Would Fans Like Divergent Timelines Within the Bayverse?

-Kanrabat- wrote:Well, I would be happy with an alternate time-line in the Bayverse, but only if at some point, the time-lines converge Spiderman No Way Home style.

You mean lots of Optimi? I'm game for that.

First-Aid wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:Well, I would be happy with an alternate time-line in the Bayverse, but only if at some point, the time-lines converge Spiderman No Way Home style.

You mean lots of Optimi? I'm game for that.

Knowing This brand, it would be lots of Bumblebees.



And all of them would still be unable to speak.

william-james88 wrote:I just call him James Bond

Hahaha exactly!
Now that I think of it, The Fast and Furious Family are all Gary Stues
Well, you do know what you are watching.

Cheesinator wrote:

muddyjoe wrote:"Liberal ideas"?... Like censoring free speech when it doesn't agree with your world view?

Do you believe that expressing disgust and/or anger at the mention of a cast being predominantly black/hispanic is generally protected under free speech?

noctorro wrote:From the teaser, lots and lots of bots! And it looks like it's not fanbaiting.

That's my hope too, but at this point I'm measuring expectations. I imagine it's difficult to provide a lot of bot action with cool kills while also making them feel like actual characters; IMO Bumblebee did this best (followed closely by TF1) due to having a small cast, while movies like RotF and DotM showed that if you have a huge cast, most of the bots end up just being kinda forgettable and seem more like extras.

On the first note, disgust and anger is sour behaviour. Even if the emotion is justified given the current Hollywood climate. You can't say with a straight face that there's nothing going on in a certain political leaning direction. Howver voicing concerns in a somewhat decent manner should not be silenced in my personal opinion.

Second part: I also think Bumblebee did it best. Keep it small and build out if the audience says it's a good movie with their wallet. Not shill media.
My gods, I think Ratchet had litteraly one line of dialogue in Dark of the Moon. And that's my second favorite Transformers movie.

If the characters don't have any depth/personality/story then them fighting etc. does very little for me in the enjoyment factor. + it's just objectivly bad.

I think I'm just a big child, I cannot contain my enthusaism in case of a big dissapointment to be honest.
It looks like Transformers filled and they talk a lot + there seems to be a lot of action. The only thing they can ruin it for me is with onesided high horse politics.
Or toilet humor, but it looks like the humor is subltle seeing that final shot of Arcee.
If Bay was in charge Arcee would be twerking, oh wait that's actually Marvel isn't it.

First-Aid wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:Well, I would be happy with an alternate time-line in the Bayverse, but only if at some point, the time-lines converge Spiderman No Way Home style.

You mean lots of Optimi? I'm game for that.

If Bee/ROTB Optimus is more in line with G1 than "Optimus the Barbarian" from the first Bay movies, I'd love to see both of them meet and react to each other.

Anything that brings an end to baynus is good to me, sadly this won't be it. Bumblebee could have been a good move forward even with its flaws. This is seemingly ten steps backwards and probably not even a Linkin Park song to save it.

@william-james88 there has never really confirmation that the film is a full continuity reboot

If they used the transwarp macguffin for time travel, maybe using it to stop Unicron, that would be a nice way to tie everything together.

And then leave it completely behind and start fresh with someone who understands the word "continuity".

bumblebeeprime_18 wrote:@william-james88 there has never really confirmation that the film is a full continuity reboot

You're right and I've said as such many times, like in my previous article. They've always been very coy about it with Travis Knight flat out saying those words meant nothing to him in regards to his film. This is all just conjecture, to stimulate discussion based on new info we've received. Basically, lots of "what if"s.

Also, even if this film branches out, it wouldn't be a full reboot. It would instead confirm that Bumblebee was in continuity with the rest of the Bayverse films and that events branch off afterwards, fully integrating all films into one universe. Which I think is the opposite fans wanted.

