The Energon Pub

[Mr_Autobot411]

"It's not good when I'm not involved."

What an @$$hole. Bay is a complete and total @$$hole. I've come to terms that we'll never see a decent Transformers adaption in our lifetimes thanks to him, but I find it amusing that people still eat up the garbage he puts on their cinematic plates.

With that kind of attitude do you think the fandom really deserve a movie pandering to the whiners?


You do know why fans don't write movies or have much impact right?



And what's wrong with people liking the movies there are worse movies and those people are not you they have different opinions so next time think before insulting people who enjoy something you don't.

I'll sum it up for you with two lists.
List one, things I don't ever want to see in a Transformers movie, but I have:
•Crass "humor" aimed squarely at slack jawed idiots.
•Discussions about masterbation
•Robots peeing on people.
•Dogs peeing on robots
•Nonsensical plots about conspiracies concerning Transformers affecting humanity's past.
•Plot points wherein characters explain why its okay for them to have sex with an under-aged minor.
•Porny shots of faked baked women in skimpy outfits.
•Weird racism.
•Blatant racism.
•Recycled footage from The Island.
•Chicago getting destroyed more than once.
•Marky Mark playing an inventor.
•Robots that don't transform as much as dissolve into thousands of tiny pieces and reassemble.
•High school boy being put off by ridiculous past of hot girl whose dad stole cars. Or something.
•John Turturro's underwear.
•Editing that looks like it was done by a bunch of interns all high on cocaine.
•Shaky camera for every action scene mixed with random bits of slow motion.
•Characters who act like douchebags, which accounts for all of them.
•Childhood icon Optimus Prime portrayed as a cold blooded killer of both Decepticons and humans who piss him off.
•Divergent story lines and characters that have nothing to do with the rest of the movie.
•Evil government/business conspiracy organizations ... again and again and again.
•There's only one way to defeat this giant evil robot — call the United States military!
•An evil sex bot with a 20-foot long tongue.

Now for list number two, things I'd like to see in a Transformers movie that we haven't seen yet and likely won't as long as Bay is involved —
•Robots besides Optimus and Bumblebee who are actually discernible from each other at a glance.
•Plots that in a broad way, make some kind of sense.
•Appealing characters, both human and robot.
•Transformers treated as characters and not just special effects in the background of Shia's attempts to get laid.
•Plots not driven completely by some type of bullcrap McGuffin.
•Dialog that sounds like regular people and not drunk college frat boys during rush week.
•Character development.
•A basic understanding of story structure.


Look, I didn't say you couldn't enjoy these movies. If you can enjoy these movies, then good for you. I'm not insulting you, but I've hated Michael Bays' style of film making ever since Armageddon.

To me watching these films (well the first one's not as bad as the others) is the cinematic equivalent of slamming my head into a metal door repeatedly. They're loud, every character is obnoxious, they have no theme, they make no sense and their story structure is nonexistent.

If you think my problems are those of a whiner, pull up Rottentomatoes sometime and read some of the reviews there. My problems with these films aren't fanboy Transformer problems, they are fundamental storytelling problems.

bro i hear u, ur list is pretty much what i think of bays crap. its too bad ppl dont like substance over style these days, much like the new star wars movie.......all style no substance

I hate when people come at me with that train of THUNK. Define "substance." Why can't style be its own damn substance? Who are you, or anyone else to tell anyone what substance is supposed to be? If I say it is substance, that's exactly what it is.

because style is never substance brother, its how it is sorry if u dont agree. thats life.

What if I were to tell you that I like the movies because of their substance? I mean, style is always going to be deciding factor to me, in determining whether or not I like anything. Regardless, what if told you that I've actually been able to find things of substantial value in these movies?

brother, thats all good, u found something in these movies that appeals to u, i on the other hand, and a few ppl here did not. Now im all for debating, but man when i come on to these forms, its all about attacking each other opinions (never seen a fandom attack each other more then TF fans). I feel many times when myself, or if anyone for that matter states as to why we dont like Bays movies, we are idoits! simple as that. just idoits. To the the ppl that like the movies. I guess on the flip side maybe when u or anyone else states why the like the movies they get bashed unfairly too. I personally respect anyone that can say why, or why they didnt like the movies, in an intelligent as cival matter. My problem is ppl that say ur a tool, cuz i dont like the movies.......I totally understand to some ppl these movies are their holy grail of film, and thats fine. Just dont get bent outta shape when someone says, hey i dont like the movies cuz of this or that. If someone doesnt like the movies and tells u why they dont, just dont take it personally! debate it if u like ask em why, and maybe u can understand the other person more and make a connection rather then just dissing that person. Im talking not about U, im talking about most of the ppl over years ive seen bash ppl for liking or hating the movie. ppl can think what they like, just be intellgent and respectable. Till all are one

