The Energon Pub

[Tammuz]

looking at the past few arena matches i can't tell,

[Jeep?]

No reason why they wouldn't. In fact, they'll be more effective than they should be.

[Dr. Caelus]

Da.

I reset my guy because it seemed too much like cheating (a level 5 with 11 strength?), but in Satanstorm's case, AFAIK he's exceeded everything xp-wise, so it seems unfair to order him to level down and leave a bunch of xp flat-out unused.

HOWEVER; going by how the cheat works, I don't understand how he was able to get any of his stats over 11. You can squeeze an extra stat out of the system by clicking too many times - just as you sometimes do normally when the site is dragging - but I didn't think you could click 4 times to get something from 9 to 13.

Maybe you can though. Don't know for certain.

[-Soundwave-]

Da.

I reset my guy because it seemed too much like cheating (a level 5 with 11 strength?), but in Satanstorm's case, AFAIK he's exceeded everything xp-wise, so it seems unfair to order him to level down and leave a bunch of xp flat-out unused.

HOWEVER; going by how the cheat works, I don't understand how he was able to get any of his stats over 11. You can squeeze an extra stat out of the system by clicking too many times - just as you sometimes do normally when the site is dragging - but I didn't think you could click 4 times to get something from 9 to 13.

Maybe you can though. Don't know for certain.

Just matter how you click the upgrade link if you get enough in before the page starts to update you can get more. I've done up to 13. sofar.

[Dr. Caelus]

Just matter how you click the upgrade link if you get enough in before the page starts to update you can get more. I've done up to 13. sofar.

Okay, that's good to know.

Not sure if it qualifies as a good thing or a bad thing though. When stats get boosted over 10 funky things do happen with the maths, hence why you aren't supposed to be able to do it. But with no foreseeable reset in the cards, we'll be seeing more and more people maxing out their relevant stats, and I'd hate to just tell them 'congratulations, you're done.'

If it is going to be considered permissable, then it would be nice if you didn't have to fool the site to do it.

[-Soundwave-]

I did it by accident, and I've change all but one that I did do it to, right now I am basically waiting on an an alt to come round to I can get the right one and not spend on armor twice.

[Tammuz]

Just matter how you click the upgrade link if you get enough in before the page starts to update you can get more. I've done up to 13. sofar.

Okay, that's good to know.

Not sure if it qualifies as a good thing or a bad thing though. When stats get boosted over 10 funky things do happen with the maths, hence why you aren't supposed to be able to do it. But with no foreseeable reset in the cards, we'll be seeing more and more people maxing out their relevant stats, and I'd hate to just tell them 'congratulations, you're done.'

If it is going to be considered permissable, then it would be nice if you didn't have to fool the site to do it.

as long as no one does it with end(dividing by 0 is bad m'kay?) or tactics it won't be too bad

[Dr. Caelus]

as long as no one does it with end(dividing by 0 is bad m'kay?) or tactics it won't be too bad

Unfair advantage bad or crossing the streams bad?

[Tammuz]

depends how the server handles being asked to divide by 0.


if we assume OS's armour mechanic is correct and we didn't miss anything it might actually just ignore that the stat exists(like the fallens armour problem)

but yeah it could lead to total positronic reversal.

[Jeep?]

as long as no one does it with end(dividing by 0 is bad m'kay?) or tactics it won't be too bad

Unfair advantage bad or crossing the streams bad?

I'm going to go ahead and assume that being asking to do the mathematically impossible will have the site taking a beating like Tammy's vagoo.

[Dr. Caelus]

Doh!

Satanstorm is running 11 Endurance!

And the game hasn't annihilated itself yet.

So it looks like if that's a bad thing, it's not a cosmically bad thing.

Which is good, because otherwise I'd be faced with the moral dilemma of whether or not to personally edit people's characters.

[-Soundwave-]

Right but once more people start doing it it might become more problematic no?

[Tammuz]

it won't be dividing by zero till someone gets end to 20.

