The Energon Pub

Can't say I like it, but can't say I don't enjoy it.

Burn wrote:I like G1.
I like Bay's stuff.
I don't like Animated.

Care to label me?

A human being, therefore with valid opinions.

As for me... with the exception of Kiss players, I think I can find something positive in just about all of TF's various incarnations. the LA movies are no exception. In quite a few respects, I find them to be superior to G1, my favorite iteration. Carbombya anyone?

Anyway, yeah. I love the movies and their design.

im a bit mixed on this.

on the one had i really like bay as an action director. what goes up on the screen LOOKS gorgeous and no one blows up shyte like him.

and i enjoyed the films enough to go see em multiple times.

i just dont consider the movieverse transformers.

its just TOO radically different from the original template i was raised on with pretty much prime being the only character i recognise, well there was jazz too but he got offed.

its annoying as those two SHOW you could update the look and still retain the astethic, but when i look at ratchet and ironhide i dont see ratchet and ironhide. anymore than i'd see superman as that electric blue suited thing DC did back in late 90s.

i think ALOT of the problems with the second film was with the writers strike giving bay way too much leeway to indulge himself (robo balls for instance ) but ironically i think the reaction to ROTF will probably mean dark of the moon will be a far tighter story.

ok the NAME is still beyond crap but i do actually think they took onboard all the stuff about the racism and meandering drawnout scenes and have high hopes for the third film to be good .

its just i dont think i can actually SAY im a fan of the films, i just enjoy them for what they are and go read the comics for the real thing (or rather i COULD till IDW threw everything out with their ongong but thats another story ! )

theres some REALLY cool ideas in em. the meteor modes for instance and what they wanted to do for arcee in ROTF (three bods, one mind ) was actually the one version of her i could stand , so much so i bought the toys. i really like the military aspect of it too and though galloway was a great character.

its just the dumb stuff like dog humping and high mothers screwed it up.

at best i suppose i can say im NOT a hater , but i really wouldnt mind a reboot as i think were getting tim burton batman when i want nolan's dark knight.

Burn wrote:I like G1.
I like Bay's stuff.
I don't like Animated.

Care to label me?

No, I do not wish to label you. I see why everyone hates Animated. I still think we'll look back on Animated someday and find something to like in it. I didn't really find anything to like in it at all until I opened my mind to it near the end of its run (could have had more potential if it continued, dammit). The biggest problem I had was the appearance of the characters; they were all wavy and un-robot-like. However, the main story intrigued me. I also thought it had better voice acting then other animated TF series. The toyline was my favorite, though. I love my TFA leader class Ultra Magnus.

Capt.Failure wrote:I'm a huge fan of the movieverse, and as far as I'm concerned it ties with G1.

What you need to realise is that in every fandom, and I mean EVERY fandom, a good portion of the original fans might be hostile to change. You wouldn't know the Harry Potter fandom has a faction violently opposed to the film versions unless you dug deep in the fandom itself (lucky for me I know plenty of Potter fans).

Transformers has been around since the 80's, and in those decades since the fandom can fracture as the series changes and is rebooted over and over. Remember how the fandom exploded over Beast Wars being about animal themed Transformers and not vehicles? That series is a classic entry in the franchise now.

It's just a hot topic because Michael Bay draws the ire of the film critic establishment for not making "worthwhile" films (a subject strictly open to interpretation, mind you) and the Transformers fandom is prone to fracturing over change.

Hey a new guy! Well dude, this is a really awesome post to me. I think everyone should consider this. We all need to realize at some point that change will always come, and it's always going to be very difficult to change it back, if possible to change it back.

partholon wrote:im a bit mixed on this.

on the one had i really like bay as an action director. what goes up on the screen LOOKS gorgeous and no one blows up shyte like him.

i just dont consider the movieverse transformers.

its just TOO radically different from the original template i was raised on with pretty much prime being the only character i recognise, well there was jazz too but he got offed.

its annoying as those two SHOW you could update the look and still retain the astethic, but when i look at ratchet and ironhide i dont see ratchet and ironhide. anymore than i'd see superman as that electric blue suited thing DC did back in late 90s.

theres some REALLY cool ideas in em. the meteor modes for instance and what they wanted to do for arcee in ROTF (three bods, one mind ) was actually the one version of her i could stand , so much so i bought the toys. i really like the military aspect of it too and though galloway was a great character.

its just the dumb stuff like dog humping and high mothers screwed it up.

