The Energon Pub

Tramp wrote:IF you look at the fine print at the bottom of the title page at the front of each issue of the Marvel books ot will read Copyright Hasbro, Used under license, all characters and etc are trademarks of Hasbr, etc... IT says basically the same thing in the IDW books as well as the DW books. Hasbro is the owner, Marvel, DW and now IDW are or were just licensees.

I know all this the reason I ask is that licenseing laws are so confusing.......look at whats going on with the DW stuff as an exsample.

Primus and Unicron are still different characters in every continuity. Nothing indicates in any text from any comic that they're the same in every Universe. I feel this is simply Tramp trying to bridge continuities AGAIN.

Tramp, understand this: You cannot bridge continuities no matter how badly you wish you could. They are not the Same Primus OR the Same Unicron. If so, why is it that if one is destroyed in one Universe, they appear in the other? Armada was set in 2015, around the same time as Masterforce was set, and unless there's some reference to Unicron in Masterforce, he isn't the same Unicron in the ArmadaVerse, since that Unicron was Cybertron's moon. Also, Marvel Primus is not cartoon Primus, and is therefore not the same as Dreamwave's Primus, and the Same Applies to Unicron. Marvel Unicron could use Cartoon Unicron as a pinball.

I have already said why they can be "destroyed" in one universe and still appear in another. First off, Regardless of the universe, Unicron can never be premanently destroyed. He will regenerate. All you're doing is destroying his physical body anyway, not his true form. Secondly, his true form is in the astral plane. He and Primus are omnipresent beings that exist in all realities at once. This is stated in TransFormers: The Ultimate Guide Which is The difinitive source[/b] on [i]TransFormers lore and history. IT doesn't cover just one continuity. It covers them all and ties them together.

Ther's no talking to you, is there? Just because you believe something, it's right. You are possibly the worst joke account I've encountered on any board, bar none. And don't try and tell me

Tramp wrote: Shirogoshi, The Ultimate guide is The Official book Written by Simon Furman! I am not a joke account! Even though it's good enough for me to demand he put females into his work because I feel he is wrong, and disproves my theory of a potential Prime and Elita sex tape, this time it SUPPORTS my argument, so he isn't wrong NOW!

Because it disproves everything we've been shown. Unicron can regenerate. Please. Then why praytell, did he need Starscream to reconnect him up to Cybertron for a new body? And Why did Cybertron fall apart when he killed Primus in the Marvel comics? Hm, Explain that, buddy? Wouldn't the "Almighty, all universal god" regenerate to save his planet, and if he was stll alive in another universe, wouldn't Cybertron NOT explode?

You pick and choose selective parts of Transformers history and attempt to ignore the parts that don't protect your argument in any topic because you don't like being wrong, and you can't accept being wrong. You will, of course, naturally claim you're right and claim I'm being "rude", all because i'm telling the truth again, but it's true. And I'm sure there are plenty of members here to back this up. (The selective recall, I mean.)

And then when someone brings up something that disproves you, or someone who has an alternate view of what you feel is right, you turn it into a novella. You are rude, you are arrogant, and you are a joke account. Good day! You cannot tie Transformers continuties together, and no-one else does. You are obnoxious, in that you feel you're always right, and you feel that in this case, tying continuities together helps your argument, and you'll use that.

If you keep on trolling, you'll be gone in the near future, you watch.

He never killed Primus in the Marvel comics Shirogoshi. What book were you reading? I mhave the entire US Marvel run, and Unicron never destroyed Primus.

Secondly, in Armada/Energon, He did regenerate. It just took time and energon to do so.

I would suggwst you actually read TransFormers: the Ultimate Guide before you start passing judgement.

That's funny, because I have my copy of End of The Road (Graphic Novel, with Issues 75-80) right in Front of me. Not only does Primus take over Xaaron, but Xaaron gets killed by Unicron. In Issue 77, Blaster states, and I quote:

Blaster wrote:We all know that Cybertron was the adopted form of our Creator Primus, and therefore, we can assume that his consciousness Was the Planet's binding force. The Damage wrought by Unicron combined WITH PRIMUS' DEATH was evidently more than the planet could handle

END QUOTE!

