The Energon Pub

Rtron wrote:

Emerje wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:Oh no. Oh NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO...!

Amid all these awesome listings, I just noticed the one that terrifies me the most: Leader class Overcharge.

Who is Overcharge, you ask? Not "who", "what". Overcharge is a redeco of Blitzwing. In very ordinary, non-striking colors. And is a troop-builder, no less, so there might be a lot of them to go around.

With how badly Blitzwing has shelf-warmed thus far, I dread how badly Overcharge is going to do the same.

We just can't escape that mold.

I for one will be treating him as a Diaclone transplant, if I wanted an accurate army of Overcharges I'd sticker up some Blitzwing figures.

I'm curious just how close to the exclusive these PRs will be. We've never really seen Hasbro do this before, but considering Legacy Dirge wasn't 100% like the original I'm guessing we'll see some slight changes here as well.

Meanwhile, still no Bumblebee.

Emerje

The lack of Bumblebee is getting a bit suspicious. It could just be typical corporate hypercorrection, with them just not wanting to release any extra Bumblebees AT ALL now. They did make sure not to feature him in the comic book, for example. But there's another possibility: that they're not rerealising the Netflix Bumblebee because a new one is in the works. ALthough they're taking their sweet time to rerelease Soundwave too, so maybe it's just them taking a long time and that's it.

Don't forget that VW may also get in the way of a Netflix Bee re-release since it is a licensed alt mode. Walmart isn't the only one with a say on that figure.

Thanks to JTPrime, we now know of new listings within the Legacy United line. While G2 Breakdown and Armada Wheeljack are new, all others are reteleases of sought after toys and figures which were moved, like Sureshot and core class BW Dinobot. Fans should be very happy about this....

As one who was able to get a copy of Cosmos and nearly-retail price through a VERY kind seller? Yes, this comes as good news for all the buyers out there who were otherwise at the mercy of scalpers. But being what we are, we are still left with some lingering resentment over a few things.

1) That the shortages ever happened in the first place when they could have easily been prevented with a little planning and common sense.

2) That it took Hasbro so dang long to recognize their fault, then even longer to act and fix it.

3) That there are still other figures like Leader 86 Snarl which they haven't moved to re-supply in the face of extremely high demand.

But well - we'll take what we can get .

o.supreme wrote:

Sowndwave76 wrote:No, it is 100% an exclusivity thing.
My local Walmart carried almost nothing from Velocitron, and I still have yet to see ANYTHING from Toxitron. Literally not one figure.
Had either of these Stunticons been regular retail releases, I could've bought them from any number of online retailers (possibly with free shipping) very, very easily.

You can throw-out "readily available" if you want to, but that's not the reality with exclusives.

That's why I go back to distribution. That was YOUR experience. Mine was that I saw almost every Velocitron toy in abundance. So much so that they went on clearance (except obviously for Cosmos (never saw) & Clampdown (only saw a couple times))

Wouldn't distribution mean stores would have set aside space for them and never put anything there? Between my two local Walmarts one got everything from the Toxitron line except the Leaders (and still has most of it on the shelves after some five or six restocks). The other didn't get a single figure and made no space for them at all. These stores are a little over 20 miles apart and are considered to be in different regions. The same store also didn't get the G1 Retro figures or the Velocitron line and neither store got the 35th exclusives. I think some stores are simply left out for whatever reason.

TF-fan kev777 wrote:Don't forget that VW may also get in the way of a Netflix Bee re-release since it is a licensed alt mode. Walmart isn't the only one with a say on that figure.

We know the Walmart exclusivity has expired and I doubt it's a VW thing because when it expired we got this:



If that can get the VW treatment then Bumblebee still can for sure. I'm guessing Hasbro simply has something else in mind for that mold, maybe it even is part of the 2025 line, this new listing is really just the last Legacy United wave, the rest of the year hasn't been leaked yet like it has been for Studio Series.

Emerje

Emerje wrote:Meanwhile, still no Bumblebee.

