The Energon Pub

Ya know, I keep looking at the pics of Motormaster and I really think the robot forms more of the torso than we think, I think the ports that attach the frame pieces are IN the robot.

Ok, I think I'm caught up with the Legacy news (RL family troubles) and I don't really have anything to say other than:

Why show off the Menasor frame on Motormaster's box?!

I'm definitely skipping this Menasor don't hurt me in favor of completing the CW one. I think finding the limbs won't be that hard soon.

O, Wildrider got his name back. Good on him!

Jelze Bunnycat wrote:Ok, I think I'm caught up with the Legacy news (RL family troubles) and I don't really have anything to say other than:

Why show off the Menasor frame on Motormaster's box?!

I'm definitely skipping this Menasor don't hurt me in favor of completing the CW one. I think finding the limbs won't be that hard soon.

O, Wildrider got his name back. Good on him!

Oh come on... Live a little! Get both!!

Bit the bullet and pre-ordered Motormaster from Target. Hoping that the pre-order sticks cause while it's not a massive discount (unlike the last time I pre-ordered from them), it's still a good discount

chuckdawg1999 wrote:Ya know, I keep looking at the pics of Motormaster and I really think the robot forms more of the torso than we think, I think the ports that attach the frame pieces are IN the robot.

It's all in the trailer. The shoulder connectors are those white rectangular blocks on either side of the tower, the upper legs are at the bottom of the tower. I'm not entirely convince yet that the arms have CW connectors.




Hey, you know what would make for a really cool retool of Motormaster and even the rest of the Stunticons to a point?




Wouldn't even be that hard. And we already have Rotorstorm.

Emerje

The Motormaster component does add depth though and I think that's where the combiner head resides, no?

It's interesting, when I first heard Motromaster was going to be sold at the commander price point I was almost done with it. We went from a voyager in CW to a commander?! And I'm still stuck having to buy 4 limb bots?!?!?! I just wasn't having it. But now that we finally see what we are getting for the commander price point, I did a complete 180 since it looks really obvious just how much you are getting. While the rest of the stunticon team is still needed for the complete look, it's pretty crazy how you can go from a small bot to a giant bot in the same commander class package. The trailer does is a triple changer on it's own with a function in every mode. The value and worth is just so clearly on display.

Just needs a retool of Dragstrip into Dragstrip, that is one ugly race car. Even all the third third party upgrades dont make it better and there is quite a fair few upgrades out there for him.

I'm really not liking the painted windows on motormaster either (it will definitely look odd next to the other stunticons in car mode with their cthru windows), no doubt there will will be upgrades for him but I think for the money I'm going to avoid figures that need upgrades for the foreseeable.

Sentinel_Primal wrote:Bit the bullet and pre-ordered Motormaster from Target. Hoping that the pre-order sticks cause while it's not a massive discount (unlike the last time I pre-ordered from them), it's still a good discount

Yeah, same. Although now I'm wondering if I should go back and put in a preorder with Amazon just in case.
I know every retailer has had issues, but I haven't had any with Amazon, and only 1 with Target.
I have a Redcard so my initial preorder was < $75 after tax (I later went back and canceled, then preordered 2 because I found a couple old giftcards + the $25 off $100 promotion).
Considering Blitzwing is $55 from most places, $75 for Motormaster is a really good discount.
I'm just glad I didn't wait to go back and preorder two... Between that promotion and a couple giftcards I ended-up only paying just over $115 for both.
I'm also feeling confident that this was put in early enough that it all goes through.
At $85+, it could be a while before this sells out. So I'd bet that early preorders are almost a guarantee.

william-james88 wrote:The Motormaster component does add depth though and I think that's where the combiner head resides, no?

It's interesting, when I first heard Motromaster was going to be sold at the commander price point I was almost done with it. We went from a voyager in CW to a commander?! And I'm still stuck having to buy 4 limb bots?!?!?! I just wasn't having it. But now that we finally see what we are getting for the commander price point, I did a complete 180 since it looks really obvious just how much you are getting. While the rest of the stunticon team is still needed for the complete look, it's pretty crazy how you can go from a small bot to a giant bot in the same commander class package. The trailer does is a triple changer on it's own with a function in every mode. The value and worth is just so clearly on display.