You lose! YOU GET NOTHING! GOOD DAY SIR!(/Willy Wonka.)

And you already stated the Ultimate Guide doesn't overwrite Marvel's continuity. Once again, you've contradicted yourself like a good little joke account.
[/quote]

Shirogoshi wrote:That's funny, because I have my copy of End of The Road (Graphic Novel, with Issues 75-80) right in Front of me. Not only does Primus take over Xaaron, but Xaaron gets killed by Unicron. In Issue 77, Blaster states, and I quote:

Blaster wrote:We all know that Cybertron was the adopted form of our Creator Primus, and therefore, we can assume that his consciousness Was the Planet's binding force. The Damage wrought by Unicron combined WITH PRIMUS' DEATH was evidently more than the planet could handle

END QUOTE!

You lose! YOU GET NOTHING! GOOD DAY SIR!(/Willy Wonka.)

And you already stated the Ultimate Guide doesn't overwrite Marvel's continuity. Once again, you've contradicted yourself like a good little joke account.

[/quote] Shirogshi. It sounds like you are referring to the UK comics. And for them I can't answer you. But in the US comics, Primus was never killed. Cybertron was never destroyed. Secondly, the Ultimate Guide doesn't overwrite details or current events strictly tied to individual continuities. What it does overwrite is the ancient history about The origins of the TransFormers, Primus and Unicron. IT does this, not by erasing the existing origins, but explaining them differently, piecing parts from the different origin stories together into a single origin. TI explains the true origins of Unicron and Primus for all universes, as well as tells how the Quintessan's involvment in the development of the TransFormer race really played out. It ties the entire multiverse together with a single unified continuity and a single origin for Primus, Unicron, and the TransFormers.

Tramp wrote:

Shirogoshi wrote:That's funny, because I have my copy of End of The Road (Graphic Novel, with Issues 75-80) right in Front of me. Not only does Primus take over Xaaron, but Xaaron gets killed by Unicron. In Issue 77, Blaster states, and I quote:

Blaster wrote:We all know that Cybertron was the adopted form of our Creator Primus, and therefore, we can assume that his consciousness Was the Planet's binding force. The Damage wrought by Unicron combined WITH PRIMUS' DEATH was evidently more than the planet could handle

END QUOTE!

You lose! YOU GET NOTHING! GOOD DAY SIR!(/Willy Wonka.)

And you already stated the Ultimate Guide doesn't overwrite Marvel's continuity. Once again, you've contradicted yourself like a good little joke account.

Shirogshi. It sounds like you are referring to the UK comics. And for them I can't answer you. But in the US comics, Primus was never killed. Cybertron was never destroyed. Secondly, the Ultimate Guide doesn't overwrite details or current events strictly tied to individual continuities. What it does overwrite is the ancient history about The origins of the TransFormers, Primus and Unicron. IT does this, not by erasing the existing origins, but explaining them differently, piecing parts from the different origin stories together into a single origin. TI explains the true origins of Unicron and Primus for all universes, as well as tells how the Quintessan's involvment in the development of the TransFormer race really played out. It ties the entire multiverse together with a single unified continuity and a single origin for Primus, Unicron, and the TransFormers.[/quote]

No most of that also happened in the US books from Marvel.Primus did in fact posses Xaaron and getts destroyed.And Cybertron does start falling apart like he said but at the end of the last issue Oprime is seen saying that with the power of the last Autobot Cybertron has been reborn.
Sorry guys I'm not trying to strenghen Tramps case but thats the way the story ended.
P.S. Just because Xaaron body was destroyed doesnt meen that Primus was also.and the dialoge between Prown and the others could have just been sumation of the fact pervee to him.As far as he knew that was the case but it doesnt meen that Prown was right.

It only conts because yuo want it to count. It helps your argument, so no Furman correcting e-mails this time. And no, it isn't the goddamn UK Comic. OK, there's your proof you're a joke account. You claim you've read all the US comics, but you can't remember something that important. You said earlier that IT CAN'T OVERWRITE THE MARVEL CONTINUITY. Can you keep our story straight for 5 seconds, Tramp? Please, just once, keep your story straight for more than 5 posts before contradicting yourself? I know it may be hard, but the rest of us legit accounts manage it. If you'd like, I can scan up the page for you that I quoted.