Emerje

Or Thrust, also released in 2020 as a relatively HTF Exclusive. I would really like for both of these to get a reissue by 2025 as I'd like to bow out soon. I only need Powerglide and a few others to finish up G1.

#1 Signal Lancer fan wrote:Armada Wheeljack is a big surprise for me. Of the Armada characters that I would have expected to get the Legacy treatment, he was pretty low on the list, but I'm all for it.

Looks like you missed out on the Pulse Exclusive Shattered Glass Sideswipe and Hot-Rod set. That made an upcoming Legacy Armada Wheeljack pretty obvious. What will be less obvious is his price point. Voyager, maybe?



If they skip the minicon because they want to sell the thing as a deluxe, they better make a minicon pack that pack in his minicon and all the other ones that are missing.

Might grab Sureshot, G2 Breakdown, and Overcharge, depending on how they turn out, and Armada Wheeljack is almost assuredly a grab for me. Cool to see a bunch of repacks for people who missed these though.

Curious where this "there's no Bees" narrative is coming from, when there's one Bee already out for this year and getting repacked later (Legacy Animated Bee), two more that are coming out later in the year (A Level SS86 Bee and SS "Next Gen" Bee), three Bees last year (SS ROTB Bee, SS WFC Bee, and the Legacy Pulsecon Core Bee), and now already a Bee listed for next year (SS MV6 Bee)?

-Kanrabat- wrote:What will be less obvious is his price point. Voyager, maybe?

If they skip the minicon because they want to sell the thing as a deluxe, they better make a minicon pack that pack in his minicon and all the other ones that are missing.

I mean, we know from the listing he's being sold at Deluxe, and that SG pack was just the retail price of a Voyager and a Deluxe even with the Minicon, so I think the Minicon is just included in the new tooling that the Sideswipe mold got?

Nemesis Primal wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:What will be less obvious is his price point. Voyager, maybe?

If they skip the minicon because they want to sell the thing as a deluxe, they better make a minicon pack that pack in his minicon and all the other ones that are missing.

I mean, we know from the listing he's being sold at Deluxe, and that SG pack was just the retail price of a Voyager and a Deluxe even with the Minicon, so I think the Minicon is just included in the new tooling that the Sideswipe mold got?

Impossible.
The Hotshot and Jolt pack sold almost like a freaking leader class figure. Granted, there was a set of blast effects. But if we remove these, the set would be sold as a voyager as the bare minimum.

Often, multi-packs have their base price being "discounted" if you count the value of the individual figures. Other times, they aren't and even, their price increase, like the Reactivate sets.

If they do sell Armada Sideswipe with his minicon, his Sideswipe gun, and the two "new" batons for a deluxe price, I'd be really impressed. Even if they don't include the old Sideswipe gun. We will have to wait and see.

I'll be getting him regardless because...

I understand Armada Wheeljack with the whole SG mold, but I’m getting really antsy for an Armada Red Alert. I can see them not doing all the Cons, but Red Alert would complete the original trio of Autobots. Plus, he’s my favorite, and I hope any new mold keeps those insane legs like the original toy had.

Emerje wrote:Wouldn't distribution mean stores would have set aside space for them and never put anything there?

Yes. the last time they released a reissue of the original Soundwave & cassettes. I remember several Walmart's in my area that had the pegs fore the cassettes, but never got any.

-Kanrabat- wrote:

Nemesis Primal wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:What will be less obvious is his price point. Voyager, maybe?

If they skip the minicon because they want to sell the thing as a deluxe, they better make a minicon pack that pack in his minicon and all the other ones that are missing.

I mean, we know from the listing he's being sold at Deluxe, and that SG pack was just the retail price of a Voyager and a Deluxe even with the Minicon, so I think the Minicon is just included in the new tooling that the Sideswipe mold got?

Impossible.
The Hotshot and Jolt pack sold almost like a freaking leader class figure. Granted, there was a set of blast effects. But if we remove these, the set would be sold as a voyager as the bare minimum.