I was always hopeful that this set would be on point. Initially I was also thinking, "Hmmmm, so all said and done this set will basically be $200... There's a ton riding on Motormaster, and this could be one of those 'all or nothing' situations".
But I completely agree-- now seeing what is involved, this seems like a more legit Commander Class figure than Rodimus imo.
I'm indifferent to the battle station mode, but likes/dislikes aside, there's enough intentionality to it that it's still a legit mode, and it is like a triple changer.
It's basically the same situation with Motormaster; even though his "3rd mode" is for Menasor, the fact that it doesn't appear to hinder the other two, that's still very substantial, and for me, is one of many reasons I can already call this a really good figure.
I'm happily surprised that this Menasor may very well overtake SS86 Sludge as my favorite figure of the year.

I've started seeing more comparison photos between the CW and Legacy versions...
Hats off to Hastak. Sure, an improvement from the previous Menasor isn't saying much, but with what they've done with this upcoming release, "improvement" is a gross understatement.

Emerje wrote:Hey, you know what would make for a really cool retool of Motormaster and even the rest of the Stunticons to a point?

Turbomasters01.jpg

Wouldn't even be that hard. And we already have Rotorstorm.

Emerje

And the combined form could be Hyperdrive.

Sabrblade wrote:

Emerje wrote:Hey, you know what would make for a really cool retool of Motormaster and even the rest of the Stunticons to a point?

Turbomasters01.jpg

Wouldn't even be that hard. And we already have Rotorstorm.

Emerje

And the combined form could be Hyperdrive.

I'm pretty sure I remember one of the leakers (one that has since run out of info) mentioning that an engineering sheet or something similar for Motormaster bore mention of a Thunderclash head, but we haven't heard anything more than that.

Sowndwave76 wrote:

Sentinel_Primal wrote:Bit the bullet and pre-ordered Motormaster from Target. Hoping that the pre-order sticks cause while it's not a massive discount (unlike the last time I pre-ordered from them), it's still a good discount

Yeah, same. Although now I'm wondering if I should go back and put in a preorder with Amazon just in case.
I know every retailer has had issues, but I haven't had any with Amazon, and only 1 with Target.

I haven't had any with Amazon, but last time I pre-ordered from Target was ER Snapdragon and SS Overload for a total of $55. Got Snapdragon no problem, but I never got Overload and ended up just cancelling the order and buying him when I found him in store. Granted, the discount for Motormaster isn't nearly as nice as that deal was, so I won't be as upset if I have to cancel him, but still a tad worried about it

The only small issue I have with him being a Commander, as well as for Rodimus, is that Optimus w/trailer has been a Leader release several times. Yeah sure someone will find an excuse/reason to justify it in their head why Motormaster should be a Commander but it doesn't justify it in my head for basically the same stuff. Granted MM's trailer is significantly more intricate than OP's trailer. However for me as someone who will not build Menasor or use the trailer for a battle platform it's a waste, which maybe means I should wait for an eventual Voyager release. Question is will that ever happen? Luckily I only had to pay $70 but still feel as if I needed the Vaseline.

Till-all-R1 wrote:The only small issue I have with him being a Commander, as well as for Rodimus, is that Optimus w/trailer has been a Leader release several times. Yeah sure someone will find an excuse/reason to justify it in their head why Motormaster should be a Commander but it doesn't justify it in my head for basically the same stuff. Granted MM's trailer is significantly more intricate than OP's trailer. However for me as someone who will not build Menasor or use the trailer for a battle platform it's a waste, which maybe means I should wait for an eventual Voyager release. Question is will that ever happen? Luckily I only had to pay $70 but still feel as if I needed the Vaseline.

I sincerely doubt Motormaster will get a standalone release.

One thing to bare in mind going forward is that price points are no longer about size alone. Leader Class Earthrise Optimus Prime was a voyager class bot with a very bare bones trailer which was enough plastic for the Leader class price point.

Emerje wrote:

chuckdawg1999 wrote:Ya know, I keep looking at the pics of Motormaster and I really think the robot forms more of the torso than we think, I think the ports that attach the frame pieces are IN the robot.

