The Energon Pub

[william-james88]

If only Transformers prime went any where and had good characters the show would of been good.


I prefer violent Movie Optimus to bland Prime Optimus at least violent Prime is entertaining to watch.

Oh everyone agrees that Prime was the worst character in Prime. It was a fun realization in this discussion: viewtopic.php?t=105159&p=1719867#p1719867

[SlyTF1]

Technically it's only a statutory rape joke when viewed through the lens of America as in the UK the age of consent is 16 so had the film be set in the UK, cade at of been unhappy but that's it.

If it were set in Iran, they could have stoned her to death for adultry. But it wasn't set in the UK or Iran. It was set in the United States where banging a 17-year-old while in your 20s is a crime.

My point is they didn't need to address it at all. Overprotective dad is an easy character type, whether she's 17 or 23, it doesn't matter. In all the over the top stupid things in these movies, you're honestly going to argue that it's important for the character motivation for it to be established that she's a minor having sex with an adult?

Hell, just have Cade be unhappy that his daughter is dating the type of douche bag that's constantly making remarks about making out with his daughter to his face. I mean what kind of nitwit has so little respect for his girlfriend's father that he says stuff like that? But that's part of my point about these movies. They are populated with simpletons who lack even basic social skills.

[

.

1. Marvel doesn't have any damn appealing characters. There isn't a single one of them, besides Ultron, and maybe, just maybe Captain America that have any appeal to me.

2. Rape joke? There's no damn rape joke in any of the Transformers movies. Not only that, but I'm sure Guardians of the Galaxy had a masturbation joke.

1. Really? So you find Sam Witwicky, dumbass who's only goal in life is to get laid more appealing than Robert Downey Jr.'s Iron Man, brilliant guy who gets laid, but also has many other layers to him? That says more about your taste than mine.

2. Are you really that naive to not know that the scene where Douche McDrivedrive pulls out the Texas Romeo and Juliet statute out of his wallet that what they are talking about is statutory rape? Because that's what they were talking about and it was supposed to be funny, but it wasn't because it was a grown man talking about his justification for having sex with someone who in the eyes of the law is still a child. Statutory rape.

Also, you're wrong about Guardians, which is a good movie. I watched it with my kids and never had to feel uncomfortable at the low brow humor. The Transformers movies are full of raunchy humor that is in appropriate for children and people with any amount of decorum or class.

Ironic, as they are movies based on a children's toy line.

1. Where in the absolute **** did you read where I wrote that? Point me to it, because I sure don't remember writing it. You're pulling words out of your ass and putting them in my mouth to back up your argument. I don't care about any of the human characters. The only few I would even deem "alright" characters would be Lennox, Epps, Cade, and Joshua, with the first 2 being less memorable. I'm talking about the Transformers, themselves. Whether you like it or not, the Transformers are characters.

2. I may not agree with it, but if it's legal, it's not rape. How the Hell can people call it rape when it legally isn't? You don't just get to decide what you think rape is.

I don't give a damn how you felt. It was still in the movie.

[Deadput]

2. I may not agree with it, but if it's legal, it's not rape. How the Hell can people call it rape when it legally isn't? You don't just get to decide what you think rape is.

It's not even rape even if it was illegal the Daughter seemed pretty willingly do people even know what the term rape means?

[Sabrblade]

2. I may not agree with it, but if it's legal, it's not rape. How the Hell can people call it rape when it legally isn't? You don't just get to decide what you think rape is.

It's not even rape even if it was illegal the Daughter seemed pretty willingly do people even know what the term rape means?

'Twould help yall's argument if ya actually knew that the word "rape" isn't being used in its literal meaning when applied to the concept of "statutory rape". It's one of those terms that uses a word to refer to something not specifically the same as the usual, more widely known meaning of the word. "Statutory rape" may not necessarily in all cases be a form of what most people think of when they hear the word "rape", but it is the official term for the subject of Tessa's and Shane's relationship as discussed in that scene in the movie.

Here's more info on the matter - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statutory_rape

Think like how the cereal called "Apple Jacks" doesn't taste like apple despite its name.

