The Energon Pub

Sentinel Pax wrote:

Tramp wrote:

Nemesis Cyberplex wrote:Also jumping in (plan to read the rest of the thread later), but Imho, that military vehicle on page 1 looks like a good fit. I've been thinking all along if he can't be a boombox, make him some sort of military vehicle that specializes in monitoring stuff...radar, sonar......you know, soundwaves.

As far as his minions are conderned, I think Blackout & Scorponok showed that this could be done by simply detatching components from inside of Soundwave.

But that's just me.

The problem with a military vehicle, particularly on a surveylance mission is that it would draw attention. IF it were just driving through town that is one thing. but to be parked for long periods of time in a civilian area? that is sure to draw lots of unwanted attention.

Well, he could use a holographic projector to make himself look like a normal car, right? They did it with drivers, why not just make a new alt mode out of a hologram?

Because that defeats the purpose of the alt mode to begin with. The main purpose of an alternate mode is disguise. Each chooses a disguise to best serve their individual role and personality. They wouldn't choose a disguise that they would also need to disguise. It doesn't make sense. Starscream, Brawl, Blackout and Bonecrusher took military modes since they hid among the military and restricted themselves to military fields of operations. Barricade and chose a cop car so that he could blend in with the city and have free movement throughout it. Frenzy, a spy, chose a stereo to be able to blend in anywhere. That is that same reasoning that Soundwave would use for his alternate mode. Soundwave works as a spy, intelligence director, communicatins officer, and Megatron's advisor. As a spy and intelligence officer, he would choose the most inconspicuous and ubiquitous alternate mode which also enhances his other functions. This mode would be a larger portable stereo.

Tramp wrote:Because that defeats the purpose of the alt mode to begin with. The main purpose of an alternate mode is disguise. Each chooses a disguise to best serve their individual role and personality. They wouldn't choose a disguise that they would also need to disguise. It doesn't make sense. Starscream, Brawl, Blackout and Bonecrusher took military modes since they hid among the military and restricted themselves to military fields of operations. Barricade and chose a cop car so that he could blend in with the city and have free movement throughout it. Frenzy, a spy, chose a stereo to be able to blend in anywhere. That is that same reasoning that Soundwave would use for his alternate mode. Soundwave works as a spy, intelligence director, communicatins officer, and Megatron's advisor. As a spy and intelligence officer, he would choose the most inconspicuous and ubiquitous alternate mode which also enhances his other functions. This mode would be a larger portable stereo.

Alright, so maybe a disguised vehicular disguise is a bit redundant, but I still think it would look less obvious than a big portable stereo. I mean, seriously, someone would notice a big-ass boombox just laying around waiting to turn into a robot killing machine. To me, it would seem that long-distance reconnaissance is best suited for Soundwave, and the more in-depth things should be his minions' department.

Sentinel Pax wrote:

Tramp wrote:Because that defeats the purpose of the alt mode to begin with. The main purpose of an alternate mode is disguise. Each chooses a disguise to best serve their individual role and personality. They wouldn't choose a disguise that they would also need to disguise. It doesn't make sense. Starscream, Brawl, Blackout and Bonecrusher took military modes since they hid among the military and restricted themselves to military fields of operations. Barricade and chose a cop car so that he could blend in with the city and have free movement throughout it. Frenzy, a spy, chose a stereo to be able to blend in anywhere. That is that same reasoning that Soundwave would use for his alternate mode. Soundwave works as a spy, intelligence director, communicatins officer, and Megatron's advisor. As a spy and intelligence officer, he would choose the most inconspicuous and ubiquitous alternate mode which also enhances his other functions. This mode would be a larger portable stereo.

Alright, so maybe a disguised vehicular disguise is a bit redundant, but I still think it would look less obvious than a big portable stereo. I mean, seriously, someone would notice a big-ass boombox just laying around waiting to turn into a robot killing machine. To me, it would seem that long-distance reconnaissance is best suited for Soundwave, and the more in-depth things should be his minions' department.

Thaty would depend on how big you're talking about. I'm talking about a portable stereo about 19" wide by 10" high by 7" deep, not some gigantic oversized radio station prop.

Well, I would still think someone would notice something like that if they were in an important secure place. I mean, to me, the fact that nobody found Frenzy's alt mode out of place was one of the biggest snags of the new movie. I'm a fan of Soundwave's alt mode for all things G1, but for the movie, I'll have to support something along TimShinn's design. But who says we can't agree to disagree, right?