[Microraptor]

Now for list number two, things I'd like to see in a Transformers movie that we haven't seen yet and likely won't as long as Bay is involved —
•Robots besides Optimus and Bumblebee who are actually discernible from each other at a glance.
•Plots that in a broad way, make some kind of sense.
•Appealing characters, both human and robot.
•Transformers treated as characters and not just special effects in the background of Shia's attempts to get laid.
•Plots not driven completely by some type of bullcrap McGuffin.
•Dialog that sounds like regular people and not drunk college frat boys during rush week.
•Character development.
•A basic understanding of story structure.

Leaving aside the fact you basically just described the fourth one, I feel the first point is one worth addressing.

I've heard people talk about how "all the robots look the same", and "you can't tell them apart". It's not true. The characters all have unique and distinct visual designs. Heck, plenty of them aren't even bipedal! Now if you want a continuity where the transformers all look the same, I can think of one. GENERATION 1.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

Given good writers and a little more plot, the movies could be amazing. I still very much enjoy them, but something more akin to Pearl Harbor would be a little better plot wise and story wise

[cruizerdave]

Now for list number two, things I'd like to see in a Transformers movie that we haven't seen yet and likely won't as long as Bay is involved —
•Robots besides Optimus and Bumblebee who are actually discernible from each other at a glance.

Leaving aside the fact you basically just described the fourth one, I feel the first point is one worth addressing.

I've heard people talk about how "all the robots look the same", and "you can't tell them apart". It's not true. The characters all have unique and distinct visual designs. Heck, plenty of them aren't even bipedal! Now if you want a continuity where the transformers all look the same, I can think of one. GENERATION 1.

My main problem with the designs is that they are overly complicated — overly designed if you will. It's difficult to distinguish them at a glance. Yes, they are different, but by the second movie, when they add in a lot more robots, it gets harder to tell them apart. Especially the Decepticons.
I would be easier if they had developed personalities, but most of them didn't.
That's not to say that some designs are fine. I really liked Barricade, and pretty much every sequence he was in was great. Except he just kinda disappeared in the last act.

[cruizerdave]

"

because style is never substance brother, its how it is sorry if u dont agree. thats life.

So much this!

[Hellscream9999]

Now for list number two, things I'd like to see in a Transformers movie that we haven't seen yet and likely won't as long as Bay is involved —
•Robots besides Optimus and Bumblebee who are actually discernible from each other at a glance.

Leaving aside the fact you basically just described the fourth one, I feel the first point is one worth addressing.

I've heard people talk about how "all the robots look the same", and "you can't tell them apart". It's not true. The characters all have unique and distinct visual designs. Heck, plenty of them aren't even bipedal! Now if you want a continuity where the transformers all look the same, I can think of one. GENERATION 1.

My main problem with the designs is that they are overly complicated — overly designed if you will. It's difficult to distinguish them at a glance. Yes, they are different, but by the second movie, when they add in a lot more robots, it gets harder to tell them apart. Especially the Decepticons.
I would be easier if they had developed personalities, but most of them didn't.
That's not to say that some designs are fine. I really liked Barricade, and pretty much every sequence he was in was great. Except he just kinda disappeared in the last act.

Yes, it seems that even the mighty 's can fall victim to abhorrent writing

[no-one]

In a recent Collider interview with Michael Bay on his new film 13 Hours, Steve Weintraub was able to sneak in a few questions about Bay's involvement with any future Transformers films. The full interview can be viewed here.

There are three talking points to add a little fuel to the rumor fires:

According to Bay his writers

...did a really good job of going back in time and connecting things in history and how it relates to different spinoffs...

Bay continued to say, presumably about Transformers 5

...I guess this will be my last one...

And when Weintraub probed Bay for additional info, he received the following statement

...I can't tease **** ...

When you're done with the interview check out the most recent additions to the AOE galleries here. And don't forget to join in the conversation and rumor mongering in the discussion below.

Remember to keep your browsers pointed to Seibertron.com for the latest in Transformer news, the largest Transformers galleries found on the web and the liveliest Transformers discussion this side of a space bridge.

[acchillyaout]

Hello fellow Sybertronians. I think this is great news to tie the previous 4 movies together. It will help build continuity and go a long way to a shared universe. Personally, I'd like to see them try a combiner again. It was such a hit in the second movie and really carried the watered down (writers strike) script. As long as Bay can bring his dependable action sequences, the 5th installlent should be successful. Let's explore some new characters as well!

