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First-Aid wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:And I also know what a high profile character is.

Yep, 6 minutes of TOTAL screen time in a single episode of a series that ran 4 seasons and was never seen again after that. Totally high profile. It's like naming the Underminer the a main character of the first "Incredibles" movie.

So why is she still being talked about even now, and having gotten attention in the last 2 trilogies? Yet Minerva has been nowhere? When it comes to profile, Elita > Minerva.

Rodimus Prime wrote:

First-Aid wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:And I also know what a high profile character is.

Yep, 6 minutes of TOTAL screen time in a single episode of a series that ran 4 seasons and was never seen again after that. Totally high profile. It's like naming the Underminer the a main character of the first "Incredibles" movie.

So why is she still being talked about even now, and having gotten attention in the last 2 trilogies? Yet Minerva has been nowhere? When it comes to profile, Elita > Minerva.

Yes, and the designer is aware, hence my article. This mold is Elita's. Now if you like it or not, it's a different story and any take is valid. But Hasbro deems this their attempt at a mold focused on a G1 Elita-1.

william-james88 wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:

First-Aid wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:And I also know what a high profile character is.

Yep, 6 minutes of TOTAL screen time in a single episode of a series that ran 4 seasons and was never seen again after that. Totally high profile. It's like naming the Underminer the a main character of the first "Incredibles" movie.

So why is she still being talked about even now, and having gotten attention in the last 2 trilogies? Yet Minerva has been nowhere? When it comes to profile, Elita > Minerva.

Yes, and the designer is aware, hence my article. This mold is Elita's. Now if you like it or not, it's a different story and any take is valid. But Hasbro deems this their attempt at a mold focused on a G1 Elita-1.

I understand that, which is why I don't like it and said so. But I'm just 1 person, and Hasbro goes with majority opinion, because that makes them the most money. So if a lot of others like the figure and accept it as an adequate or even excellent representation of the character, it is what it is. We all have our opinion and (presumably) our own money to spend and in the end that's what matters. We must speak with our wallets because that's the most common language Hasbro understands, from design to accounting to marketing.

I gotta admit, this design appeals to me more than the majority of the lady-bot car designs from the last few years of CHUG. And, personally, I've stopped caring just how much the term "Legacy" applies to these figures, since some of the better-looking ones (like Elita and the Prime Universe figures) have strayed the most from their original looks. Sacrificing show accuracy for a better Transformer toy is worth it to me.

Glarryg

Glarryg wrote:I gotta admit, this design appeals to me more than the majority of the lady-bot car designs from the last few years of CHUG. And, personally, I've stopped caring just how much the term "Legacy" applies to these figures, since some of the better-looking ones (like Elita and the Prime Universe figures) have strayed the most from their original looks. Sacrificing show accuracy for a better Transformer toy is worth it to me.

Glarryg

Legacy is a fun & great concept if Hasbro can pull it off properly. I think, as lacking as Bulkhead & especially Arcee were in its execution, choosing them to Geewunify is a good idea. Legacy brings Bulkhead into the G1/80's universe, and Arcee a more realistic Earth mode that people can't complain like the T30/ER/SS versions. So Geewunify more popular non-G1 characters into G1 designs, I'm fine with that!

But I wished Hasbro would go with doing faithful-to-toon TFP Knockout, Blackarachnia & Smokescreen. If not in Legacy than in a future toy line. Those were the weakest of the TFP figures and deserve a redo. Bring TFP Ratchet into the Voyager scale would be nice too.

So Legacy Knockout is a disappointment in that regard (for me). But I still pre-ordered as it's a good figure. It'll replace the original until I can get a near-MSRP R.E.D. Knockout as a replacement on my Prime shelf (then I'll rework it into Rapido). I haven't found R.E.D. Knockout available in stores or online at Walmart Canada yet though. I don't have my hopes up.

Evil Eye wrote:To be fair, Elita's cartoon model, being as it is without even Arcee's shoulder pods, is completely unworkable as a transforming toy (it doesn't even have an onscreen transformation!). Now personally I feel like a new Voyager scale Elita that turned into a streamlined Cybertronian truck would be cool, but this one doesn't look half bad.

I just watched 'Search for Alpha Trion' today, and she actually did transform in that episode, right when she and Prime pull up after she's repaired. It's mostly obscured by Prime, though. The front of her car mode kind of shrinks and forms her chest. You'd think the leader of the female Autobots (and Prime's girlfriend) would have gotten a better transformation than that. Hell, you see more of Lancer and Greenlight's transformations than Elita's, and they didn't even have any lines in the episode, not to mention it took almost 25 years after it aired for them to even get names.

That being said, I do think Elita One should have been a larger Deluxe (like Ironhide), or a Voyager, to better scale with Prime.

