The Energon Pub

by **Tammuz** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 6:21 pm

right as much as i like kicking arse as much as i am, this is getting stupid

the cons have a very huge advantage now, we've always had a mission going attitude that helped us alot in the early After Reset thing, and now spiralled out of control, when we first started and everyone had the same stat it was pretty much a numbers game, if you could get more number your side won, and 100xp IS ALOT at level 0.

us winning forces the other faction to the arena(where winning doesn't net you as much as a bonus), and gives us a pretty mighty xp boost which means we get stats sooner and brings more cons to the missions, meaning we're even more likely to win, and the the cycle repeats, except each time it gets more extreme.

i dunno if this is quickly fixable, but I suggest toning down the xp payout for winning; 1*base is too much.

by **Edgecrusher** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 6:26 pm

that is one way to do it or switch cons to bot, pred and maxi

by **Sharpwing** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 6:30 pm

I acknowledge this as a (serious) problem, one that's only going to get worse.

Cons winning 75%+ of the time --> bigger xp gap --> Cons leveling faster --> Bots win even less & Cons have to fight lower levels = less xp

It's a negative spiral.

News Credits: 3 · by **Dread_Wing** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 6:38 pm

A wider range of missions may help the lower levels not be wailed on so much by the higher levels. Some 0 only missions, and some 1-? missions to take them out of the equation, give the other factions a chance to get organised build up xp then level up.

EDIT: This is obviously not going to help in the short term, but may do in the long term.

by **ashe5k** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 6:43 pm

None of my bots are ever out-numbered in the missions anymore. Now it's just the RNG hating on my bots in a BIG way. I'm still getting an aver of 150 exp per mission per bot on my team, but my losses are piling up, and it's level 0 bots versus level 0 of everyone else.

I think I've had a handful of missions against level 1s and it was only 1 level 1 and they didn't do a whole lot.

Hopefully my luck changes as my builds get better, but Yeesh!

by **Sharpwing** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 6:48 pm

ashe5k wrote:None of my bots are ever out-numbered in the missions anymore. Now it's just the RNG hating on my bots in a BIG way. I'm still getting an aver of 150 exp per mission per bot on my team, but my losses are piling up, and it's level 0 bots versus level 0 of everyone else.

I think I've had a handful of missions against level 1s and it was only 1 level 1 and they didn't do a whole lot.

Hopefully my luck changes as my builds get better, but Yeesh!

It's not the RNG... it's the system (as Tammuz said)

Look at these 3 missions (actually my 3 latest missions):
http://www.seibertron.com/heavymetalwar ... _id=186396
http://www.seibertron.com/heavymetalwar ... _id=186403
http://www.seibertron.com/heavymetalwar ... _id=186395

All 3 have the Cons take the top 6 spots. Can you imagine the xp difference between the winners (the Cons) and the losers (the Bots).

This will lead to a huge xp-gap (already does, look the the HS page) that has several negative aspects to all sides.

by **sumowrestler** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 6:59 pm

This might be another long term fix but cap the number per faction. I don't know how many new people join HMW but if one faction is already capped, they would need to fill another slot. However, this would be penatalizing the new players if the faction they wanted is already full.

by **ashe5k** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:02 pm

Sharpwing wrote:
ashe5k wrote:None of my bots are ever out-numbered in the missions anymore. Now it's just the RNG hating on my bots in a BIG way. I'm still getting an aver of 150 exp per mission per bot on my team, but my losses are piling up, and it's level 0 bots versus level 0 of everyone else.

I think I've had a handful of missions against level 1s and it was only 1 level 1 and they didn't do a whole lot.

Hopefully my luck changes as my builds get better, but Yeesh!

It's not the RNG... it's the system (as Tammuz said)

Look at these 3 missions (actually my 3 latest missions):
http://www.seibertron.com/heavymetalwar ... _id=186396
http://www.seibertron.com/heavymetalwar ... _id=186403
http://www.seibertron.com/heavymetalwar ... _id=186395

All 3 have the Cons take the top 6 spots. Can you imagine the xp difference between the winners (the Cons) and the losers (the Bots).

This will lead to a huge xp-gap (already does, look the the HS page) that has several negative aspects to all sides.

I guess I'm not understanding. The way Tammuz was talking is that the bots and others are fleeing to the arena, which isn't the case if there are full missions.

Most of my bots have their stats up and are working on getting the last one to hit level 1 at this point and I'm STILL getting trounced by other level 0's and that's not set-up, that's really BAD luck.

I don't have to imagine the exp difference. I'm living it.

News Credits: 42 · by **Psychout** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:09 pm

As cons gain more 1's, the opponenents 0's will make bigger hauls fighting them. Lowering the xp reward will stop that from happening and make the situation worse, as thats how I see the game balancing itself.

Im loathe to suggest this, but an answer might be to handicap the leading faction some how (temporarily)

News Credits: 1 · by **Hoistimus** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:12 pm

Is it just me.. I thought the bots were improving, or at least the missions I get in to, as they are almost always full missions on both sides. My win ratio is getting closer to 50/50 as it started off very bad due to entering a lot of suicide missions when I started. I guess I was used to suicide missions paying off for me at the high levels, but they sure don't at level 0. Anyway, I think at least for the bots things are improving. The game has been active for less than a week, so how can we dictate the long term trends at this point already?

Although, some information for those that get the screen to pick their allegiance wouldn't hurt at all. Like, current membership per side and pros/cons for picking a certain faction.

by **Loki God Of Mischief** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:13 pm

I'm glad that I'm not the only one that thinks a player per faction cap is a good idea. I don't think it should be permenant by any means. But I do think that until the sides are at least even that there should be a cap. Perhaps since some will see this as unfair a bonus could be provided by the Gaming Staff to new players as compensation for not being able to go to one of the more densely populated factions. Also a friend of mine was telling me about how that like once or twice a year there's a tournament where the factions are opened up for "free agents". So players that join the less populated factions have a chance at the other factions.