Sentinel Pax wrote:Well, I would still think someone would notice something like that if they were in an important secure place. I mean, to me, the fact that nobody found Frenzy's alt mode out of place was one of the biggest snags of the new movie. I'm a fan of Soundwave's alt mode for all things G1, but for the movie, I'll have to support something along TimShinn's design. But who says we can't agree to disagree, right?

That's just it, it wouldn't be out of place. Secure facility or not, people like music and often bring stereos to work or have a company one there. Most people woud assume it belongs there even if they themselves didn't bring it. They would figure that someone else brought it or the boss did. It is highly unlikely someone would question it. Thwe reason why Frnzy worked so well in that scene is because a stereo is so ubiquitous. They're found literally everywhere.

Actually yeah, Soundwave would be pretty damn awesome as a Marshall Stack, celestion cabinets and all... But that's just me...

Here are some existing ideas for a possible Soundwave:
http://www.tfmaster.com/gallery_kb0139.php
http://www.tfmaster.com/gallery_kb0106.php
http://www.tfmaster.com/gallery_kb0078.php

Those are Alternators.

Why does everyone insist on having Soundwave be a boombox. It's 2007 people, let go of G1 already. I grew up with G1 but I'm stuck on it to inmediately dismiss any design different to G1. I loved Cybertron Soundwave and he wasn't a radio or anything that resembled one. So please, let go of the past and enjoy Transformers for what they are, the coolest concept of the 80's that has lasted more than 20 years and it's still going strong.

esclavo wrote:Why does everyone insist on having Soundwave be a boombox. It's 2007 people, let go of G1 already. I grew up with G1 but I'm stuck on it to inmediately dismiss any design different to G1. I loved Cybertron Soundwave and he wasn't a radio or anything that resembled one. So please, let go of the past and enjoy Transformers for what they are, the coolest concept of the 80's that has lasted more than 20 years and it's still going strong.

He also wasn't Soundwave. he was a completely different character. He was "Soundwave" in name only. He didn't have the same personality, the same function, or anything. He was not Soundwave.

G1 Soundwave got his name from his alternate mode. That is one of the reasons why he needs to keep a similar mode. Not only does it best suit his finction from an in universe perspective, but, from a character perspective, a stereo system alternate mode is the best mode for a character named "Soundwave"

Tramp wrote:

esclavo wrote:Why does everyone insist on having Soundwave be a boombox. It's 2007 people, let go of G1 already. I grew up with G1 but I'm stuck on it to inmediately dismiss any design different to G1. I loved Cybertron Soundwave and he wasn't a radio or anything that resembled one. So please, let go of the past and enjoy Transformers for what they are, the coolest concept of the 80's that has lasted more than 20 years and it's still going strong.

He also wasn't Soundwave. he was a completely different character. He was "Soundwave" in name only. He didn't have the same personality, the same function, or anything. He was not Soundwave.

G1 Soundwave got his name from his alternate mode. That is one of the reasons why he needs to keep a similar mode. Not only does it best suit his finction from an in universe perspective, but, from a character perspective, a stereo system alternate mode is the best mode for a character named "Soundwave"

And I completely agree, however, there nothing wrong with making him an information officer or any other spy functionality with his minions. I'm getting the point across that we shouldn't stick to one alternative because for one mass convertion seems stupid in this day and age and we already had Frenzy on the first movie which was a boombox. Maybe a surveilance vehicle could suit him better than a military vehicle, but not a boombox.

esclavo wrote:

Tramp wrote:

esclavo wrote:Why does everyone insist on having Soundwave be a boombox. It's 2007 people, let go of G1 already. I grew up with G1 but I'm stuck on it to inmediately dismiss any design different to G1. I loved Cybertron Soundwave and he wasn't a radio or anything that resembled one. So please, let go of the past and enjoy Transformers for what they are, the coolest concept of the 80's that has lasted more than 20 years and it's still going strong.

He also wasn't Soundwave. he was a completely different character. He was "Soundwave" in name only. He didn't have the same personality, the same function, or anything. He was not Soundwave.

