievably tempted to go for KOs of 3P toys right now. Like... you know that feeling where you know something is a bit iffy but no-one's really done anything about it and it's not that terrible anyway so no point fighting it; but you do this one little seedy loophole that makes you feel like such an ass but you love that it makes you feel that way? That's me right now. Over considering getting KOs of 3Ps. Fight the establishment with an arguably worse establishment!

Cobotron stated the worries with the grey territory very well. Me? I have very little honor when it comes to plastic. I've got a room full of Has/Tak figures and I'm sure I won't stop throwing money at them anytime soon. I do however feel no guilt in buying KOs of 3p figures. I'll see how it goes when I pick up a KO of a 1st party figure. In my opinion there is no difference in buying 3p or KO and to double down (for certain markets), buying Takara is the same as not buying Hasbro

If you are on the fence though, I'll give you this piece of advice. Much like potato chips, you can't just have one. Or to keep on theme and rip off a trademark: "once you pop you just can't stop"

My little morality check comes into play with the rather vague little guideline of "add-ons or things HasTak probably will not do". I don't exactly expect Hasbro to release better hands and feets for Combiner Wars, nor do I expect to see an IDW Cosmos, Tarn or even Rodimus in my lifetime. That's where it's easier for me - it's not taking money away from HasTak because HasTak weren't making a similar product to get money from me! Win-Win! Same goes for 'Ultrl Magenus' here. Is Generations truly going to come out with a specifically Legends-scaled Ultra Magnus, especially when the focus has shifted from smaller versions of big dudes like Optimus and Starscream to just making figures of small guys like Rewind and Brawn? Is a Legends-Scale Magnus really going to happen from HasTak? Is it really? So yeah, no remorse here~

... of course, then I find a 3P Legends Soundwave with Ratbat and Buzzsaw for £15 - and a Legends Soundwave doesn't seem too unlikely from official channels sometime in the future - and I start to waver. Especially when an official one is not likely to be of the quality shown nor is it likely to have two tiny Cassetticons...

Kurona wrote:My little morality check comes into play with the rather vague little guideline of "add-ons or things HasTak probably will not do". I don't exactly expect Hasbro to release better hands and feets for Combiner Wars, nor do I expect to see an IDW Cosmos, Tarn or even Rodimus in my lifetime. That's where it's easier for me - it's not taking money away from HasTak because HasTak weren't making a similar product to get money from me! Win-Win! Same goes for 'Ultrl Magenus' here. Is Generations truly going to come out with a specifically Legends-scaled Ultra Magnus, especially when the focus has shifted from smaller versions of big dudes like Optimus and Starscream to just making figures of small guys like Rewind and Brawn? Is a Legends-Scale Magnus really going to happen from HasTak? Is it really? So yeah, no remorse here~

... of course, then I find a 3P Legends Soundwave with Ratbat and Buzzsaw for £15 - and a Legends Soundwave doesn't seem too unlikely from official channels sometime in the future - and I start to waver. Especially when an official one is not likely to be of the quality shown nor is it likely to have two tiny Cassetticons...

That's where I started with 3p add-ons then KOs of those add-ons, then a few clearance 3p figures, then a few KOs of 3p figures. At some point you get a little numb and money talks. I see no harm in picking up figires/accessories that would never be made or even figures you wouldn't have bought in the first olacw. Anyway do what feels right.

So what 3p Soundwave are you talking about? Iron Factory? Doesn't that one come with Laserbeak and Buzzsaw? I'm real close to. Pulling the trigger on Mech Planet's Sound Track.

https://tf-direct.com/mech-planet-the-h ... p1730.html

Looks like I may have answered my own question, but I still didn't see Buzzsaw.