Hasbro Designer Explains why Velocitron Scourge has a Nemesis Prime deco

While a straight redeco of Car Robots 2000 Black Convoy would have been preferable to me, I don't hate what we got. Getting an explanation makes it much easier to accept (in my case, not speaking for others).

I'm kind of using a different more head-canon-esque explanation for the character in my collection, anyway.

It's cool that this subline is going to continue, but so far the only one from wave two I might be interested in is Hot Rod, and only if it's a MTMTE version. Blurr and Tarn give me hope.

AcademyofDrX wrote:

ZeroWolf wrote:At another site someone joked that hot rod could be a retool of override

That might not be a joke. The original rumors said that Override was a retool of Hot Rod, and there was precedent in the 3P scene where I think MMC used a shared design for those two. If it's an IDW Hot Rod, as with Legacy IDW Blurr, that would arguably be a better base.

I certainly don't think it's likely, but it's at least plausible.

It would be easier IMO to retool 86 Rod into IDW Rod than Override. With the 86 mold, the chest and shins could be swapped out very easily, and the tall shoulders could also be done if they don't mind sacrificing articulation. I'm not even sure how IDW Rod's shoulders could even work with Override's transformation scheme, and the chest would be more complicated to retool. Not that Override couldn't work, it would just take more extensive retooling.

Not to mention, IIRC it was clarified that the wave 2 voyager assortment was going to be 2 Hot Rods and 1 Override, so it would be a bit odd having the whole wave be the same mold.

I can forgive him if the bad communication was true, but I'm still passing on this in hopes for a proper Scourge repaint.

Emerje wrote:Hot Rod needs to be the cartoon colors, bonus points if he comes with Daniel on a hoverboard.

Some things I'd like to see in this line, be it wave 2 or a possible third wave if this goes the way of the Netflix line.

-Sunstreaker (with proper matching yellow and red shoulders)


Emerje

I'd definitely buy another Hot Rod if it came with Danial and Hoverbaord!


Also want a Sunstreaker do over!

honestly the different deco is kinda making me want to get this one now. I have the original black battle convoy, and I don't see the legacy mold as an upgrade, but rather something of a downgrade. But I have always loved the nemesis prime color theme more then the scourge one. decisions, decisions...

Emerje wrote:Wild speculation:

Crasher will be a retooled Wheeljack (closest thing we've had to her original Gobots alt mode, but watch it be Mirage again). Shadow Striker as a heavy Siege Chromia retool (their bot modes have very similar back and arm kibble).

Additional options:
-Crasher from Drag Strip, if they're actually going for accuracy to the original design (assuming they can cuz rights weirdness)? The new head would fill in the seat area of the alt mode, she'd just have some extra wheels (and would get to be a secret extra Stunticon cuz why not)
-I've seen a digibash floating around of Shadow Striker from that Elita/Minerva mold, since the shoulder pylon kibble can be folded back into the backpack I think that could work also Siege Chromia mold sucks please don't bring it back

Emerje wrote:The Leader slot is a mystery, wouldn't surprise me if it were Galaxy Upgrade Optimus Prime in the black and red colors of the original repaint. That would actually make me happy and it would make sense for a firetruck to be here, to say nothing of the Velocitron theme.

OOH, that is an interesting possibility, I hadn't even considered that. It'd definitely make more sense than anything else I had thought of.

Emerje wrote:-Glyph or Tap-out (kinda crazy they haven't done these obvious and long requested repaints yet, but we got Roadranger and Puffer somehow)

I'm starting to wonder if the only reason this hasn't happened yet is because they are actually trying to get the VW Bug tooling for Glyph, considering we're only just now seeing it get a second use.

...is it wrong that I'm still waiting for a Toxitron redeco? This whole "that's not MY Scourge deco!" kerfuffle is flying right over my head
(I can definitely understand the disappointment, though!)

william-james88 wrote:We had big reveals lately but there's one part I forgot was coming and that is all the listings for the next year which we get at the half year mark. Thanks to fellow Seibertronian JTprime17 and TF fan HyperShauta, we have listings of the second wave of the Velocitron line. As with the previous line, it has characters from all sorts of Transformers or Trasformers ajacent worlds together, like Crasher from GoBots, Shadow Striker from Cyberverse and voyager Hot Rod from some aspect of G1 (maybe a movie inspired redeco, purely speculation). These listings come from Walmart, which is the exclusive outlet for these toys.