My gut feeling that Paramount is never gonna fully address the notion of Bumblebee and Rise of the Beasts ever being a separate timeline because they don't want to fully discard the first five movies after how much money the first four made for them, and will continue to remain completely agnostic on the matter so that ROTB could still, even if just theoretically, take place chronologically before the 2007 movie in the same timeline. Basically Hasbro's "squint test" logic they had regarding the Aligned fiction.

Like, it feels likely that they aren't ever going to make a movie that unambiguously says something like "We are willfully ignoring and deliberately irrevocably contradicting the 2007 movie! Here's Megatron in a G1 body dancing on top of Hoover Dam at a point when he should instead be on ice inside of it! He just flew down to Earth from outer space! And he's only just now meeting Optimus for the first time ever! And he even brought his wife and kids with him!"

Money talks big words to big corporate executives, even if some of that money came from something as half-baked as ROTF.

Considering how badly things turned out by the later movies, I wouldn't mind the idea of these movies being part of a different timeline.

On one hand, if it would provide some closure to the unresolved threads from TLK (basically by erasing them) then I guess it's a good thing.

However, I absolutely loathe the trend film series have with alternate timelines, either through some time changing shenanigans or just straight up rebooting like say the Halloween movies have done. All it does is convince me that filmmakers and studios are even less concerned with the quality of their work than ever since anytime time film underperforms or if they simply no longer want to be bothered with it, they flat out trashcan the thing. I'm less excited to see movies than ever since they feel so disposable. The people in charge of them don't care, why should I?

william-james88 wrote:I will first and foremost reiterate that for the live action Transformers films, it's best to enjoy them as singular entities rather than try to map out any kind of continuity, even though the films do often attempt connecting visual or story elements. The next film, Rise of the Beasts, will be no different, hence my earlier article about it not making a difference if it's a reboot or not.

People have since written in and commented, offering good points. The best one being that while the tropes of the live action Transformers films may be inevitable (and even enjoyed by many fans), at least a reboot of the continuity would mean that the films don't lead to the unconcluded story set up in The Last Knight. That is an excellent point, and for the reasons I will point out below, that may be what this franchise plans on doing with this film. That does mean, however, that while the continuity changes, the live action films would still be in the same universe, set up by Michael Bay and Steven Spielberg (aptly called Bayverse by many). And there in lies the question, would fans be ok with preserving the Bayverse but branching off into an alternate storyline/continuity within?

I bring this up because there were rumours of a test screening for the Rise of the Beasts, which included elements of time travel, connecting the Rise of the Beasts movie directly with the earlier Bay era movies and changing the past so that the storylines don't end up in the same direction as the previous Bay films, creating a new timeline. There was never solid evidence of these screenings, so not much attention was given to them. Those story elements are starting to resurface with the mention of the Transwarp Key (or Keys), which we know will factor into this movie, and that was mentioned in the accounts of the test screenings. It may have been a lucky guess but, regardless, the "Transwarp" element does come from Beast Wars canon and it was the Transwarp Drive which let the Maximals travel through time originally. All to say, time travel can factor into this movie.

Other outlets have written similar articles comparing this possible plot point to the X-Men franchise where time travel was also used to create a diverging timeline within the same universe, creating new potential storylines (like the Apocalypse and Dark Pheonix film). As I read all this and put it together, I wonder if the fans who were asking for a reboot would be satisfied by this. While it would help the storytellers for future films, it still provides zero indication of fans getting what they want, which is a film focused on the robots with very few (to no) humans. It just means that the Unicron plot point from Transformers The Last Knight is abandoned, which would anger other fans. So ultimately, it looks like this doesn't benefit any fan. Those who want the Bayverse to die don't get that, and those who want to see a satisfying conclusion to the story the live action films were telling don't get that either.

But maybe this middle ground of a divergent storyline would satisfy some fans, hence the question this article asks: would fans be happy with an alternate timeline within the Bayverse?

