The Energon Pub

Shadowman wrote:Nemesis Cyberplex, you really think he'll listen to that?

It's reason, he can't understand it.

Well, if nothing else, it'll show everybody else how a second boombox mini TF sneaking around wouldn't possibly be as entertaining as a giant robot smash & grab.

...except to Tramp......

Tramp wrote:He cannot be limited to any one type of location.

Well, thank God a stereo system wouldn't limit him to only one loca...tio...wait a minute!

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:
No, any military vehicle that hung around in a civilian area for any significant length of time would b out of place. Especially if there was no military base even remotely near by. A surveylance vehicle would be even more suspicious.

See, this is the problem right here. You're creating a scenario where there has to be an hours-long stakeout for the infiltration to take place in. That doesn not necessarily have to be the case. Even then, he could simply drop a minion off,not do the infiltration himself, drive off to where he wouldn't be in a conspicuous place, & then return at a pre-designated time for the pickup.

However, I've also noticed that amongst these alleged scenarios, you have set in your head the ideal scenario for a mass-shifting boombox transformer, & because of that, no other alt mode could possibly accomplish the same goal because it is set up specifically for a mass-shifting boombox to perform. So of course no other type of TF could serve that function as well as a mass-shifting TF boombox, because you've figured it out how it can be nothing else.

But this is Michael Bay's baby now, & it is pretty well known that A: he'd rather blow sh*t up than sneak around. & B: there is not going to be a "perfect scenario" because he does not think too terribly deeply on how it'd work. he'd go for what idea would sound cooler.

So let's see: long, drawn-out stakeout, watching download screens, grass growing in the background, maybe a single person getting kidnapped without alerting anybody, quirky mass-shifting boombox TF.....or powerful-looking military vehicle drives up....does a quick surveilence sweep before smashing its way into said building, taking what it wants, ejecting minions for further chaos, possibly to keep people from alerting others, & then transforms back & somehow, unknownst to the audience, quietly disappears.

Personally between watching Tom Cruise worried about sweat dropping & alerting authorities & giant robot smash & grab, I'd rather watch giant robot smash & grab. Infiltration be damned. Give me giant f*cking robots blowing sh*t up.

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Nemesis, all fo your scenerios could be handled by Barricade or any other Decepticon. That is not Soundwave's function. Soundwave serves a very specific function in TF lore. He is a very specific character, and very iconic. The scenerios I have given highlight the practicallity of the a stereo alternate mode as well as mass conversion. Frenzy demonstrateds the effectiveness of having a stereo alternate mode in the first movie, he just lacked the mass conversion. a vehicle can only do surveylance of the bulding extereior. He can't see inside. Only someone inside can. If you want "smash and grab" use Bonecrusher or Brawl. That is not Soundwave. In most cases, Soundwave works on site doing his own surveylance as well as coordinating the work of his minions. He is very hands-on. He cannot do that with a vehicle mode. He cannot go indoors with a vehicle mode. He cannot go to certain locations in a particular vehicle mode. A civilian vehicle would be off-limits to certain parts of a military compound, and a military vehicle would be extremely suspicious in a city. Neither can go inside. Soundwave has to be able to fit in anywhere and link up with his minions, and only an alternate mode like a stereo or other ubiquitous peice of electronics will suffice for that purpose. And the most fitting and closest to his original form is a portable stereo.

Sentinel Pax wrote:

Tramp wrote:He cannot be limited to any one type of location.

Well, thank God a stereo system wouldn't limit him to only one loca...tio...wait a minute!

A stereo alte mode does not limit him to one type of location. A stereo can fit in anywhere. It fit in at a miitary base. It fits in at a factory. It fits in at an office. It fit in at a lab. It fits in in someone's home. It fits in at the park. There is nowhere that a stereo cannot fit in.

You have to love with all the advanced technology of the world on top of being an advanced alien robot you want him to turn into a simple boombox and you keep saying that he need to be a boombox to interpret information which is stupid because his abilities shouldn't be limited by his disguise. Also you cant accept that having his minions do all the grunt work while he sits back would be a cooler function for soundwave. Since he in a way controls them he can sneak them into a building and see what they see and in essence spy on multiple areas at the same time.

Tramp wrote:

Sentinel Pax wrote:

Tramp wrote:He cannot be limited to any one type of location.

Well, thank God a stereo system wouldn't limit him to only one loca...tio...wait a minute!