[Deadput]

If only Transformers prime went any where and had good characters the show would of been good.


I prefer violent Movie Optimus to bland Prime Optimus at least violent Prime is entertaining to watch.

Quoting myself here (Obviously) I was on my phone typing this now that I'm back on my computer I'll explain in further detail.



Prime had potential it had great designs (Most of the time) heck some of the relics were pretty clever and cool and there were even a few good Autobots and Decepticons such as Ratchet, Dreadwing, Smokescreen and especially Knock Out.



But then the problems come in let me start with the lifelessness Prime was with the lack of civilians and the amount of barren locations we were at and the lack of Autobots and the Decpeticons army comprising of merely Vehicons and a few soldiers.



Then there were the bland action scenes at least the Bayfromers were visually cool to look at in Prime it's just shooting and punching hell the least they of done was used cover and don't get me started on how quick the Autobots slaughter Vehicons and Insecticons without effort with the small amount of forces they had.



The wasted potential or cut short story plots remember Breakdown's hints of doubting or his rivalry with Bulkhead never went anywhere and they unceremoniously killed him heck Bulkhead doesn't even seemed to care like at all same goes with Dreadwing who was just killed when they had nothing to do with him anymore who was also never mentioned again in the show.

Arachined a character created for what again? She was just put on a bus twice.


Cliffjumper what was the damn point to make the show seem threatening? Yeah the same show where Autobots never get injured and effortlessly win with no further casualties and were we supposed to feel sad for Cliffjumper when he died in the first five minutes? He was never killed in a fight either just stabbed in the chest and done for.



Going to end it with Starscream...who the heck did that whiny unimposing feminine thing become second in command again?

He was never good at fighting and was just a butt monkey at least G1, Animated, and Movie versions of the same guy showed he could put up a fight and scheme up some decent plans I'm grateful they killed him off at the end even if it was off screen. (His voice actor confirmed his fate)



My brains going to explode if I go on and there are others who can explain better then me so I'm done.

[Deadput]

Twould help yall's argument if ya actually knew that the word "rape" isn't being used in its literal meaning when applied to the concept of "statutory rape". It's one of those terms that uses a word to refer to something not specifically the same as the usual, more widely known meaning of the word. "Statutory rape" may not necessarily in all cases be a form of what most people think of when they hear the word "rape", but it is the official term for the subject of Tessa's and Shane's relationship as discussed in that scene in the movie.

Then call it Statutory rape and not just rape there is a difference.


Regardless still applies for the people claiming Shane rapes Tessa.

[Burn]

Now that I've finished my lunch, I'm going to go back to work now.

When I get back I'm going to assume the rape/statutory-rape discussion has either ended or moved to its own thread...

[Deadput]

Now that I've finished my lunch, I'm going to go back to work now.

When I get back I'm going to assume the rape/statutory-rape discussion has either ended or moved to its own thread...

Lunch?


It's 10 pm where I am so where the heck are you for it to be early enough for lunch?

[Sabrblade]

Then call it Statutory rape and not just rape

They DID. People were using the term "statutory rape". It was you and Sly who were confusing it for the other meaning.

[Deadput]

Then call it Statutory rape and not just rape

They DID. People were using the term "statutory rape". It was you and Sly who were confusing it for the other meaning.

I was quoting Sly so yeah...lets stop I'm depressing myself with this pointless argue fest.


I swear I'm getting grey hairs and sore backs at 18 years old.

[o.supreme]

Transformers is not and never will be Shakespeare it's an adaption to half baked children's toy commercial seeing Transformers having story telling potential as Star wars, Star Trek, Walking Dead, Breaking Bad, Citizen Kane or even the Marvel films will never understand on how ridiculous the idea of Transformers is to a general person who isn't a fan.

You lost me here when you compare Shakespeare and Citizen Kane to all those other franchises. Those should all not even be mentioned in the same sentence.

