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ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Sunday, June 18th, 2023 11:01AM CDT

Categories: Movie Related News, People News, Interviews
Posted by: william-james88   Views: 78,536

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Regardless of what you think of the Rise of the Beasts film, it shows that the director and writers did see the robots as the titular characters that they are rather than giant props in the background. Steven Caple Jr, the director was a fan of the source material and did good on his word to provide a Transformers movie with a focus on the Transformers as much as he could (we previously wrote why that's usually not the norm in these films). So it begs to reason why Wheeljack was such a change from his previous look, especially when he had a more accurate look in the Bumblebee movie. Well, it turns out that this decision and push was out of his hands according to this interview from UPROXX. From the interview below, we see that this more nerdy look came from the higher ups, be that Hasbro or Paramount (not that it matters, both companies must sign off on these decisions) and that Wheeljack's look was changed so that he can be more different from the rest of the cast, both in look and the personality inferred by the look. Also, we've gotten early designs of the film which show that Wheeljack's new design was done at a very preliminary stage of production, before Caple was even attached to the film. And it remained this way. Along with Wheeljack, ee have other "previs" designs to share with you from Fred Pashe, who also worked on Beast Machines back in the day. Enjoy!

"When I got into the film, they had already wanted the Wheeljack part of this picture, but they wanted to redesign it and actually lean more into the science and nerdy part of Wheeljack. They felt like the Wheeljack – I don’t know if this is the studio or Hasbro who was here before me – he was kind of falling into the lane of the other characters. Kind of tough. Ironhide, and those kind of vibes. Just didn’t feel like enough variety across the board. And so, for me as a fan, I was like, “All right, how can I keep some of the essence?” But I was like, I’m going to just dive deep into the lore and just gave him his whole sort of personality and a different look as we start to now develop and move on. But yeah, that was it. It was no shade or callbacks to the other Wheeljack at all. But people started calling Pablo Wheeljack, which I thought was kind of funny. And Cristo likes it too. He’s like, “I’m down for that.” Cristo Fernandez, who plays him, which is cool."


Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"

Transformers News: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups"
Credit(s): UPROXX and Artstation

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Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163693)
Posted by Bounti76 on June 18th, 2023 @ 12:10pm CDT
I mean, to be fair, he wasn't as bad as I'd thought. Also, at least his "glasses" served an actual purpose and weren't just an overly human aspect of the character design.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163697)
Posted by Quantum Surge on June 18th, 2023 @ 2:53pm CDT
Previs Wheeljack is how Pablo Haters see him before praying to his Beewun form
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163705)
Posted by epyon927 on June 18th, 2023 @ 4:31pm CDT
To be fair live action Hound wasn’t I pictured him to be. Pot bellied, middle aged with a beard! But he has a place as will Pablo Wheeljack!
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163708)
Posted by Brokebot on June 18th, 2023 @ 6:17pm CDT
epyon927 wrote:To be fair live action Hound wasn’t I pictured him to be. Pot bellied, middle aged with a beard! But he has a place as will Pablo Wheeljack!


Yeah, I really didn't need a Hound that looks like me. I don't need the representation.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163717)
Posted by D-Maximal_Primal on June 18th, 2023 @ 8:01pm CDT
epyon927 wrote:To be fair live action Hound wasn’t I pictured him to be. Pot bellied, middle aged with a beard! But he has a place as will Pablo Wheeljack!

Hound is still one of the best bots to come out of the bay movies, and he and Crosshairs are probably the best to come out of AOE
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163720)
Posted by william-james88 on June 18th, 2023 @ 8:37pm CDT
To those who watched Transformers Rise of the Beasts, you may be curious about what was cut and how the movie changed during production. We will have 3 articles detailing different aspects such as a cut character, scenes we saw in the trailers and from the set videos that were cut, and the difference between earlier test screenings and the final film.

We already went over the the cut character and the scenes in the trailer that were changed or removed, and now we have a detailed account of an early cut of this film seen in a test screening, so you can see how much the film has changed since. I'm personally sad to see that Cheetor calling Primal "Big Bot" was removed, along with the removal of the Transit scene of course. You'll let us know if you prefer this original version or not. This analysis was done by TF fan Cyborgraptor.


The first big obvious changes I’ll get out of the way are the beginning and the ending.

The scene I see everyone talk about, that's notoriously known for being cut, was the Transit fight. Funny enough, this scene was one of the more completed sequences in my cut, since the rest of the movie was still very much in production (about 80% pre-vis)



So the movie originally opens with an Optimus Prime monologue about how for the last few years, the Autobots have stayed hidden as they continued to be hunted by Decepticons, but he's still determined to find a way to get back home and take the fight back to Cybertron and there's a line about how "The hunted have now become the hunters..."