1. I agree with you there.
2. Well, too bad. It's still TF to me, (some) fans, and Hasbro. I don't see why it isn't TF. Prove why it is not.
3. Again, as soon as something new comes we immediately decide we hate it. Change can be innovation.
4. I agree there.
5. Oh, wow someone with a real sense of humor that's sick of that stuff. Is the crotch and drug references the only sources of humor nowadays?

Thanks to the movies that I was able to get a Seeker jet and Ravage. I'm sure that Hasbo are going to have a tough time with Transformers: Prime,

Ok so back to add whatever it was I said I was gonna add....

Basically, I am a huge movie fan, without it, I would probably not even be into TransFormers right now.
I prefer the aesthetic to the others and the designs, I won't say they're flawless or deep movies but they are entertaining and good enough to watch again.

I love Animated, and Movieverse, and pretty much everything else TFs, barring KP of course.

There's just one undeniable fact: Giant robots + Explosions + Peter Cullen = AWESOME!

And if i want to see a movie with plot, i'd go to a Nolan film. I go to these movies for A)Transformers and B)S**T exploding.

partholon wrote:i just dont consider the movieverse transformers.

Why? You've got Prime, Bee, Screamer, Megs, and they TRANSFORM! They come from a planet called Cybertron, and we have Autobots, Decepticons, Allsparks, Matrixes, and robot-fights. How is it not Transformers?

JetOptimus23 wrote:I love Animated, and Movieverse, and pretty much everything else TFs, barring KP of course.

There's just one undeniable fact: Giant robots + Explosions + Peter Cullen = AWESOME!

Yep, agree with everything here. Initially, I absolutely despised Animated, I thought it was tied to the movie and got everything wrong.

But then, years later, I discovered that Blackout was in it and gave it another chance, so far I absolutely love it.

Though, I have only been watching random episodes...

Here's my opinion: I think people invest too much time into worrying about this subject. Take heart in the fact that at least the TF movies haven't been directed by Oliver Stone. Now that is something that would stink.

In my eyes, Revenge of the Fallen was simply "Gobots: the Movie." There are too many flaws in it for me to consider it as any part of Transformer-verse. Heck, if you didn't read the prequels or the novel, you wouldn't even know what the Solar Harvesters purpose is!

I like the first movie, however. It was simple, had some awesome scenes (Blackout; the arrival...) and was generally OK. But Bay magnified all the flaws from the first movie for the second. Less story, more idiotic jokes, and sometimes the order of the scenes just don't make sence.

partholon wrote:i just dont consider the movieverse transformers.

I consider it more Transformers than anything else of the past 20 years.

its annoying as those two SHOW you could update the look and still retain the astethic, but when i look at ratchet and ironhide i dont see ratchet and ironhide.

Well to me they're the first Ratchet and Ironhide I actually like both personality and design (actually I liked Ratchet's stories in the marvel comics but he still looked crap, somehow he looked more interesting when fused with megatron into a freakshow). And it's nice that they don't look alike to each other at all too.

its just the dumb stuff like dog humping and high mothers screwed it up.

Ok I could certainly live without seeing dogs having sex.

OptiMagnus10 wrote:I also thought it had better voice acting then other animated TF series. The toyline was my favorite, though. I love my TFA leader class Ultra Magnus.

The voice acting is one of my most hated things about the show. It's horrendous. The DC cartoons tend to have really good voice acting. Animated had mostly the same annoying voice actors I've seen in other bad cartoons like other recent TF shows. Grating irritating and just plain terrible. The godawful 'art' style and the fact every TF has a face I wanna smack in the face with the back of a truck just adds to my distate of that show.

The toyline impresses me only in that they managed to make those ugly designs actually work in toy form. I've never had a desire to buy any of them. Except maybe Rodimus cos the colors and flames still catch my eye but then I see his face and I know that one day I'd be walking past my shelf and I'd suddenly shove my fist into that toy and smash it and I wouldn't want to risk my Classics Rodimus getting caught in the impact too.

edit:damn quote tags...