In my head, 2018's Bumblebee already re-booted the live-action film franchise.

How bout some consistent world building and continuity, with a consistent art style that's it's own thing and not the Frankenstein's monster it has been for the last 5 years? That would be pretty neat I think, fellas.

What were the real reasons for the movie release delays?

babylon queen wrote:What were the real reasons for the movie release delays?

15 days to slow down the spread...

As a generality, I think multi-verses and diverging timelines are a sign of lazy writing. If Hollywood wants ROTB, or any other Transformers movie, to 'start over' and move away from previous movies? Then by all means, have at it. If they want to be original, they should be clever and prove it by not leaning on previous films as a crutch.

How many different Batman movies have we had, for example? They didn't try to carry on in Nolan's "Batman Returns" by linking it as a separate timeline to the Burton-verse "Batman & Robin" (thank goodness).

-Kanrabat- wrote:

babylon queen wrote:What were the real reasons for the movie release delays?

15 days to slow down the spread...

God, we're paying for that now...

First-Aid wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

babylon queen wrote:What were the real reasons for the movie release delays?

15 days to slow down the spread...

God, we're paying for that now...

I don't want to derail the thread further but they tested some James Bond's villain "world conquest" schemes and it worked beautifully.
I fear for our future.

Meanwhile, let's just distract ourselves with bread and games like this upcoming movie until The Empire falls!

-Kanrabat- wrote:

First-Aid wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

babylon queen wrote:What were the real reasons for the movie release delays?

15 days to slow down the spread...

God, we're paying for that now...

I don't want to derail the thread further but they tested some James Bond's villain "world conquest" schemes and it worked beautifully.
I fear for our future.

Meanwhile, let's just distract ourselves with bread and games like this upcoming movie until The Empire falls!

The heck with bread. It's the holidays. Let's make cookies!

About the movie timeline I have two different expectations:

-Make the differences between the past and duture of timeline a part of the plot, with the Maximals coming from the future that takes places after the conflict between Quintessa and Unicron.

-As the timeline catches up to the prsent day, we will have movies that references the previous ones, but will not feel obliged to follow the continuity directly.

I'm can see both working and would be fine with them.


About the argument a few pages ago about having humans in the movies, I will quote my opinion about it that we have discussed in the EarthSpark topic

transformers-earthspark-show-discussion-thread-t116145s100.php

TulioDude wrote:I agree with other users in this topic,in that humans in Transformers shouldn't be dismissed.
They serve to the thematic purpose of highlighting the differences between the Autobots and the Decepticons.While the Decepticons in general see the humans as disposable and weak,the Autobots and humans try to understand one another,and by working together manage to achieve what neither could on their own.

MaximalNui wrote:
Besides, there's another aspect of humans to consider: we learn and adapt. Even the Toho films have them developing stuff like Mechagodzilla, The Oxygen Destroyer or the Gotengo. And then you have to consider the Autobots possibly sharing technology and helping humans, or merely humans studying leftovers from the latest battles. It'd be unrealistic for them to start as mere cannon fodder and stay as mere cannon fodder the whole run. And frankly, static characters that never learn, improve or adapt are just annoying to me, whether they're cannon fodder, comedic relief or Leeroy Jenkins.

I agree.Even the Godzillas films have humans play important parts of the plot.

I think it's a good idea. For my sins I enjoy all the movies to very varying degrees, but the first two (well...parts of ROTF) and Bumblebee are the ones that give me real joy. William-James88's suggestion makes a lot of sense to me. As soon as I read it a lightbulb went off in my head!

Given how consistent The Yellow Guy's head design and portrayal are across all the movies makes it hard to accept he's not intended to be the same Yellow Guy in all of them.

On the flipside, as others have pointed out we have different Batmans who aren't connected and no attempt has been made or seen to be needed. But I think in those cases it was made explicit by the filmmakers they were separate characters/timelines. And then there's the live-action Spiders-Man who do end up being connected to very enjoyable effect.