Visually you see stars that transition to the wet streets of NY as Prime drives through the city and pulls into a bus lot. He transforms (you see this in the 2nd trailer) and announces "I know you're here..."
A bus pulls out, revealing a Decepticon logo on the front grill, and transforms saying things like "You can't find us all, Prime. We'll get you eventually!" A fight ensues and it's pretty sick. There's a part where Prime grabs Transit's head and pushes it into a nearby bus and grinds it throughout the inside of the bus. Prime demands to know where the con's ship is, but Transit laughs and tells him that he blew up his ship just for the satisfaction of knowing the autobots can't get off this planet to save his Autobots back home, and even shows a hologram of Autobots being executed as they swear Optimus will return to save them (rough, right?) and this pisses Prime off. I don't remember the specifics of how Transit dies, but I know Prime uses his axe.(which, in my version, they borrowed the DOTM axe model AND that was actually the only time he used the axe in my cut iirc) The scene ends with Optimus dragging Transit's body, and dumping it into a nearby river, and as it floats, Transit lands on top of a revealed pile of cons so you know Optimus has been doing this for a while. HE monologues about not giving up on finding a way off Earth and back home. This then transitions to Noah back home.



As for the ending battle, there were a good amount of changes with how it was approached.


One was the original plan to destroy the control console using Airazor’s deceased spark as a bomb. I can’t remember how they lose the bomb, but they have to change plans using the codes Elena found to stop it instead.

Then there’s Mirage’s fate. In my cut, Mirage first turns into a shield like form and protects Noah from Scourge’s attacks, then the scene plays out like normal and he turns into the suit, but doesn’t hint at him being ok. This version ends on the assumption that Mirage sacrifices himself to become the suit and that’s it.

Then there’s the big change. Instead of Prime escaping from being pulled in by the transwarp key explosion, in my cut, he actually DIDN'T! He gets sucked up, and everyone assumes he died sacrificing himself. This leaves the movie with only 3 of the original Autobots (and Stratosphere) alive and everyone kind of feels like shit. (I think that shot was in one of the trailers or ads too?) This goes into Noah embracing his family, and that’s how the film ended.

The after credit scene reveals Optimus has survived the transwarp teleportation and drifts in space...towards Unicron. He floats inside Unicron where his two big eyes open, looking straight at Optimus. Cuts to black. (This change was also interesting since this was the only time we saw Unicron's eyes, as the earlier scene with Scourge and Unicron, after the museum fight, just had either a burning light or his planet form [hard to remember] looming over him instead)


There were a bunch of other small changes. Here what I can remember:

There was a shot of Airazor flying over New York after Elena discovers the Falcon vase.

Bumblebee explains humans aren't all bad to Optimus at the autobot meet up scene instead of before the museum. “The people…ZZzzt…They ain’t all bad..zzt.” In fact, the whole scene of Optimus, Arcee, and Bee waiting for Mirage and Noah outside the island was an additional scene. Same goes for Mirage explaining Optimus to Noah in the car. Since Optimus didn’t have his beginning monologue explaining the situation, they added this scene to do that instead.

Another widely known cut was the Wheeljack and Arcee relationship. When the Bots land in Peru, Arcee hears Wheeljack is joining and gets flustered. “Wheeljack’s coming…?” Later on, while Arcee is inside Wheeljack waiting for Noah and Elena, Arcee mentions how it’s been a long time since they've seen each other and Wheeljack embarrassingly says, “Yes, it’s been a while since you’ve been inside me…Erm, I mean…”. The final battle has Wheeljack be a little more concerned for Arcee too when they get swarmed.

One scene I wished they saved was when the Autobots are staking out the city in Peru, Wheeljack lends his glasses to Optimus to zoom in. so there’s a little funny look of Optimus wearing Wheeljack’s glasses that was sadly cut out.

There’s a cool line where the heroes are charging, Scourge just looks at them and says “Defend the bridge…” and that’s when a gate appears, releasing the terracon army, instead of them being materialized. Optimus has another little inspiring speech before charge too.

The lines about Optimus Primal’s name being an inspiration from Optimus’s name were added. Good, since I thought that it was bizarre that they all just glossed over that.

Airazor’s introduction to the Autobots was slightly changed since there was originally no Maximal planet opening. Like Optimus in 2007, she uses her eyes to show holograms of her planet for a quick scene of a bunch of generic beasts being chased by two Scorponoks and Scourge as he fires his blaster at them. She then shows Unicron and tricks Noah and Elena’s vision with holograms of as if Unicorn was in the sky, about to consume the Earth, showing them the threat that now faces them. If I recall correctly, Optimus originally thinks Unicron was a myth, but Aiirazor reassures him he’s real. The scene with Elena saying "It's not real. It's not real..." was there too.

Airazor and Elena had more communication between each other. In the scene where they’re waiting for Stratosphere, there’s a part where Elena mentions how she bets Airazor was “making bots turn their necks as she flew by” with Airrazor agreeing “ I did know to shake a tail feather or two.” In fact that whole scene was different. Stratosphere doesn't even show up. It’s just them grouping up and having more dialogue and then someone asks how they are going to get to Peru, smash cutting to them inside Stratosphere. Mirage makes a joke that they are probably going to crash, but Stratosphere responds saying they are safe inside him. Here, Noah and Elena’s dialogue was a bit different. I don’t think Elena ever mentions her dad and Noah explains that he’s worked with military people like Optimus before and doesn’t trust him.