JetOptimus23 wrote:

partholon wrote:i just dont consider the movieverse transformers.

Why? You've got Prime, Bee, Screamer, Megs, and they TRANSFORM! They come from a planet called Cybertron, and we have Autobots, Decepticons, Allsparks, Matrixes, and robot-fights. How is it not Transformers?

because it strays too far from the source material ala the burton/schumacker era batman.

if this is someones FIRST experience of transformers its perfectly fine. but from MY perspective i see too many disparaties to take it seriously as an attemtpt to portray the transfomers they name check.

ratchet for instance fixes NOBODY in a film with several characters being blown away left right and center. he doesnt even use his alt mode to help dying humans. lennox did more medical stuff than this guy.

as for the rest of the bots besides the names theres nothing to really connect them to their cannon counterparts. i like movie ironhide, but i honestly wouldnt feel any different about the guy if he was called armourhide instead as he's not the same character that bore that name in previous incarnations. he doesnt even do the same job (weapon specialest as opposed to bodyguard and confident of prime)

the megatron I know would never willingly bend his knee to ANYONE. let alone look like he cares when the fallen gets offed. my megs wouldve shot the fallen in the back once the solare harvester was up and running, not tugged the forelock to him.

starscream is pretty close to what he's meant to be ill give the movies that, but he also WASNT this much of a failour. wheres the agenda that he's always running to try and up megs ? the blokes an opertunist at heart, a schemer , yet we bearly see that.

in fact even the supposed motivation for the war, the effort to secure the allspark, was NEVER a part of transformer lore till the movies. till then all versions of megs simply wanted to rule tyranically and establish a galactic empire while prime thought himself duty bound to stop him, essentially keeping his race in check to preserve the universe.

and dont get me started on the "hatchlings"

as other posters have pointed out, remove prime from the film and change the names and youve got a servicable "gobots" movie. in fact the hatchlings would actualy make sense in that.

like i said , i can take the films as they are. just like i reckon batman fans could take burtons vision for what it was. but like those comic fans im waiting for the nolan of our franchise to turn up and give us a more faithfull vision of the story and the iconic characters. mainly as there was nothing really WRONG with it.

to borrow a phrase from galloway right now i have no idea why the hell the bots and cons are still on earth. dumb as it was even the cartoon gave a reasonable motivation for that (to suck earth dry).

personally i think thats gonna be a theme of the third film as right now the deceps have no purpose. and hey it look like the designs are getting an update to try and fix some of what i mentioned so its not like theyre not trying to address this stuff.

because it strays too far from the source material ala the burton/schumacker era batman.

You could say same thing about any series past G1. People went ape sh*t litterally when beast wars came out. This no bigger offender in reimagining than any other reboot we saw. Or is RiD Megatron transforming into a giant hand somehow a better alt mode than a cybertronian tank?

ratchet for instance fixes NOBODY in a film with several characters being blown away left right and center. he doesnt even use his alt mode to help dying humans. lennox did more medical stuff than this guy.

Bumble bee gets fixed by Rachet. He fixes his vocal cords with his laser. Then between films he likely put Bee's legs back together. He assisted in forming Jet-optimus as he directed where the parts went. Jolt magnetized them while he used his own magnetic powers to attach them to prime.

the megatron I know would never willingly bend his knee to ANYONE. let alone look like he cares when the fallen gets offed. my megs wouldve shot the fallen in the back once the solar harvester was up and running, not tugged the forelock to him.

The Fallen has powers over people's will. It was shown very subtlely. Megatron imediately goes there's no command by mine even in death. Then he kneels when he sees the Fallen? You see him actting his own bot when he's not around the Fallen. This part of why only a Prime could defeat him.

I liked it since it showed Megatron having loyalty to something as a leader would need to. An organization of backstabbing can't hold itself together. I'd been fine if they'd gone the direction the game did where he betrayed the Fallen when he didn't make good on his deal too.

to borrow a phrase from galloway right now i have no idea why the hell the bots and cons are still on earth. dumb as it was even the cartoon gave a reasonable motivation for that (to suck earth dry).

