The Energon Pub

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Spark Light wrote:People always consider it a plot hole, but it was established in one episode why the Autobots stopped flying.

Can't remember what episode, but one time one of the minibots I believe(probably Cliffjumper) got pissed off and tried to fly after the Decepticons, only to end up being tricked by Skywarp or something. They told them they couldn't fly as fast as the Decepticons so he shouldn't go after him.

So there you go. The Autobots can fly, they're just rubbish at it, so after a while, they didn't bother. The Decepticons are built for flight, and the Seekers are even faster, possibly several times so(than the autobots) in Jet mode.

As for the comics I don't believe they flew. TFs flying was established as early as Diaclone though, if you look at the old adverts.

I think you got some of your info mixed up....the closest thing to that was when Ironhide went after the Decept's with Bluestreaks help[no minibots] and when he was brought down [by Skywarp] it was Optimus who said there to fast for us in the sky.
As I said earlyer....The autobots can fly but have no spead in the air.

But they can't fly on some episodes.

Auto Bot wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Spark Light wrote:People always consider it a plot hole, but it was established in one episode why the Autobots stopped flying.

Can't remember what episode, but one time one of the minibots I believe(probably Cliffjumper) got pissed off and tried to fly after the Decepticons, only to end up being tricked by Skywarp or something. They told them they couldn't fly as fast as the Decepticons so he shouldn't go after him.

So there you go. The Autobots can fly, they're just rubbish at it, so after a while, they didn't bother. The Decepticons are built for flight, and the Seekers are even faster, possibly several times so(than the autobots) in Jet mode.

As for the comics I don't believe they flew. TFs flying was established as early as Diaclone though, if you look at the old adverts.

I think you got some of your info mixed up....the closest thing to that was when Ironhide went after the Decept's with Bluestreaks help[no minibots] and when he was brought down [by Skywarp] it was Optimus who said there to fast for us in the sky.
As I said earlyer....The autobots can fly but have no spead in the air.

But they can't fly on some episodes.

Correct me if I'm wrong....but I beleave that in every story,where it is said that Autobot's cant fly......later in the same story the do.

If Autobots can fly, there should be some logic behind it.

I don't think they carry Anti-Gravity devices. Those belong to Macross only.

Jet pack is one possible way.

Another is having wings, to create lift from difference in air pressure.

But what about Autobot (with car alt modes) floating in the sky, without any sign of engine exhaust? How can they explain that?

The Seekers are the most complete fliers. They got wings to ride on aerodynamics when flying with speed. And they got thrusters to float around when stationary.

What about Megatron and Soundwave? How come they can fly? Guns and boomboxes don't have any flight capable contraptions.

If Soundwave can fly, i don't remember seeing Blaster fly too.

After promising myself I wouldn't get involved with forums again, I find myself dragged in. Bah.

Anyhoo, if we're keeping the discussion to G1, you have to pretty much ignore anything from MTMTE, unless you also want to argue that Soundwave is an Autobot. As has been mentioned, that three part story was a pilot, and things change between pilot episodes and the actual series.

Moving on to the main series, Decepticons can fly. All of them. I can't think of an exception to that. When you get to the Autobots, it's a little less clearly defined. GENERALLY, any Autobot with an aerial alt mode can fly. The Dinobots can fly, presumably because otherwise they'd be too slow to deploy to battle usefully. Wheeljack can fly because of his solid fuel jets. Tracks can fly with his modified alt mode. Sideswipe routinely wears his rocket pack, and Dinobot Island showed that the Autobots have rocket packs available (although why they simply didn't get Skyfire to transport them I don't know).

But isn't all of this easily found in the cartoons and character's tech specs? So what's the problem?

Sledge wrote:After promising myself I wouldn't get involved with forums again, I find myself dragged in. Bah.

Anyhoo, if we're keeping the discussion to G1, you have to pretty much ignore anything from MTMTE, unless you also want to argue that Soundwave is an Autobot. As has been mentioned, that three part story was a pilot, and things change between pilot episodes and the actual series.

Moving on to the main series, Decepticons can fly. All of them. I can't think of an exception to that. When you get to the Autobots, it's a little less clearly defined. GENERALLY, any Autobot with an aerial alt mode can fly. The Dinobots can fly, presumably because otherwise they'd be too slow to deploy to battle usefully. Wheeljack can fly because of his solid fuel jets. Tracks can fly with his modified alt mode. Sideswipe routinely wears his rocket pack, and Dinobot Island showed that the Autobots have rocket packs available (although why they simply didn't get Skyfire to transport them I don't know).