Stratosphere still transformed in the film. The scene where he transforms with Bumblebee in hand was the first time you see him in my cut.

The scene with Noah and Elena going through the caverns and finding the empty key tomb was followed by the freezer attacking them, but after Noah blasts it, they get discovered by Cheetor and Rhinox. The Maximals chase the humans around the caverns for a while until Rhinox chases them to a crack only the humans can fit too. That's when they lead out into the jungle to be stopped by Primal. The first teaser’s shot of Rhinox is from this scene.

When Mirage says "Don't ask what part of my body it came from", Wheeljack follows up and says "He's talking about his butt."

Scourge's character was twisted between cuts too. He had some lines that made you know he was forced and tortured working for Unicron. When Scourge and Unicron have the meeting, Unicron ends it by threatening to make his life a living hell if he doesn't find the remaining Transwarp Key and Scourge responds to himself afterwards with “...it already is…”. When Scourge meets Primal after corrupting Airazor, there was some dialogue between the two that made it seem like they knew each other personally, but I can’t remember the exact words. Near his death, Optimus tells Scourge to stop the Transwarp keys, and Scourge mentions something like “It’s too late. Even if I wanted to, I couldn’t stop the keyes now.” A lot of the new lines in the official cut make him seem more like a cookie cutter villain with only the drive to do what Unicron demands. Also, his design was the one from the promotional art and toys (possibly including a mustache, but I may not be accurate on that). They showed his final design for a split second in one of the more completed scenes, so I knew he was going to be changed eventually.

The scene at the end with the G.I Joe tease was obviously added in later, including the Elena redemption part. I was part of the focus group at the end, and I remember we all realized that Elena didn’t have any resolution to her arc, so I’m glad they added it.

Obviously this includes the Mirage surviving scene being a later addition too. Personally, I’m not a big fan of this decision since that just means everyone can get revived. Let's get Airazor back! Why not! Woo Hoo! No consequences! We can have our cake and eat it too!

Mirage seemed more insufferable in my cut. I remember rolling my eyes more than half the time he spoke. I think he’s better in the official cut. I wouldn't be surprised if Pete D. ad libbed some better lines.

Mirage’s head crest was white, like what we see in some promotional material. Also he never had the weird Vader mask thing. Don’t know what that was about.

When Mirage turns into a garbage truck, they made it more clear the back half was a hologram.

Optimus’s character arc was a little wishy washy in my cut. He seemed to not like humans at all for the majority of the film until Noah decides not to shoot the Transwarp key. Then, after the whole Airrazor death scene. Optimus makes a speech about how great humans are and how wrong he was. It was a bit jarring how quick Optimus decides to trust humans and protect Earth. I'm glad they gave Optimus a bit more scenes with Noah to pad out the trust and care he develops for Earth. This speech also had Optimus say “For Cybertron!” Primal says “For Earth!” and Rhinox jumps in and says “For HOME!” and they all turn to Rhinox and Noah says “You can talk!?” . The scene in the trailer about “How big can this guy be?” was also in this scene, but was obviously cut out.

In the final battle, Cheetor says the line “We’re right behind you, big bot!”

Primal kills Battletrap the same way, but Optimus wasn’t there to help kill him and make the joke.

When Airazor is escaping with Elena and the key, my cut had the DOTM track “I’m just a messenger” with a bit of a jungle beat playing. I wish that was still there.

When Primal fights the corrupted Airazor, Airazor doesn't talk back or says to kill her, she's completely farrell. Also Primal snaps her neck instead of crushing her chest.

When Unicron is entering through the transwarp portal , he sucks the energon from around the area, including where Bee is, causing the energon to go through Bee first. Also Bee is considered dead in my cut. There’s no lines about possibly saving him, so they just like carrying around his body, I guess?

Primal says "Maximal maximize" instead of calling out Cheetor and Rhinox specifically

When Unicron drops Scorponoks onto the battlefield, Noah yells what those things are, and Primal responds “Predacons….”

Like Optimus's axe, his swords were the first trilogy swords that were probably place holders until they designed the new ones

Noah gives the final speech alone, since Prime was teleported and assumed dead.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163724)
Posted by TK415 on June 18th, 2023 @ 11:17pm CDT
If Optimus floated to Unicron at the end of this movie, does anyone have a guess as to how the story could have gone after that?
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163725)
Posted by Solrac333 on June 19th, 2023 @ 12:25am CDT
I think it's messed up that the "higher ups" only see smart characters or characters as nerds and should look like geeky nerds.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163727)
Posted by -Kanrabat- on June 19th, 2023 @ 4:01am CDT
Solrac333 wrote:I think it's messed up that the "higher ups" only see smart characters or characters as nerds and should look like geeky nerds.


They don't know how the real world works outside their office walls so they rely on stereotypes and tropes.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163729)
Posted by Dr. Caelus on June 19th, 2023 @ 6:01am CDT
I'm glad thwy changed Scourge. The story of the tortured thrall is great when you actually devote time and energy to it and have their rebellion impact the plot (e.g., Darth Vader, Marvel's version Galvatron), but when it's just some throwaway lines to make you feel sorry for the punching bag it feels like shallow sentiment annd cheap stakes. At best you get a character like Beast Wars Rampage who just ends up feeling unfinished.

