The Energon Pub

Caelus wrote:What about cutting some of the missions down to 3v3?

Im not sure that would help as it would reduce the overall amount of xp avalable from the mission which would still mean slower gains all round.

As Sustain said above; as we get more 1's, the opponents 0's will get bigger scores so it should balance itself out, the overall problem is that the bots have taken much longer to filter back to the game than the hyperactive 'cons have and we have got the lead as a result.

I still say give it time.

Psychout wrote:I still say give it time.

QFT.

Psychout and Sustain wrote:Smart stuff.

All in favour, say aye.

Aye!

Sustain wrote:

Psychout wrote:I still say give it time.

QFT.

Agree.

It's barely been a week. Let things settle down.

After a bit of thought I had an idea..... Mind it is 4:38 am here.

I don't like the idea of making people switch faction if they don't want to, really I don't like telling anyone how they should be playing.

A few level 0 only missions could help, but with the way the Decepticons play seems the Autobots and Beasts will still get owned. Having the level 1s in with the 0s however gives the 0s a chance to get an xp bonus of hitting a higher level, this is where my idea comes in.

At level one for the moment those who are there are stalled, and I mean we haven't anyone to fight to make the bigger xp pay outs. No big deal to me, however if we raised the bonus for killing a level above you the 0s would get more. It won't change for force people to play differently and still promote better builds.

I agree with what the pthers said. It's wayyyyy too early to consider an Autobot Bailout plan! What are they, the U.S. Financial sector? lol

Besides, I think they are doing QUITE well against my cons and even my level 1's. hHre are some examples:
http://www.seibertron.com/heavymetalwar ... _id=186961
http://www.seibertron.com/heavymetalwar ... _id=186956
http://www.seibertron.com/heavymetalwar ... _id=186966

Also, I am 200% against being forced to switch sides. I guess a cap for new players may not be too bad if the ability to switch sides occassionally is re-instated so nobody is permanently trapped on one side or another.

Just my two cents worth.

We don't need a bailout plan yet. I'm sure some were just venting about how lopsided it has been up to this point. As was stated before, it has only been a week into the reset. Everything is so random at Level 0 with such low stats and ineefective weapons. Things will start to even out eventually. It just takes time. It is just frustration setting in early on how the 'Cons have been dominating early on.

Evolution Prime wrote:It is just frustration setting in early on how the 'Cons have been dominating early on.

Just starting how we mean to go on

I aint sure it is so random down, surely if it was i wouldn't have a seventy plus who ratio.
And yes it is early days and i am against player caps and forced defections. However i think halfing the win bonus is a good idea

I see where you are coming from, but halving the win bonus will just make it harder for the other factions to catch us up.

We just have to put up with being much better that any of the competition until they finally get their **** together to oppose us.

I think it is too early to do much of anything yet. I can see why the beast factions would have lower scores as we out number them but the bots still have more than the cons. I think it is just we have more con players that play a lot compared to the bots. I don't really see any missions where I outnumber the bots most of the time it is 6 on 6.

Psychout wrote:

Caelus wrote:What about cutting some of the missions down to 3v3?

Im not sure that would help as it would reduce the overall amount of xp avalable from the mission which would still mean slower gains all round.

I was thinking that 3v3 missions would allow for more missions with both sides full. The cons would wind up with about half their missions unopposed, giving them that 100xp advantage though, of course.

I agree though, as crazy as it sounds, it's both too late and too early to make any changes.

It's a bit premature to say for certain that the imbalance won't be self-correcting by the xp gains that will be gotten off of the lvl 1s.

And, if there is a serious imbalance that has launched the Decepticons to lvl 1, it's too late to make a change and make it fair without resetting again.

Suggesting that we should slash the xp payout b/c the cons are in the lead may be intended as 'let's slow down their advance', but it can also come off as 'let's handicap everyone while the cons are still ahead'. I'm sure that's not how it's meant, but I'm equally sure that's how a lot of players will read it.

Caelus wrote:

Psychout wrote:

Caelus wrote:What about cutting some of the missions down to 3v3?

Im not sure that would help as it would reduce the overall amount of xp avalable from the mission which would still mean slower gains all round.

I was thinking that 3v3 missions would allow for more missions with both sides full. The cons would wind up with about half their missions unopposed, giving them that 100xp advantage though, of course.

I agree though, as crazy as it sounds, it's both too late and too early to make any changes.

It's a bit premature to say for certain that the imbalance won't be self-correcting by the xp gains that will be gotten off of the lvl 1s.

And, if there is a serious imbalance that has launched the Decepticons to lvl 1, it's too late to make a change and make it fair without resetting again.

Suggesting that we should slash the xp payout b/c the cons are in the lead may be intended as 'let's slow down their advance', but it can also come off as 'let's handicap everyone while the cons are still ahead'. I'm sure that's not how it's meant, but I'm equally sure that's how a lot of players will read it.