But isn't all of this easily found in the cartoons and character's tech specs? So what's the problem?

Wait what? Soundwave was never EVER shown as an Autobot. He was transformered as a Light post on Cybertron and stationed outside the Autobot base to SPY on them but they never knew he was there.

And now to answer this question...

isn't all of this easily found in the cartoons and character's tech specs? So what's the problem?

The cartoon is entirely contridicting all the way through the series. Allso the teh specs are meaningless when talking about the cartoons. There cartoon and Comic personalitys are allmost allways completly different from eachother and the tech specs are based on the comic book versions of the characters.

Now You mentioned Sideswipes jet pact. I mentioned this before. Don't know what episode this was but there was an episode where we clearly see Optimus flying in robot mode. Immediatly after landing he asks Sideswipe for his jet pack. As far as I can remember that's allso the only episode that even gave mention to any Autobot wearing a jet pack.

Simply put the action does not match the dialog. They keep talking about how Autobots can't fly yet they constantly show Autobots flying.

Has nothing to do with Pilot episodes vs the rest of the series either. The entire series is like this. No episode lives up to the story of previous episodes. Heck the construticons and a few other characters hae multiple origin episodes. In one episode the Constructicons are built by the Decepticons, in another episode Megatron reprogramed them from Autobots back on Cybertron.

Some characters even show up out of thin air like Cosmo, Powerglide, and Seaspray just randomly appeared in one episode. No exsplination about who they were, where they came from. Were they built on Earth? Were they reinforcements called in from Cybertron? Did they find them crashed on Earth and in hybernation like Skyfire and the Insecticons? No one knows for sure they just appeared.

Saber Prime wrote: Wait what? Soundwave was never EVER shown as an Autobot. He was transformered as a Light post on Cybertron and stationed outside the Autobot base to SPY on them but they never knew he was there.

BZZT! Swing and a miss. In MTMTE when the 'Cons are sealed in ruby crystal mines Soundwave is clearly shown with an Autobot insignia. I think it happens somewhere else as well, but I can't quite remember where.

And now to answer this question...
The cartoon is entirely contridicting all the way through the series.

Not on this issue. Aside from MTMTE, the Autobots don't fly without a damn good reason.

Allso the teh specs are meaningless when talking about the cartoons. There cartoon and Comic personalitys are allmost allways completly different from eachother and the tech specs are based on the comic book versions of the characters.

BZZT! Swing and a miss. Tech specs came first. All else was based on them. And whilst a few characters were radically different between continuities (Shockwave springs to mind), I'd say most of them started from the same place but were developed differently. Assuming that they were given screen/page time, and weren't just background spear carriers.

Now You mentioned Sideswipes jet pact. I mentioned this before. Don't know what episode this was but there was an episode where we clearly see Optimus flying in robot mode. Immediatly after landing he asks Sideswipe for his jet pack. As far as I can remember that's allso the only episode that even gave mention to any Autobot wearing a jet pack.

You're wrong. Prime borrows Sideswipe's jetpack at the end of MTMTE. He is seen flying a lot earlier in the episode (Sherman Dam, I think), but what do we have to remember about MTMTE? That's right: it's a pilot. Things change between pilots and full production.

Simply put the action does not match the dialog. They keep talking about how Autobots can't fly yet they constantly show Autobots flying.

You're simply wrong. Sorry. Have you watched the episodes lately? 'Cos I think you're remembering MTMTE and mistakenly attributing scenes to later episodes.

Has nothing to do with Pilot episodes vs the rest of the series either. The entire series is like this. No episode lives up to the story of previous episodes. Heck the construticons and a few other characters hae multiple origin episodes. In one episode the Constructicons are built by the Decepticons, in another episode Megatron reprogramed them from Autobots back on Cybertron.

Except, as I've pointed out, the series IS consistent on Autobots not flying once you get beyond MTMTE. As for the Constructicons, I believe the popular theory is that the 'Cons built them new bodies on Earth, not that they constructed them from scratch.

Some characters even show up out of thin air like Cosmo, Powerglide, and Seaspray just randomly appeared in one episode. No exsplination about who they were, where they came from. Were they built on Earth? Were they reinforcements called in from Cybertron? Did they find them crashed on Earth and in hybernation like Skyfire and the Insecticons? No one knows for sure they just appeared.