First-Aid wrote:As a TF Prime lover, that Knockout is just a$$. Yes the original toy was also, but Geewunning that figure is a horrific insult to the animation model. If it were, say, a new character or even Prowl/Bluestreak/Smokescreen it would be infinitely better. But as a TFP figure, it's just insulting.

It's also such a weird decision. They didn't G1-ify Beast Wars or the Unicron trilogy, thankfully. So I don't know what the deal with them doing that crap to Transformers Prime is. Everyone is saying "hey, but what ifs are cool". Yeah, they're cool when you've gotten the main version first. Otherwise, it feels like a crappy bait and switch.

For those who don't get the complaints about the Prime guys having gotten G-ified. Imagine if Hasbro had never made a new G1 Starscream, no classics seeker mold, no Generations, no Combiner Wars or WFC or anything. And then, when it finally seems like you'll get a new one, it's 2007 movie Starscream in G1 colors. You'd all be losing your ****.

Rtron wrote:For those who don't get the complaints about the Prime guys having gotten G-ified. Imagine if Hasbro had never made a new G1 Starscream, no classics seeker mold, no Generations, no Combiner Wars or WFC or anything. And then, when it finally seems like you'll get a new one, it's 2007 movie Starscream in G1 colors. You'd all be losing your ****.

Funny thing is if Classics didn't happen we would have gotten just that.



I wonder how we would have reacted? RobotMasters was out there in Japan, but Hasbro didn't have any interest in importing it so most fans didn't have access. There was the Starscream repaint from Energon, but that's no better than the movie repaint since it was a different character and not a perfect resemblance. I feel like we just would have been amused and a little annoyed by the paint app more than anything since there wasn't much of a precedence for new G1 figures back then. We're pretty spoiled now.

What I want to know is why people want new Prime toys that look exactly like the original toys? What could Hasbro possibly do to improve on them now? Ankle tilts? Nothing they could do today would be better than what we had then so they may as well do something different. What we need is more reissues IMO.

Emerje

I think it's cool to have a unified design aesthetic for a line(and the brand as whole), I just don't think it's a good idea to call it the "G1 aesthetic".

Elita One is looking cool.

Jelze Bunnycat wrote:

First-Aid wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:And I also know what a high profile character is.

Yep, 6 minutes of TOTAL screen time in a single episode of a series that ran 4 seasons and was never seen again after that. Totally high profile. It's like naming the Underminer the a main character of the first "Incredibles" movie.

Being heavily connected to a high profile character is all it takes. Look at Roller!

There's so many characters that have brief story appearances. If we can get all of the seeker repaints, we can have Elita One.

Day 877 of waiting for Transformers Armada Masterpiece news.

Emerje wrote:

Rtron wrote:For those who don't get the complaints about the Prime guys having gotten G-ified. Imagine if Hasbro had never made a new G1 Starscream, no classics seeker mold, no Generations, no Combiner Wars or WFC or anything. And then, when it finally seems like you'll get a new one, it's 2007 movie Starscream in G1 colors. You'd all be losing your ****.

Funny thing is if Classics didn't happen we would have gotten just that.



I wonder how we would have reacted? RobotMasters was out there in Japan, but Hasbro didn't have any interest in importing it so most fans didn't have access. There was the Starscream repaint from Energon, but that's no better than the movie repaint since it was a different character and not a perfect resemblance. I feel like we just would have been amused and a little annoyed by the paint app more than anything since there wasn't much of a precedence for new G1 figures back then. We're pretty spoiled now.

What I want to know is why people want new Prime toys that look exactly like the original toys? What could Hasbro possibly do to improve on them now? Ankle tilts? Nothing they could do today would be better than what we had then so they may as well do something different. What we need is more reissues IMO.

Emerje

[Sighs in Airachnid]

Evil Eye wrote:

Emerje wrote:

Rtron wrote:For those who don't get the complaints about the Prime guys having gotten G-ified. Imagine if Hasbro had never made a new G1 Starscream, no classics seeker mold, no Generations, no Combiner Wars or WFC or anything. And then, when it finally seems like you'll get a new one, it's 2007 movie Starscream in G1 colors. You'd all be losing your ****.

Funny thing is if Classics didn't happen we would have gotten just that.



I wonder how we would have reacted? RobotMasters was out there in Japan, but Hasbro didn't have any interest in importing it so most fans didn't have access. There was the Starscream repaint from Energon, but that's no better than the movie repaint since it was a different character and not a perfect resemblance. I feel like we just would have been amused and a little annoyed by the paint app more than anything since there wasn't much of a precedence for new G1 figures back then. We're pretty spoiled now.

What I want to know is why people want new Prime toys that look exactly like the original toys? What could Hasbro possibly do to improve on them now? Ankle tilts? Nothing they could do today would be better than what we had then so they may as well do something different. What we need is more reissues IMO.