Scourge reminded me of IDW Overlord and that was fine. Unicron is an awesomely powerful being who has annihilated countless civilizations; he shouldn't have a hard time either finding or conditioning a zealous sadist to do his bidding, so why have a herald who is mopey about it?

Edit: Now that Unicron has had a proper introduction, they could make Cyclonus the BBEG of the next movie and Galvatron the BBEG of the next after that. Then they would have time to build Cyclonus up as a sympathetic character (callback to IDW) so that he could help save the day by betraying Galvatron.

As far as Wheeljack, it was always weird that in G1 he went from his alternate mode beimg a practical utility van large enough to carry another bot to being a racecar too small and too conspicuous to be useful.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163731)
Posted by Stormshot_Prime on June 19th, 2023 @ 8:37am CDT
For how little he was ultimately in the Final Cut, that’s a bit weird that they pushed it so hard. But again, when I think of the movie and how much I loved it, Wheeljack doesn’t come to mind.

A lot more cut content than I realized, I thought it was just the Transit stuff. Now I’m wondering if we’re gonna get a Director’s Cut version of the movie, Alien 3 style.

(Also can we see Megatron? Beast or otherwise?)
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163753)
Posted by CobraKai on June 19th, 2023 @ 3:31pm CDT
Some things i like, like the Transit fight, the rest i think were changed for the better. I do hope, since that transit fight was almost done, that it makes it into an extended edition of the movie. I think it would actually help with the pacing as theres a big gap of TF action between the opening and the museum.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163766)
Posted by D-Maximal_Primal on June 19th, 2023 @ 8:26pm CDT
TK415 wrote:If Optimus floated to Unicron at the end of this movie, does anyone have a guess as to how the story could have gone after that?

Just bear with me a quick second, to pull up an old fan theory that ended up false:

Notice how Optimus took a shot from Scourge that just skimmed the lower left side of his face, and notice how Scourge's real face has his main injury in the same spot.

Just saying.

The line from Unicron about Scourge not dying with his planet might have been added after they went away from the Optimus in space ending. Which, funny enough, mirrors the end of the Netflix WFC cartoon with Nemesis Prime.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163933)
Posted by Sabrblade on June 21st, 2023 @ 12:08am CDT
I guess nobody noticed these names written at the bottom of the second group shot:
william-james88 wrote:Image
Sandstorm Scorponok DoublePunch
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163937)
Posted by noctorro on June 21st, 2023 @ 3:22am CDT
D-Maximal_Primal wrote:
TK415 wrote:If Optimus floated to Unicron at the end of this movie, does anyone have a guess as to how the story could have gone after that?

Just bear with me a quick second, to pull up an old fan theory that ended up false:

Notice how Optimus took a shot from Scourge that just skimmed the lower left side of his face, and notice how Scourge's real face has his main injury in the same spot.

Just saying.

The line from Unicron about Scourge not dying with his planet might have been added after they went away from the Optimus in space ending. Which, funny enough, mirrors the end of the Netflix WFC cartoon with Nemesis Prime.


I think the original writers/creatives had some cool and interesting ideas.

And then the corporate morons who know nothing about character writing and story writing came in with their demands and we ended up with this.
All the good and interesting parts were reduced to 1 line of dialogue. World building kept to a minimum and just here and now interaction and reactions.

Anybody remember Iron Man 1? Where talented people made a great movie with sci fi and action?
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163940)
Posted by primeisboss on June 21st, 2023 @ 8:15am CDT
I saw the movie for the second time last night and I noticed that the transwarp key looks similar to an ancient mastodon bone. This is probably just a coincidence, but thought it was cool.

Mastadon.jpg

key.jpg
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163941)
Posted by Dr. Caelus on June 21st, 2023 @ 8:17am CDT
noctorro wrote:I think the original writers/creatives had some cool and interesting ideas.

And then the corporate morons who know nothing about character writing and story writing came in with their demands and we ended up with this.
All the good and interesting parts were reduced to 1 line of dialogue. World building kept to a minimum and just here and now interaction and reactions.


This is pretty normal writing. You have pages and pages of notes with various conflicting ideas, and you pick a set that don't conflict and spam your first draft with them. Then you cut, again and again, removing the stuff that doesn't 'hang together', stuff that slows the story too much without moving it forward, and stuff that -oops- does actually conflict with the other things you wrote. You leave a few dangling threads to give yourself as much flexibility for a sequel as possible while still giving the story closure.

Anybody remember Iron Man 1? Where talented people made a great movie with sci fi and action?


Iron Man 1's world-building consisted of actually having the generic government agents refer to their organization as SHIELD (well, technically I think they didn't) rather than DOD, NSA, FBI, etc., and introducing Nick Fury after the credits.