As with anything, a new interpretation/continuation does not mean the original is gone. For better or for worse!

Wel... a reboot is always a traumatic event, moreover with a movie serie as movies are less "elastic" than books or comics.

Anyway, I think They've courage in rebooting, as They have clear that most of TF fans don't like TLK storyline. and, to be true, if We have to talk about a reboot, We can say that TLK was a reboot as it has given to continuity a completely new and somehow disturbing direction very close to a dead end.

So, IMHO the only way for movie franchise to go on existing is to abandon TLK storyline (and, maybe, also AoE storyline) anche reunite with DOTM plot.

PS I liked TLK, I think it was a good movie but it wasn't... a TF movie. I hate AoE.

Speaking of reboots, I don't mind them. That is, as long that the previous series have a proper ending. Too many series of movies or shows are never finished or "end" in a frustrating cliffhanger that will never be resolved.

I know business and money decide whenever something gets cancelled and rebooted, but every time it's very frustrating.

pointless trying to keep things sane now. its all a mess.

muddyjoe wrote:As much as I despise Michael Bay's movies, at least his aren't woke, identity politics bullcrap.

Sit down.

-Kanrabat- wrote:

First-Aid wrote:

-Kanrabat- wrote:

babylon queen wrote:What were the real reasons for the movie release delays?

15 days to slow down the spread...

God, we're paying for that now...

I don't want to derail the thread further but they tested some James Bond's villain "world conquest" schemes and it worked beautifully.
I fear for our future.

Oh the 10 year old Rockefeller report on the upps of something like this to lineup the sheep.
Our countries political parties had some questions about that to our government, since then 0,0% trust in my government.

Just give is quality movies man, people are slow but eventually they will stop giving you money (look at Star Wars). I love Transformers and I just want good to great entertainment, I'm invested.
The toys are doing absolute killer since the Prime Wars trilogy. More than 6 years of great toys and counting.

Regarding william-james88's arguments, I'll agree with the visual differences, especially since:

First-Aid wrote:The bots can alter their structure to create weapons and such, why not the ability to alter their facial appearance.

However, as for the continuity issues, I'd say that while the previous movies contradicted themselves a lot, it was mostly by adding stuff without actually removing the previous ones (the Creators when we had the AllSpark, Quintessa when we had the Creators, the Sentinel Prime conspiracy when we had the search for the ASllSpark...), and even then we could always find ways to work around the contradictions (the AllSpark could easily be a tool of the Creators, Quintessa being known as "The Great Deceiver" puts everything she says into question unless confirmed by another character, Sentinel could easily be a contigency plan in case the Decepticons lost the AllSpark...). Bumblebee, on the other hand, was the first to fully remove something from the other films, which calls for at least some continuity reworking.

As for a Days of Future Past/Kelvin Star Trek-esque reboot, I actually liked the idea in those franchises and would love it in Transformers. My only critique would be the X-Men's decision to focus the new timeline exclusively on the younger past-version characters instead of their adult present-day selves. And using time travel to justify all changes even when they should logically occur long before the divergence point.

Honestly, it's less that I want a reboot to happen and more that I want Hasbro and Paramount to actually take a stand on the whole debate instead of doing all the flip-flopping statements and vague descriptions like "new storytelling universe". Even if they decide not to reboot it, or just to erase only a few select films instead of a true reboot, I'd be satisfied with having some actual confirmation.

This is dumb. I’m tired of this social Justice nonsense. Newsflash, Steven Caple Jr. WE. DONT. WATCH. TRANSFORMERS. FOR. THE. DUMB. HUMANS. WE COME TO SEE ROBOTS BEAT THE SNOT OUT OF EACH OTHER.