[Black Bumblebee]

Such a hack. Wish he'd just move on to something else.

[Microraptor]

I'm glad Bay's in charge of this one.

[BullDragon513]

I know I'm going to catch a lot of flak for this but,as long as it's better than the 3rd movie I'll be happy. The 4th one was good, once I finally got around to watching it. DoTM put me so off the movies that I waited until AoE was uploaded to Netflix before watching it.

[dragons]

Such a hack. Wish he'd just move on to something else.

Did people say same thing about George Romeo who made nothing and started whole zombie movie series?

[MGrotusque]

Such a hack. Wish he'd just move on to something else.

Did people say same thing about George Romeo who made nothing and started whole zombie movie series?

George Romero invented the Zombie genre with vision. Bay is just scrambling and stumbling his way through this franchise with zero understanding of the source material to bang out a buck for movie execs and line pockets. He is NOT doing the characters or the franchise justice by rebooting them in his uninformed and belligerent style. The movies are painful and repulsive to watch for ME as a life long fan of TF's...... IMO of course.
I'm bummed to see that once again he has the helm.

[BERSEKAEL]

the only thing I hope, is a rich Legion class collection, just like the first 3 movies... Hasbro really messed up with AoE Legion class

[Mkall]

Still haven't seen 4, will probably not see 5 either.

[JoeMabbon]

You can't even say Bay started the trend of live-action adaptations of cartoons. People had already been doing that for decades to varying success.

I'm vaguely curious as to how any of this ties together. The movies have such sloppy continuity I almost don't see a point... other than to ape Disney.

[Sabrblade]

I'll reiterate what I've said before. Bay is not the sole issue at play with these movies. There's also the writers, the producers, and other members of the production staff. Getting rid of Bay won't solve every problem, and it seems to be less that he won't give these movies up and more that the movies won't give him up. I really get the feeling that he'd honestly like to let go of these movies, but everyone else involved keeps pulling him back in because, in spite of every flaw the previous movies had, they were still super financially successful, and Bay's involvement seems to be what the higher ups believe to be a key aspect of that financial success these movies keep having. So if Bay is to ever finally be let go, these movies are gonna have to somehow stop making so much money. But they're such big moneymakers that I just don't see that happening and thus don't see the higher up be willing to set Bay free anytime soon. But even if they were to do so, there's still the other members of the production staff to contend with.

[Randomhero]

I'll reiterate what I've said before. Bay is not the sole issue at play with these movies. There's also the writers, the producers, and other members of the production staff. Getting rid of Bay won't solve every problem, and it seems to be less that he won't give these movies up and more that the movies won't give him up. I really get the feeling that he'd honestly like to let go of these movies, but everyone else involved keeps pulling him back in because, in spite of every flaw the previous movies had, they were still super financially successful, and Bay's involvement seems to be what the higher ups believe to be a key aspect of that financial success these movies keep having. So if Bay is to ever finally be let go, these movies are gonna have to somehow stop making so much money. But they're such big moneymakers that I just don't see that happening and thus don't see the higher up be willing to set Bay free anytime soon. But even if they were to do so, there's still the other members of the production staff to contend with.

Bravo. You're very right. honestly i very much remember what he said in the commentary to the second or third one. "If these movies are so bad than why do they keep being so successful?" You can't argue that. Yes, you can go to any fandom forum and you'll find a bitter group that just want to say how much they hate him and his he's damaging transformers but honestly he's not and these movies aren't. I know plenty of people who are not fans of the franchise and fandom like we are but see the movies because they're fun action films and they are. They're harmless.

These movies are an option to see, if after 5 films you want to continue complaining then please move one. Obviously they're not for you and we are lucky enough to be in a time when there's so many different branches in transformers that you can find something you can enjoy and if you honestly can't than enjoy what you liked when you were a kid. Throw in the DVDs to G1, collect the old stuff or classics. Go back and watch Animated or beast wars or God forbid the unicorn trilogy. Or and dare I say and please don't take this personal, maybe move on.

Something I'm starting to see over the past couple years now is people finally saying "these movies just aren't for me which is fine. I like the comics, or RiD/Prime or generations" I wish more people would be like that.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

I would like to see them stitch the movies together and make sense of it. Should make John Barber the screen writer.

[Randomhero]

I would like to see them stitch the movies together and make sense of it. Should make John Barber the screen writer.

John actually did that!...sort of. When he was placed in charge of the movie comics for dark of the moon he added text stories at the end of every issue for the prequels that tied plot holes together. The only one I remember fondly is the one about Thundercracker stealing one of Sentinel's space bridge nodes and using it to release the fallen from his sarcophagus.