It's all in the trailer. The shoulder connectors are those white rectangular blocks on either side of the tower, the upper legs are at the bottom of the tower. I'm not entirely convince yet that the arms have CW connectors.




(...)

Emerje

From what I can tell they don't. The "arms" wrap around for base mode, with the tower forming the back. Also worth noting is that the base is laying on its tummy, and the feet are connected by very simple pegs.

For those who really don’t want Menasor and are on the fence with Motormaster, I’d say wait for a while…
If I had to bet, Motormaster will sell less than Rodimus, who still ended up going on a hefty sale.
$85-$90 is no easy sell to kids (or parents), fans, & even collectors, so I don’t see this being a difficult purchase even months from now.
Heck, I could see this figure being on at least 1 retailer’s Black Friday sale list.
In fact the only reason I preordered 2 so soon instead of 1 was because of that promotion Target had.

I think where people need to be careful is with the limb figures, specifically Dragstrip & Wild Rider…
6 months from now availability for 1 or both could be scarce & very limited.
My advice if you’re on the fence is go for them now… Returns are really easy.
But avoid the after/secondary market.
I learned this lesson the hard way with ER Sunstreaker… I was going to pass, then was on the fence for a long time.
Although I never saw him in-store, & at that point there was no way to know how much I’d be skipping from Legacy, I had chances to get him online for around $25-ish. I clearly waited too long, and now, I’ve missed out because I refuse to pay $55+.
I’m by no means crushed, but it’s a bit frustrating.
While it seems distribution is getting better, 5-6 months from now these first limb figures could still be really tough to get ahold of no matter if distribution is back to normal or not.

Alternatively if you want the figure, you should buy it; and if you don't want it, you shouldn't buy it. Availability, discounts, and secondary market prices over time have very indirect relationships to each other. There's nothing wrong with making guesses and factoring that into purchasing decisions to save money, but trying to predict these trends is a fool's errand in my opinion.

AcademyofDrX wrote:Availability, discounts, and secondary market prices over time have very indirect relationships to each other. There's nothing wrong with making guesses and factoring that into purchasing decisions to save money, but trying to predict these trends is a fool's errand in my opinion.

Actually, availability and secondary market prices are very closely if not directly related.
And knowing some if not most TF go up in price once unavailable at regular retail goes beyond prediction at this point... Sure, it may be technically labeled a trend, but even so, that's one lengthy trend, and seems even more foolish to assume this is going to change any time soon if ever.

Sowndwave76 wrote:

AcademyofDrX wrote:Availability, discounts, and secondary market prices over time have very indirect relationships to each other. There's nothing wrong with making guesses and factoring that into purchasing decisions to save money, but trying to predict these trends is a fool's errand in my opinion.

Actually, availability and secondary market prices are very closely if not directly related.
And knowing some if not most TF go up in price once unavailable at regular retail goes beyond prediction at this point... Sure, it may be technically labeled a trend, but even so, that's one lengthy trend, and seems even more foolish to assume this is going to change any time soon if ever.

On a long timeline, absolutely, you'd be foolish to wait years to get a toy that's out now if you want it now. But there are plenty of Earthrise figures that are still available at major retailers for list price, and some retailer exclusives from the last few years sell for fractionally more while others sell for hundreds. "Transformers that are no longer on sale are generally more expensive, sometimes much more" is true but obvious. "Buy this figure instead of this other figure because this is what will happen at retail and on eBay" is a very different proposition.

From my own experience, I'm obsessive about picking up Target exclusives because every now and then, something drops there that gets bought up and skyrockets in value. But that's generally not because of demand or popularity so much as how many are produced, or distribution quirks. The Siege Rainmakers sold out their initial stocking and sold for multiples on eBay, then they were restocked and went on clearance, then they went back up again, but even now they're available at original retail price at other retailers. I would not want to try to predict that cycle at the individual product level for any Transformer.

AcademyofDrX wrote:On a long timeline, absolutely, you'd be foolish to wait years to get a toy that's out now if you want it now. But there are plenty of Earthrise figures that are still available at major retailers for list price

Please point me in the direction of a major retailer that is still selling Sunstreaker and/or Trailbreaker for $22. That's not at all sarcasm. I'm really asking.