Emerje

[Sighs in Airachnid]

This. there were figures that were subpar that needed a redo, among them Knockout, Airachnid, and Smokescreen. There are also figures that needed something more in scale and could use an improvement, like Predaking, Darksteel, and Sky Lynx. Then there were some where they got a good figure, but it was the damned first editions that were hard to get a hold of and are uber expensive now, like Cliffjumper and Arcee. Lest we forget that Hasbro never released a Breakdown until the new re-release and we were shorted a Unicron Megatron.

There were options.

Rodimus Prime wrote:

First-Aid wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:And I also know what a high profile character is.

Yep, 6 minutes of TOTAL screen time in a single episode of a series that ran 4 seasons and was never seen again after that. Totally high profile. It's like naming the Underminer the a main character of the first "Incredibles" movie.

So why is she still being talked about even now, and having gotten attention in the last 2 trilogies? Yet Minerva has been nowhere? When it comes to profile, Elita > Minerva.

You're definitely correct there. Minerva hasn't really been used in American fiction, until very recently - The Wreckers comic that wrapped a few months back. In that comic, she's sporting that body and alt-mode given to the currently discussed Elita-1.

Besides the rumors, my thinking was that it takes a good while to plan all this stuff out. Minerva started appearing as a Wrecker last year, which means they probably started finalizing all this in 2020(?). Is it the chicken or the egg? I don't know - I don't care, either. I'm just breaking down why it 'makes sense' that Minerva was the original and Elita-1 the tool modification, but we know all these alternate heads and body parts get put on the same sprue so it doesn't really have to be either/or.

sol magnus wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:

First-Aid wrote:

Rodimus Prime wrote:And I also know what a high profile character is.

Yep, 6 minutes of TOTAL screen time in a single episode of a series that ran 4 seasons and was never seen again after that. Totally high profile. It's like naming the Underminer the a main character of the first "Incredibles" movie.

So why is she still being talked about even now, and having gotten attention in the last 2 trilogies? Yet Minerva has been nowhere? When it comes to profile, Elita > Minerva.

You're definitely correct there. Minerva hasn't really been used in American fiction, until very recently - The Wreckers comic that wrapped a few months back. In that comic, she's sporting that body and alt-mode given to the currently discussed Elita-1.

Besides the rumors, my thinking was that it takes a good while to plan all this stuff out. Minerva started appearing as a Wrecker last year, which means they probably started finalizing all this in 2020(?). Is it the chicken or the egg? I don't know - I don't care, either. I'm just breaking down why it 'makes sense' that Minerva was the original and Elita-1 the tool modification, but we know all these alternate heads and body parts get put on the same sprue so it doesn't really have to be either/or.

Pretty much this, we know that it takes about 2 years to design a toy.

Also, if you want to get technical, mineva has vastly more screen Time then Elita, only difference is the countries that it was shown

Ultimately I don't think it matters who came first or who wears it best. As long as the Mineva rumours are correct, she'll get her first toy in the west (unless there's some exclusive I'm not familiar with) that should be cause for celebration anyway.

I wasn't crapping on Minerva, I wish she had been featured more. I'm just saying they're distinct enough that they deserve separate designs.

Rodimus Prime wrote:I wasn't crapping on Minerva, I wish she had been featured more. I'm just saying they're distinct enough that they deserve separate designs.

Oh, I never thought you were. And I don't disagree. If I had an issue with saturation, though, I'd say Arcee and Elita-1 are both being made a bit too repeatedly.

Sabrblade wrote:Also, Elita, her pals, and Arcee may have all appeared first, but Minerva was the first-ever female character to get a TOY released at mass retail (barring later-made retcons).

I don't count Ask Vector Prime retcons, Minerva was the first figure specifically intended to be a girl

Who was the later retcon?

Here's hoping Minerva comes with her Titanmaster that came with LGEX God Ginrai, just to make her truly complete

Sabrblade wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:Who was the later retcon?

Freezon.

Interesting, thanks Sabrblade.

Evil Eye wrote:[Sighs in Airachnid]

Pssst!

Autobot N wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:Also, Elita, her pals, and Arcee may have all appeared first, but Minerva was the first-ever female character to get a TOY released at mass retail (barring later-made retcons).

I don't count Ask Vector Prime retcons, Minerva was the first figure specifically intended to be a girl

Uh...


Semantics, but let's just settle for "first female figure".

Emerje

Emerje wrote:

Autobot N wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:Also, Elita, her pals, and Arcee may have all appeared first, but Minerva was the first-ever female character to get a TOY released at mass retail (barring later-made retcons).

I don't count Ask Vector Prime retcons, Minerva was the first figure specifically intended to be a girl

Uh...


Semantics, but let's just settle for "first female figure".

Emerje

Let's do it like this, barring retcons:

MF Minerva: first female character to get a toy, period
BotCon 1995 Nightracer: first female character to get a toy in the US
BW Blackarachnia: first female character to get a toy in US main retail
BW Transmetal Airazor: first toy specifically designed as female