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ScottyP wrote:So how about issue 18, eh? Loved it and without giving anything away, it delivered on a big twist in a smart way that's way cooler and more sinister than anything I'd speculated.
Leonardo wrote:Take your lips off my pipe!
Randomhero wrote:AllNewSuperRobot wrote:If they have a toy, they have a better chance of survival.Randomhero wrote: a soft reboot to G1 with the 84 toyline being the focus like everything these days. Crash landing on earth, a small group of humans discovering them and making friends and fighting the Decepticons who are evil because they’re written to be evil.
Addressing the Elephant in the room, but when has this actually happened, post-1984???
Dream Wave, perhaps? Outside of that, which I haven't read so wouldn't know, No cartoon or comic I've seen has ever reused the 1984 framework. IDW certainly didn't, nor did Beast Wars/Machines and the cartoons that followed them. I see a lot of chatter decrying this as a certainty, but I don't know where the basis for it stems from?
Transformers isn't really in the same boat as say, He-Man. Wherein the 2002 cartoon & toys predominantly relied on appealing to the nostalgia of it's original fanbase. Mattel realised too late, that to exclusively fixate on the old fans is a liability to your future success IE The show and toyline were soon cancelled and other than a single comic, He-Man hasn't been onscreen and/or relevant to pop culture in 15/16 years.
IDW did do it though. Just last year with retconning hearts of steel. Transformers crashing on earth and fighting. Granted it was all the machinations if shockwave but it’s still happened
Armada did it too. The cartoon and comics had the minicons crash on earth and starting the war there.
Devils due did it too with their Transformers VS G.I. Joe series
And don’t forget about animated. That was the start too. Crashing on earth
Also you should probably go back and watch beast wars. It opens with the maximals and predacons fighting in orbit and crashing on earth lol
Also beast machines revealed they also crashed when they came home
Edit: oh! Don’t forget RID that also dealt with a ship crash landing on earth releasing a bunch of Decepticons
Crash landing on earth,
G1 with the 84 toyline being the focus like everything these days.
a small group of humans discovering them and making friends and fighting the Decepticons who are evil because they’re written to be evil.
I think there's still more to it that's unresolved, to the point where it can't be a cop-out. The namedrop of Troja Major may help to serve as a reminder that Agonizer pointed out five crests to Velocity and Nautica, yet the flashback to the Knights of Cybertron arriving to Mederi only shows one on the banners.Ironhidensh wrote:ScottyP wrote:So how about issue 18, eh? Loved it and without giving anything away, it delivered on a big twist in a smart way that's way cooler and more sinister than anything I'd speculated.
I dunno yet...... it could be (and I hope and believe it is) brilliant, or it could be a horrible cop out.
Either way, I didn't see it coming.
AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Randomhero wrote:AllNewSuperRobot wrote:If they have a toy, they have a better chance of survival.Randomhero wrote: a soft reboot to G1 with the 84 toyline being the focus like everything these days. Crash landing on earth, a small group of humans discovering them and making friends and fighting the Decepticons who are evil because they’re written to be evil.
Addressing the Elephant in the room, but when has this actually happened, post-1984???
Dream Wave, perhaps? Outside of that, which I haven't read so wouldn't know, No cartoon or comic I've seen has ever reused the 1984 framework. IDW certainly didn't, nor did Beast Wars/Machines and the cartoons that followed them. I see a lot of chatter decrying this as a certainty, but I don't know where the basis for it stems from?
Transformers isn't really in the same boat as say, He-Man. Wherein the 2002 cartoon & toys predominantly relied on appealing to the nostalgia of it's original fanbase. Mattel realised too late, that to exclusively fixate on the old fans is a liability to your future success IE The show and toyline were soon cancelled and other than a single comic, He-Man hasn't been onscreen and/or relevant to pop culture in 15/16 years.
IDW did do it though. Just last year with retconning hearts of steel. Transformers crashing on earth and fighting. Granted it was all the machinations if shockwave but it’s still happened
Armada did it too. The cartoon and comics had the minicons crash on earth and starting the war there.
Devils due did it too with their Transformers VS G.I. Joe series
And don’t forget about animated. That was the start too. Crashing on earth
Also you should probably go back and watch beast wars. It opens with the maximals and predacons fighting in orbit and crashing on earth lol
Also beast machines revealed they also crashed when they came home
Edit: oh! Don’t forget RID that also dealt with a ship crash landing on earth releasing a bunch of Decepticons
Let's break this down.Crash landing on earth,
Oh I see, so just by using this single trope, it means they are replicating G1 origins?
Really???It just makes them all lousy pilots.
G1 with the 84 toyline being the focus like everything these days.
How many of them did this exactly? Think hard...
Beast Wars/Machines?
RiD/Car Robots?
Unicron Trilogy?
Animated?
Prime?a small group of humans discovering them and making friends and fighting the Decepticons who are evil because they’re written to be evil.
As I do know what I'm talking about with Beast Wars, none of that applies. There were no humans (thankfully) and Megatron bribed a crew to fulfill a secret mission.
The other series perhaps but it was done with a contemporary setting. No One went back to 1984, it's human characters or even Autobot City (only recently has IDW even picked up this concept)etc .
There was no retread of any of the Sunbow/Marvel story beats either, given the rosters all varied wildly, only references and homages.
Rid/Car Robots: the Autobots were already heavily entrenched on Earth.