G1 Soundwave got his name from his alternate mode. That is one of the reasons why he needs to keep a similar mode. Not only does it best suit his finction from an in universe perspective, but, from a character perspective, a stereo system alternate mode is the best mode for a character named "Soundwave"

And I completely agree, however, there nothing wrong with making him an information officer or any other spy functionality with his minions. I'm getting the point across that we shouldn't stick to one alternative because for one mass convertion seems stupid in this day and age and we already had Frenzy on the first movie which was a boombox. Maybe a surveilance vehicle could suit him better than a military vehicle, but not a boombox.

Mass conversion is not stupid. extreme size changes have been a staple of science fiction and fantasy stories and movies for decades. IF it were so stupid, it would never have been used in the first place. There is no such thing a "stupid" idea, just poor execution of that idea. Secondly, Frenzy was originally going to be Soundwave, but he didn't fit the name because he lacked the mass conversion, and his personality was way different. Thus, he became frenzy and Soundwave was moved to one of the Sequels where they could do him right. On top of that, Frenzy is dead, his head and brain casing destroyed by his own weapon. He is not coming back. Therefore, Soundwave is likely to replace him, which is all the more reason to have Soundwave be a stereo. He is going to serve much the same function and then some.

Tramp wrote:

esclavo wrote:

Tramp wrote:

esclavo wrote:Why does everyone insist on having Soundwave be a boombox. It's 2007 people, let go of G1 already. I grew up with G1 but I'm stuck on it to inmediately dismiss any design different to G1. I loved Cybertron Soundwave and he wasn't a radio or anything that resembled one. So please, let go of the past and enjoy Transformers for what they are, the coolest concept of the 80's that has lasted more than 20 years and it's still going strong.

He also wasn't Soundwave. he was a completely different character. He was "Soundwave" in name only. He didn't have the same personality, the same function, or anything. He was not Soundwave.

G1 Soundwave got his name from his alternate mode. That is one of the reasons why he needs to keep a similar mode. Not only does it best suit his finction from an in universe perspective, but, from a character perspective, a stereo system alternate mode is the best mode for a character named "Soundwave"

And I completely agree, however, there nothing wrong with making him an information officer or any other spy functionality with his minions. I'm getting the point across that we shouldn't stick to one alternative because for one mass convertion seems stupid in this day and age and we already had Frenzy on the first movie which was a boombox. Maybe a surveilance vehicle could suit him better than a military vehicle, but not a boombox.

Mass conversion is not stupid. extreme size changes have been a staple of science fiction and fantasy stories and movies for decades. IF it were so stupid, it would never have been used in the first place. There is no such thing a "stupid" idea, just poor execution of that idea. Secondly, Frenzy was originally going to be Soundwave, but he didn't fit the name because he lacked the mass conversion, and his personality was way different. Thus, he became frenzy and Soundwave was moved to one of the Sequels where they could do him right. On top of that, Frenzy is dead, his head and brain casing destroyed by his own weapon. He is not coming back. Therefore, Soundwave is likely to replace him, which is all the more reason to have Soundwave be a stereo. He is going to serve much the same function and then some.

but for a movie that is trying to present Transformers as rooted on the real world as possible, mass conversion wouldn't be a good idea even if it was well executed.

esclavo wrote:but for a movie that is trying to present Transformers as rooted on the real world as possible, mass conversion wouldn't be a good idea even if it was well executed.

The only reason why mass conversion was not used in the first movie (except for the Allspark) is because they felt it was too much to deal with along with everything else they had to cover. It was simply too much for a single movie. There are only so many fantastic elements you can put into one movie at a time. By spreading those elements over multiple movies, they are more acceptible to the audience. Therefore, by saving mass conversion for a sequel, they can do Soundwave the way he is supposed to be done— as a stereo with the capability to transform into a full sized Decepticon. The trick is to make the growth happen during transformation. That way it looks like he is simply unfolding into ths huge robot.

Tramp wrote:

esclavo wrote:but for a movie that is trying to present Transformers as rooted on the real world as possible, mass conversion wouldn't be a good idea even if it was well executed.