Iron Man 1 only introduced the 10 Rings as a stereotypical terrorist organization indistinguishable from the villains in True Lies. Their actual goals and value were left vague at best, and their leader was a forgettable mook.

Iron Man 1 introduced Obadiah Stane, whose characterization was 'greedy and deceptive'. That was it. He wasn't even that deceptive; Tony was just really naive. He dies.

Iron Man 1 introduced Tony's brief savior/mentor (whose name I'd have to look up, TBH). He dies faster than Obiwan Kenobi.

Iron Man 1 introduced James Rhodes, the responsible, practical black man exasperated by the antics of his eccentric white bestie.

Iron Man 1 introduced Pepper Potts, the hyper competent woman stuck working in the shadow of an egomaniac, but effectively runn8ng his business while also dealing with an inappropriate amount of his personal life. But it's okay because she falls in love with him.

Iron Man 1 inytroduced Happy Hogan. He's the director.

Most importantly, Iron Man 1 introduced Tony Stark. It did that with a ton of tropes that, while faithful to the character, are still pretty shallow. His character is dynamic, but he's the only dynamic character in the movie, and his characterization is stillbmoreorless left unexamined until Iron Man 2 starts to dive into his history with his father, his alcoholism, and the start of his PTSD - all of which is kind of touched on too lightly because it was genuinely too much to tackle in a movie that has Iron Man, Warmachine, Black Widow, (the arguably over-developed) Whiplash, Pepper and Happy, Nick Fury, and Justin Hammer packed into it.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163990)
Posted by william-james88 on June 22nd, 2023 @ 3:24pm CDT
Just a fun fact, don't know if this is in the wiki either, but the most famous macguffin of all time is the Maltese Falcon. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MacGuffin

And this film's macguffin is inside the statue of a falcon.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2163992)
Posted by First-Aid on June 22nd, 2023 @ 4:01pm CDT
william-james88 wrote:Just a fun fact, don't know if this is in the wiki either, but the most famous macguffin of all time is the Maltese Falcon. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MacGuffin

And this film's macguffin is inside the statue of a falcon.


Ha! Good point! Never thought about it. Sooooo...instead of the Maltese Falcon it's the Warp-Keys Falcon?
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164094)
Posted by bluecatcinema on June 24th, 2023 @ 2:51pm CDT
Finally got around to watching this today, and I thought it was fantastic. Great visuals, compelling story, awesome action, and endearing characters. Especially Peter Dinklage as Scourge.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164138)
Posted by RotorstormNZ on June 25th, 2023 @ 7:57pm CDT
I’ll be back with my thoughts (TL;DR really really enjoyed it) but I just had to chime in on this:

Brokebot wrote:
epyon927 wrote:To be fair live action Hound wasn’t I pictured him to be. Pot bellied, middle aged with a beard!

Yeah, I really didn't need a Hound that looks like me. I don't need the representation.

That comment made me laugh like you wouldn’t believe :lol: :lol:
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164460)
Posted by TulioDude on July 2nd, 2023 @ 12:50pm CDT
Dr. Caelus wrote:I'm glad thwy changed Scourge. The story of the tortured thrall is great when you actually devote time and energy to it and have their rebellion impact the plot (e.g., Darth Vader, Marvel's version Galvatron), but when it's just some throwaway lines to make you feel sorry for the punching bag it feels like shallow sentiment annd cheap stakes. At best you get a character like Beast Wars Rampage who just ends up feeling unfinished.



I agree with this, adding tragic elements to Scourge's story, and not develop it further would felt weird. The final movie version works with what its was setting up to do. A bad guy with no empaty for his adversaries.

D-Maximal_Primal wrote:
epyon927 wrote:To be fair live action Hound wasn’t I pictured him to be. Pot bellied, middle aged with a beard! But he has a place as will Pablo Wheeljack!

Hound is still one of the best bots to come out of the bay movies, and he and Crosshairs are probably the best to come out of AOE


Really like Hound and Crosshairs, hope we can see more of them, in movies or the extended media.


As for some of the unfinished version differences:
-The Transit scenes sounds that would helped to explaing Optimus's mood during the movie, but I wonder how dark it would have been and if it would be too much of a contrast compared to the rest.
-As I would have enjoyed more time with the Maximals, some of these cut stuff sounds neat.
-I'm glad the scenes of Wheeljack and Arcee weren't in final version, since it feels to me that it has no buildup and would'nt lead nowhere. Besides there are other characters I like to pair up Arcee with.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164476)
Posted by Tuned Agent on July 2nd, 2023 @ 7:40pm CDT
Finally got a chance to see RotB. I thought it was pretty solid overall. It was actually surprising how coherent the movie was with all the factions and concepts it was introducing. Noah was a good human protagonist. I really liked Mirage, he brought a lot of personality to the movie. I also thought Peter Dinklage was great as Scourge, even if he was a pretty one-note villan.

The movie wasn't perfect though, my biggest issue was probably the pacing. The movie went a mile a minute, and really could have used a tad longer runtime for a few more character moments, better flow for narrative events, or to just let the movie breathe a little. There were a few weird editing choices, and a few shots where it really wasn't clear what was going on (like when Primal crushed Airrazor's chest, it just looked like he was restraining her until he let go and she was just dead). The CGI also often felt like a step down from previous films.