That's a load of slag. If anything the Decepticons had even less reason be on the earth once they came out of stasis lock in G1 as guys like Astrotrain could taken them to some planet the autobots weren't on to get resources. It's like insisting on robbing a bank in gotham city when you could pick any other city in the country and not have to deal with batman. It's not like there wasn't better planets to pillage like in Fight or Flight.

In the movies we know EXACTLY why they are on earth. They are looking for the Allspark on Earth, The star harvest and matrix of leadership in the second. I'm not sure how you reached this train of thought. Nothing supports it.

Chaoslock wrote: Heck, if you didn't read the prequels or the novel, you wouldn't even know what the Solar Harvesters purpose is!

I didn't read any of those and I got the point:It turns suns into Energon yes? The movie explained that fine to me...

I like the first movie, however. It was simple, had some awesome scenes (Blackout; the arrival...) and was generally OK. But Bay magnified all the flaws from the first movie for the second. Less story, more idiotic jokes, and sometimes the order of the scenes just don't make sence.

Ok, I can agree to this, in fact without those, I think the movie would have been an actual very good movie just because the idiotic jokes were THAT stupid...

My question to all is: Why does everything have to be G1? Why do the characters have to look excatly like their G1 counterparts? Why does the story have to add up with G1? WHY DO WE HATE CHANGE? WHY DO WE HATE EVOLUTION?

Because that's how people are. If something makes them happy, why not want to hold on to it?

Burn wrote:Because that's how people are. If something makes them happy, why not want to hold on to it?

Yes, but does liking the movies automatically make you let go of G1? No! G1 will always be there. You are not betraying G1 by liking the movies, or whatever the case may be. You can still have your old G1 figures, you can still watch DVDs of the show, you can still buy new classic figures, and you can still have your comics. I just don't see the big deal.

You don't see the big deal?

Well I don't see why YOU are making a big deal out of people not liking the movies.

They don't.

Nothing you say or do will change that.

Accept it.

Burn wrote:You don't see the big deal?

Well I don't see why YOU are making a big deal out of people not liking the movies.

They don't.

Nothing you say or do will change that.

Accept it.

Am I trying to make people like the movies like trying to convert people to a religion? No. I accept that I can't change that, and I never will change that. No one will. I'm more surprised at the number of people that really despise the movieverse. Maybe it's just because I really have no problem with any TF theme.

OptiMagnus10 wrote:Am I trying to make people like the movies like trying to convert people to a religion? No. I accept that I can't change that, and I never will change that. No one will.

Yet by your own admission you can't accept that people don't like it.

So why keep hammering the question? The answer is simple. YOU need to accept that people don't like it.

It really is that simple.

Burn wrote:

OptiMagnus10 wrote:Am I trying to make people like the movies like trying to convert people to a religion? No. I accept that I can't change that, and I never will change that. No one will.

Yet by your own admission you can't accept that people don't like it.

So why keep hammering the question? The answer is simple. YOU need to accept that people don't like it.

It really is that simple.

Okay, I'll accept it. Let's not argue.

OptiMagnus10 wrote:

Burn wrote:

OptiMagnus10 wrote:Am I trying to make people like the movies like trying to convert people to a religion? No. I accept that I can't change that, and I never will change that. No one will.

Yet by your own admission you can't accept that people don't like it.

So why keep hammering the question? The answer is simple. YOU need to accept that people don't like it.

It really is that simple.

Okay, I'll accept it. Let's not argue.

You can accept it, but they should also accept that people like the movieverse. There's a lot of "I can't believe it!" on both sides.

Don't cave to Burn's pov completely.

Autobot032 wrote:

OptiMagnus10 wrote:

Burn wrote:

OptiMagnus10 wrote:Am I trying to make people like the movies like trying to convert people to a religion? No. I accept that I can't change that, and I never will change that. No one will.

Yet by your own admission you can't accept that people don't like it.

So why keep hammering the question? The answer is simple. YOU need to accept that people don't like it.

It really is that simple.

Okay, I'll accept it. Let's not argue.

You can accept it, but they should also accept that people like the movieverse. There's a lot of "I can't believe it!" on both sides.

Don't cave to Burn's pov completely.

My POV that he should enjoy TF's his way and not let the ways others enjoy it or not enjoy it impact on his?