Often, multi-packs have their base price being "discounted" if you count the value of the individual figures. Other times, they aren't and even, their price increase, like the Reactivate sets.

Comparing the SG Sideswipe/Armada Wheeljack situation to that Hot Shot set is apples to oranges, and people need to stop thinking they're equivalent just because they both include Minicons.
1. I don't remember how it came out in Canada, but at least in the US the Hot Shot set was Pulsecon exclusive, and those always have markups regardless of content (BW Ravage came with less stuff than this set and somehow commanded even higher pricing?)
2. Jolt and the new guns share zero plastic with Hot Shot himself, they are molded with each other and nothing else (which is why the gun handles match Jolt), which means that set is functionally two figures + blast effects (or two figures, one of which already includes blast effects), whereas Whisper is molded in the exact same colors as the new parts on Sideswipe, which is why I think they're just molded together
3. Both SG releases that year (that multipack and Grimlock) went for their normal retail pricing per figure, which to me says less "we're offering this multipack at a discount" and more "SG releases are retail price now because the markups only came from the included comics"
4. In fact now that I think about it, basically the only multipacks that ever retail for a lower price than the included figures would individually are Target exclusives specifically (I say basically because I can think of a single counterexample, SG Slicer & Exo-Suit, but that's it)
5. We're also comparing a set containing the second use of that Hot Shot mold to this:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

...at which point I feel like that new tooling basically should have paid for itself, regardless of if the Minicon was included or not.

Could I be wrong? Absolutely, I'm only going off of the precedents I can see. Do I think Wheeljack having his Minicon is "impossible"? Absolutely not.

Sabrblade wrote:

Stormshot_Prime wrote:I understand Armada Wheeljack with the whole SG mold, but I’m getting really antsy for an Armada Red Alert. I can see them not doing all the Cons, but Red Alert would complete the original trio of Autobots. Plus, he’s my favorite, and I hope any new mold keeps those insane legs like the original toy had.

Red Alert Will probably be made from whatever mold is used to make Cannonball in the Star Seeker subline.

Which, if I had to guess, would probably be the Crankcase mold.

Considering Cannonball was a Cybertron Red Alert repaint, not Armada, a hypothetical Armada Red Alert should be a new mold regardless of what's happening with Cannonball.

I wonder if they had all these uses planned out when they first conceived Siege Sideswipe.

Well, Nemesis Primal, I think that there's no rime or reasons to the prices of the figures. There may be some rules and conditions that we mortals can't phantom.

BTW, Every repaints of the SS86 Leader Grimlock mold had skipped (or will) skip the Wheelie figure. Sure, it wasn't much, but it was something. So that's kinda a price increase.

If SG Sideswipe's minicon was gang-molded with his new parts, this mean the minicon is sure to be included with Armada Wheeljack. One thing is less sure though, is the price. I really doubt will be generous enough to sell this set at the standard deluxe price-point.

And finally, so far, all of the Hasbro Pulse exclusives (minus the HASLAB) had found their way into Canadian Gamestops and sometime, some independent retailers. Their prices are usually ludicrous.

Nemesis Primal wrote:Curious where this "there's no Bees" narrative is coming from, when there's one Bee already out for this year and getting repacked later (Legacy Animated Bee), two more that are coming out later in the year (A Level SS86 Bee and SS "Next Gen" Bee), three Bees last year (SS ROTB Bee, SS WFC Bee, and the Legacy Pulsecon Core Bee), and now already a Bee listed for next year (SS MV6 Bee)?

You've misunderstood, we're talking specifically about Netflix Volkswagen Bumbelbee which has yet to be re-released and in high demand. We've had the Bumblebee head on the Cliffjumper body and the Bumblebee body with the Goldbug head, but we've yet to have that same combination of parts for a proper Bumblebee since the original. He's still selling in completed auctions on eBay consistently for around $70+ sealed, $45 loose after shipping.