Shirogoshi wrote:It only conts because yuo want it to count. It helps your argument, so no Furman correcting e-mails this time. And no, it isn't the goddamn UK Comic. OK, there's your proof you're a joke account. You claim you've read all the US comics, but you can't remember something that important. You said earlier that IT CAN'T OVERWRITE THE MARVEL CONTINUITY. Can you keep our story straight for 5 seconds, Tramp? Please, just once, keep your story straight for more than 5 posts before contradicting yourself? I know it may be hard, but the rest of us legit accounts manage it. If you'd like, I can scan up the page for you that I quoted.

But cybertron wasnt destroyed the last autobot saved it.

Shirogoshi, I have the US Marvel run. including the issues you refer to, and Cybertron is not destroyed. Primus is not killed. Cybertron still plays a part in Generation 2. It couldn't do that if it were gone. Yes, Emirate Xaaron may have died while acting as a vessel for Primus. That does not mean Primus is dead, and certainly not permanently. Remember, the Last Autobot? He restored Cybertron. He restored Primus, just as he recerated Optimus Prime from Hi-Q.

Tramp I want to ask you a question.How do the Japanese universes fit into your theroy?I'm not looking for a large debate just looking for your thought on it.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Tramp I want to ask you a question.How do the Japanese universes fit into your theroy?I'm not looking for a large debate just looking for your thought on it.

Well, considering that the earlier ones before RID all stemmed directly from the original US G1 cartoon which had been dubbed into Japanese, I would place them in the same continuity as that show. The Manga versions as well are alternate continuities to thje anime, or, in some cases, direct translations of the anime. As for Car Robots, Micron Legend/Superlink and then Galaxy Force, those are three different continuities, yet still all part of the greater multiverse of TF lore. Everything officially published or produced by hasbro, Takara, and their licensees is part of official TF canon. They are all part of the greater TransFormers multiverse.

Tramp wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Tramp I want to ask you a question.How do the Japanese universes fit into your theroy?I'm not looking for a large debate just looking for your thought on it.

Well, considering that the earlier ones before RID all stemmed directly from the original US G1 cartoon which had been dubbed into Japanese, I would place them in the same continuity as that show. The Manga versions as well are alternate continuities to thje anime, or, in some cases, direct translations of the anime. As for Car Robots, Micron Legend/Superlink and then Galaxy Force, those are three different continuities, yet still all part of the greater multiverse of TF lore. Everything officially published or produced by hasbro, Takara, and their licensees is part of official TF canon. They are all part of the greater TransFormers multiverse.

Have you seen any of Japanese shows that follow the G1 toon?

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Tramp wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Tramp I want to ask you a question.How do the Japanese universes fit into your theroy?I'm not looking for a large debate just looking for your thought on it.

Well, considering that the earlier ones before RID all stemmed directly from the original US G1 cartoon which had been dubbed into Japanese, I would place them in the same continuity as that show. The Manga versions as well are alternate continuities to thje anime, or, in some cases, direct translations of the anime. As for Car Robots, Micron Legend/Superlink and then Galaxy Force, those are three different continuities, yet still all part of the greater multiverse of TF lore. Everything officially published or produced by hasbro, Takara, and their licensees is part of official TF canon. They are all part of the greater TransFormers multiverse.

Have you seen any of Japanese shows that follow the G1 toon?

Unfortunately no, I haven't. I've seen Scramble City on my TransFormers the Movie DVD, as well as part of one episode of Beast Wars Neo I think. It had Leo Convoy and Leo Jr. in it. I would like to see them though. I wouldn't mind getting a hold of the Victory manga translated as well. Unfortunately, I don't read Japanese.

Tramp wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Tramp wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:Tramp I want to ask you a question.How do the Japanese universes fit into your theroy?I'm not looking for a large debate just looking for your thought on it.