Velocitron listings

Tra Gen legacy Velocitron deluxe Crasher
Product number: F8050
EAN: 5010994186609

Tra Gen Legacy Velocitron Deluxe Shadow Striker
Product Number: F8049
EAN: 5010994186586

Tra Gen Legacy Velocitron Voyager Hot Rod
Product Number: F8054
EAN: 5010994186593

Tra Gen Legacy Velocitron LDR 2
Product Number: F8052
EAN: 5010994186616

The Leader is not known and it is unknown if this is the extent of the listings, it probably is not.

Interesting list.

Crasher might be a buy if they ive her a good alt mode. , But Shadow Striker is more interesting. Might mean we get a R.I.D SideBurn repaint out of that, which is one step closer to updating the R.I.D Car Robots.

Wonder what the

Overcracker wrote:But Shadow Striker is more interesting. Might mean we get a R.I.D SideBurn repaint out of that, which is one step closer to updating the R.I.D Car Robots.

It's more likely this Shadow Striker, the one who's been in recent mainstream media:

Nemesis Primal wrote:

chuckdawg1999 wrote:Haven't we seen Clampdown with Red Alert's rifle? Aren't we passed the nickel and diming over this mold?

Clampdown comes with both the rifle and the shoulder rocket, both were shown on the stream (not to mention the leaked in-hand copy earlier).

Thank you my friend, I don't watch the streams and those early leaks sometimes come with accessories the main releases don't.

Sabrblade wrote:

Overcracker wrote:But Shadow Striker is more interesting. Might mean we get a R.I.D SideBurn repaint out of that, which is one step closer to updating the R.I.D Car Robots.

It's more likely this Shadow Striker, the one whose been in recent mainstream media:

Still a sleek sports car with a thin robot body, works for SideBurn, even if it doesn’t get the engine chest.

I still don't understand how they could be confused by what colors the G2 long nose tanker truck with big shoulders should have when painted black. He's been done half a dozen times before, every previous design team on both sides of the Pacific understood his colors, how did the current design team have no idea what they were supposed to do with him? It's just frustrating, they had no clear plan for this figure and it ended up being a mess of ideas mashed together. It also means they aren't going to do it "right" later like many of us hoped. Or at least not for a few years since they clearly have nothing planned.

Nemesis Primal wrote:Additional options:
-Crasher from Drag Strip, if they're actually going for accuracy to the original design (assuming they can cuz rights weirdness)? The new head would fill in the seat area of the alt mode, she'd just have some extra wheels (and would get to be a secret extra Stunticon cuz why not)

I could be wrong, but I think Hasbro will fix one of the mistakes they made during Combiner Wars and not make "limbs" that don't have dedicated combiners. A G2 repaint, sure, even an entire retool for a new team, but I think they'll stay away from just doing repaints for the sake of repaints. I hope so anyway.

Emerje

I couldn't give a toss what the designer stated; until it comes out in the "correct" Scourge colours, I'm not buying it.

Either this figure will get the correct colours soon, or a better version still come out later. Until then, I'll stick with the Takara Tomy Legends version for the time being.

I've been mulling it over about the new deco for this version of Scourge, and feel that, despite my (and many others') initial misgivings about it, I'm slowly warming up to it on the notion of it not being a new version of Scourge in his original body, but a new version of Scourge in an upgraded body.

There is precedent in how both of his Takara Legends toys have been depicted as new, upgraded bodies for him instead just reinterpretations of his original body:






His Deluxe toy even has red/pink chest windows like this new one does. Granted, in that Deluxe toy's case, it was because those chest windows were also his actual truck windows, but it's still a case of his robot mode having red/pink windows.

But while that gives precedent for the color of his chest windows, it admittedly doesn't do the same for his torso being black instead of gray. Well, there just so happens to be another toy of his that, in fact, does. Scourge's very first upgraded-body toy had a black torso instead of a gray one. And that was Destructicon Scourge:



Sure, that one also had the gray-and-black chest windows and shoulders, but I do feel that it could be the missing link between the original Scourge and this new one.

In fact, one could even call the Velocitron Scourge the missing link between all of the others Scourges. If one wanted to consider the Destructicon the actual second body upgrade, then the Velocitron one could come next, followed by the existing evolution of Scourge's bodies, giving us the following pattern:

Body 1: Gray torso, gray-and-black windows



Then he undergoes a significant body-change in which his torso changes from gray to black (and his overall shape changes), but his robot mode windows stay the same.

Body 2: Black torso, gray-and-black windows



Then he goes back to his original shape, but keeps his black torso, and his robot windows change to red/pink.