[Burn]

Why is this even being debated?

Stats are intended to only upgrade to 10, no higher.

Seriously. It's a flaw that is more than likely giving him an advantage and last I checked those flaws were either corrected or people were monitored to ensure they weren't exploiting the flaws.

Or are we going back to the bullshit "if it can be done in the game it's legal" stance which brought a tonne of grief to this game?

[Jeep?]

Doh!

Satanstorm is running 11 Endurance!

And the game hasn't annihilated itself yet.

So it looks like if that's a bad thing, it's not a cosmically bad thing.

Which is good, because otherwise I'd be faced with the moral dilemma of whether or not to personally edit people's characters.

Well, when his Endurance gets to 15, he'll take ZERO damage from weapons. And if it gets to 20, anyone attempting a repair on him will crash the game.

[Tammuz]

you're right Burn, but i don't get to make site policy, i just get to tell poeple about arithmetic.

and Jeep you're also right I'd forgotten about end being included in weapon damage calulation, it will be 15 End at which weapon damage will encounter a divide by 0, tactic damage will encounter a divide by 0 at twenty END, and repairers will start earning infinite xp per repair on that 20 END.

[-Soundwave-]

20. . . good lord. USUALLY the pages loads to fast can't get past 13. I'd imagine if the site was lagging though that it is possible.

I wonder what OS was thinking then when he made The Fallen like that(though he was controlled by admin). I've got to wonder if this little problem has been like this since The Fallen was introduced.

[Jeep?]

you're right Burn, but i don't get to make site policy, i just get to tell poeple about arithmetic.

and Jeep you're also right I'd forgotten about end being included in weapon damage calulation, it will be 15 End at which weapon damage will encounter a divide by 0, tactic damage will encounter a divide by 0 at twenty END, and repairers will start earning infinite xp per repair on that 20 END.

Partly right. Weapon damage involves a multiplication by 0 at End 15, and multiplying anything by 0 makes it 0.
I think the best way to handle this would be to (if the rumours of a ground-up V2 having been started, slowly, are true) is to involve more exponents in the code, even if the indices need to be brutally small to retain a level of linear similarity. Incur an index of 0, and things work out - whereas a coefficient involving 0 is always messy.

[Tammuz]

i think we just limit stats to between 0 and 10 how they're meant to be uses additional multiplyers for gimmicky ****.

cos i can see this is gonna end it up with pi or e on ln or some other stupid indices which isn't an interger and thus make the game mechanics totally inaccesable to anyone but perceptor.

[Dr. Caelus]

Okay, I'm going to take this to the powers that be.

If they agree with the consensus here, I figure I'll post a warning in the HMW frontpage that anyone found having >10 stats after x amount of time will have their stats rounded down manually by a game mod without having their xp reimbursed.

[Burn]

Thank you Caelus. Hopefully we are listened to as I don't really want to see a repeat of the crap that use to happen with exploits of the past.

Just because it CAN be done doesn't mean it SHOULD be done.

[Dr. Caelus]

Oh, and as far as the "x amount of time" I figure x to be a fairly large value so peeps like Sustain have a chance to reset with their choice alts before the crack down.

And if the appropriate alt doesn't come into rotation before x time, I can personally alter alts just the same as stats, though if the alt-image doesn't have a unique name, it may require some trial and error, so I'd like to avoid that scenario.

[-Soundwave-]

Sounds like a plan to me.

[-Soundwave-]

Oh, and as far as the "x amount of time" I figure x to be a fairly large value so peeps like Sustain have a chance to reset with their choice alts before the crack down.

And if the appropriate alt doesn't come into rotation before x time, I can personally alter alts just the same as stats, though if the alt-image doesn't have a unique name, it may require some trial and error, so I'd like to avoid that scenario.

Won't bother me I'll switch back when it comes, I have the energon, I was just lazy.

[Animus]

Oh Noes!!!11!11!!Shift + 1

You can't divide by zero! This is what happened to the universe when the last person tried to divide by zero.