I don't really think official word is needed. Take the Legend of Zelda series for example. For years, fans theory-crafted how the timeline of the series included all games. Then Nintendo did so officially ala the Hyrule Historia. To many, their interpretation was worse than what the fans came up with. But as they are the official word, now we are canonically stuck with that.

When Rise of Beasts comes out. Just sit down and watch with the mindset that this is the sequel to the Bumblebee Movie...

We had details from test screenings of Transformers Rise of the Beasts back in August but the details were hard to corroborate. They still are, though we definitely have more info regarding the movie now than we did then. So we are giving you that info now so that all fans have access to all the info possible. Here are a few things to note first:
1. This could all be fabrications
2. Avoid if you want no SPOILERS, even though this may be misinformation
3. Below is a composite of 2 viewers who may have had different cuts shown to them
4. As with test screenings, what is shown may be heavily changed for the final film
5. The sources will not be given to protect whoever transcribed this, if whoever transcribed this wants to be credited, let us know.

-The basic plot Synopsis is that the Autobots and Terrorcons are fighting over these "Transwarp" keys. The Autobots want them to [go] home, while the Terrorcons want them to bring Unicron to Earth
-There was one decepticon at the beginning. He was a generic no name, but he turned into a bus. Prime kills him in the beginning to give you that Bot vs Con feel.
-Optimus Prime will start the movie as being distrustful/aloof of humans, but will learn to care for them and become a protector during the film.
-Bumblbee isn't in it much. He talks radio like we're used too. Nothing specific about his past adventure, but he does try to tell Prime humans ain't all bad earlier in the film.
-Mirage is the human-friend of the film, meets Noah (anthony ramos). Reminded Source of Sam and Bee, i.e. the "stolen car" chase
-There is an implied past relationship between Arcee and Wheeljack, and there are sexual jokes that are weird and random
-The Wheeljack head change is unfortunately true. He has a generic autobot face with big dorky glasses, not like Que's.
-Heroes go to Peru/Machu Picchu via a cargo plane Transformer, to look for part of a key.
-The cargo ship IS Stratosphere. Our cut had him voiced by John DiMaggio with a Scotsman voice. The only other voice I could recognize was the actor who voiced Arcee in Prime did the voice in this movie too.
-[regarding the Maximals] Airrazor and Primal do most of the talking. Airrazor is a kind and wise maximal who is used to becoming exposition for our heroes. Primal is a proud warrior who is tasked to guarding on of the keys with Cheetor and Rhinox. He kinda mentors Prime a bit about being kind and trust humans. Cheetor and Rhinox are just there. Cheetor says a few lines and even calls Primal boss bot. Rhinox says one line and they all laugh it off like "You can talk?". They have their maximize moment, but the ps2 graphics that were their character models made them like all the same unfortunately. I'm sure that will be different when it's finished
-Action is great but gets messy
-[Airrazor] is attacked by the terrorcons and hacked, turns evil.
-Scourge, the main Terrorcon of the 3, activates a beam in the sky in which more enemies come out of. Maximals and Autobots fight and defeat them.
-There are no true Predacons. Only a bunch of Scorponoks (?) But they don't do anything other than be scorpions.
-The designs [of those scorpions] were original. They were larger than your average transformer
-[Dominique Fishback's character Elena] was SO bland. He character is a museum intern who wants to work for the museum and she has the knowledge for it, but that gets left behind completely. When all is said and done, she doesn't even get a little resolution at the end. She only there to read old maximal hyroglphs.
-No military [in the film]. Just suburban kids and robots. The main humans are Noah and Elena and Noah's sick brother as the largest support character. There's other small roles obviously, but those three are the most important


There is also a report of a midcredit sting with Unicron. Interestingly, there is no mention of time travel, so what we, and other publications, suggested here might not come to pass afterall.

Well, the note about Arcee's voice actress being the same one from Prime is completely bogus, since her voice actress has already been confirmed to instead be Liza Koshy, not Sumalee Montano.