Well, considering that the earlier ones before RID all stemmed directly from the original US G1 cartoon which had been dubbed into Japanese, I would place them in the same continuity as that show. The Manga versions as well are alternate continuities to thje anime, or, in some cases, direct translations of the anime. As for Car Robots, Micron Legend/Superlink and then Galaxy Force, those are three different continuities, yet still all part of the greater multiverse of TF lore. Everything officially published or produced by hasbro, Takara, and their licensees is part of official TF canon. They are all part of the greater TransFormers multiverse.

Have you seen any of Japanese shows that follow the G1 toon?

Unfortunately no, I haven't. I've seen Scramble City on my TransFormers the Movie DVD, as well as part of one episode of Beast Wars Neo I think. It had Leo Convoy and Leo Jr. in it. I would like to see them though. I wouldn't mind getting a hold of the Victory manga translated as well. Unfortunately, I don't read Japanese.

Just to let you know that would have been Beast wars 2nd.Big convoy was in BW neo.But now to why I asked you that question about the Japanese shows.In Headmasters the show that come's right after the Return of Optimus Prime [they didnt get the rebirth for many years after] the headmasters and targetmasters are not people from Nebulose.Their not even humanoid.All the TF's are the same but their history's are different.The headmasters are TF's that left Cybertron after the start of the war.They settled on a planet they called Master where they down-sized them selfs to say energy.After many years they build themselfs bigger bodys that they could control by transforming into their heads.After Scopornok returns to Cybertron the Fortressmaximus takes his troops and returns as well.As the show weny on Cybertron was destroyed and never rebuilt.Rodimus Prime then hands over leadership to FMax and starts looking for a new planel to call home.
By the start of the next series almost every thing starts over again.Each Japanese show had its own universe after Headmasters.

The reason I told you all this is because those universes can not fit into your theroy.

By the way I have most of those episodes on tape and on disk so if your interested let me know

Well they still can. There is no reason why they shouldn't, even if each is its own continuity, which I am dubious about because everything I have read and heard about them says that they are all part of the same continuity, at least through Victory and on through BW Neo, and that each is a continuation of the previous show. I do know that Beast Wars 2 andBeast Wars Neo are supposed to tie into Beast Wars, and Cybertron, aka Primus lives yet again in that series and in the two Japanese BW sequel series. Thus, it would stand to reason that Primus reformed his body, and Cybertron (Seibetron in Japan) was reborn aome time after the war ended and peace was established.

Tramp wrote:Well they still can. There is no reason why they shouldn't, even if each is its own continuity, which I am dubious about because everything I have read and heard about them says that they are all part of the same continuity, at least through Victory and on through BW Neo, and that each is a continuation of the previous show. I do know that Beast Wars 2 andBeast Wars Neo are supposed to tie into Beast Wars, and Cybertron, aka Primus lives yet again in that series and in the two Japanese BW sequel series. Thus, it would stand to reason that Primus reformed his body, and Cybertron (Seibetron in Japan) was reborn aome time after the war ended and peace was established.

As far as the Japanese version of Armada,Energon and Cybertron were all in different continuity's as well.As a mater of fact when Armada was first running in Japan the produsers were claming that it was a direct continuation of the G1 story......a claim they back off from by the start of their 2nd season.

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Tramp wrote:Well they still can. There is no reason why they shouldn't, even if each is its own continuity, which I am dubious about because everything I have read and heard about them says that they are all part of the same continuity, at least through Victory and on through BW Neo, and that each is a continuation of the previous show. I do know that Beast Wars 2 andBeast Wars Neo are supposed to tie into Beast Wars, and Cybertron, aka Primus lives yet again in that series and in the two Japanese BW sequel series. Thus, it would stand to reason that Primus reformed his body, and Cybertron (Seibetron in Japan) was reborn aome time after the war ended and peace was established.

As far as the Japanese version of Armada,Energon and Cybertron were all in different continuity's as well.As a mater of fact when Armada was first running in Japan the produsers were claming that it was a direct continuation of the G1 story......a claim they back off from by the start of their 2nd season.