As for the cut content, I really think they should have kept the Transit fight. It would have been a much better way of introducing Prime's motivations than Mirage just explaining it to Noah.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164714)
Posted by TulioDude on July 9th, 2023 @ 1:12pm CDT
Thinking about it a bit more, if the in the job interview part at the end , if it was revealed it was Sector Seven instead of GI Joe, I think it would haved tiet better with the Bumblebee movie and the rest of the franchise.

I'm not sure what to think of GI Joe, on what they can bring to the movie series . A crossover sounds similar NEST in previous films.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164719)
Posted by Sabrblade on July 9th, 2023 @ 2:15pm CDT
TulioDude wrote:Thinking about it a bit more, if the in the job interview part at the end , if it was revealed it was Sector Seven instead of GI Joe, I think it would haved tiet better with the Bumblebee movie and the rest of the franchise.

I'm not sure what to think of GI Joe, on what they can bring to the movie series . A crossover sounds similar NEST in previous films.
The scene was originally filmed with it being Sector Seven, but it was changed to G.I. Joe because it being Sector Seven (or the FBI or CIA) didn't feel like a big enough surprise reveal with as resonating an emotional reaction.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164727)
Posted by D-Maximal_Primal on July 9th, 2023 @ 5:02pm CDT
Sabrblade wrote:
TulioDude wrote:Thinking about it a bit more, if the in the job interview part at the end , if it was revealed it was Sector Seven instead of GI Joe, I think it would haved tiet better with the Bumblebee movie and the rest of the franchise.

I'm not sure what to think of GI Joe, on what they can bring to the movie series . A crossover sounds similar NEST in previous films.
The scene was originally filmed with it being Sector Seven, but it was changed to G.I. Joe because it being Sector Seven (or the FBI or CIA) didn't feel like a big enough surprise reveal with as resonating an emotional reaction.

should've been a mid or end credits scene with Sector 7. G.I. Joe just does not work here
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164786)
Posted by william-james88 on July 10th, 2023 @ 6:22pm CDT
Transformers Rise of the Beasts is coming to digital tomorrow. And it will have several features, including deleted scenes. To promote this release, part of the Optimus vs Transit fight has been revealed through IGN. We have posted it below, but be warned that it is unfinished.

Below that we also have a list of all the extras that will be on the DVD/Blu Ray release in October. It is unclear how many of those features will also be available in tomorrow's release.



Special features:

Heroes (10 minutes)
Villains (9 minutes)
Human Affairs (8 minutes)
Life In The 90s (6 minutes)
The Chase (6 minutes)
The Battle Of Ellis Island (7 minutes)
The Switchback Attack (7 minutes)
Into The Jungle (10 minutes)
The Final Conflict (11 minutes)
The Transit Depot Alternate Opening – Deleted Scene (4 minutes)
The Cave/Switchback – Alternate/Extended (4 minutes)
Are You Ready? – Deleted Scene (2 minutes)
This Can’t Be Real – Extended (1 minute)
Noah Comes Home – Extended/Deleted Scene (1 minute)
The Maximal Crest – Extended (1 minute)
Alternate Ending – Deleted Scene (1 minute)
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164791)
Posted by Sabrblade on July 10th, 2023 @ 7:09pm CDT
Optimus: "Where is it!?"

Me: "Where is what?"
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164792)
Posted by -Kanrabat- on July 10th, 2023 @ 7:09pm CDT
It's been years and years since I popped in a DVD/BD and watch the special features.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164795)
Posted by Quantum Surge on July 10th, 2023 @ 7:18pm CDT
Sabrblade wrote:Optimus: "Where is it!?"

Me: "Where is what?"
It. He means it.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164796)
Posted by EvasionModeBumblebee on July 10th, 2023 @ 7:23pm CDT
Looking forward to seeing the rest of this scene! Transit's design is pretty cool
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164798)
Posted by cloudballoon on July 10th, 2023 @ 7:38pm CDT
There are 2 concepts shown in this video of Transit. The flat, low-poly version is the one with the bug eye that the (iirc, Japanese?) bio card hinted. The more polished (with more polys & lighting FX applied) version is an unfamiliar design for me.... but it looks more boring/generic to me.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164799)
Posted by Bounti76 on July 10th, 2023 @ 7:42pm CDT
Quantum Surge wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:Optimus: "Where is it!?"

Me: "Where is what?"
It. He means it.


We'll likely hear in the full scene, but a synopsis of the scene had them fighting and Transit taunted Optimus by saying he'd destroyed "it", it being the ship Transit came to earth on. The Decepticons basically sent Transit to mock the fact that Optimus was stuck on Earth and couldn't get back to Cybertron to continue to fight the war.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164800)
Posted by Sabrblade on July 10th, 2023 @ 8:09pm CDT
Bounti76 wrote:
Quantum Surge wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:Optimus: "Where is it!?"

Me: "Where is what?"
It. He means it.