This really doesn't relate to the point on Autobots flying. New characters appeared. So what? Did you assume the whole Cybertronian race was about 20-30 TFs who crash-landed on Earth?

Sledge wrote:

Saber Prime wrote: Wait what? Soundwave was never EVER shown as an Autobot. He was transformered as a Light post on Cybertron and stationed outside the Autobot base to SPY on them but they never knew he was there.

Sledge wrote: BZZT! Swing and a miss. In MTMTE when the 'Cons are sealed in ruby crystal mines Soundwave is clearly shown with an Autobot insignia. I think it happens somewhere else as well, but I can't quite remember where..

He's right but I'm not sure if it happened in MTMTE but trew out the 3 seacons there were many animation errors of this type.

Allso the teh specs are meaningless when talking about the cartoons. There cartoon and Comic personalitys are allmost allways completly different from eachother and the tech specs are based on the comic book versions of the characters.

Sledge wrote:BZZT! Swing and a miss. Tech specs came first. All else was based on them. And whilst a few characters were radically different between continuities (Shockwave springs to mind), I'd say most of them started from the same place but were developed differently. Assuming that they were given screen/page time, and weren't just background spear carriers..

While your right the tec spec's came first much of the info on them does fly in the face of the toon but not so much with the book.I like to think of the spec's as having their own continuity.

Now You mentioned Sideswipes jet pact. I mentioned this before. Don't know what episode this was but there was an episode where we clearly see Optimus flying in robot mode. Immediatly after landing he asks Sideswipe for his jet pack. As far as I can remember that's allso the only episode that even gave mention to any Autobot wearing a jet pack.

Sledge wrote: You're wrong. Prime borrows Sideswipe's jetpack at the end of MTMTE. He is seen flying a lot earlier in the episode (Sherman Dam, I think), but what do we have to remember about MTMTE? That's right: it's a pilot. Things change between pilots and full production..

In the episode Dinobot Island pt1 Bumblebee is seen yousing a jet pack to get to the island and in pt 2 Optimus orders all the autobot to put on their jet packs so that they can get to the island.

First to sto_vo_kor_2000, your quote tags are a little messed up.

And now on to this...

Sledge wrote:

Saber Prime wrote: Wait what? Soundwave was never EVER shown as an Autobot. He was transformered as a Light post on Cybertron and stationed outside the Autobot base to SPY on them but they never knew he was there.

BZZT! Swing and a miss. In MTMTE when the 'Cons are sealed in ruby crystal mines Soundwave is clearly shown with an Autobot insignia. I think it happens somewhere else as well, but I can't quite remember where.

Lots of characters have at one point or another been shown with incorrect insignias. Not just in Transformers but all cartoons of that erra. Batman has even been known to appear without ay bat symbol on his chest and Megatron was even show with an Autobot insignia at one point. It doesn't mean anything just animation errors.

And now to answer this question...
The cartoon is entirely contridicting all the way through the series.

Not on this issue. Aside from MTMTE, the Autobots don't fly without a damn good reason.

This is an issue because you stated that the only inconsistancy is between pilot episodes and the rest of the series. I said that was wrong and it is. Being Pilot episodes has nothing to do with it.

Allso the teh specs are meaningless when talking about the cartoons. There cartoon and Comic personalitys are allmost allways completly different from eachother and the tech specs are based on the comic book versions of the characters.

BZZT! Swing and a miss. Tech specs came first. All else was based on them. And whilst a few characters were radically different between continuities (Shockwave springs to mind), I'd say most of them started from the same place but were developed differently. Assuming that they were given screen/page time, and weren't just background spear carriers.

Either way the Tech Specs from what I've heard match their Comic Book profiles not the series. I've never read the comics myself so I don't know how true that is but I have read the tech specs. They allmost never match the characters on the series.

Now You mentioned Sideswipes jet pact. I mentioned this before. Don't know what episode this was but there was an episode where we clearly see Optimus flying in robot mode. Immediatly after landing he asks Sideswipe for his jet pack. As far as I can remember that's allso the only episode that even gave mention to any Autobot wearing a jet pack.