A stereo alte mode does not limit him to one type of location. A stereo can fit in anywhere. It fit in at a miitary base. It fits in at a factory. It fits in at an office. It fit in at a lab. It fits in in someone's home. It fits in at the park. There is nowhere that a stereo cannot fit in.

I'm sure someone would ask which one of their coworkers picked up the new stereo system...and a stereo in the park seems a bit silly. Look, just because Soundwave can't go inside a building doesn't mean he can't moniter a building or record something going on inside of it. There are surveillance vehicles that can hook up to satellites, which can view almost anything and anywhere. You seem to forget that Soundwave doesn't need human recording technology to record information. He's a high tech alien robot, for God's sake.

Sentinel Pax wrote:

Tramp wrote:

Sentinel Pax wrote:
I'm sure someone would ask which one of their coworkers picked up the new stereo system...and a stereo in the park seems a bit silly. Look, just because Soundwave can't go inside a building doesn't mean he can't moniter a building or record something going on inside of it. There are surveillance vehicles that can hook up to satellites, which can view almost anything and anywhere. You seem to forget that Soundwave doesn't need human recording technology to record information. He's a high tech alien robot, for God's sake.

Yes, it does mean he can't fully monitor what's going on inside, and Satalites are only good for mapping. They can't see inside either. The best he would get is auditory recording, and many places are soundproof, so he might not even get that. As for the workers, most likely, no they won't if they bother to notice at all. Did the stweardess on Air Force One question where the stereo that was Frenzy came from? Did she question who owned it? No. What makes you think someone working in a busy office would? That is what makes it and other small electronic devices such a perfect disguise for espionage.

Tramp wrote:Yes, it does mean he can't fully monitor what's going on inside, and Satalites are only good for mapping. They can't see inside either. The best he would get is auditory recording, and many places are soundproof, so he might not even get that.

Well, it sure sounds like he could use some help, then. I mean, someone would notice a 30-foot robot in their office building. If only he had some smaller robots to help him out. Hmmmm.

most likely not all the info is gonna come from talking so someone would have to do some interfacing with a comp, it might be a bit hard to for a 30ft robot to stand in a building and interface with a very small comp

Sentinel Pax wrote:

Tramp wrote:Yes, it does mean he can't fully monitor what's going on inside, and Satalites are only good for mapping. They can't see inside either. The best he would get is auditory recording, and many places are soundproof, so he might not even get that.

Well, it sure sounds like he could use some help, then. I mean, someone would notice a 30-foot robot in their office building. If only he had some smaller robots to help him out. Hmmmm.

With mass conversion, he can take on a smaller size and get in unnoticed and take his alternate mode to do his surveylance along with his minions. By working together in such a way, they gather more informatin faster. There is no reason for Soundwave to be a vehicle. Anythign he could do as a vehicle could be done by Barricade or any of the other Decepticons.

Great Atlas wrote:most likely not all the info is gonna come from talking so someone would have to do some interfacing with a comp, it might be a bit hard to for a 30ft robot to stand in a building and interface with a very small comp

But it would not be a problem for a robot who can mass convert and get inside and who has an alternate mode which is also an electronic device with interface jacks, like a stereo.

Mass shifting is cheating. It means you can't design a Transformer well enough to make them fold and change properly.

And it would never look right. People would think: "Did that robot just turn from thirty foot robot turn into a ten-inch-tall boom box? Christ, this is worse then BloodRayne."

if soundwave were to shrink to a small size and do a minion's job, that'd make his minions obsolete

Great Atlas wrote:if soundwave were to shrink to a small size and do a minion's job, that'd make his minions obsolete

No, it wouldn't. They werren't obsolete in G1 were they? And he had mass conversion then too. No, what being able to take on a small size does is allow him to do his job along with his minions and work more closely with them, and coordinate their efforts more efficiently as well as interface with them better so the mission is accomplished with greater chance of success.

Tramp wrote:Page after page of Soundwave can only be a stereo, because I am Tramp, and my opinion is more informed and better than yours. Oh, and Stereos are the only way to spy.

Tramp seriously i think u've said the exact same thing for at least 50 post, i think it prob would have been better if u copied and paste the same post, because all that has changed is a few words but the content is exactly the same

Great Atlas wrote:Tramp seriously i think u've said the exact same thing for at least 50 post, i think it prob would have been better if u copied and paste the same post, because all that has changed is a few words but the content is exactly the same

And, you keep saying the same thing too, which makes us at an impass. None of what you guys have suggested cannot be accomplished by Barricade or Blackout, and Barricade is still definately alive. Evarything I have said can only be done by Soundwave as a stereo with mass conversion, in conjunction with his minions. Frenzy used to do that role, but he is dead. He also lacked the mass conversion, which meant he was defenseless against large opponents. Having Mass conversion and a stereo mode gives Soundwave the full capabilities Frenzy had as wel as the combat ability and status that a larger Decepticon has. Thise are practical advantages. There is no reason why he should not have that capability. There is no reason why he should be a vehicle when we already have Barricade for mobile support. There is every reason for him to be a stereo.