If you haven't seen any of that stuff check them out on the tfwiki. The summaries are all there. They're pretty neat.

[D-Maximal_Primal]

I would like to see them stitch the movies together and make sense of it. Should make John Barber the screen writer.

John actually did that!...sort of. When he was placed in charge of the movie comics for dark of the moon he added text stories at the end of every issue for the prequels that tied plot holes together. The only one I remember fondly is the one about Thundercracker stealing one of Sentinel's space bridge nodes and using it to release the fallen from his sarcophagus.

If you haven't seen any of that stuff check them out on the tfwiki. The summaries are all there. They're pretty neat.

I did see that thanks! It's mainly his role in trying to comically patch things together, not to mention his current IDW run that has basically put the IDW-verse in order, that make me wish he would

[MGrotusque]

I'll reiterate what I've said before. Bay is not the sole issue at play with these movies. There's also the writers, the producers, and other members of the production staff. Getting rid of Bay won't solve every problem, and it seems to be less that he won't give these movies up and more that the movies won't give him up. I really get the feeling that he'd honestly like to let go of these movies, but everyone else involved keeps pulling him back in because, in spite of every flaw the previous movies had, they were still super financially successful, and Bay's involvement seems to be what the higher ups believe to be a key aspect of that financial success these movies keep having. So if Bay is to ever finally be let go, these movies are gonna have to somehow stop making so much money. But they're such big moneymakers that I just don't see that happening and thus don't see the higher up be willing to set Bay free anytime soon. But even if they were to do so, there's still the other members of the production staff to contend with.

The director has far more pull than you seem to suggest here. The Director is in complete control of all art direction, plot production and story telling. He has utmost control and artistic direction of the film. The execs and producers give concepts and idea but it;s the directors job to establish credibility, believability and continuity to the product they've invested in financially. It's not their job to make the movie and tell the story but only to finance it. It's the directors job, in tandem with writers, to weave the story and create the cohesive plot development along with the characters, their aesthetics, and establish a rich story arc that engages the audience. Bay, along with Hasbro unfortunatley, have an unlimited lexicon of material to research in which to create a cohesive and colourfull vision of the Transformer franchise and it's universe but he seems to resist to do so and to sell that to Hasbro execs. He's a bull in a china shop as far as i'm concerned and a pawn. He's not the Director that should be at the helm of this project any longer. The torch needs to be passed on to somebody that gives a shiet and has a vision and actually appears to give a fu@ck about the story behind it all.

[cruizerdave]

Hello fellow Sybertronians. I think this is great news to tie the previous 4 movies together. It will help build continuity and go a long way to a shared universe. Personally, I'd like to see them try a combiner again. It was such a hit in the second movie and really carried the watered down (writers strike) script. As long as Bay can bring his dependable action sequences, the 5th installlent should be successful. Let's explore some new characters as well!

Yeah, such a big hit. It was combined just long enough for a juvenile and idiotic joke about giant metal balls before it was defeated by the power of the U.S. Navy.
Maybe in the next one they can use the combiner to make a joke about metal vaginas and have it be defeated by Coast Guard.

[ZeroWolf]

To be fair the navy did have a nonexistent prototype rail gun (or mass driver). That's the kind of text that would bring a tf down, even a combiner. A plot hole would of been the fact it was never used again (I'm talking about Dark of the Moon here)

Or do you have a problem with humans taking down tfs. For me? I'm okay with it, though it all depends on how it happens.

[cruizerdave]

To be fair the navy did have a nonexistent prototype rail gun (or mass driver). That's the kind of text that would bring a tf down, even a combiner. A plot hole would of been the fact it was never used again (I'm talking about Dark of the Moon here)

Or do you have a problem with humans taking down tfs. For me? I'm okay with it, though it all depends on how it happens.

It's not a plot hole, it's just a stupid plot point and how it was handled. The Decepticons have unleashed this ultimate weapon for the purpose of ... tearing down a pyramid? Really? Plus this huge monstrosity at the climax of the film is defeated by a cell phone call to the Navy who shoot him with a rail gun. So this huge thing, seemingly unstoppable thing is put down not by Optimus Prime, not by any characters or elements that have been established earlier in the movie.
Nope, he's destroyed by the crew of a navel ship hundreds of miles away who we as a film audience don' t know and have never seen before.

It would be like if the first Star Wars movie ended with the dog fight at the Death Star. Only this time instead of Luke blowing up the Death Star, Leia calls her uncle who shoots it with a different superweapon that was never established prior in the movie, and then never seen again.

Plus it had that crass joke about robot testicles. Completely indefensible.