Emerje

Emerje wrote:

Nemesis Primal wrote:Curious where this "there's no Bees" narrative is coming from, when there's one Bee already out for this year and getting repacked later (Legacy Animated Bee), two more that are coming out later in the year (A Level SS86 Bee and SS "Next Gen" Bee), three Bees last year (SS ROTB Bee, SS WFC Bee, and the Legacy Pulsecon Core Bee), and now already a Bee listed for next year (SS MV6 Bee)?

You've misunderstood, we're talking specifically about Netflix Volkswagen Bumbelbee which has yet to be re-released and in high demand. We've had the Bumblebee head on the Cliffjumper body and the Bumblebee body with the Goldbug head, but we've yet to have that same combination of parts for a proper Bumblebee since the original. He's still selling in completed auctions on eBay consistently for around $70+ sealed, $45 loose after shipping.

Emerje

Ahhhh, I see, you meant G1 specifically. Well, presumably the SS86 Bee will alleviate that need.

-Kanrabat- wrote:If SG Sideswipe's minicon was gang-molded with his new parts, this mean the minicon is sure to be included with Armada Wheeljack. One thing is less sure though, is the price. I really doubt will be generous enough to sell this set at the standard deluxe price-point.

...but we have the retail listing now, we know he's at that exact price-point.

-Kanrabat- wrote:And finally, so far, all of the Hasbro Pulse exclusives (minus the HASLAB) had found their way into Canadian Gamestops and sometime, some independent retailers. Their prices are usually ludicrous.

There it is, yeah, I remembered you mentioning the pricing for Pulsecon exclusives before but not where you were getting them from.

o.supreme wrote:

Sowndwave76 wrote:No, it is 100% an exclusivity thing.
My local Walmart carried almost nothing from Velocitron, and I still have yet to see ANYTHING from Toxitron. Literally not one figure.
Had either of these Stunticons been regular retail releases, I could've bought them from any number of online retailers (possibly with free shipping) very, very easily.

You can throw-out "readily available" if you want to, but that's not the reality with exclusives.

That's why I go back to distribution. That was YOUR experience. Mine was that I saw almost every Velocitron toy in abundance. So much so that they went on clearance (except obviously for Cosmos (never saw) & Clampdown (only saw a couple times))

Same with the Toxitron line. Especially Toxitron himself, and G2 Grimlock, clogging shelves for months One store in my area still has them. But I never saw G2 Dead End because he was 1 per case. Ended up paying a scalper price for him. If all the excess that my area, and several other areas had, made its way to areas that got none such as yours, this wouldn't be an issue, thus it is Walmarts screw up.

But I guess all of this is moot since Hasbro is reissuing most of them. If you never saw Override or Road Hauler, all I can say is; try to network with fans. They were like rabbits multiplying and clogging shelves at stores in my area. Unfortunately I didn't want them. but I'm always willing to ship to fans at cost, and I know others will as well, for anything that they may not have access to.

But seeing some of those figures in abundance was YOUR experience.
I know my experience wasn't the norm, but there's no way it could be a one-off.
Road Hauler and Blurr were the figures I saw. But this was never about me complaining that I couldn't get figures that I wanted.
The point was that when a figure is an exclusive, it's naturally going to be more difficult to get.
And to make figures more difficult to get, especially any that are part of a combiner, is poor form.

If the G2 Stunticons weren't exclusives, "Walmart screwing up" or playing the blame game with distribution wouldn't be an issue. Period.
I truly don't get why you're trying to argue this.

There are many people who have experienced this between multiple years now.
ER Dirge, Ramjet, Thrust, Prowl, Ironide, Ratchet, Sideswipe, Red Alert...
NF Bumblebee, & Soundwave...
Buzzworthy Kup, & Cliffjumper..
Cosmos...
G2 Shadowstrip, & Dead End...
At least a few of the SS86 G1 reissues...

All more difficult to get because they were exclusives.

Hell, I only have Origins Jazz because my wife found one (the only one in the store) when she was out of state on a work trip.
I was never claiming an exclusive is some kind of unicorn.
But most people who have a lot of exclusive figures cannot say those were all easy to get ahold of.