You're wrong. Prime borrows Sideswipe's jetpack at the end of MTMTE. He is seen flying a lot earlier in the episode (Sherman Dam, I think), but what do we have to remember about MTMTE? That's right: it's a pilot. Things change between pilots and full production.

Things change between every episode not just the pilot.

Simply put the action does not match the dialog. They keep talking about how Autobots can't fly yet they constantly show Autobots flying.

You're simply wrong. Sorry. Have you watched the episodes lately? 'Cos I think you're remembering MTMTE and mistakenly attributing scenes to later episodes.

While we're on the subject when was the last time YOU have watched G1. I watched a bunch of episodes on YouTube not too long ago. If you want me to I could go watch them again and post a 3 page essay o every single episode, every single animation error, and every single time an Autobot is seen flying in the series. I can't remember all the episode titles right off hand but I do know Autobots are seen flying in several episodes outside the pilot.

Has nothing to do with Pilot episodes vs the rest of the series either. The entire series is like this. No episode lives up to the story of previous episodes. Heck the construticons and a few other characters hae multiple origin episodes. In one episode the Constructicons are built by the Decepticons, in another episode Megatron reprogramed them from Autobots back on Cybertron.

Except, as I've pointed out, the series IS consistent on Autobots not flying once you get beyond MTMTE. As for the Constructicons, I believe the popular theory is that the 'Cons built them new bodies on Earth, not that they constructed them from scratch.

But you've pointed out wrong. It's not consistant about anything anywhere. Secondly that's a fan theory as you said. There's not really anything in cannon to support it. It might be possible but then again why would they need to be rebuilt? They can just scan new vehicles on Earth like the original crew did.

Some characters even show up out of thin air like Cosmo, Powerglide, and Seaspray just randomly appeared in one episode. No exsplination about who they were, where they came from. Were they built on Earth? Were they reinforcements called in from Cybertron? Did they find them crashed on Earth and in hybernation like Skyfire and the Insecticons? No one knows for sure they just appeared.

This really doesn't relate to the point on Autobots flying. New characters appeared. So what? Did you assume the whole Cybertronian race was about 20-30 TFs who crash-landed on Earth?

You missed my point completly on this one. You're stuck on the "Autobots flying subject" when I'm trying to prove a point that the series is never consistant about anything. Flying is only on small part of the inconsistancys, you're missing the bigger picture, and it's not confined to the Pilot episode either. Characters who appear out of thin air with no exsplination of where they came from is just part of the series inconsistant nature. Most likely they're just new arrivals from Cybertron but that was never actully exsplained in any way, for we know they could be from an entirly different planet.

There are now officially too many quotes within quotes for me to keep track of who's saying what and what I should respond to, so I'll stick to your final point. Yes, I appreciate that their are inconsistancies in G1. But they don't matter as we are solely discussing the matter of whether Autobots can fly. And the answer, as I said, was "No, unless they: have an aerial alt mode, are wearing a jetpack or are given the ability to fly via something in their tech specs a la Wheeljacks solid fuel rockets." No, please tell me what you find wrong with that.

[quote="Saber Prime"]First to sto_vo_kor_2000, your quote tags are a little messed up.

And now on to this...




But you've pointed out wrong. It's not consistant about anything anywhere. Secondly that's a fan theory as you said. There's not really anything in cannon to support it. It might be possible but then again why would they need to be rebuilt? They can just scan new vehicles on Earth like the original crew did.

[quote]

It was my firsr time trying to answer mulitble quotes so I'm sorry.But getting to one of your post.The TF's of the G1 toon could not scan new alt modes on their own.The original crew of both bot's and con needed Telatran 1 to do that for them....and there for would have needed bodys built for them.Now I'm not sayin that thats how it happened for the Constructicon just sayin that they would not have been able to scan for new bodys on their own.Altho they could have done so back on Cybertron but if I'm right the Constructions were on the run from Omegasupream ontill that they heard that Megatron was back then rejoined him.

did it again sorry

Sledge wrote:There are now officially too many quotes within quotes for me to keep track of who's saying what and what I should respond to, so I'll stick to your final point. Yes, I appreciate that their are inconsistancies in G1. But they don't matter as we are solely discussing the matter of whether Autobots can fly. And the answer, as I said, was "No, unless they: have an aerial alt mode, are wearing a jetpack or are given the ability to fly via something in their tech specs a la Wheeljacks solid fuel rockets." No, please tell me what you find wrong with that.