Body 3: Black torso, red/pink windows



Then he changes again, his torso goes back to gray, but his windows stay red/pink.

Body 4: Gray torso, red/pink windows



The TFSS version is similar enough to just be considered the "Hasbro version" of this form.



And finally, he upgrades one more time, keeping his gray torso but returing his windows to gray-and-black, restoring his original deco to come full circle.

Body 5: Gray torso, gray-and-black windows

I'm not really a fan of G2 Laser Prime, for me personally he will always be G1 look. That said I do like the redeco as is for Scourge and might be tempted to buy it as a totally different bot, though I would prefer a different head sculpt to set it apart. That is where I think Hasbro fails at times on repaints by not tooling a new head to make it look like a different character, this one could have looked much better with a source accurate artistic head sculpt rather than just reusing Prime's boxy/squarish looking one.

Why's everyone so confused as to which Shadow Striker it's going to be? It's so very clearly going to be RotF Shadow Striker. It's just so obvious. It's going to be a black with red redeco of the as of yet unseen SS86 core class Wheelie with a bunch of extra weapons to make up the deluxe price point. It's going to have all three pieces of the sword as well as the guns for Skywarp. That's on top of anything Wheelie is going to come with. In fact, it will come with two complete swords and Thundercracker's guns.

I mean the only thing more obvious than this is the Legacy Hot Shot being an update of RID 2001 Hot Shot using a version of Sideswipe as a base.

I'm obviously kidding in case it wasn't clear but I wouldn't put it past Hasbro to mess with fans at this point. I just still think this leak is too good to be true. I already know it's from the Walmart computer system to whoever tried to tell me in the other thread but it wouldn't be the first time those were faked or just outright wrong if I recall correctly.

But no lie, I would love both of those figures though. Dipping into the Spy Changers would be dangerous though. Some of those molds seem to have as many deco options as Starscream does.

For Crasher, I think Dragstrip could be easily retooled into her. The spoiler/feet could be retooled to better resemble Crasher's. The top of the vehicle/chest could be too. The front wheels could be redone as well to have only two and still have the same transformation somehow. This way when you transform them, everything will still work correctly. But most importantly, with some reworking, the front scoop can be placed behind her head and/or back. A hinge system of some sort or just retooled ball pegs or ports to get them down and then a slider to connect the two halves as well as get them out of the way of the retooled shoulder wheels. Pop them off and do it yourself to see what it would look like. Even if they don't retool this area, the ball pegs fit into the hollow parts under the scoop and a 3D printed part can be inserted to friction around the ball pegs holding the scoop down and back behind the head. And who cares if it's a combiner part? It's not like you can tell from looking at it. You have to go out of your way to stab a release mechanism with a flat object to get it to separate on its own. It would just be an added feature.

And I joked about about Hot Rod being a retool of Override on another site last night. I don't know if I'm the one that the other commenter was talking about or not but if they were at least they figured out that I was mostly joking in that large post I made. Again, the whole leak just seems crazy. And I was tired at the time like I am now so I was having a little more fun with the post than normal.

I want all the Leo Primes now. Regular, sparkly white, black, purple, Lio Junior, Thundertron, Go Prime, Alpha Trizer, Leobreaker, Nemesisbreaker, Razorclaw, Universe Leo Prime, Kimba, Mufasa, Simba, Scar, Solgaleo, shiny Solgaleo, Pyroar and shiny Pyroar colors lol. Taste the rainbow of lions. I want a whole bunch of lions so I can form Voltron. Wait, all the Voltron lions are female so that wouldn't work. I mean, none of them have manes so they must be female right? Maybe they're too young to grow out their majestic manes yet.

Crasher, if released should obviously be that faux CW Jazz. It's basically the same car as her original Gobots version.

Between the lines, I read that quote as the actual colour scheme was looked into retroactively. When the mistake was noticed, a wishy-washy "new version" answer was given instead.

If it had been Hot Rod or Optimus with inverted colours, someone would have rectified it immediately. But it is neither a G1 character, nor one of the most popular. So zero F's were given to the error.