We'll likely hear in the full scene, but a synopsis of the scene had them fighting and Transit taunted Optimus by saying he'd destroyed "it", it being the ship Transit came to earth on. The Decepticons basically sent Transit to mock the fact that Optimus was stuck on Earth and couldn't get back to Cybertron to continue to fight the war.
Just imagine how wild it would be if Optimus was talking about the AllSpark. 8-}
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164801)
Posted by Quantum Surge on July 10th, 2023 @ 8:11pm CDT
Sabrblade wrote:
Bounti76 wrote:
Quantum Surge wrote:
Sabrblade wrote:Optimus: "Where is it!?"

Me: "Where is what?"
It. He means it.


We'll likely hear in the full scene, but a synopsis of the scene had them fighting and Transit taunted Optimus by saying he'd destroyed "it", it being the ship Transit came to earth on. The Decepticons basically sent Transit to mock the fact that Optimus was stuck on Earth and couldn't get back to Cybertron to continue to fight the war.
Just imagine how wild it would be if Optimus was talking about the AllSpark. 8-}

Or a book not literally starring the lowest US coin filled with wisdom.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164806)
Posted by blackeyedprime on July 11th, 2023 @ 3:23am CDT
Seems like it was missing some dialogue after the "I'll destroy you* *then I'll go smell boys". Beast wars voice actors lucked out on not being given time of the day for this.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164842)
Posted by D-Maximal_Primal on July 11th, 2023 @ 7:29pm CDT
Having now seen the full deleted scene, the Transit fight would have been awesome, and the test audiences saying it was "too dark" is utterly ridiculous. Even with the Maximal opening, this could have been in the film.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164859)
Posted by -Kanrabat- on July 11th, 2023 @ 8:55pm CDT
D-Maximal_Primal wrote:Having now seen the full deleted scene, the Transit fight would have been awesome, and the test audiences saying it was "too dark" is utterly ridiculous. Even with the Maximal opening, this could have been in the film.


WHO are those "test audiences?"

Because way too often, they are so, SO wrong.

Like for example, they preferred the "Hollywood cliché" ending for I Am Legend rather than the real and thought provocative one.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164883)
Posted by Cheesinator on July 12th, 2023 @ 7:45am CDT
Ah man this is a real shame to have been left out.

Marks a very clear departure from Bayverse Prime as well (I know they're meant to be the same, but let's be real, the casual audience don't care about detailed continuity anymore); willingness to negotiate and peacefully resolve a conflict, and not in permanent godmode against anyone except the main antagonist.

Helps set a different tone for the movie compared all the predecessors (barring TF1 and Bumblebee).
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164890)
Posted by blackeyedprime on July 12th, 2023 @ 12:48pm CDT
Watched it, sadly not in russian.

Felt like an average sequel to the Bee film and seperate to bayverse. Out of three movies with a history museum in it (ww84, eternals and this) maybe slightly below eternals but def better than ww84.

It doesnt really do the dirty on beast wars characters because they dont have any character, so yay for that?

more spoilery thoughts below.

___________________________________________________________________________

not much to grumble or swear at, the story doesnt really make sense but hey ho. Just transwarp to the past when Unicron finds you, rinse and repeat. Ignoring that, the Maximals thinking unicron is a myth but yet they know of Optimus for primal to name himself after him was probably another picky plot hole.

Kid needs medicine for bad hands after playing on a years old ancient game boy despite his bro knowing electronics and having street contacts seemed off.

Ron Perlman is surprisingly okay as Primal, h e might not sound like Primal but probably the best voice in it -his character isnt there (doesnt threaten his own team mates with beating thme with their severed limbs but hey, his team mates dont speak kinda so it would be pointless).

Very bot orientated but not that good a thing when they have very little characterisation and wheeljack was like...could they just have him not speaking too.

didnt find anything funny or comical. Freezers were a bit like dull versions of live action frenzy. Why they reuse scorponoks name again on things that arent scorponok is just becoming a hting.

nightbird just flying, because, why dont all the car bots do that...but probably less of a headache than trying to figure out tripple changing toys like they couldn't with Bees villains.

Choosing Apeling rather than using ANYTHING that doesnt look like Primal, BBoom, Lioconvoy, Owl Prowl, a floating Butt, anything might have been a better choice.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164891)
Posted by First-Aid on July 12th, 2023 @ 1:44pm CDT
blackeyedprime wrote:
Felt like an average sequel to the Bee film and seperate to bayverse. Out of three movies with a history museum in it (ww84, eternals and this) maybe slightly below eternals but def better than ww84.


Seriously, worse than Eternals? Respectfully, I wouldn't wipe my butt with the film Eternals was filmed on and found ROTB far more entertaining and coherent. WW84 was horrifically executed, but more entertaining than Eternals.