Transformers is like Star Wars, Star Trek, and The Marvel Films in terms of fandom and support (across various forms of media, conventions etc...) and actually has a much longer history and richer mythology than Walking Dead or Breaking Bad. (not even sure why those were mentioned)

Oh everyone agrees that Prime was the worst character in Prime. It was a fun realization in this discussion: viewtopic.php?t=105159&p=1719867#p1719867

Sorry, I have to be The Lone Ranger here. I thought Prime was great in TF Prime. Probably the closest Prime has ever been to his Original Series personality. I'd take this Optimus any time over the personification in the last 2 films (again not saying I hate those films, just to be clear).

[william-james88]

Transformers is like Star Wars, Star Trek, and The Marvel Films in terms of fandom and support (across various forms of media, conventions etc...) and actually has a much longer history and richer mythology than Walking Dead or Breaking Bad. (not even sure why those were mentioned)

I agree, Transformers has the same potential as any other multi medium fantasy franchise aimed at all ages (you can also add Ninja Turtles, Power Rangers and Godzilla to that list). The 80s Transformers show is better than any Marvel show that preceded it.

I think a TF movie can be much better than they currently are. My only point in all this was that changing director is not necessarily the answer to this. Michael Bay can do some good stuff with a decent script (like The Rock (the movie, not the movie star)).

[o.supreme]

I totally agree 100%. I guess we'll only see in the coming years what the result of the conference establishing multiple writers for multiple sequels and spinoffs creating the "Transformers Cinematic Universe" was, and to know if it was a worthwhile venture or not.

[cruizerdave]

1: What do you expect with most men being perverts It's in most movie hell ever Marvel films to a small extent.



2: The films have flaws but saying their as bad as slamming your head into a metal door is over exaggerating it.




3. If someone says that Rottentomatoes is a reliable source they lose credibility to me and not just with Transformers but in general.



4. Transformers is not and never will be Shakespeare .



5. I'm done here for now I'm not going to waste my sanity with arguing plus I can't ever speak what I'm trying to say anyways so my argument here is probably going to look arrogant and rude which is not the intention it's a brain to mouth thing if you understand what I mean.

1. These are movies based on a children's toy line, plus in today's world objectifying women is offensive.
2. Really, because I have a headache after watching one of these. Every time.
3. Rottentomatoes is nothing more the the compiling of every film critic they can find. When you have a series of films that's scoring in the teens and 30s, that telling you that most critics don't care for it. And say what you will, critics do know a thing or two about movies. The Transformers films score worse than the Star Wars prequels, and honestly, they are worse movies.
4. I don't want Shakespeare. I'd be happy with Furman level writing in these. As it is, they are horribly written from top to bottom.
5. Not at all. You've been civil and articulate in how you express your opinions. We may not agree on these movies, but there are certainly no hard feelings.

[Deadput]

You lost me here when you compare Shakespeare and Citizen Kane to all those other franchises. Those should all not even be mentioned in the same sentence.

Transformers is like Star Wars, Star Trek, and The Marvel Films in terms of fandom and support (across various forms of media, conventions etc...) and actually has a much longer history and richer mythology than Walking Dead or Breaking Bad. (not even sure why those were mentioned)



Sorry, I have to be The Lone Ranger here. I thought Prime was great in TF Prime. Probably the closest Prime has ever been to his Original Series personality. I'd take this Optimus any time over the personification in the last 2 films (again not saying I hate those films, just to be clear).

Yes I realize its not a good comparison but its just the impression I get from people I talk to about the movies apparently they expect a movie to be god tier in quality.


Movies could be better I agree I'm just sick of the exaggerations people make about the movies Like I'm pretty sure watching an ok film (what I consider Transformers to be it serves it's purpose as entertaining like a movie should) is better then slamming your head on a metal door.


Also sick of people calling Bay an awful person because he is not he is a pretty decent person just because you don't have a stellar product or make some kind of controversy mistake doesn't mean their Satan of films.





Prime Optimus gave speeches but was an absolute boring character even G1 Optimus had a dry wit about him I do think G1 cartoon is the ideal Prime while not in battle although in battle since he is the Autobot's leader I expect him to be a powerful fighter who does everything he can to stop the Decepticons from hurting others even if he has to do a savage kill every once in awhile and I expect that since war is not pretty and you can't be a leader of an army or military if you can't do whats necessary.