Sowndwave76 wrote:

o.supreme wrote:

Sowndwave76 wrote:No, it is 100% an exclusivity thing.
My local Walmart carried almost nothing from Velocitron, and I still have yet to see ANYTHING from Toxitron. Literally not one figure.
Had either of these Stunticons been regular retail releases, I could've bought them from any number of online retailers (possibly with free shipping) very, very easily.

You can throw-out "readily available" if you want to, but that's not the reality with exclusives.

That's why I go back to distribution. That was YOUR experience. Mine was that I saw almost every Velocitron toy in abundance. So much so that they went on clearance (except obviously for Cosmos (never saw) & Clampdown (only saw a couple times))

Same with the Toxitron line. Especially Toxitron himself, and G2 Grimlock, clogging shelves for months One store in my area still has them. But I never saw G2 Dead End because he was 1 per case. Ended up paying a scalper price for him. If all the excess that my area, and several other areas had, made its way to areas that got none such as yours, this wouldn't be an issue, thus it is Walmarts screw up.

But I guess all of this is moot since Hasbro is reissuing most of them. If you never saw Override or Road Hauler, all I can say is; try to network with fans. They were like rabbits multiplying and clogging shelves at stores in my area. Unfortunately I didn't want them. but I'm always willing to ship to fans at cost, and I know others will as well, for anything that they may not have access to.

But seeing some of those figures in abundance was YOUR experience.
I know my experience wasn't the norm, but there's no way it could be a one-off.
Road Hauler and Blurr were the figures I saw. But this was never about me complaining that I couldn't get figures that I wanted.
The point was that when a figure is an exclusive, it's naturally going to be more difficult to get.
And to make figures more difficult to get, especially any that are part of a combiner, is poor form.

If the G2 Stunticons weren't exclusives, "Walmart screwing up" or playing the blame game with distribution wouldn't be an issue. Period.
I truly don't get why you're trying to argue this.

There are many people who have experienced this between multiple years now.
ER Dirge, Ramjet, Thrust, Prowl, Ironide, Ratchet, Sideswipe, Red Alert...
NF Bumblebee, & Soundwave...
Buzzworthy Kup, & Cliffjumper..
Cosmos...
G2 Shadowstrip, & Dead End...
At least a few of the SS86 G1 reissues...

All more difficult to get because they were exclusives.

Hell, I only have Origins Jazz because my wife found one (the only one in the store) when she was out of state on a work trip.
I was never claiming an exclusive is some kind of unicorn.
But most people who have a lot of exclusive figures cannot say those were all easy to get ahold of.

Using this list as a shortcut:
ER Dirge, Ramjet, Thrust, Prowl, Ironide, Ratchet, Sideswipe, Red Alert...
NF Bumblebee, & Soundwave...
Buzzworthy Kup, & Cliffjumper..
Cosmos...
G2 Shadowstrip, & Dead End...
At least a few of the SS86 G1 reissues...

Ironhide and Rachet sold out quickly, and of course Cosmos disappeared in minutes. Most of the others were either up for pre-order or were available online for reasonable periods. With notable exceptions, and especially with Pulse offering limited partner exclusives and timed launches, most of these were very gettable. My main takeaway from the pandemic period was that if I want something, I need to jump on it. Especially for in-demand figures, I can't trust that I'll be able to pick it up when it's convenient. A handful of these I was able to get only because I was checking out as soon as they went up, but that has been the exception rather than the rule, even for that subset.

With all of that said, I completely get the frustration. It shouldn't be this hard. I'm glad that Hasbro has taken steps like reissuing the coneheads, and if these leaks are real, it shows they want to satisfy the fanbase. They have to juggle getting everything into everyone's hands while also satisfying retailer expectations.

Makes you wonder about Cosmos if they're able to reissue it Legacy Universe main line, why couldn't they have just done that in the first place? It's a new Bot specific mold after all, so you'd think the tooling would require those resource. I guess this was a case that it wouldn't have even happened without Walmart exclusivity but I always thought that these were primarily repaint not new tooling. So that aspect does seem odd especially given the fact Walmart themselves screwed the case breakdown and decided to short pack that figure. Though I guess that's how you offset a brand new mold, packing it in with more repaints.