But again, just my opinion. I'd put ROTB above both of those three.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2164908)
Posted by oceanfrr on July 12th, 2023 @ 10:11pm CDT
It wasn't too bad.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2165038)
Posted by william-james88 on July 15th, 2023 @ 11:14pm CDT
There was a glimmer of hope that the never ending talks about whether or not the Transformers live action film franchise was rebooting with these newer films would end once Rise of the Beasts came out. But it didn't because the film chose not to be too much of a change stylistically from the other live action Transformers films. Plot wise, connections to other films were kept vague and they even introduced a tool that any writer can use to bring whatever character they want into any point in time (the Transwarp key, which while now destroyed is still around in the past to be picked up and used at any point in time). Some fans have accepted that this wishy washiness and lack of commitment to a full on reboot of the franchise is all intentional on the part of Paramount, but others still want a clear answer.
Well, for those wanting a real answer, Steven Caple Jr has one: Continuity in this franchise DOES NOT MATTER. Even though this is all the same film series, the events will not match up, because each movie or series of movies focuses on their own thing. They should instead be treated as stand-alones. And not just the new films, but the previous Bay films too. Below is the transcript of that part of the interview, within the Empire Podcast Spoiler Special with Steven Caple Jr, where continuity is discussed.

Interviewer: In terms of the continuity of the franchise, are you worried about matching it up with the first Bay film, which suggests that Optimus has never been to earth before…
Caple Jr: … But now it’s kinda broken already. For me, I’m not like fully worried about it. There are things I would love to stay within that line, but at a certain point, we all know it, Bay has admitted it, I had certain conversations with him like, in terms of tracking the storyline by movie 3, 4 and 5 (5 specifically i would say), now it’s kinda like …
Interviewer: … they were freestyling it
Caple Jr: They were freestyling. Unicron is planet earth, it was things like that. Cool conceptually but that’s a lot to unravel and will we ever see Unicron? Cause now it’s Earth. Probably a reason why they stopped right there. So like, for me, I’m not worried about it, it’s about what’s best for the movie. For me, I have my classics. We got movie 1 with Sam witwicky, it’s a classic. Then we got 3, some of the best action I’ve seen in any movie, best Transformers battles, like it was really good. Those are the movies, they’re like stand-alones. For us, we just make sure about our story and if it tracks through each one [we make]. If we try to hold ourselves to what another storyline/ timeline was, we’d definitely be in trouble. Cause at a certain point, I don’t think anyone knew exactly where they were going with 4 and 5.


What you just read is the new official take on the matter of continuity: that it does not matter. You'll see that the word reboot is not uttered because that's not what anyone making these films want to convey either. This film, Bumblebee, AOE, TLK, and the initial trilogy are all their own stories within the same franchise, but with no need to connect perfectly to eachother. They are all constant (soft) reboots in their own way, if you want to see it that way, but also all (soft) reboots of Bayverse. So the Bayverse is far from dead, it is instead fragmented, and anything can happen from here on out. So have fun with that take.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2165042)
Posted by Silver Wind on July 16th, 2023 @ 1:26am CDT
My interest in the movie franchise was never that high after watching the first live-action Transformers film in 2007 (sans the 2018 Bumblebee film), but this completely kills it for me.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2165044)
Posted by noctorro on July 16th, 2023 @ 4:32am CDT
This is silly and why Transformers up untill now is still just silly action fun and a toy commercial.

I would love for a team to take Transformers seriously and of course for them to be competent (unlike the netflix show, my god the writing is some of the worst I've ever seen).

Transformers needs a reboot, and a different top management. The same buttfaces are still in charge of the movie franchise and as long as they are there, all Transformers movies will suffer.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2165046)
Posted by Lore Keeper on July 16th, 2023 @ 5:05am CDT
"We're not concerned with continuity" is writer speak for "We're not competent enough to write a compelling serialized story, so we'll just make a bunch of unconnected stories about whatever we want."
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2165047)
Posted by -Kanrabat- on July 16th, 2023 @ 5:23am CDT
Lore Keeper wrote:"We're not concerned with continuity" is writer speak for "We're not competent enough to write a compelling serialized story, so we'll just make a bunch of unconnected stories about whatever we want."


Exactly. The MCU was able to do it for over a decade, and it's still going. So why can't Transformers?
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2165049)
Posted by william-james88 on July 16th, 2023 @ 6:10am CDT
-Kanrabat- wrote:
Lore Keeper wrote:"We're not concerned with continuity" is writer speak for "We're not competent enough to write a compelling serialized story, so we'll just make a bunch of unconnected stories about whatever we want."


Exactly. The MCU was able to do it for over a decade, and it's still going. So why can't Transformers?


Probably because they wrote themselves into a story they no longer want to follow
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2165052)
Posted by blackeyedprime on July 16th, 2023 @ 9:12am CDT
If it works for star wars the why not transforners... Oh wait.
Re: ROTB Wheeljack's Nerdy Redesign was a Demand from the "Higher Ups" (2165054)
Posted by TulioDude on July 16th, 2023 @ 9:44am CDT
Image

There has been this back and foward with this subject. I'm not sure if I believe it 100%.

We will know for sure when they announce the next film.

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Transformers Podcast: Twincast / Podcast #352 - Revenge of Buzzsaw
Twincast / Podcast #352:
"Revenge of Buzzsaw"
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