[jogunwarrior]

I'm quite excited by this news! I'm a big fan of the Transformers movies!

[Stuartmaximus]

look Bay's not a terrible director! he's just terrible where the Transformers movies are concerned!

just wish he'd hurry up n make Bad Boys 3!

[ZeroWolf]

He's not even a terrible director as far as the tf films go. The director isn't the only person who makes the movie.

[Mr_Autobot411]

"It's not good when I'm not involved."

What an @$$hole. Bay is a complete and total @$$hole. I've come to terms that we'll never see a decent Transformers adaption in our lifetimes thanks to him, but I find it amusing that people still eat up the garbage he puts on their cinematic plates.

With that kind of attitude do you think the fandom really deserve a movie pandering to the whiners?


You do know why fans don't write movies or have much impact right?



And what's wrong with people liking the movies there are worse movies and those people are not you they have different opinions so next time think before insulting people who enjoy something you don't.

I'll sum it up for you with two lists.
List one, things I don't ever want to see in a Transformers movie, but I have:
•Crass "humor" aimed squarely at slack jawed idiots.
•Discussions about masterbation
•Robots peeing on people.
•Dogs peeing on robots
•Nonsensical plots about conspiracies concerning Transformers affecting humanity's past.
•Plot points wherein characters explain why its okay for them to have sex with an under-aged minor.
•Porny shots of faked baked women in skimpy outfits.
•Weird racism.
•Blatant racism.
•Recycled footage from The Island.
•Chicago getting destroyed more than once.
•Marky Mark playing an inventor.
•Robots that don't transform as much as dissolve into thousands of tiny pieces and reassemble.
•High school boy being put off by ridiculous past of hot girl whose dad stole cars. Or something.
•John Turturro's underwear.
•Editing that looks like it was done by a bunch of interns all high on cocaine.
•Shaky camera for every action scene mixed with random bits of slow motion.
•Characters who act like douchebags, which accounts for all of them.
•Childhood icon Optimus Prime portrayed as a cold blooded killer of both Decepticons and humans who piss him off.
•Divergent story lines and characters that have nothing to do with the rest of the movie.
•Evil government/business conspiracy organizations ... again and again and again.
•There's only one way to defeat this giant evil robot — call the United States military!
•An evil sex bot with a 20-foot long tongue.

Now for list number two, things I'd like to see in a Transformers movie that we haven't seen yet and likely won't as long as Bay is involved —
•Robots besides Optimus and Bumblebee who are actually discernible from each other at a glance.
•Plots that in a broad way, make some kind of sense.
•Appealing characters, both human and robot.
•Transformers treated as characters and not just special effects in the background of Shia's attempts to get laid.
•Plots not driven completely by some type of bullcrap McGuffin.
•Dialog that sounds like regular people and not drunk college frat boys during rush week.
•Character development.
•A basic understanding of story structure.


Look, I didn't say you couldn't enjoy these movies. If you can enjoy these movies, then good for you. I'm not insulting you, but I've hated Michael Bays' style of film making ever since Armageddon.

To me watching these films (well the first one's not as bad as the others) is the cinematic equivalent of slamming my head into a metal door repeatedly. They're loud, every character is obnoxious, they have no theme, they make no sense and their story structure is nonexistent.

If you think my problems are those of a whiner, pull up Rottentomatoes sometime and read some of the reviews there. My problems with these films aren't fanboy Transformer problems, they are fundamental storytelling problems.

bro i hear u, ur list is pretty much what i think of bays crap. its too bad ppl dont like substance over style these days, much like the new star wars movie.......all style no substance

[Sabrblade]

You know, last night I watched the first episode of the old Challenge of the GoBots cartoon for the first time ever, and that one episode felt much closer to what I'd like to see in a live action Transformers movie than any of the live movies we've gotten so far.

[SlyTF1]

"It's not good when I'm not involved."

What an @$$hole. Bay is a complete and total @$$hole. I've come to terms that we'll never see a decent Transformers adaption in our lifetimes thanks to him, but I find it amusing that people still eat up the garbage he puts on their cinematic plates.