It's not that hard to figure out. Look...

The quote inside the quote is Me.

The quote itself is you.

tech specs are not relivent to the cartoon. Wheeljack, unless he was cramed in the backround somewhere that I didn't notice him, was never even seen in a battle much less flying.

And the rocket packs themselfs are a inconsistancy. They were only given mention to in a couple episodes and in at least the one characters were seen flying without them. Like Optimus Prime. We can allso see in the movie that Optimus Prime has jets attached to him and can fly to transform to robot mode. He never does this EVER outside the movie. And I am of course speaking of the original 1986 movie not the recent one that just came out.

I'm saying Autobots can fly. For whatever reason, weather it be arieal modes, jet packs, or whatever they still fly. Doesn't matter how they fly it's still flying.

Saber Prime wrote:

Sledge wrote:There are now officially too many quotes within quotes for me to keep track of who's saying what and what I should respond to, so I'll stick to your final point. Yes, I appreciate that their are inconsistancies in G1. But they don't matter as we are solely discussing the matter of whether Autobots can fly. And the answer, as I said, was "No, unless they: have an aerial alt mode, are wearing a jetpack or are given the ability to fly via something in their tech specs a la Wheeljacks solid fuel rockets." No, please tell me what you find wrong with that.

It's not that hard to figure out. Look...

The quote inside the quote is Me.

The quote itself is you.

tech specs are not relivent to the cartoon. Wheeljack, unless he was cramed in the backround somewhere that I didn't notice him, was never even seen in a battle much less flying.

And the rocket packs themselfs are a inconsistancy. They were only given mention to in a couple episodes and in at least the one characters were seen flying without them. Like Optimus Prime. We can allso see in the movie that Optimus Prime has jets attached to him and can fly to transform to robot mode. He never does this EVER outside the movie. And I am of course speaking of the original 1986 movie not the recent one that just came out.

I'm saying Autobots can fly. For whatever reason, weather it be arieal modes, jet packs, or whatever they still fly. Doesn't matter how they fly it's still flying.

Maybe it's just because I'm getting old, but when someone posts about half a page worth of quotes from at least three different people, I start having trouble keeping track who's saying what.

Anyhoo, moving on. Wheeljack flies in Plague Of Insecticons. Ok? You can go and watch that. Then you can come back and apologise.

As for your point on rocket packs, please tell me what episodes you're talking about. It's very difficult to have a discussion about something like this without knowing specifically what you're referring to. As I've said, I suspect you're thinking of MTMTE. If you're not, I'd love to know which episodes have Autobots inexplicably flying.

Prime in the Movie: doesn't fly. We see a couple of rockets give him a boost into the air, but they're not continually burning to propel him through the sky.

Sledge wrote:

Saber Prime wrote:

Sledge wrote:There are now officially too many quotes within quotes for me to keep track of who's saying what and what I should respond to, so I'll stick to your final point. Yes, I appreciate that their are inconsistancies in G1. But they don't matter as we are solely discussing the matter of whether Autobots can fly. And the answer, as I said, was "No, unless they: have an aerial alt mode, are wearing a jetpack or are given the ability to fly via something in their tech specs a la Wheeljacks solid fuel rockets." No, please tell me what you find wrong with that.

It's not that hard to figure out. Look...

The quote inside the quote is Me.

The quote itself is you.

tech specs are not relivent to the cartoon. Wheeljack, unless he was cramed in the backround somewhere that I didn't notice him, was never even seen in a battle much less flying.

And the rocket packs themselfs are a inconsistancy. They were only given mention to in a couple episodes and in at least the one characters were seen flying without them. Like Optimus Prime. We can allso see in the movie that Optimus Prime has jets attached to him and can fly to transform to robot mode. He never does this EVER outside the movie. And I am of course speaking of the original 1986 movie not the recent one that just came out.

I'm saying Autobots can fly. For whatever reason, weather it be arieal modes, jet packs, or whatever they still fly. Doesn't matter how they fly it's still flying.

Maybe it's just because I'm getting old, but when someone posts about half a page worth of quotes from at least three different people, I start having trouble keeping track who's saying what.

Anyhoo, moving on. Wheeljack flies in Plague Of Insecticons. Ok? You can go and watch that. Then you can come back and apologise.