Sabrblade wrote:Well, the note about Arcee's voice actress being the same one from Prime is completely bogus, since her voice actress has already been confirmed to instead be Liza Koshy, not Sumalee Montano.

They didn't know the facts, just that it sounds like her

Wow, this sounds... Just awful.
David Kaye and Garry Chalk don't exist, I guess.
God forbid we have Predacons in our Beast Wars movie.

84everfan wrote:Wow, this sounds... Just awful.
David Kaye and Garry Chalk don't exist, I guess.
God forbid we have Predacons in our Beast Wars movie.

But this isn't a Beast Wars movie. A separate Beast Wars movie is coming later.

Sabrblade wrote:

84everfan wrote:Wow, this sounds... Just awful.
David Kaye and Garry Chalk don't exist, I guess.
God forbid we have Predacons in our Beast Wars movie.

But this isn't a Beast Wars movie. A separate Beast Wars movie is coming later.

I thought that was no longer on the radar. Hasbro just includes this film and the animated TF film on their upcoming slate.

william-james88 wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

84everfan wrote:Wow, this sounds... Just awful.
David Kaye and Garry Chalk don't exist, I guess.
God forbid we have Predacons in our Beast Wars movie.

But this isn't a Beast Wars movie. A separate Beast Wars movie is coming later.

I thought that was no longer on the radar. Hasbro just includes this film and the animated TF film on their upcoming slate.

Oh? I thought it had been said somewhere that it was coming later.

Either way, this isn't Beast Wars. It's Rise of the Beasts.

Not surprised at all that the roles of Rhinox and original wallflower Airazor have been flipped. The Predacon stuff, if true, isn’t surprising either. Too many factions listed for them all to be given fair dues. At least no silly military presence in this one would be a huge plus.

bring unicron to earth? i thought unicron IS the earth

griftimus prime wrote:bring unicron to earth? i thought unicron IS the earth

Assuming this is real, the I'm guessing they're cutting tlk free...which I can agree with.

Yeah . . . looks like I'll be watching this movie by way of YouTube highlights.

One day maybe we'll get a movie made by people who actually give a damn about the material and characters, but I suspect I won't live long enough to see it.

It's always been really limiting as a concept. You can't have Unicron transform if it destroys the Earth to do so. Therefore removing the main draw of actually seeing him.

Also wish they wouldn't keep holding out the Unicron carrot all the time. There is a wealth of Transformers lore waiting to make it to Live Action. That has more to do and say than the Chaos Bringer.

At this point either the guy had good prediction skills or this leak was indeed legitimate, the following stuff in the article has been confirmed legit since the leak.

-"Transwarp" keys (Hasbro descriptions for Battletrap mention them)
-The Wheeljack head change (The toy leak)
-Stratosphere voiced by John DiMaggio. (Was part of the recent cast reveal news)
- Sky Beam and the Predacons that Maximals and Autobots team up to fight (While the actual the sky beam and if the enemies are Predacons aren't confirmed themselves, the end of the trailer does show a big device/tower and there seems to be a bunch of lanky generics that clash with the Autobots/Maximals so there is at least a similar detail)

As for stuff that might be true based on snippets of info, the pieces aren't all there but there is some.

-decepticon bus (I was looking at the movie thread on TFW and one thing some users noted is that there was a worn-looking Bus present during filming and it was spotted again in the background in a image-tweet regarding reshoots, that doesn't confirm the bus is a con but it does confirm there is a bus in the film)
-Mirage is the human-friend (Mirage and Noah do have some interaction in the trailer and there is more focus on Mirage than Bumblebee in regards to human relations so it's likely)
-Airrazor is attacked, hacked, turns evil. (Might be a stretch but we do see her breathing fire at a bridge where Optimus is kinda approaching in the background of the shot, it is unusual for a good-aligned character to be causing potential damage like this)
- Terrocon and Unicron connection (It's worth to note that the design of the group's insignia and Scourge's headsculpt do resemble Unicron, in addition the group's name has been used in the past for Unicron related things like in Transformers Prime)


Anyways if all this is true that leaves me worried about this bit.

