Getting this out of the way before my response to the larger preceding post:
Burn wrote:Deadput wrote:Burn wrote:So I asked my partner this, and she couldn't answer, so now we're both curious.
Were Dropkick and Shatter named in the movie? Neither of us recall their names being mentioned at all.
No unfortunately which is a shame, one of my few criticisms with the movie, I feel like they could of introduced themselves by name to Sector 7 to appear more friendly but I can understand why they wouldn't bother telling the human's their names.
Hopefully a Cybertron movie if there is one could have the two in a smaller role but be named there.
That ... is a massive balls up. They were the major bad guys and they weren't named? How does something like that get overlooked?
Sadly, only B-127/Bumblebee, Optimus Prime, and Ravage were named in the movie. Shatter, Dropkick, Blitzwing, and all other TFs in this movie were only named in the end credits' voice cast list.
As for how it happened, well, Drift was likewise never named in AOE, so, it happens. Still sad, but, what can you do?
Anyway,
Nemesis Maximo wrote:I’m not sure I can agree with that 100%. Movie 1 seemed pretty clear on the fact that Optimus was there only after Bumblebee contacted him in that film, and that they were on earth for the Allspark, not to establish a base, but then they decided to stay on Earth because of the relationship they had just built with Thurman’s and the fact that it’s the last place the Allspark had been.
I mean, there's nothing explicit in the first movie that declared the 2007 arrive scene to be very first time that Optimus & Friends had ever been on Earth before (something which TLK did try to retcon in before this movie threw that out with its own less egregious take on the idea); it was only implied since we had no reason to think otherwise at the time. But now that we've had much more of the history revealed to us over time, our perception of the 2007 arrival scene is given new light by this movie showing that at least Optimus had been to Earth 20 years prior to that scene. And at that time, neither he nor any of the Autobots knew of the AllSpark being on Earth, so when they were ready to leave Earth between this movie at the first, they saw no reason to stick around if they believed the AllSpark was elsewhere, but were evidently keen enough to let Bumblebee stay behind "just in case".
Also, who's Thurman?
Nemesis Maximo wrote:I’m not saying the continuity is airtight in the sequels, by any means. I just think that as a prequel, Bumblebee should be held to a higher standard of fitting into what was established.
That's a good sentiment to have. But since there's a whole lot of empty unknown space between 1987 and 2007 in this timeline, there's a lot that we don't know about during that time that could serve to explain the connectivity between this movie and Movie 1. A lot can happen over the span of 20 years. and we know that at the beginning of this movie, the AllSpark is not a priority since merely getting off Cybertron and away to safety is the Autobots' main concern. Cybertron didn't look dead yet at the start of this movie, so searching for the Cube wouldn't yet be as urgent as when the planet does go dark later. For all we know, the quest for the AllSpark in this movie's timeline may not have formally begun until, say, 1991; four years after this movie's time and 16 years before Movie 1. We just don't know at this point. It's all 'wait and see' right now.
Nemesis Maximo wrote:Here’s something I see when you put everything in those terms; ROTF seems to be the worst offender as far as continuity, obviously as a result of the Writer’s Strike (not defending the film, just stating fact). If you take out ROTF, more so than any other film, the continuity tightens right up.
Save for Megatron beingvery much alive and (mostly) well in DOTM, despite having definitely died and been dumped into the ocean at the end of Movie 1.
Nemesis Maximo wrote:I’ll give you “as easily as” but I definitely disagree about the issues being more easily handwaved. Again, being a prequel designed to show how we got to square one, it should fit into what square one established. Imagine if Rogue One didn’t fit in to established Star Wars continuity. To me, that’s what it feels like with Bumblebee doing it’s own thing.
Like I said, 20 years is a long time for things to happen between then and now.
Sabrblade wrote:I mean, I hate taking anything LdB says as truth, he’s the epitome of the Hollywood Tool Producer. The man has no real clue.
Sure, but, in this case, I can't see any fault in the idea of the Autobots leaving Earth once they're able to after this movie's events. Their coming to Earth in this movie in the first place always struck me as a temporary thing. A tactical retreat to give the Autobots a chance to regroup and recuperate until they were ready to head back out and continuing fighting the good fight. Since at this point in the timeline the Autobots have no reason to seek any help from humanity (unlike in Movie 1 where they specifically needed help from the descendant of Archibald Witwicky), and need to remain autonomous in their time of hiding on Earth from the Decepticons (rather than fully bringing their war to Earth at this point), they wouldn't feel obligated to become the planet's guardians like they later do in the sequel films, and could leave Earth without fear of the Decepticons wrecking the planet in their absence, since the war wouldn't have fully spread to Earth yet.
Nemesis Maximo wrote:And I definitely took that red truck at the end as Optimus Prime himself. That’s way too specific of a reference to be anything but Optimus Prime.
Or, it's Travis Knight showing just how much of a G1 fanboy he is by going out of his way to include a truck and trailer like that that so heavily resemble G1 Cartoon Optimus Prime's altmode.
Plus, in the designs video Knight was in, he talked about how Optimus, being in his Cybertronian body, would not yet have certain Earth truck designs like the truck grill and such, and so deliberately omitted those kinds of details from the design for Optimus. Yet, when Optimus appears on Earth in that final scene, his body is exactly the same as it was in the Cybertron scenes, suggesting that he has not (yet) scanned an Earth altmode since, as evidenced by other scanning instances (both in this movie and in the others), his body would have changed to feature new elements of his altmode had he already scanned one before that final scene.
Eh, this movie's got much better internal consistency when it comes to the transitions between night and day and scene locations (e.g. - no starting out in Washington D.C. and stepping outsite of the Smithsonian to suddenly be in Arizona).
Plus, that final scene took place in a remote forest. Bee was last seen on the Golden Gate Bridge in the big city San Francisco Bay Area. Some time definitely passed between the bridge scene and his rendezvous with Optimus.