Website · by **Silver Wind** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:20 pm

I agree that there is a faction imbalance. For example, I can view a mission one moment, and the next find that where there were only a couple Decepticons (or Autobots), the slots are now all filled up. If there's less than 6-8 minutes left for a mission to fill up and only 2 Maximals versus a filled up slot... sorry, but I pass those up for the arena, where at least my TF has a chance of not spending an hour in the CR. And that happens quite often for me.

I may have to agree with sumowrestler on capping faction numbers. Distasteful as it is (with penalizing newcomers), I think it would be worse if we wait down the road, when the imbalance is more pronounced & difficult to overcome.

Whatever the solution is, it'll still be likely to involve asking players to switch factions (as has been done in the past).

Like Evolution Prime on Facebook · by **Evolution Prime** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:30 pm

I too have been seeing mission results like that, Sharpy. It gets frustrating as a player to see one faction dominate like that. It discourages the losers to go take refuge in the arena where they may have a better chance at fairing. I'm sticking with it in hopes things turn around.

by **Nightwarp** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:39 pm

you know i agree with everything, before the reset my team were constantly on a losing streak but now they win most of the missions and it kind of boring both ways.

the cons have and unfair advantage due to them getting more xp and energon, where as the bots have an unfair advantage due to them having more members.
btw i always try to avoid the maximals and preds whenever i can.

News Credits: 2 · by **-Soundwave-** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:43 pm

I understand that it is frustrating. But the more 1's there are for the cons the more XP the bots will earn for just hitting us. At the same time I get less for killing them. I don't think anyone should be forced to join a side they don't want.

To me it just seems like hey are going through what I had to go through when I first started back in 05 as a con with too many bots.

News Credits: 1 · by **Hoistimus** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:44 pm

Another idea I just had..

Make missions of two factions vs one so those factions that do not have as many players can be assured a full mission. For instance, Autobot and Maximal vs Decepticons. Or Max/Pred vs Con.

If it's a mission where the cons are full and there's 2 or 3 bots, I jump in those and within the next few minutes they're full on both sides, as the next person to check realizes there's one less position to fill to make it a full mission. I bet you it will work if you try it for a few days, as others gain the confidence that missions will fill up.

Maybe reducing the amount of xps in the arena will get more into missions as well...

by **Conjurous** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:48 pm

Easy to see when u check the win % of the top teams and bots from each side, top con team probably has 80% win ratio where as top autobot team probably only has 55% win ratio. Us autobots have to play twice as much and still stand no chance of catching up. At one point yesterday i went on a streak of 15 mission losses in a row and they were all 6 v 6, i still lose 60-70% to them, one good thing is at least i score decently most of the time even on a loss and thats more than i would get in arena with a win, only downer is waiting an hour b4 that bot can go again.

Had it the other day where i had all 12 of my bots in CR and still 20 mins b4 any of them came out to fight again.

Like Evolution Prime on Facebook · by **Evolution Prime** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 8:08 pm

And such is life at Level 0. Some days the RNG smiles upon you. Other days, not so much. It seems to be shining on the 'Cons right now, even though missions usually have been filled up on both sides. I now offer my sacrifice up to the RNG for his approval.

The RNG approves! He has offered me two holy hand grenades!

by **Snoball** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 8:13 pm

The chances for a level zero with one or two upgrades hitting a level 1 with 8 or 9 is very slim and more times than not there is very little xp gain for the level 0.

by **sumowrestler** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 8:58 pm

I'm one of those that has mechs in CR chamber for the hour time and I try not to do suicide missions but when you are a Maximal, it is hard not to find one even with friends. My winning percentage is maybe 5% if that good in missions and have yet to hit arena. As for my capping of teams, it was a temporary idea but I really do like adding the current number per side to those who sign up.

News Credits: 6 · by **Dr. Caelus** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:32 pm

What about cutting some of the missions down to 3v3?

by **Ransom** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:02 pm

Evolution Prime wrote:And such is life at Level 0. Some days the RNG smiles upon you. Other days, not so much. It seems to be shining on the 'Cons right now, even though missions usually have been filled up on both sides. I now offer my sacrifice up to the RNG for his approval.

<image>

The RNG approves! He has offered me two holy hand grenades!

<image>

It's Nemesis Prime in disguise!
sorry EP, couldn't resist

sumowrestler wrote:As for my capping of teams, it was a temporary idea

Don't know if you're talking to me, the general public or both, but I'll point out anyway that I was wanting it to be temporary.

Website · by **Silver Wind** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:04 pm

^
|
|

Not again...

I think I'll quit for tonight. -_-

News Credits: 1 · by **Redimus** » Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:28 am

You know, there is a simple way to solve this problem, all you other none con factions: WORK TOGETHER.

Innitially, we Preds were getting bashed about. A lot.

So a group of us (generally between 3 to 6 commanders) got together on MSN, and co-ordinated ourselves. Obviously we dont win everything, but our win rates improve impresivly where there are a few of us talking to eachother on MSN.

Unfortunetly, there's a lot of Bot and Max players how have no interest in comunicating with their bretherine.

by **Tammuz** » Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:39 am

Back in 05, the bots didnt have quality as well as quantity, you could find bots with rank and skill. You could also find them with dud weapons. That is not true of the cons now. Were better there are more of us. So even if the bot flood appears it just is not good enough.
The arena comment was mainly for the maximals