-There is an implied past relationship between Arcee and Wheeljack, and there are sexual jokes that are weird and random (If this is true and as bad as I'm imagining, Hasbro you are allowed to put your foot down for the benefit of the children and teens this nonsense isn't necessary and never will be in a Transformers film.)

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:It's always been really limiting as a concept. You can't have Unicron transform if it destroys the Earth to do so. Therefore removing the main draw of actually seeing him.

Also wish they wouldn't keep holding out the Unicron carrot all the time. There is a wealth of Transformers lore waiting to make it to Live Action. That has more to do and say than the Chaos Bringer.

It's probably because more people are aware of Unicron as a concept, but he is diminishing returns. Problem is if the suits fancy taking a risk on any other branch of lore from the wealth of fiction from the almost 40 years the brand has been going.

My issue with Unicron is that almost every time he's used he ends up being bland, lacking in character and too obvious a plot device, and the first 2 is for when he actually shows up as a character and isn't just a looming threat that might not even show up.

It's concerning that The Fallen who shows up less often than Unicron is to a degree someone who can be more interesting than him.

I really hope that one day a film, show or comic establishes more of a character and motivation for him that isn't just being a wanderer who eats planets, someone who can be on par with Megatron and other notable franchise antagonists.

Maybe I've been successfully conditioned by the previous live action movies, but hearing that it's a relatively simple plot with lots of bot interaction and fight scenes sounds pretty positive to me.

Could still be terrible if the majority of screentime is cringey comedy and contrived drama for the humans, which is my main concern. I'm surprised there's not much comment on that beyond mentioning lack of military.

ZeroWolf wrote:It's probably because more people are aware of Unicron as a concept, but he is diminishing returns.

Deadput wrote:My issue with Unicron is that almost every time he's used he ends up being bland, lacking in character and too obvious a plot device, and the first 2 is for when he actually shows up as a character and isn't just a looming threat that might not even show up.

It's concerning that The Fallen who shows up less often than Unicron is to a degree someone who can be more interesting than him.

I really hope that one day a film, show or comic establishes more of a character and motivation for him that isn't just being a wanderer who eats planets, someone who can be on par with Megatron and other notable franchise antagonists.

See, it's exactly that. As great as he was in the '86 Movie (mostly down to Orson Welles). Unicron is a one trick pony. A plot device. The Comics bring him in to end their respective runs. Even UT arguably didn't add anything major to his characterisation either. Ironic, in hindsight.

That's why he should be something esoteric within Transformers lore. Akin to a Lovecraftian Elder God. A name with cult-like/deific worship. He shouldn't be a physical thing in Live Action. Because he can't be fought. Even in animation, as soon as he transforms, he stands still until plot happens.

Deadput wrote:Anyways if all this is true that leaves me worried about this bit.

-There is an implied past relationship between Arcee and Wheeljack, and there are sexual jokes that are weird and random (If this is true and as bad as I'm imagining, Hasbro you are allowed to put your foot down for the benefit of the children and teens this nonsense isn't necessary and never will be in a Transformers film.)

I'm a bit less worried because this is just dialogue that could be cut if it didn't go over well with the audience. So this could all be real, but it also doesn't mean we'll get it in the end.

Cheesinator wrote:Maybe I've been successfully conditioned by the previous live action movies, but hearing that it's a relatively simple plot with lots of bot interaction and fight scenes sounds pretty positive to me.

Could still be terrible if the majority of screentime is cringey comedy and contrived drama for the humans, which is my main concern. I'm surprised there's not much comment on that beyond mentioning lack of military.

This is exactly where I stand, to a T. Many were worried there would be a lot of emphasis on humans and while I am sure that part will still be there, the bots seem to be at the forefront here. Which would be a first. Low bar, I know, but I don't know what else people would expect from a live action Transformers film at this point.