Unicron Trilogy: they all went to Earth in search of Minicons
Animated: they were cadets
Prime: was animated Bayformers/aligned continuity
None of these were Sunbow/Marvel/Takara Reboots, other than superficial similarities and with good reason. Those writers and artists that grew up with it don't want to repeat it, they want to put their own ideas into the setting they know.
Lastly, it may be a point of contention for some, but I still see Megatron:Origin and Infiltration as the beginning of IDWverse. Not some lazy retcon after thought. In print, as per the IDW HC Collection, those two stories are the first of book one, so that is all I need to know.
Ironhidensh wrote:ScottyP wrote:So how about issue 18, eh? Loved it and without giving anything away, it delivered on a big twist in a smart way that's way cooler and more sinister than anything I'd speculated.
I dunno yet...... it could be (and I hope and believe it is) brilliant, or it could be a horrible cop out.
Either way, I didn't see it coming.
Randomhero wrote:
The minicons still woke up and a signal was sent to cybertron which brought the autobots to earth.
Beast wars still counts because by season three they maximal did end up betting protohumans and making friends with them.
You can only count megatron origins as much as you want and not care for retcon but you’re hitting personal fanon then. It can’t be ignored. It happened.
I was referring to the revelation about the Knights of Cybertron, or at least that one 'clan' of then. Regardless, full marks indeed for calling it on the Mutineers!Randomhero wrote:Ironhidensh wrote:ScottyP wrote:So how about issue 18, eh? Loved it and without giving anything away, it delivered on a big twist in a smart way that's way cooler and more sinister than anything I'd speculated.
I dunno yet...... it could be (and I hope and believe it is) brilliant, or it could be a horrible cop out.
Either way, I didn't see it coming.
I did. I called it two months ago and mentioned that the sparkeater army is gonna be the crew of the lost light that mutinied.
AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Randomhero wrote:
The minicons still woke up and a signal was sent to cybertron which brought the autobots to earth.
Yes and how is that related to G1?Beast wars still counts because by season three they maximal did end up betting protohumans and making friends with them.
They "made friends" is a kind appraisal. They were virtually Neanderthals, they had no real perception of anything going on around them. They were hardly Miko, Sari or the Witwicky's.You can only count megatron origins as much as you want and not care for retcon but you’re hitting personal fanon then. It can’t be ignored. It happened.
It's not about what I "want", Fanon or any of that meaningless stuff. It's what IDW states in print.
Show me in this book, where it says otherwise?
AllNewSuperRobot wrote:The point is people have been saying "oh the reboot will mean going back to 1984 all over again" and my point was that no one has. They may have taken influences from it, but that's all. No writer/artist wants to retell Sunbow/Marvel/Takara. It was of it's time and as the years go by, only the character designs retain their relevance.
Crashing a spaceship and using Earth as a backdrop isn't exclusive to G1 either.
AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Yes but, in closing as this is going on too long, not one iteration did it to the same effect. Everyone who crashed got up more or less instantly and carried on their lives. No other series crashed into a dormant volcano and "slept" for millions of years.
The Animated "footage" is also a bit of a hot potato within the community, I have discovered elsewhere.
The bottom line is it is Homage and nothing more. The aim of the writers and series above is only that. Acknowledge it, as easter eggs, for the ever diminishing fans of yesterday and then move on to the New thing. No one wants to go backwards.
Randomhero wrote:AllNewSuperRobot wrote:Yes but, in closing as this is going on too long, not one iteration did it to the same effect. Everyone who crashed got up more or less instantly and carried on their lives. No other series crashed into a dormant volcano and "slept" for millions of years.
The Animated "footage" is also a bit of a hot potato within the community, I have discovered elsewhere.
The bottom line is it is Homage and nothing more. The aim of the writers and series above is only that. Acknowledge it, as easter eggs, for the ever diminishing fans of yesterday and then move on to the New thing. No one wants to go backwards.
Beast wars did as an homeage but everything after decided to use it an introducer for the universe
But they were still using it as an introduction point. It wasn’t until IDW and Simon Furman decided they want to essentially make Ultimate Transformers like marvel had done with their ultimate comics. Modernize them.
My point is if IDW decides to play it safe, they’ll probably do a soft reboot and start the new continuity with them crashing on earth. It’s something that by now is really familiar and a story that will not only attract the fans but hopefully attract the new readers or the ones that didn’t like the IDW-verse.
You start with the autobots crashing on earth you’re gonna get the fans that haven’t read the comics saying “I recognize that! I’m gonna check this out.”
That’s what Dreamwave did, that’s what beast wars did. And animated and armada and so on. It’s something people remembered from the original and can find something to attach to.
Quint wrote:Exposition-heavy nonsense. I'm not complaining about the choices, such as the end of the quest and where they are etc etc, but as a read that was atrocious.
Characters were stood around explaining the plot to each other for page after page after page. It didn't read as revelatory, nor as a logical conclusion. Ha, certainly not. It was a huge narrative leap, and it was like listening to characters read aloud from a wiki entry.
Awful IMO.
Quint wrote:It's also sweet that you're trying hard to like the issue too.
ScottyP wrote:I'm surprised by the negativity. I guess I shouldn't be around you Buzz Killingtons but here we are![]()
I'm not even going to argue, some of y'all will find a way to dislike literally anything.
Carrying on then, how great was Fulcrum at being this comic's Buzz Killington? Even has the chin.
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