The only reason why mass conversion was not used in the first movie (except for the Allspark) is because they felt it was too much to deal with along with everything else they had to cover. It was simply too much for a single movie. There are only so many fantastic elements you can put into one movie at a time. By spreading those elements over multiple movies, they are more acceptible to the audience. Therefore, by saving mass conversion for a sequel, they can do Soundwave the way he is supposed to be done— as a stereo with the capability to transform into a full sized Decepticon. The trick is to make the growth happen during transformation. That way it looks like he is simply unfolding into ths huge robot.

you haven't completely sold me into the idea but this kind of makes sense when you say: "The trick is to make the growth happen during transformation. That way it looks like he is simply unfolding into ths huge robot."
The unfolding part could kind of work.

Tramp wrote:

esclavo wrote:

Tramp wrote:

esclavo wrote:Why does everyone insist on having Soundwave be a boombox. It's 2007 people, let go of G1 already. I grew up with G1 but I'm stuck on it to inmediately dismiss any design different to G1. I loved Cybertron Soundwave and he wasn't a radio or anything that resembled one. So please, let go of the past and enjoy Transformers for what they are, the coolest concept of the 80's that has lasted more than 20 years and it's still going strong.

He also wasn't Soundwave. he was a completely different character. He was "Soundwave" in name only. He didn't have the same personality, the same function, or anything. He was not Soundwave.

G1 Soundwave got his name from his alternate mode. That is one of the reasons why he needs to keep a similar mode. Not only does it best suit his finction from an in universe perspective, but, from a character perspective, a stereo system alternate mode is the best mode for a character named "Soundwave"

And I completely agree, however, there nothing wrong with making him an information officer or any other spy functionality with his minions. I'm getting the point across that we shouldn't stick to one alternative because for one mass convertion seems stupid in this day and age and we already had Frenzy on the first movie which was a boombox. Maybe a surveilance vehicle could suit him better than a military vehicle, but not a boombox.

Mass conversion is not stupid. extreme size changes have been a staple of science fiction and fantasy stories and movies for decades. IF it were so stupid, it would never have been used in the first place. There is no such thing a "stupid" idea, just poor execution of that idea. Secondly, Frenzy was originally going to be Soundwave, but he didn't fit the name because he lacked the mass conversion, and his personality was way different. Thus, he became frenzy and Soundwave was moved to one of the Sequels where they could do him right. On top of that, Frenzy is dead, his head and brain casing destroyed by his own weapon. He is not coming back. Therefore, Soundwave is likely to replace him, which is all the more reason to have Soundwave be a stereo. He is going to serve much the same function and then some.

Actualy frenzy did have mass convert the part where he copied michelas phone his giant head spider thing folded up into a tiny ass phone which looked really bad and it was a cheat in animation as far as I'm concerned, and this wasn't as much of a stretch as your talking about having a giant robot turn into a tiny boombox is ridiculous. Also another boombox robot would be boring anyways. Also you keep saying the boombox wouldn't be noticed I think after the first movie since it is known that transformers exist and I think more secure measures are going to be taken to prevent a boombox from walking into a secure area. They had that machine in the first movie where they can tell if anyone or anything is a transformer sector 7 used it a few times. And it has been said a few times that this is not G1 so things change for the big screen and chances are he wont be a boombox.

glitched9700 wrote:Actualy frenzy did have mass convert the part where he copied michelas phone his giant head spider thing folded up into a tiny ass phone which looked really bad and it was a cheat in animation as far as I'm concerned, and this wasn't as much of a stretch as your talking about having a giant robot turn into a tiny boombox is ridiculous. Also another boombox robot would be boring anyways. Also you keep saying the boombox wouldn't be noticed I think after the first movie since it is known that transformers exist and I think more secure measures are going to be taken to prevent a boombox from walking into a secure area. They had that machine in the first movie where they can tell if anyone or anything is a transformer sector 7 used it a few times. And it has been said a few times that this is not G1 so things change for the big screen and chances are he wont be a boombox.

You don't understand human nature very well then. People don't really notice the little things, which is why these disguises work. Secondly, Sector Seven has been disbanded. On top of that, while they may be known in certain circles, do you really believe the general public knows much about them? All they would know is what they saw in the press conference with Jon Voight's character. Therefore, they wouldn't likely even think of a stereo being a robot in disguise. Also, while the movie may not be true G1, it is G1 which the movie was based upon, not any of the other continuities. They started with G1 and built from there, changing things only to better fit the medium and to modernize the story. At its roots, it is still G1 based. On top of that, Hasbro themselves basically demanded that Soundwave have mas convesion. That was why he wasn't used in the first movie in the first place. Therefore, chances are, Soundwave will be a portable stereo.