As for your point on rocket packs, please tell me what episodes you're talking about. It's very difficult to have a discussion about something like this without knowing specifically what you're referring to. As I've said, I suspect you're thinking of MTMTE. If you're not, I'd love to know which episodes have Autobots inexplicably flying.

Prime in the Movie: doesn't fly. We see a couple of rockets give him a boost into the air, but they're not continually burning to propel him through the sky.

If your asking what episode autobots use rocetpacks to fly besides MTMTE Theres Dinobot island parts 1 and 2.....if your asking what episodes they just fly on their own there are too many to count

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Sledge wrote:

Saber Prime wrote:

Sledge wrote:There are now officially too many quotes within quotes for me to keep track of who's saying what and what I should respond to, so I'll stick to your final point. Yes, I appreciate that their are inconsistancies in G1. But they don't matter as we are solely discussing the matter of whether Autobots can fly. And the answer, as I said, was "No, unless they: have an aerial alt mode, are wearing a jetpack or are given the ability to fly via something in their tech specs a la Wheeljacks solid fuel rockets." No, please tell me what you find wrong with that.

It's not that hard to figure out. Look...

The quote inside the quote is Me.

The quote itself is you.

tech specs are not relivent to the cartoon. Wheeljack, unless he was cramed in the backround somewhere that I didn't notice him, was never even seen in a battle much less flying.

And the rocket packs themselfs are a inconsistancy. They were only given mention to in a couple episodes and in at least the one characters were seen flying without them. Like Optimus Prime. We can allso see in the movie that Optimus Prime has jets attached to him and can fly to transform to robot mode. He never does this EVER outside the movie. And I am of course speaking of the original 1986 movie not the recent one that just came out.

I'm saying Autobots can fly. For whatever reason, weather it be arieal modes, jet packs, or whatever they still fly. Doesn't matter how they fly it's still flying.

Maybe it's just because I'm getting old, but when someone posts about half a page worth of quotes from at least three different people, I start having trouble keeping track who's saying what.

Anyhoo, moving on. Wheeljack flies in Plague Of Insecticons. Ok? You can go and watch that. Then you can come back and apologise.

As for your point on rocket packs, please tell me what episodes you're talking about. It's very difficult to have a discussion about something like this without knowing specifically what you're referring to. As I've said, I suspect you're thinking of MTMTE. If you're not, I'd love to know which episodes have Autobots inexplicably flying.

Prime in the Movie: doesn't fly. We see a couple of rockets give him a boost into the air, but they're not continually burning to propel him through the sky.

If your asking what episode autobots use rocetpacks to fly besides MTMTE Theres Dinobot island parts 1 and 2.....if your asking what episodes they just fly on their own there are too many to count

I wasn't asking anything. Where did you see a question? I allways use the proper ? when it's a question, at least I think I do. I'm not use to this key board.

Saber Prime wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

As for your point on rocket packs, please tell me what episodes you're talking about. [size=12]It's very difficult to have a discussion about something like this without knowing specifically what you're referring to. As I've said, I suspect you're thinking of MTMTE. If you're not, I'd love to know which episodes have Autobots inexplicably flying.[/size]

If your asking what episode autobots use rocetpacks to fly besides MTMTE Theres Dinobot island parts 1 and 2.....if your asking what episodes they just fly on their own there are too many to count

I wasn't asking anything. Where did you see a question? I allways use the proper ? when it's a question, at least I think I do. I'm not use to this key board.[/quote]

Right there

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Saber Prime wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Sledge wrote:

As for your point on rocket packs, please tell me what episodes you're talking about. It's very difficult to have a discussion about something like this without knowing specifically what you're referring to. As I've said, I suspect you're thinking of MTMTE. If you're not, I'd love to know which episodes have Autobots inexplicably flying.

If your asking what episode autobots use rocetpacks to fly besides MTMTE Theres Dinobot island parts 1 and 2.....if your asking what episodes they just fly on their own there are too many to count

I wasn't asking anything. Where did you see a question? I allways use the proper ? when it's a question, at least I think I do. I'm not use to this key board.

Right there

Um dude you're talking to yourself? lol that's your own question or did we miss quote again?

-=edit=-

Went back and looked at the original post. You were answering a question Sledge posted but was directed at me.

Wow I'm confused please edit your posts and fix your quote tags it's hard to tell who you're talking to.

Sorry about the qoute thing.I havnt sleept in 3 days but that post of yours said and this time I'm typing it my self:

As for your point on rocket packs, please tell me what episodes you're talking about.