So, quick opinion on the official releases:

- Diaclone colors (Burn Out & Clampdown): meh, okay I guess. Honestly I'd be more interested in an actual crossover with the Diaclone reboot than more Easter Egg repaints, but I'm not against it.
- Road Hauler: the screaming face is an odd choice, but seems good.
- Blurr: my only question is why they don't specify the universe for this one. Otherwise, I really like this remold.
- Cosmos: a bit of an oddball choice, and I'm not too sure about the protuding cockpit. However, all of that just makes it seem oddly endearing to me.
- Road Rocket: I'd probably remold or replace the Energon blade/shield with a buzzsaw, but otherwise a perfect retool. Nothing else to say.
- Override: yes! Double yes! Triple yes!
- Scourge:... ok, at first I was weirded out by the innacurate deco, and knowing that it was mostly due to not knowing which version of "anti-Optimus" to do just soured the whole thing more for me. But Sabrblade's little upgrade timeline theory made me warm up to the deco. I'll still wait to see if a better one comes along, though.

As for the leaked releases:

- I do hope Crasher is closer to the GoBots design. Takara and Bandai have teamed up now, so it's possible.
- I'm divided about Shadow Striker. On the one hand, if it's based on the Universe design, we might get a Side Burn retool that isn't such a massive shellformer. On the other, if it's the Cyberverse design, we might finally get the Frankensteined mold. I really don't know which one I want most.
- ... IDW Hot Rod? Energon Rodimus? Animated Rodimus? I really don't know.
- I'm hoping the Leader is Cybertron Crumplezone, but it probably will be someone else.

MaximalNui wrote:- I'm divided about Shadow Striker. On the one hand, if it's based on the Universe design, we might get a Side Burn retool that isn't such a massive shellformer. On the other, if it's the Cyberverse design, we might finally get the Frankensteined mold. I really don't know which one I want most.

IMO, there's no way it's going to be Universe, I know RiD fans are still desperate for more, but this isn't how it'll happen. I don't think the Frankenstein approach is likely either, because the toy will still need to convert and none of the Cyberverse toys had that. Plus the most recent comics didn't keep that design element. Practically speaking, the best we could hope for would be recolored limbs, and I don't think that's very fun.

I hope Crasher is a remold of POTP Jazz.

So I was looking at Selects Ricochet...little retooling on the knee, little more to move the windshield to the hood...bingo bango, you've got Crasher!

MeGrimlock78 wrote:So I was looking at Selects Ricochet...little retooling on the knee, little more to move the windshield to the hood...bingo bango, you've got Crasher!

See above.

$;!\!&!

I REALLY gotta read ALL the posts before commenting.

Excellent work, btw!

On Scourge, it seems like he got a little bit of artistic freedom, which is fine considering the plethora of "Black Optimus Prime" deco variants we have. The non-specific instruction didn't help, and it feels like the higher-ups are like "whatever looks good" which is more like "I can't be bothered to care" attitude to me (which I somewhat hate).

On Crasher and Shadow Striker... ho boy. I can't really say anything about it that hasn't said except this: if they're the same general shape of car, there is a chance Crasher may actually be white to offset Shadow Striker:



... which happens to be the basis for SG Crasher

If she's a racing car like Movie 2007 Fracture... Earthrise Mirage will do just fine.

MeGrimlock78 wrote:$;!\!&!

I REALLY gotta read ALL the posts before commenting.

Excellent work, btw!

NP. Btw, I didn't paint that. It's someone else's custom.

Jelze Bunnycat wrote:...there is a chance Crasher may actually be white to offset Shadow Striker...

Er...

Indeed, with a minimum of retooling like removing the combiner port and how the chest fold, PotP Jazz can be a great Gobots Crasher.

A favorite of mine....'nuff said!

Nemesis Destron wrote:



A favorite of mine....'nuff said!

I have this figure… Still sealed.
I doubt I will ever sell this one!

Sowndwave76 wrote:

Nemesis Destron wrote:



A favorite of mine....'nuff said!

I have this figure… Still sealed.
I doubt I will ever sell this one!

Well, it's not worth much. So might as well open her and marvel at how much a ragdoll she is in bot mode.

At least the vehicle is solid.

Sowndwave76 wrote:

Nemesis Destron wrote:



A favorite of mine....'nuff said!

I have this figure… Still sealed.
I doubt I will ever sell this one!

I painted the lips on mine pink and added her "mascara" too.

Transformers head designer Mark Maher offered some pretty cool info on his Instagram page, regarding his design of the upcoming Walmart exclusive Cosmos toy. He actually started the design process with the Cybertronian mode Bumblebee toy as a basis. You can see the images of that dropped process below along with his commentary. What is really cool here is how we see the importance of Takara in the process. They don't just figure out how to work with the Hasbro design given to them (which in this case was a retool) but they seem to have the power to change the design fully, which in this case meant create a new mold. He also posted an image of the entire set all together so you can see the range of sizes. And Hasbro designer Sam Smith also added some turnaround videos on his Instagram page. You can click here to see them.