AcademyofDrX wrote:"Buy this figure instead of this other figure because this is what will happen at retail and on eBay" is a very different proposition.

There was never any "purchase this instead of that" in my post.
But again, if you think any of these Legacy figures will have gone down in price anywhere 9-12 months from now, you're trying to fool yourself.
My earlier post was said as friendly advice (not some new observation by any means) based on my own semi-recent experience and what has typically been the norm for the roughly 15 years I've been collecting.
Not as some warning that the end is near.

AcademyofDrX wrote:From my own experience, I'm obsessive about picking up Target exclusives because every now and then, something drops there that gets bought up and skyrockets in value. But that's generally not because of demand or popularity so much as how many are produced, or distribution quirks. The Siege Rainmakers sold out their initial stocking and sold for multiples on eBay, then they were restocked and went on clearance, then they went back up again, but even now they're available at original retail price at other retailers. I would not want to try to predict that cycle at the individual product level for any Transformer.

I understand and believe you. However, that situation isn't the norm. That's not to suggest that I believe there's ONE "norm".
But it's fair to say that any TF eventually is more likely to go up in price, despite the price changes while it's available (including the in/out of stock status) at retail.

That's all fair, I apologize, I think I came off as more argumentative and confrontational than I intended. I think we're in agreement on the basic point that it's better not to take chances later on.

And really, it would be strange if Dragstrip didn't get released again in a later wave for people that were holding out to complete Menasor, possibly even in the 2023 line as we're seeing a lot of transplants lately. Both Kingdom Wave 4 and Wave 5 were half new figures and half rereleases.

Emerje

AcademyofDrX wrote:That's all fair, I apologize, I think I came off as more argumentative and confrontational than I intended. I think we're in agreement on the basic point that it's better not to take chances later on.

No worries…
I apologize if I came off overly aggressive.
& yeah it seems we’re on the same page.

Emerje wrote:And really, it would be strange if Dragstrip didn't get released again in a later wave for people that were holding out to complete Menasor, possibly even in the 2023 line as we're seeing a lot of transplants lately. Both Kingdom Wave 4 and Wave 5 were half new figures and half rereleases.

Emerje

This is also a good point…
Especially with Dragstrip, maybe even Wild Rider.
There’s no telling, but assuming there will be some who later decide they want Menasor, Hastak should encourage that by giving those same people another opportunity to easily (or relatively easily) get the earlier limb figures.

But then I think to ER Sunstreaker vs the X number of Wheeljack repacks…

Sowndwave76 wrote:For those who really don’t want Menasor and are on the fence with Motormaster, I’d say wait for a while…
If I had to bet, Motormaster will sell less than Rodimus, who still ended up going on a hefty sale.
$85-$90 is no easy sell to kids (or parents), fans, & even collectors, so I don’t see this being a difficult purchase even months from now.
Heck, I could see this figure being on at least 1 retailer’s Black Friday sale list.
In fact the only reason I preordered 2 so soon instead of 1 was because of that promotion Target had.

I think where people need to be careful is with the limb figures, specifically Dragstrip & Wild Rider…
6 months from now availability for 1 or both could be scarce & very limited.
My advice if you’re on the fence is go for them now… Returns are really easy.
But avoid the after/secondary market.
I learned this lesson the hard way with ER Sunstreaker… I was going to pass, then was on the fence for a long time.
Although I never saw him in-store, & at that point there was no way to know how much I’d be skipping from Legacy, I had chances to get him online for around $25-ish. I clearly waited too long, and now, I’ve missed out because I refuse to pay $55+.
I’m by no means crushed, but it’s a bit frustrating.
While it seems distribution is getting better, 5-6 months from now these first limb figures could still be really tough to get ahold of no matter if distribution is back to normal or not.

I think he will sell better since he's easier to see the value (even though both probably have the same production cost). And I've read more excitement regarding him than Rodimus when he was revealed and more people are ready to order him.
I heard no one say his price point makes no sense.

Plus he brings back the idea that a commander means a big bot.

I just hope we get CW vs. Legacy Menasor comparisons in time.