As fro Frenzy, technically, what he used to transform his head into a cell phone wasn't mass conversion, it was parts compression, which is another form of size changing for less extremem size changes.

Tramp wrote:

glitched9700 wrote:Actualy frenzy did have mass convert the part where he copied michelas phone his giant head spider thing folded up into a tiny ass phone which looked really bad and it was a cheat in animation as far as I'm concerned, and this wasn't as much of a stretch as your talking about having a giant robot turn into a tiny boombox is ridiculous. Also another boombox robot would be boring anyways. Also you keep saying the boombox wouldn't be noticed I think after the first movie since it is known that transformers exist and I think more secure measures are going to be taken to prevent a boombox from walking into a secure area. They had that machine in the first movie where they can tell if anyone or anything is a transformer sector 7 used it a few times. And it has been said a few times that this is not G1 so things change for the big screen and chances are he wont be a boombox.

You don't understand human nature very well then. People don't really notice the little things, which is why these disguises work. Secondly, Sector Seven has been disbanded. On top of that, while they may be known in certain circles, do you really believe the general public knows much about them? All they would know is what they saw in the press conference with Jon Voight's character. Therefore, they wouldn't likely even think of a stereo being a robot in disguise. Also, while the movie may not be true G1, it is G1 which the movie was based upon, not any of the other continuities. They started with G1 and built from there, changing things only to better fit the medium and to modernize the story. At its roots, it is still G1 based. On top of that, Hasbro themselves basically demanded that Soundwave have mas convesion. That was why he wasn't used in the first movie in the first place. Therefore, chances are, Soundwave will be a portable stereo.

As fro Frenzy, technically, what he used to transform his head into a cell phone wasn't mass conversion, it was parts compression, which is another form of size changing for less extremem size changes.

Got to hand to you Tramp, you do love your mass conversion.

Tramp wrote:There is no such thing a "stupid" idea, just poor execution of that idea.

Sweet! I'm gonna go streaking in a cactus field!

esclavo wrote:Got to hand to you Tramp, you do love your mass conversion.

It's not so much a matter of liking mass conversion. It's wanting to see Soundwave done right, and his mass conversion ability and his alternate mode are as much a part of his character as anything. They are iconic parts of who he is just as much as Prime being red and blue having windows in his chest and a face plate, and just as much as Bumblebee being yellow and black.

he should be a giant fricking car audio system that gets installed in the newly-reincarnated Jazz, who rips Jazz apart (again), but from the inside.

DesalationReborn wrote:

Tramp wrote:There is no such thing a "stupid" idea, just poor execution of that idea.

Sweet! I'm gonna go streaking in a cactus field!

And if you execute that properly (by not getting picked up by the police and not getting stuck by a cactus) it won't be a stupid idea; it'll be a riot.

I think a good way to make Soundwave true to what he does as a spy is make him a triple-changer. A good reason for this is your average movie viewer would find it easier to except a robot to have more than one alt.mode than a robot that is say between 20-25 feet tall and weighing a few tons turning into a stereo system thats only at most 5 feet tall and close to a hundred pounds. (I have no idea how much a stereo system weighs so this may vary.) Anyway give him a surveillance vehicle mode to get to and from where he's spying and a transformer sized computer mode to relay info to his comrades. I'd also like to add that it should be his minions who do the spying cause they're less likely to be seen as frenzy has shown in the first film.

Frostliger, do you know what a "surveylance vehicle" looks like? Most of them look like delivery trucks or Phone company vans, neither of which stick around too long. They're only around long enough to complete their delivery or make their repairs. Think about it. There is no such thing as a steriotypical "surveylance truck" If they did look like what we imagine them to look like" black vans with antennae and a dish, they'd fail utterly at their jobs because everybpody and their mother would know what they are.

And, no, the average viewer would not have a problem with a 25 foot robot turning into a boombox. Nearly all of the people I talked to at Summerfest this past weekend were "average viewers" not die-hard fans, and every one of them agreed that Soundwave needed his Mass conversion and to be a stereo. Not one thought he should be a vehicle.

As far as I know surveillance vehicles that look like delivery vans or a telephone company truck are found in movies. Who's to say it won't look like a normal vehicle, and if he's found out why can't he scan a new vehicle mode or if that's too far-fetched be able to change the color of his alt.mode?