Mark Maher wrote:Do you believe?!?!Here he is folks, in all of his cybertronian glory! COSMOS!

Lets get into it! For capsule programs and the mainline as a whole, we have certain allocated funds for new molds. I wanted a Cosmos badly, to further finish the deluxe minibots collection, but just because I love this guy. His voice, design aesthetic, colors, and especially his alt mode are all fire.

Swipe right and you will see how I sold him in as a partial tool using the Origins BB mold. He would of been more of a new rendition of him. I just didnt think a g1 version of him was possible with the tooling allocated. But TT made it happen All NEW in 3 molds!!!

Ittoku Kuwazu worked closely with Hasui Shogo in making this guy the best Cosmos evah! I chimed in on making the flag alt as a blaster and really worked hard on getting the proportions as close to his animation appearance as possible. As you can see from block model to final look, a lot had to happen. But with our great partnership this guy is ready to officiate the Speedia 500.

Let me know who you are routing for to become the new leader of Velocitron!!!

Very cool! From retool to original mold.

Cosmos looks amazing!

That partially explains where the retool rumors come from for new-mold figures: pitched as a retool, but reworked into an all-new mold.

That Cosmos looks terrible. Just like the animation model.

That Origins Bee version of Cosmos is definitely a "What could have been." The proportions of the alt-mode they ended up with just look wrong to me; like a trash can on a pitcher's mound.

It doesn't matter who he was patterned after. That saucer mode looks like a stylized trashcan.

Dumbest Cosmos evah!

Transformers G1 1985 Cosmos (Adams) (Reissue) Gallery


Transformers G1 1985 Cosmos (Adams) (Reissue) Gallery

The top does seem tall compared to the G1 original.

Jelze Bunnycat wrote:
Transformers G1 1985 Cosmos (Adams) (Reissue) Gallery


Transformers G1 1985 Cosmos (Adams) (Reissue) Gallery

The top does seem tall compared to the G1 original.

it's about 1/4 taller than the animation model it's patterned after, which is taller than the original toy.

The taller body also makes it loose its visual reference to the infamous ufo fakes the design was based on

It is fun seeing this process though and looking at the rough prototypes.

It's a shame that it uses the color scheme of the fan-colored Ukrainian model.

The saucer mode is still too tall. It looks good in robot mode so I'll probably get it, but this figure is far from a great piece.

I want that cosmos, but due to the Bullcrap that is the exclusivity of the Velocitron line, I may never be able to get it at normal retail.

MCutter wrote:That Origins Bee version of Cosmos is definitely a "What could have been." The proportions of the alt-mode they ended up with just look wrong to me; like a trash can on a pitcher's mound.

Are you really willing to sacrifice the bot mode for a kinda better, but not great saucer mode? I'm not.


For me the saucer is "good enough" and the bot mode is nearly perfect. I don't think I would have been very happy with a skinny, lanky Cosmos just so he'd have an objectively better alt mode. The top of the saucer being off center on the proposed figure would have always bugged me.

Emerje

Emerje wrote:

MCutter wrote:That Origins Bee version of Cosmos is definitely a "What could have been." The proportions of the alt-mode they ended up with just look wrong to me; like a trash can on a pitcher's mound.

Are you really willing to sacrifice the bot mode for a perfect saucer mode? I'm not.


For me the saucer is "good enough" and the bot mode is nearly perfect. I don't think I would have been very happy with a skinny, lanky Cosmos just so he'd have an objectively better alt mode. The top of the saucer being off center on the proposed figure would have always bugged me.

Emerje

It not being a circle would have bugged me too

Maybe I'll just wait it out for the eventual retool in two years, since this is Walmart Exclusive and I've not had that great of luck finding them anyway. Definitely not paying the after market price for it though!

Behind-the-Scenes Mark has confirmed that Override is the exact same situation as Cosmos was in terms of starting as a retool until Takara stepped in, originally based this time on SS86 Hot Rod (which explains/confirms the early leak): https://www.instagram.com/p/CfcoUaVuAhk ... MyMTA2M2Y=

Takara need to step in more

"This is a great example of what Legacy is all about, who would of thought we’d dig deep into the ol Cybertron series eh"

Dig deep? Override is not some deep-cut obscure Cybertron character. She was one of the series main characters. A Convoy, no less. Digging deep would have been if they'd made someone like Signal Lancer, a cartoon-only cameo character who never got a toy. Or a toy-only character like Hardtop or Shortround.