Brokebot wrote:Yeah . . . looks like I'll be watching this movie by way of YouTube highlights.

One day maybe we'll get a movie made by people who actually give a damn about the material and characters, but I suspect I won't live long enough to see it.

Here's a good example. I am curious, Brokebot, what were you expecting in terms of a live action film and what in the description made it a certainty that you wouldn't watch all of it?

And I will agree with everyone that Unicron is a one note plot/character, and that's by design. Even without any of these "leaks", I think there's good evidence to Unicron's peripheral involvement, simply through designs. Though it being peripheral means that element could be cut if audiences don't test well with it.

And the questions as to why Unicron is coming rather than being on Earth are valid, since it seems Hasbro/Paramount is still skirting around the whole "Reboot but still Bayverse, so not a full reboot" idea and will not offer a clean break for fans, let alone casual viewers, to know if this isn't meant to be associated to the past films. I expect more frustration.

Spoilers please, Can you guys gray that stuff out?
I don't need to know details about the plot.

Just make it those stars or stripes or whatever. Don't blatantly post it on da frontpage pls

Even if the story is going to be a bland, written by a braindamaged gerbil, "modern" hollywood nightmare.

AllNewSuperRobot wrote:See, it's exactly that. As great as he was in the '86 Movie (mostly down to Orson Welles). Unicron is a one trick pony. A plot device. The Comics bring him in to end their respective runs. Even UT arguably didn't add anything major to his characterisation either. Ironic, in hindsight.

That's why he should be something esoteric within Transformers lore. Akin to a Lovecraftian Elder God. A name with cult-like/deific worship. He shouldn't be a physical thing in Live Action. Because he can't be fought. Even in animation, as soon as he transforms, he stands still until plot happens.

The Armada cartoon was the closest he ever came to being a Lovecraftian Eldritch entity. He was at his most alien in that series. A seeming force of nature that fed off hated and violence, inner workings that were gross and semi-organic, supernatural abilities that bordered on magical, reality-bending and dimensional-warping powers used to toy with the minds of lesser beings, use of avatars to communicate with said lesser beings, a voice that sounded as emotionless and otherworldly as the original Orson Welles voice (particularly in the Japanese version), creating life from his very cells just to stir up the existing Autobot/Decepticon conflict. Armada cartoon Unicron was truly one of the most frightening depictions of the character. The true monster wasn't the giant moon-sized robot that loomed in Cybertron's orbit, but the horrific monstrosity that lay deep inside that giant outer shell.

And since not many in the West have seen it, not many know about the Beast Wars Neo depiction of Unicron. A vicious creature made of pure energy, this version of Unicron was a nigh-invincible being who, instead of being a giant-sized looming threat all the time, was standard Transformer-sized and got down and dirty from the moment he was resurrected. Instead of only using minions, he would get up close and personal, directly mopping the floor with Big Convoy and his teammates in every episode, decimating all in his path, and LOVING every moment of it. He was very sadistic in this series, cockily and gleefully relishing in all of the pain and destruction he caused in his quest to reacquire all of his Angolmois Energy and get back to Cybertron. And what's more, this version of Unicron made it a point to explicitly note that he was NOT a god, but that he desired to become a god, wanting to do so by merging with Vector Sigma and making Cybertron itself his new body.

There's also Shattered Glass Unicron, but not much has been done with him as a good guy.

And then there's the more recent "End of G1 Universe" manga that provides the newest and most different take on Unicron, in which Dark Amber Leo Prime is presented as a new being born from a fusion of Unicron and Lio Convoy, creating a morally-ambiguous character who is both self-aware of his past as Unicron but also unsure of his place in the world, almost like this version is an actual attempt at trying to reform and rehabilitate the evil Unicron into a not-so-evil character, something that's never been done before.