Four v. four would probably be a little better. The beast factions faired fairly well when there was 4v4 missions; we didn't stand a chance in the tourney with those 6v6 missions, though.

And I don't see how Tammuz' suggestion could be read as handicapping everyone else. Let's face it, the cons are winning. A lot. I've seen cons with 87% winning percentages. Cutting the win bonus to 50xp will help everyone else, cause that means the other factions can make up the XP difference on a loss with a few hits on a level 1, or some avoids.

It also means that the unopposed missions that Cons are padding their XP and win percentages with won't pay out as much, so it becomes in their best interest for more of the rest of the factions to start showing in missions.

cutting the win bonus hurts the winning faction most, creates homeostasis.

i'd be quite tempted to provide starting bonuses to the less populous factions so thath they do have an added incentive to join those factions.

Just thought I would add my 2 cents. I've played for a little over 2 years now and this is my first post.

The advantage the cons are seeing right now is crazy, while I think it's temporary, that temporary time frame may be long enough to make it a real issue. During this time until an evening out occurs I make 1 suggestion which I think will make just about everyone happy and shouldn't require too much programming to accomplish.

For all missions make the xp as so:
Your xp is multiplied by the number of foes, and divided by the number of people on you team (yourself included) decimal rounded up. This is done win or lose.
xp bonus for victory untouched by calculation.

That may sound like a lot, but only fractionally. If you are outnumbered 6-1, how many hits will you land? 1 or 2? atleast having that number multiplied by 6 still gives people a reason to join. In reverse, if you outnumber your foe 6-1 you have your xp divided by 6 before adding the victory bonus. In a 6 on one mission, what does that mean, 103 or 104 xp instead of 118 or 124. That'll slow the cons down only marginally, but speed up the process of helping everyone else get up to speed (including the Maximals and Predicons especially). Besides, if you manage to do say 60 pts of damage 6 on 1, you should be rewarded (your going to be sitting that character out for an hour anyway).

Most bot/con missions are 6 on 6 (atleast when i'm active during the workday) so that calculation would add up to multiplying everyone's xp by 1 which means no change. If you would have gotten 120 for a 5 on 6 mission you would get 144 (marginal increase but an increase). And vice versa 120 for a 6 on 5 would be 100.

It's not severe, but I think it would help speed things up for the 3 lagging factions and slow things down for the Cons.

My 2 cents.
Tenrak

tenrak wrote:Just thought I would add my 2 cents. I've played for a little over 2 years now and this is my first post.

The advantage the cons are seeing right now is crazy, while I think it's temporary, that temporary time frame may be long enough to make it a real issue. During this time until an evening out occurs I make 1 suggestion which I think will make just about everyone happy and shouldn't require too much programming to accomplish.

For all missions make the xp as so:
Your xp is multiplied by the number of foes, and divided by the number of people on you team (yourself included) decimal rounded up. This is done win or lose.
xp bonus for victory untouched by calculation.

That may sound like a lot, but only fractionally. If you are outnumbered 6-1, how many hits will you land? 1 or 2? atleast having that number multiplied by 6 still gives people a reason to join. In reverse, if you outnumber your foe 6-1 you have your xp divided by 6 before adding the victory bonus. In a 6 on one mission, what does that mean, 103 or 104 xp instead of 118 or 124. That'll slow the cons down only marginally, but speed up the process of helping everyone else get up to speed (including the Maximals and Predicons especially). Besides, if you manage to do say 60 pts of damage 6 on 1, you should be rewarded (your going to be sitting that character out for an hour anyway).

Most bot/con missions are 6 on 6 (atleast when i'm active during the workday) so that calculation would add up to multiplying everyone's xp by 1 which means no change. If you would have gotten 120 for a 5 on 6 mission you would get 144 (marginal increase but an increase). And vice versa 120 for a 6 on 5 would be 100.

It's not severe, but I think it would help speed things up for the 3 lagging factions and slow things down for the Cons.

My 2 cents.
Tenrak

Genius!

Hmm, interesting arguements indeed. The first question is there a problem. Some say yes and trying to figure out how to correct it. Some day no and let the "economy" work itself out. I would say if the answer is no problem, that doesn't mean we have to sit back and wait but instead figure out a preemptive measure to try to correct what there is now which hopefully will prevent anything real ugly. It all boils down to strategy including actively working together on MSN or YIM or something similar and activity in general for the sides.

As for the number problems for the BW factions, the easiest explanation may be that it been ten plus years since the series came out on tv and probably a couple since any comics came out. If people don't know who or what the factions are, they would be hesistant to join. If there was some way to make each faction more distinct among each other outside of the alt modes, that would add flavor to the game but still makes me wonder how much help that would give to the smaller sides.

tenrak wrote:Just thought I would add my 2 cents....My 2 cents.
Tenrak

So you do exist!