I know that Galaxy Force is separate from Micron Legend and Superlink, but I also know that Micron Legend and Superlink are still tied together as a singlge continuity, though Glaxy Force it is's own continuity, whereas in the US, Armada, Energon and Cybertron ar all part of a single continuity. Remember, There are cross-over characters from Micron Legend (Armada) to Superlink (Energon), including Demolishor and Cyclonus before they get new bodies, as well as Tidalwave, and also the kids from Micron Legend ([i]Armada) all grown up. Those two series are defintately part of a single contiuity, just as they are in the US.

Tramp wrote:

sto_vo_kor_2000 wrote:

Tramp wrote:Well they still can. There is no reason why they shouldn't, even if each is its own continuity, which I am dubious about because everything I have read and heard about them says that they are all part of the same continuity, at least through Victory and on through BW Neo, and that each is a continuation of the previous show. I do know that Beast Wars 2 andBeast Wars Neo are supposed to tie into Beast Wars, and Cybertron, aka Primus lives yet again in that series and in the two Japanese BW sequel series. Thus, it would stand to reason that Primus reformed his body, and Cybertron (Seibetron in Japan) was reborn aome time after the war ended and peace was established.

As far as the Japanese version of Armada,Energon and Cybertron were all in different continuity's as well.As a mater of fact when Armada was first running in Japan the produsers were claming that it was a direct continuation of the G1 story......a claim they back off from by the start of their 2nd season.

I know that Galaxy Force is separate from Micron Legend and Superlink, but I also know that Micron Legend and Superlink are still tied together as a singlge continuity, though Glaxy Force it is's own continuity, whereas in the US, Armada, Energon and Cybertron ar all part of a single continuity. Remember, There are cross-over characters from Micron Legend (Armada) to Superlink (Energon), including Demolishor and Cyclonus before they get new bodies, as well as Tidalwave, and also the kids from Micron Legend ([i]Armada) all grown up. Those two series are defintately part of a single contiuity, just as they are in the US.

Not when it was first produced.Micron Legend was to be part of the G1 continuity but was changed by the start of the 2nd season.Unicron wasnt even part of the script that the Japanese had laid out but Habro wanted him in.Superlink was intended to be a fresh start a.k.a. reboot to the series
and that can be seen in some of the early episodes that have conterdicting origins about Alantis but again Hasbro insisted that it be tied to the show before and so it was retcon to be part of the same continuity as Micron leagen.As for Glaxy Force it was again intended to be a reboot but as always Hasbro want it tied to the others but this time it was only done for our market.

As for the other part of this debate.Head masters is in the same universe as the G1 toon in Japan.....but Masterforce was a fresh start and Victory is in the same continuaty as masterforce.Transformers Zone tryed to tie it together as a retcon

I don't think so. Everything I have read and researched has said that MasterForce and Victory are continuations of Headmasters, they just take place several years later. Unless there is somethifg in the stories themselves which contradicts that, I have to believe that they are all one continuity with the G1 cartoon in Japan. You are the only person who has said otherwise.

Tramp wrote:I don't think so. Everything I have read and researched has said that MasterForce and Victory are continuations of Headmasters, they just take place several years later. Unless there is somethifg in the stories themselves which contradicts that, I have to believe that they are all one continuity with the G1 cartoon in Japan. You are the only person who has said otherwise.

Its coming from interviews from the writers and produces of the show.....but I'll admit that I cant prove it any more.....all that stuff I had stored on my old pc witch fell victom to my crazy wife
Altho you can see a hint of it on its posting on Wiki but I dont normaly refer to them for fact finding.But to make a long story short the writers felt that the TF's had to much history and wanted to bring in a new generation of fan feeling that the old one had out grown toys.So the idea was to reboot the story so that new fans would have a point of origin for them selfs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transformers_Masterforce

You see there were many ideas that were changed between TF headmasters and TF masterforce.The Headmasters in the Headmaster show were not humanoid's but they were in Masterforce.Also in the orignal script the Pretenders and the powermaster bodys were hiding for milions of years on Earth but why I dont think was ever explored.

But most of that was also retconed by a series of clip episode's that were released after the series ended.The reasons for this was that they fell short on their agreed oponed amount of episodes for the series and to please the fan bace that objected to the many inconsistases in the story telling.