With that kind of attitude do you think the fandom really deserve a movie pandering to the whiners?


You do know why fans don't write movies or have much impact right?



And what's wrong with people liking the movies there are worse movies and those people are not you they have different opinions so next time think before insulting people who enjoy something you don't.

I'll sum it up for you with two lists.
List one, things I don't ever want to see in a Transformers movie, but I have:
•Crass "humor" aimed squarely at slack jawed idiots.
•Discussions about masterbation
•Robots peeing on people.
•Dogs peeing on robots
•Nonsensical plots about conspiracies concerning Transformers affecting humanity's past.
•Plot points wherein characters explain why its okay for them to have sex with an under-aged minor.
•Porny shots of faked baked women in skimpy outfits.
•Weird racism.
•Blatant racism.
•Recycled footage from The Island.
•Chicago getting destroyed more than once.
•Marky Mark playing an inventor.
•Robots that don't transform as much as dissolve into thousands of tiny pieces and reassemble.
•High school boy being put off by ridiculous past of hot girl whose dad stole cars. Or something.
•John Turturro's underwear.
•Editing that looks like it was done by a bunch of interns all high on cocaine.
•Shaky camera for every action scene mixed with random bits of slow motion.
•Characters who act like douchebags, which accounts for all of them.
•Childhood icon Optimus Prime portrayed as a cold blooded killer of both Decepticons and humans who piss him off.
•Divergent story lines and characters that have nothing to do with the rest of the movie.
•Evil government/business conspiracy organizations ... again and again and again.
•There's only one way to defeat this giant evil robot — call the United States military!
•An evil sex bot with a 20-foot long tongue.

Now for list number two, things I'd like to see in a Transformers movie that we haven't seen yet and likely won't as long as Bay is involved —
•Robots besides Optimus and Bumblebee who are actually discernible from each other at a glance.
•Plots that in a broad way, make some kind of sense.
•Appealing characters, both human and robot.
•Transformers treated as characters and not just special effects in the background of Shia's attempts to get laid.
•Plots not driven completely by some type of bullcrap McGuffin.
•Dialog that sounds like regular people and not drunk college frat boys during rush week.
•Character development.
•A basic understanding of story structure.


Look, I didn't say you couldn't enjoy these movies. If you can enjoy these movies, then good for you. I'm not insulting you, but I've hated Michael Bays' style of film making ever since Armageddon.

To me watching these films (well the first one's not as bad as the others) is the cinematic equivalent of slamming my head into a metal door repeatedly. They're loud, every character is obnoxious, they have no theme, they make no sense and their story structure is nonexistent.

If you think my problems are those of a whiner, pull up Rottentomatoes sometime and read some of the reviews there. My problems with these films aren't fanboy Transformer problems, they are fundamental storytelling problems.

bro i hear u, ur list is pretty much what i think of bays crap. its too bad ppl dont like substance over style these days, much like the new star wars movie.......all style no substance

I hate when people come at me with that train of THUNK. Define "substance." Why can't style be its own damn substance? Who are you, or anyone else to tell anyone what substance is supposed to be? If I say it is substance, that's exactly what it is.

[Burn]

I hate when people come at me with that train of THUNK. Define "substance." Why can't style be its own damn substance? Who are you, or anyone else to tell anyone what substance is supposed to be? If I say it is substance, that's exactly what it is.

ENOUGH!
Every damn time Sly, every damn time someone posts their grievances with the movies you pounce on them and force them to defend their opinions.

Everyone knows what these movies mean to you, but pull your head out of that little world you live in and realise people think differently from you.

Respect their opinions, because I'm damn tired of seeing YOU shove YOUR opinions down the throats of others. No one owes you any damn explanations of why they have a problem with the movies.

[SlyTF1]

I hate when people come at me with that train of THUNK. Define "substance." Why can't style be its own damn substance? Who are you, or anyone else to tell anyone what substance is supposed to be? If I say it is substance, that's exactly what it is.

ENOUGH!
Every damn time Sly, every damn time someone posts their grievances with the movies you pounce on them and force them to defend their opinions.