As for some of the others, why didn't they just repack Dirge, Ramjet and Thrust into a 4-pk similar to that Buzzworthy troop builder pack? Is it because they're not random troopers? Not that I'm in favor of Exclusives but at least it would have gotten those three most wanted out all at once instead of having to wait another 3-5 years one at a time.

Emerje wrote:
Meanwhile, still no Bumblebee.

Emerje

I know, right?

AcademyofDrX wrote:Using this list as a shortcut:
ER Dirge, Ramjet, Thrust, Prowl, Ironide, Ratchet, Sideswipe, Red Alert...
NF Bumblebee, & Soundwave...
Buzzworthy Kup, & Cliffjumper..
Cosmos...
G2 Shadowstrip, & Dead End...
At least a few of the SS86 G1 reissues...

Ironhide and Rachet sold out quickly, and of course Cosmos disappeared in minutes. Most of the others were either up for pre-order or were available online for reasonable periods. With notable exceptions, and especially with Pulse offering limited partner exclusives and timed launches, most of these were very gettable. My main takeaway from the pandemic period was that if I want something, I need to jump on it. Especially for in-demand figures, I can't trust that I'll be able to pick it up when it's convenient. A handful of these I was able to get only because I was checking out as soon as they went up, but that has been the exception rather than the rule, even for that subset.

I'm agreeing with most of this, although there was plenty of word here on the forums that sometimes people would get a preorder placed, say with Amazon, and later had issues with it actually being delivered.
For what feels like well over a year if not two, I've relied on preorders, and have placed them as soon as possible. Buying when it's convenient is a roll of the dice.

AcademyofDrX wrote:With all of that said, I completely get the frustration. It shouldn't be this hard. I'm glad that Hasbro has taken steps like reissuing the coneheads, and if these leaks are real, it shows they want to satisfy the fanbase. They have to juggle getting everything into everyone's hands while also satisfying retailer expectations.

I also wanted to make it clear that me bringing this up is mainly on behalf of others, and what I've read online (and not just these forums). I've been able to get the vast majority of what I've really wanted. Of that list above, 4 of them I was unable to get. On top of that, 5/6 reissues I would've liked to have had didn't happen either, but those weren't truly on my "want list". I'm not crushed that I wasn't able to get those Stunticons. But again, it shouldn't have been so difficult. The most frustrating "miss" for me was NF Bumblebee. And in the grand scheme, oh well. At one point I could've had him for around $40 and passed.

As I said, good on Hastak for making plans to get some of these elusive figures back out there.

Sabrblade wrote:

Till-all-R1 wrote:Makes you wonder about Cosmos if they're able to reissue it Legacy Universe main line, why couldn't they have just done that in the first place? It's a new Bot specific mold after all, so you'd think the tooling would require those resource. I guess this was a case that it wouldn't have even happened without Walmart exclusivity but I always thought that these were primarily repaint not new tooling. So that aspect does seem odd especially given the fact Walmart themselves screwed the case breakdown and decided to short pack that figure. Though I guess that's how you offset a brand new mold, packing it in with more repaints.

Cosmos originally wasn't supposed to be a brand new mold. He was going to be a retool of the Buzzworthy Bumblebee origin Bumblebee mold. TakaraTomy, all on their own, Surprise Hasbro by finding a way to make a whole new Cosmos mold of its own with the tooling budget that was meant for retooling Origin Bumblebee. The same thing happened with Override being a new mold, when she too was originally supposed to be a retool, of the SS86 Hot Rod mold. Suppose of them ended up being rare cases of new molds being made for a line of mold reuses.

Interesting. I never knew this, but that's why you the professionals of our hobby provide us fans with tidbits like the one above.

How sad it would be if Cosmos came with some bad mold degredation but no doubt to those that missed getting him the first run wouldn't mind this!