Now I know you didnt place a question mark at the end but it looks like a question to me.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Sorry about the qoute thing.I havnt sleept in 3 days but that post of yours said and this time I'm typing it my self:

As for your point on rocket packs, please tell me what episodes you're talking about.

Now I know you didnt place a question mark at the end but it looks like a question to me.

Yea I didn't post the question, Sledge did, it was directed at me. I think I don't know anymore.

Dude I'm sorry your right!!!!All these quote's on all these pages are messing me up!!!!I need to get some sleep.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Dude I'm sorry your right!!!!All these quote's on all these pages are messing me up!!!!I need to get some sleep.

It's OK, get some sleep, come back tomarrow, we cool.

Sledge wrote:There are now officially too many quotes within quotes for me to keep track of who's saying what and what I should respond to, so I'll stick to your final point. Yes, I appreciate that their are inconsistancies in G1. But they don't matter as we are solely discussing the matter of whether Autobots can fly. And the answer, as I said, was "No, unless they: have an aerial alt mode, are wearing a jetpack or are given the ability to fly via something in their tech specs a la Wheeljacks solid fuel rockets." No, please tell me what you find wrong with that.

Yeah, the multiple quotes are dizzying!

Saber Prime: If there are too many episodes where Autobots fly on their own, why can't you name any of them? I'm really not trying to be nasty here, but I've explained and backed up my point, and you're just sitting there going "No, you're wrong. But I won't prove it." Name me an episode. I'm not asking for all of them, or for you to count all of them. Just name me one epsiode. If what you say is correct, it should be easy.

My own two cents:

If the Autobots could fly...why "roll out" in vehicle mode? Why even bother being vehicles to begin with?

Fear not; Tracks can fly in car mode.

If I may clear up some confusion here, according to writers of the series, who have discussed this issue at various Botcons and Comiccons, it's been stated that in the first two episodes the Autobots could fly, but due to the nature of the fact that it was odd to have AUTObots flying in the air since they are all ground based vehicals the writers as a group decided as of the third episode of MTMTE that the Autobots would no longer fly at all. Recon the first two episodes flight entierly. It was later decided that the decpeticons couldn't roll like the Autobots, and would only be air robots.

So here's the just of things. As of Episode three of the first season, all Autobots were ground based beings that needed specialized gear to fly. In the third Episode of More then Meets the Eye Prime asks Sideswipe for his jet pack to follow Megatron, after the cons took off on the newly built rocket ship. The Jetpack either failed or was destroyed and Prime fell back to earth, leaving the saving to be done by Mirage.

Anyway as for plague of Insecticons, Wheeljack had a power jump, this is indicated by the sound effect. If there are inconsistancys in G1, Flying isn't one of them, after More then Meets the Eye, then they are done by color or by simple animation mistakes and not by the dialogue. By season two it is firmly established that Autobots need gear to fly, save for the Dinobots. The reason being their massive size and structure, and they weren't tripple changers, so the deal was that they had some sort of repulsery system that allowed them to fly. It should be noted that they didn't fly at first at all. It was only in season two that they started to fly. Correction, the first time we see them flying is in War of the Dinobots, and again I do believe it is due to some sort of replusary system since their alt modes would be too slow to have following the trucks and cars that are going at ninety or a hundered miles an hour.

Infact Desertion of the Dinobots, War Dawn, and Key to Vector Sigma clearly established the rule regarding Autobot and Decepticon flights. In Desertion we learn that the Autobots developed stealth, aka, trasformation to deal with the War machines. Later in War Dawn, we learn that the Decepticons combated the stealth mode by developing the ablity to fly, and then in Sigma we finally learn that the Autobots can't fly as a rule, thus why the Cons can easily retreat and thus why you have planes like Sky fire and Powerglide, only flying when they're in Alt mode. Neather Sky, nor, Powerglide, fly when they're in robot mode, nor does Springer in the movie. This is a rule that was established Post MTMTE. The reason for the Combatacons being built was so that the Cons had some way of dealing with the autobots on the ground, because they couldn't prior to this. They had no altmodes that could ram into Prime.

Yes there are inconsistancys with animation in G1, but it's more the error of the animation due to the same model sculpts and color schemes that caused it more then anything else. Not the bible that the writers went on after MTMTE.

I hope this clears things up.
DS