Everyone knows what these movies mean to you, but pull your head out of that little world you live in and realise people think differently from you.

Respect their opinions, because I'm damn tired of seeing YOU shove YOUR opinions down the throats of others. No one owes you any damn explanations of why they have a problem with the movies.

What I'm trying to do is ease their grievances. I'm trying to show them that someone liking these movies isn't as much as a detriment to society as they think it is. For some people, there is "substance" to be found in these movies, and not just for me, but for a number of the people who like them. And that number may not even realize it. Maybe I should have explained myself better and with less hostility, but at least consider what I have to say. At least entertain the notion that people may just see something in the movies that you don't see, instead of chalking it up to people being a bunch of idiots who just want something to watch. That's all I ask.

It has nothing to do with an opinion, it has to do with the generalization towards people who like a damn movie. It's been this way for years, and people still aren't getting it. And with TF5 coming out, I'm not trying to deal with the same elitist mentality again. And I bet if I were to explain myself, people would call me crazy and tell me I'm trying to read too deeply into a "dumb" movie. Just don't come at me, implying that anyone who likes the movies is stupid.

[Mr_Autobot411]

"It's not good when I'm not involved."

What an @$$hole. Bay is a complete and total @$$hole. I've come to terms that we'll never see a decent Transformers adaption in our lifetimes thanks to him, but I find it amusing that people still eat up the garbage he puts on their cinematic plates.

With that kind of attitude do you think the fandom really deserve a movie pandering to the whiners?


You do know why fans don't write movies or have much impact right?



And what's wrong with people liking the movies there are worse movies and those people are not you they have different opinions so next time think before insulting people who enjoy something you don't.

I'll sum it up for you with two lists.
List one, things I don't ever want to see in a Transformers movie, but I have:
•Crass "humor" aimed squarely at slack jawed idiots.
•Discussions about masterbation
•Robots peeing on people.
•Dogs peeing on robots
•Nonsensical plots about conspiracies concerning Transformers affecting humanity's past.
•Plot points wherein characters explain why its okay for them to have sex with an under-aged minor.
•Porny shots of faked baked women in skimpy outfits.
•Weird racism.
•Blatant racism.
•Recycled footage from The Island.
•Chicago getting destroyed more than once.
•Marky Mark playing an inventor.
•Robots that don't transform as much as dissolve into thousands of tiny pieces and reassemble.
•High school boy being put off by ridiculous past of hot girl whose dad stole cars. Or something.
•John Turturro's underwear.
•Editing that looks like it was done by a bunch of interns all high on cocaine.
•Shaky camera for every action scene mixed with random bits of slow motion.
•Characters who act like douchebags, which accounts for all of them.
•Childhood icon Optimus Prime portrayed as a cold blooded killer of both Decepticons and humans who piss him off.
•Divergent story lines and characters that have nothing to do with the rest of the movie.
•Evil government/business conspiracy organizations ... again and again and again.
•There's only one way to defeat this giant evil robot — call the United States military!
•An evil sex bot with a 20-foot long tongue.

Now for list number two, things I'd like to see in a Transformers movie that we haven't seen yet and likely won't as long as Bay is involved —
•Robots besides Optimus and Bumblebee who are actually discernible from each other at a glance.
•Plots that in a broad way, make some kind of sense.
•Appealing characters, both human and robot.
•Transformers treated as characters and not just special effects in the background of Shia's attempts to get laid.
•Plots not driven completely by some type of bullcrap McGuffin.
•Dialog that sounds like regular people and not drunk college frat boys during rush week.
•Character development.
•A basic understanding of story structure.


Look, I didn't say you couldn't enjoy these movies. If you can enjoy these movies, then good for you. I'm not insulting you, but I've hated Michael Bays' style of film making ever since Armageddon.

To me watching these films (well the first one's not as bad as the others) is the cinematic equivalent of slamming my head into a metal door repeatedly. They're loud, every character is obnoxious, they have no theme, they make no sense and their story structure is nonexistent.