After reading through these last few pages I have to agree with the others all you're doing is being a broken record. Now, how's this idea work for ya, with all the technology we have today anyone and I mean ANYONE can access the internet from just about anywhere in the world, so what's to keep a super advanced robot from having the proper tech to connect wirelessly? Seriously all Soundwave would need is a wireless or satellite uplink to get any info he wants. Frenzy proved that they have VERY excellent hacking skills meaning just about no information, regardless of how tight the security is, is out of their grasp. Now info on a separate server is obviously gonna require other methods of retrieval. This is where his minions come into play as they're smaller and more likely to get past any security in their way.

Frostliger wrote:After reading through these last few pages I have to agree with the others all you're doing is being a broken record. Now, how's this idea work for ya, with all the technology we have today anyone and I mean ANYONE can access the internet from just about anywhere in the world, so what's to keep a super advanced robot from having the proper tech to connect wirelessly? Seriously all Soundwave would need is a wireless or satellite uplink to get any info he wants. Frenzy proved that they have VERY excellent hacking skills meaning just about no information, regardless of how tight the security is, is out of their grasp. Now info on a separate server is obviously gonna require other methods of retrieval. This is where his minions come into play as they're smaller and more likely to get past any security in their way.

You still need to get inside to gather visual data or to extract a target. Hacking is only good for gathing computer data. It does not grant you visual or auditory data. It does not grant you access to tangable objects, or people. Frenzy also proved how effective an alternate mode a stereo system is. He is dead now though, which means he needs to be replaced. Soundwave is the perfect replacement. Frenzy was going to be Soundwave initially anyway. He was probably killed off to make room for Soundwave in the sequel. Think about that.

Tramp wrote:

Frostliger wrote:After reading through these last few pages I have to agree with the others all you're doing is being a broken record. Now, how's this idea work for ya, with all the technology we have today anyone and I mean ANYONE can access the internet from just about anywhere in the world, so what's to keep a super advanced robot from having the proper tech to connect wirelessly? Seriously all Soundwave would need is a wireless or satellite uplink to get any info he wants. Frenzy proved that they have VERY excellent hacking skills meaning just about no information, regardless of how tight the security is, is out of their grasp. Now info on a separate server is obviously gonna require other methods of retrieval. This is where his minions come into play as they're smaller and more likely to get past any security in their way.

You still need to get inside to gather visual data or to extract a target. Hacking is only good for gathing computer data. It does not grant you visual or auditory data. It does not grant you access to tangable objects, or people. Frenzy also proved how effective an alternate mode a stereo system is. He is dead now though, which means he needs to be replaced. Soundwave is the perfect replacement. Frenzy was going to be Soundwave initially anyway. He was probably killed off to make room for Soundwave in the sequel. Think about that.

Didn't he use Laserbeak for that most of the time?

Shadowman wrote:

Tramp wrote:

Frostliger wrote:After reading through these last few pages I have to agree with the others all you're doing is being a broken record. Now, how's this idea work for ya, with all the technology we have today anyone and I mean ANYONE can access the internet from just about anywhere in the world, so what's to keep a super advanced robot from having the proper tech to connect wirelessly? Seriously all Soundwave would need is a wireless or satellite uplink to get any info he wants. Frenzy proved that they have VERY excellent hacking skills meaning just about no information, regardless of how tight the security is, is out of their grasp. Now info on a separate server is obviously gonna require other methods of retrieval. This is where his minions come into play as they're smaller and more likely to get past any security in their way.

You still need to get inside to gather visual data or to extract a target. Hacking is only good for gathing computer data. It does not grant you visual or auditory data. It does not grant you access to tangable objects, or people. Frenzy also proved how effective an alternate mode a stereo system is. He is dead now though, which means he needs to be replaced. Soundwave is the perfect replacement. Frenzy was going to be Soundwave initially anyway. He was probably killed off to make room for Soundwave in the sequel. Think about that.

Didn't he use Laserbeak for that most of the time?