Evolution Prime wrote:

tenrak wrote:Just thought I would add my 2 cents....My 2 cents.
Tenrak

So you do exist!

Like Bigfoot and the Loc Ness Monster there are occasional sightings.

I've stayed quiet in this thread, being a relative newcomer I didn't think that my two cents might be as weighted as some of the veterans, however I would like to say my thoughts.

When I first started before the reset it was very very difficult to get any good points, took forever for me to level up as the cons were pretty outnumbered at the lower levels. But I didn't complain, as my thoguht was it was just a challange to get better. I kept working hard and it paid off as I finally started doing better once I got to level 2, and started winning. I heard many people have troubles in level 2, but I was finally doing good, before that I was constantly getting low scores and being trounced.

Now... I think it's very unfair for everyone to be so up in arms about this. The Autobots outnumber the Decepticons by about 200 people right now! You would think they would have the advantage by numbers, but instead its' the fact theres a few very enthusiastic players that play regularly against those who aren't so enthuisastic.

Yes, I understand that there are a lot of obsessed players who soared ahead fast (i being one of them), in order to make a mark. Just because they all chose to be Cons doesn't mean that you should change what started as a fair fight to favor the losing team because they feel slighted. No offense here, I truely don't mean to start any bad feelings, but I think it's a bit early to be complaining how unfair things are just because those who play all day all the time all chose one particular faction.

We all started equal. Everyone was at the same level, the same stats, the same level playing field. There is always going to be one team that's slightly ahead, be it cons or bots, just because you can't have equality the entire game. Things will even out as we go on, and the balance will steady out, is my feeling. If you want better scores, work harder to get them. Dont' change the rules just because you're losing, step forward and make a difference. It's not somthing that promotes fair play if you ask for the rules to be changed just because you're losing... that's poor sportsmanship.

Again, no offense, I've read through the comments here and respect everyone's views, but just have gotten more and more frustrated at everyone calling 'foul' here just because a few sprinted ahead of the pack.

From what I've seen in missions the Bots are now winning more frequently, about 50% of the missions I've been in, so I think that the bots are putting forth a much more agressive effort! This is great, keep it up, this is how you win. You work hard for it.

Let's just calm down, see what happens. The Bots aren't that far behind and are catching up fairly quickly I think. It's only been a week!

*goes to hide under a rock again*

I'm opposed to any changes at all until this is shown to actually be a long term problem and not just a case of the RNG being a bit lopsided for the moment. We're five days into the game being back online, it seems way too early to be panicking about this. Especially since it seems like the situation should be correcting itself: The 'Cons make it to L1 too fast, so they can only make xp from hitting L0s, thus slowing them down. The 'Bots get extra xp off the L1 'Cons and level up faster. Personally, even being on the, apparently, horribly disadvantaged 'Bot side, my team has been flying through L0 a lot faster than the first version of the game.

Caelus wrote:I was thinking that 3v3 missions would allow for more missions with both sides full.

Maybe it's different for the Beast vs 'Con missions, but all of the Bot/Con missions I ever see are well on their way to being full or are full by the time they start. TBH, I think we could actually stand some Bot/Con missions with more players per side; it would potentially allow better xp earnings and it seems like the Bots and Cons have enough people to support it.

One thing I always liked was a flexible faction modifier. The factions that have less players have a better modification. What the modification does can be anything from lower cr time to greater damage to better pay outs. The whole purpose of the modifications are to make the smaller factions looks more appealing since they get benefits. This should help those in the smaller factions and also encourage players to sign up for those factions. It also doesn't impede the larger factions. Those benefits go away when there are more members and the faction size gets closer to the medium of the other factions/the larger faction.

While it is a bit too early to come to any conclusions, there is not a single autobot in the top 50.

Both CF and tenrak have made great suggestions, id happily agree with either of them.

As on off-the-wall-faction-balancing solution, how about granting the beast factions a free point in avoid? Reason it in the same way as 'Megatron's upgrade' gives all 'cons robot mode flight in the 'toon, apply it to all the beasts and give them +1 avoid automatically for being smaller/more-advanced/whatever. It will help them develop faster and give them an advantage in gaining xp early, but only from L0 to ~3. After that 1 avoid rarely helps but still gives that 3% chance of ingoring a hit as an incentive to stay.

As a possible trade off give cons and bots 5% cheaper kit or something; lower tech = lower prices, but thats just a suggestion.

I don't think there can be free upgrades, but there could always be free exp for being well behaved (not that I think that would happen, we're never well behaved).

lol, Fair enough.

Im was thinking more in terms of an incentive that would make the BW factions stand out and be more attractive to new players, i.e. an RPG'esque racial advantage over the 'ancients', so the +1 would be coded directly into the beast characters and couldnt be reset and re-applied elsewhere. (edit: or count towards their level)
Is that not possible? Shame.