If you think my problems are those of a whiner, pull up Rottentomatoes sometime and read some of the reviews there. My problems with these films aren't fanboy Transformer problems, they are fundamental storytelling problems.

bro i hear u, ur list is pretty much what i think of bays crap. its too bad ppl dont like substance over style these days, much like the new star wars movie.......all style no substance

I hate when people come at me with that train of THUNK. Define "substance." Why can't style be its own damn substance? Who are you, or anyone else to tell anyone what substance is supposed to be? If I say it is substance, that's exactly what it is.

because style is never substance brother, its how it is sorry if u dont agree. thats life.

[SlyTF1]

"It's not good when I'm not involved."

What an @$$hole. Bay is a complete and total @$$hole. I've come to terms that we'll never see a decent Transformers adaption in our lifetimes thanks to him, but I find it amusing that people still eat up the garbage he puts on their cinematic plates.

With that kind of attitude do you think the fandom really deserve a movie pandering to the whiners?


You do know why fans don't write movies or have much impact right?



And what's wrong with people liking the movies there are worse movies and those people are not you they have different opinions so next time think before insulting people who enjoy something you don't.

I'll sum it up for you with two lists.
List one, things I don't ever want to see in a Transformers movie, but I have:
•Crass "humor" aimed squarely at slack jawed idiots.
•Discussions about masterbation
•Robots peeing on people.
•Dogs peeing on robots
•Nonsensical plots about conspiracies concerning Transformers affecting humanity's past.
•Plot points wherein characters explain why its okay for them to have sex with an under-aged minor.
•Porny shots of faked baked women in skimpy outfits.
•Weird racism.
•Blatant racism.
•Recycled footage from The Island.
•Chicago getting destroyed more than once.
•Marky Mark playing an inventor.
•Robots that don't transform as much as dissolve into thousands of tiny pieces and reassemble.
•High school boy being put off by ridiculous past of hot girl whose dad stole cars. Or something.
•John Turturro's underwear.
•Editing that looks like it was done by a bunch of interns all high on cocaine.
•Shaky camera for every action scene mixed with random bits of slow motion.
•Characters who act like douchebags, which accounts for all of them.
•Childhood icon Optimus Prime portrayed as a cold blooded killer of both Decepticons and humans who piss him off.
•Divergent story lines and characters that have nothing to do with the rest of the movie.
•Evil government/business conspiracy organizations ... again and again and again.
•There's only one way to defeat this giant evil robot — call the United States military!
•An evil sex bot with a 20-foot long tongue.

Now for list number two, things I'd like to see in a Transformers movie that we haven't seen yet and likely won't as long as Bay is involved —
•Robots besides Optimus and Bumblebee who are actually discernible from each other at a glance.
•Plots that in a broad way, make some kind of sense.
•Appealing characters, both human and robot.
•Transformers treated as characters and not just special effects in the background of Shia's attempts to get laid.
•Plots not driven completely by some type of bullcrap McGuffin.
•Dialog that sounds like regular people and not drunk college frat boys during rush week.
•Character development.
•A basic understanding of story structure.


Look, I didn't say you couldn't enjoy these movies. If you can enjoy these movies, then good for you. I'm not insulting you, but I've hated Michael Bays' style of film making ever since Armageddon.

To me watching these films (well the first one's not as bad as the others) is the cinematic equivalent of slamming my head into a metal door repeatedly. They're loud, every character is obnoxious, they have no theme, they make no sense and their story structure is nonexistent.

If you think my problems are those of a whiner, pull up Rottentomatoes sometime and read some of the reviews there. My problems with these films aren't fanboy Transformer problems, they are fundamental storytelling problems.

bro i hear u, ur list is pretty much what i think of bays crap. its too bad ppl dont like substance over style these days, much like the new star wars movie.......all style no substance

I hate when people come at me with that train of THUNK. Define "substance." Why can't style be its own damn substance? Who are you, or anyone else to tell anyone what substance is supposed to be? If I say it is substance, that's exactly what it is.

because style is never substance brother, its how it is sorry if u dont agree. thats life.

What if I were to tell you that I like the movies because of their substance? I mean, style is always going to be deciding factor to me, in determining whether or not I like anything. Regardless, what if told you that I've actually been able to find things of substantial value in these movies?