No. He used Laserbeak, Ravage, as well as himself for that. He would get inside a target building, then release Laserbeak or Ravage. While they did their jobs, he would do his, which included surveylance of the poeple inside as well as his own data gathering. He did not leave it all up to his minions.

You still need to get inside to gather visual data or to extract a target. Hacking is only good for gathing computer data. It does not grant you visual or auditory data. It does not grant you access to tangable objects, or people. Frenzy also proved how effective an alternate mode a stereo system is. He is dead now though, which means he needs to be replaced. Soundwave is the perfect replacement. Frenzy was going to be Soundwave initially anyway. He was probably killed off to make room for Soundwave in the sequel. Think about that.

Actually you CAN get audio and visual data online, take iTunes for example there you can download music and movies which as far as I know is audio and visual data. So that blows a hole in your response I'm sorry to say. Now about gathering a target (if your referring to a human) Soundwave could just hack into the surveillance system and monitor the targets movement and retrieve him/her as they leave the building or follow them till it's safe to transform and snatch them.

Frostliger wrote:

You still need to get inside to gather visual data or to extract a target. Hacking is only good for gathing computer data. It does not grant you visual or auditory data. It does not grant you access to tangable objects, or people. Frenzy also proved how effective an alternate mode a stereo system is. He is dead now though, which means he needs to be replaced. Soundwave is the perfect replacement. Frenzy was going to be Soundwave initially anyway. He was probably killed off to make room for Soundwave in the sequel. Think about that.

Actually you CAN get audio and visual data online, take iTunes for example there you can download music and movies which as far as I know is audio and visual data. So that blows a hole in your response I'm sorry to say. Now about gathering a target (if your referring to a human) Soundwave could just hack into the surveillance system and monitor the targets movement and retrieve him/her as they leave the building or follow them till it's safe to transform and snatch them.

Internal surveylance ssytems are closed systems, They aren't hooked up to the internet. Thus, Soundwave would still have to get inside to hack into and monitor the security systems. He can't do it from the parking lot, and a strange vehicle, particularly the ones everyone has been describing, sitting in such a place woudl draw attention, probably of the cops. No, Soundwave would have to get inside. Jack into the security systems and conduct his surveylance and monitor the humans while his minions did their work.

Internal surveylance ssytems are closed systems, They aren't hooked up to the internet. Thus, Soundwave would still have to get inside to hack into and monitor the security systems. He can't do it from the parking lot, and a strange vehicle, particularly the ones everyone has been describing, sitting in such a place woudl draw attention, probably of the cops. No, Soundwave would have to get inside. Jack into the security systems and conduct his surveylance and monitor the humans while his minions did their work.

Ok... so what's to stop Soundwave from having lets say Rumble connect a wireless transmitter to the buildings security system? It's like wiretapping or planting a bug to listen to who your spying on. The FBI and CIA do this already so how is that so hard to understand? Also with todays technology you don't have to be within 50 feet of the building your trying to hack into, you can be as far away as you want to be. The only reason he would stay close is to pick up his minions when they've done their job then he can monitor the goings on from the safety of the Decepticon base.

Frostliger wrote:

Internal surveylance ssytems are closed systems, They aren't hooked up to the internet. Thus, Soundwave would still have to get inside to hack into and monitor the security systems. He can't do it from the parking lot, and a strange vehicle, particularly the ones everyone has been describing, sitting in such a place woudl draw attention, probably of the cops. No, Soundwave would have to get inside. Jack into the security systems and conduct his surveylance and monitor the humans while his minions did their work.

Ok... so what's to stop Soundwave from having lets say Rumble connect a wireless transmitter to the buildings security system? It's like wiretapping or planting a bug to listen to who your spying on. The FBI and CIA do this already so how is that so hard to understand? Also with todays technology you don't have to be within 50 feet of the building your trying to hack into, you can be as far away as you want to be. The only reason he would stay close is to pick up his minions when they've done their job then he can monitor the goings on from the safety of the Decepticon base.

Barricade could just as easily pick up the infiltrators to. You don't need Soundwave for that. Soundwave is an infiltrator and intelligence officer. Secondly, wiretapping is great if you wish to tap into the phone lines, not the security cameras. That still has to be done directly. On top of that trying to monitor via a remote transmitter from the parking lot still leavse you vulnerable to drawing attention, and could still be done by Barricade. You still do not need Soundwave as a vehicle out in the parking lot when Barricade could do a much better job of that without drawing the attention. No, Soundwave is better served inside with his minions.